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Upscalers, CRTs, PVMs & RGB: Retro gaming done right!

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S

Spartan FI

Neo Member
Recently bought a Framemeister and is having trouble getting stable sync over RGB SCART from Super Famicom, Pal Mega Drive 1 (60 HZ modded), PS1 and PS2 slim.

Auto sync only works on the Super Famicom but with a very unstable picture and none of the sync levels with auto sync off gives a stable image. No picture from MD1 on auto sync and none of the sync levels with auto sync off gives stable picture at both 50/60 HZ. Same issue as the MD1 with both PS1 and PS2. Original Xbox over Component and Super Famicom over Composite works so should be no problem with the Framemeister itself. The Framemeister have firmware 1.11 installed.

Super Famicom and MD1 are both using RGB SCART composite video sync cables from Retro Gaming Cables and I think the problem lies there. The PS RGB cable is a no name brand so not surprised that isn’t working. I used the cables before i got the Framemeister and had no problems with them on the same LCD TV.

Anyway, ordered this SCART adapter with a sync stripper so maybe that will help the sync issues with my existing cables. I can't think of any other problem than the cables when multiple systems are having problem with the same cable brand and sync type. Also ordered this cable for the PS consoles. Heard a lot of good things about those cables so figured I try them out.

Any experience with Retro Gaming Cables and if their cables are problematic or is the Framemeister sensitive when it comes to cable quality or sync type?
 
J

Jamix012

Member
Spartan FI said:
Recently bought a Framemeister and is having trouble getting stable sync over RGB SCART from Super Famicom, Pal Mega Drive 1 (60 HZ modded), PS1 and PS2 slim.

Auto sync only works on the Super Famicom but with a very unstable picture and none of the sync levels with auto sync off gives a stable image. No picture from MD1 on auto sync and none of the sync levels with auto sync off gives stable picture at both 50/60 HZ. Same issue as the MD1 with both PS1 and PS2. Original Xbox over Component and Super Famicom over Composite works so should be no problem with the Framemeister itself. The Framemeister have firmware 1.11 installed.

Super Famicom and MD1 are both using RGB SCART composite video sync cables from Retro Gaming Cables and I think the problem lies there. The PS RGB cable is a no name brand so not surprised that isn’t working. I used the cables before i got the Framemeister and had no problems with them on the same LCD TV.

Anyway, ordered this SCART adapter with a sync stripper so maybe that will help the sync issues with my existing cables. I can't think of any other problem than the cables when multiple systems are having problem with the same cable brand and sync type. Also ordered this cable for the PS consoles. Heard a lot of good things about those cables so figured I try them out.

Any experience with Retro Gaming Cables and if their cables are problematic or is the Framemeister sensitive when it comes to cable quality or sync type?
Click to expand...

Please tell me you got JP Scart and not Euro scart...
Edit: That Scart cable you linked won't work on the Framemeister. You need JP Scart. But that Sync stripper should make them work.
 
L

Lettuce

Member
I posted this in the MegaDrive thread but thought id post it here as well.

I thought id take some comparison pictures of the 2 RGB Megadrive 2 scart cables from the eBay seller retro_console_accessories and retrogamingcables.co.uk.as i know these are the 2 main companies most of us uses for our retro stuff...

4VaU0mr.jpg
Click to expand...

WaTXvRf.jpg
Click to expand...

It would appear that the retro console accessories cable seem to have more wires connected (ground i believe) and use caps on the R, G, B lines, where the retro gaming cables cable uses resistors on the R,G,B lines instead and doesnt have as many wires connected or though the wires are slightly thicker.

On thing i have noticed between the cables on my HANTAREX CT 28 EQ MONITOR its that the Retro Gaming Cable scart cable seem to have trouble syncing the screen on a scene change, for example when i first turn the MD2 on and the SEGA logo is display then the picture will jump a few times and then become stable, once the screen changes from the SEGA logo to the intro of the game then the same thing will happen again. This never happened at all with the Retro Console Accessories cable and the picture was 100% stable all the time. Other than this issue they seem to produce the same quality picture. Any ideas what might be the cause of this picture stability issue with the Retro Gaming Cables scart cable is?
 
T

thechristoph

Sir!
Khaz said:
The Z80 was taken out from the Nintendo portables as soon as the Game Boy Micro, which can't play GB and GBC games anymore. The DS and 3DS never had this processor either, yet all can play GBA games.
Click to expand...

The 3DS cannot put GBA games into sleep mode or create restore points. There's something funky about the way it emulates GBA.
 
S

Spartan FI

Neo Member
Jamix012 said:
Please tell me you got JP Scart and not Euro scart...
Edit: That Scart cable you linked won't work on the Framemeister. You need JP Scart. But that Sync stripper should make them work.
Click to expand...

Assumed the cable was compatible with the EUR Scart to XRGB Mini adapter which i have. Cable has not shipped yet so will ask the seller is so are the case.
 
B

Borman

Member
Got my new capture card. Only downside is that 1080p60 doesnt want to work properly. I think it is because of my mac being PCI-e 1.0 only :( Will need to upgrade. Besides 1080p, things are looking quite nice! Will have to pick up an XSync soon too.
 
T

Timu

Member
Lettuce said:
I posted this in the MegaDrive thread but thought id post it here as well.

I thought id take some comparison pictures of the 2 RGB Megadrive 2 scart cables from the eBay seller retro_console_accessories and retrogamingcables.co.uk.as i know these are the 2 main companies most of us uses for our retro stuff...





It would appear that the retro console accessories cable seem to have more wires connected (ground i believe) and use caps on the R, G, B lines, where the retro gaming cables cable uses resistors on the R,G,B lines instead and doesnt have as many wires connected or though the wires are slightly thicker.

On thing i have noticed between the cables on my HANTAREX CT 28 EQ MONITOR its that the Retro Gaming Cable scart cable seem to have trouble syncing the screen on a scene change, for example when i first turn the MD2 on and the SEGA logo is display then the picture will jump a few times and then become stable, once the screen changes from the SEGA logo to the intro of the game then the same thing will happen again. This never happened at all with the Retro Console Accessories cable and the picture was 100% stable all the time. Other than this issue they seem to produce the same quality picture. Any ideas what might be the cause of this picture stability issue with the Retro Gaming Cables scart cable is?
Click to expand...
Are both of those composite video or composite sync?

Friend of Sonic said:
Do I pull the trigger, GAF?!
Click to expand...
Yes.
 
M

Madao

Member
SheepyGuy said:
iPhone effect. Everyone reviewing tech these days thinks everything should be made out of aluminum and glass. :(
Click to expand...

the XRGB mini does feel really light and usually light weight = cheap so i can see why he would say that.

though i guess there's reasons for the XRGB mini to be built like that. it seems like a form factor designed to prevent overheating (after all, the XRGB should last a few years, not months like most phones)
 
A

antibolo

Banned
BONKERS said:
Ebay isn't a good solution either since basically NO ONE wants to ship these. Even if the person is willing to pay.
Click to expand...

Shipping a CRT is asking for trouble. Especially in this day and age where they aren't the norm anymore.

If you want a PVM, you need to consider having to go on a road trip to get it.
 
F

Friend of Sonic

Member
Yeah, SavonPat on eBay is a brave soul who is still shipping these. He packed my 20l5 well, but still showed up with busted innards. I had to ship it back, he fixed it, and packed it even better and luckily made it safe.

Speaking as a buyer, I would never order another PVM and have it shipped. As a seller, I could never imagine doing such a thing when I've seen what I've seen what USPS, Fedex, and UPS can do to a package
 
L

Lettuce

Member
Timu said:
Are both of those composite video or composite sync?

Yes.
Click to expand...

Im not 100% sure, the cable from Retrogamingcables didnt have an option to select between composite or video sync like there SNES cables do. And the cable from retro console accessories was bought soo long ago i cant remember

Why were you asking??
 
L

Lettuce

Member
MightyHedgehog said:
Eh, that's kind of pricey. How difficult is the mod supposed to be? Could be worth it that way, but I'm not throwing $100 at it.
Click to expand...

RetroRGB now do a RGB-AMP PCB for easy install, to be fair the install was easy enough in the first place but this just make it neater....

http://retrorgb.com/n64rgbmod.html

Also am i right in thinking that now ALL N64 can be RGB modded, i though i heard a french guy had a new method that aloud the mod to be carried out on all n64's now??
 
M

MightyHedgehog

Member
The Mageling said:
It looks pretty simple, but I don't have any first-hand experience. The amp is about $20 if I remember correctly.
Click to expand...

Hmmm...yeah, looks like it could be pretty simple, all told, but I'm not seeing the mod diagram and instructions for an original SNES model. Guess I could pick up a SNES mini considering its apparent reputation for better RGB output, as listed here.

Lettuce said:
RetroRGB now do a RGB-AMP PCB for easy install, to be fair the install was easy enough in the first place but this just make it neater....

http://retrorgb.com/n64rgbmod.html

Also am i right in thinking that now ALL N64 can be RGB modded, i though i heard a french guy had a new method that aloud the mod to be carried out on all n64's now??
Click to expand...
Ah, thanks. Gonna have to invest in both of these before too long, I can tell.
 
T

Timu

Member
Lettuce said:
Im not 100% sure, the cable from Retrogamingcables didnt have an option to select between composite or video sync like there SNES cables do. And the cable from retro console accessories was bought soo long ago i cant remember

Why were you asking??
Click to expand...
Weird, it has the option for those cables at that site now, I'm gonna choose composite sync when I get my cables from them. And speaking of that, when it comes to the Genesis/Megadrive it's been said composite sync is preferable to composite video, I know it gets rid of jailbars and such.
 
F

Friend of Sonic

Member
Peagles said:
Fuck it, I'm gonna try make one. I figured I'll get a long good quality SCART cable (readily available here) and chop it in half to make 2 cables. I think I even have some genuine composite cables with chewed wires that I can pillage a multi out or two from.
Click to expand...
Are you going to do the coax shielding? Or is your system properly shielded for the audio? I was getting audio buzz from her cable, but I sent it in for the coax treatment. Unfortunately, I think she wired it for csync and it isn't working for me anymore. My guess is I don't have that wired in my modded Mini, but I'll have to open it up and check it out. Really hoping the coax fixes the excessive buzz.
 
P

Peagles

Member
Friend of Sonic said:
Are you going to do the coax shielding? Or is your system properly shielded for the audio? I was getting audio buzz from her cable, but I sent it in for the coax treatment. Unfortunately, I think she wired it for csync and it isn't working for me anymore. My guess is I don't have that wired in my modded Mini, but I'll have to open it up and check it out. Really hoping the coax fixes the excessive buzz.
Click to expand...

Is that the super thick cables? If I can get a cable like that I will. Most sellers don't specify but SCART cables can be had for a couple of bucks here so I might just buy a bunch that look good and see what I've got to work with. A lot of super high end ones are well sealed up at the ends so I might be hard to find super shielded ones that I can modify.

It might be too thick to match up with the multi out though...
 
F

Friend of Sonic

Member
Peagles said:
Is that the super thick cables? If I can get a cable like that I will. Most sellers don't specify but SCART cables can be had for a couple of bucks here so I might just buy a bunch that look good and see what I've got to work with. A lot of super high end ones are well sealed up at the ends so I might be hard to find super shielded ones that I can modify.

It might be too thick to match up with the multi out though...
Click to expand...
Here is her pic
$_57.JPG

I am guessing it's just thicker cabling all around? The overall thickness definitely is increased when comparing to my normal cables.
 
P

Peagles

Member
The thick cables are usually 1.5cm thick, that's how you tell. Actually I might already have some, I'll check in the wardrobe today.

Most of my good ones are flat cables though, don't think I could make them with with a multi out lol.
 
L

Lettuce

Member
Timu said:
Weird, it has the option for those cables at that site now, I'm gonna choose composite sync when I get my cables from them. And speaking of that, when it comes to the Genesis/Megadrive it's been said composite sync is preferable to composite video, I know it gets rid of jailbars and such.
Click to expand...

Ah crap, you know what i ordered if from my phone, probably the mobile site doesnt show that option. Whats is the default selection?

I guess i could just solder the wire on the scart pin for v sync and resolder it to the pin for c sync right?. There is on other difference between a c sync and v sync cable is there?

On a side note why do some cables just have resistors on the RGB lines and other have caps?. Whats the difference?
 
T

Timu

Member
Lettuce said:
Ah crap, you know what i ordered if from my phone, probably the mobile site doesnt show that option. Whats is the default selection?

I guess i could just solder the wire on the scart pin for v sync and resolder it to the pin for c sync right?. There is on other difference between a c sync and v sync cable is there?

On a side note why do some cables just have resistors on the RRB lines and other have caps?. Whats the difference?
Click to expand...
Composite video is the default.

I guess you could do that.
 
BONKERS

BONKERS

Member
antibolo said:
Shipping a CRT is asking for trouble. Especially in this day and age where they aren't the norm anymore.

If you want a PVM, you need to consider having to go on a road trip to get it.
Click to expand...

Drive thousands of miles? Ugh no thanks. (If I can find one in say, Seattle for example though. I can definitely make that trip. Only about 12 hours round trip)

When packed and shipped properly. It should really be a non-issue. Considering much heavier more fragile things are shipped consistently throughout the world.

Shipping would be expensive, but it needs to be for something like this.
 
L

lostinblue

Banned
I have had one PVM shipped from germany, didn't get here in one piece but was still fixable and tube wasn't harmed, but yeah.

It's not very easy to do, no matter how well you pack it there's risk because dudes doing deliveries throw them around and never respect indications like "this side up" and things like that. I've seen a few plasmas being delivered and they had indications in regards to that, they always ignore them "oh it's fine, we've done thousands of these" yeah, and sometimes it doesn't go right, but... there's insurance and shit for that.

They don't care, heat never reaches their asses in long distance transfers, changes hands 10 times within a trip so one can't fault anyone in specific.

One case that I know off (with a VT20), short distance transporter for repair under extended warranty, it's different ... dudes even changed their description from "used with normal use marks" to "cracked and broken" on the paper they delivered to the repair company... but forgot he had an original copy saying the prior, only due to that he managed to have his money back.

Incredible, I know.
 
BONKERS

BONKERS

Member
So, since I discovered that over component on a CRT the PS3 doesn't display 240p game as 240p. I continued playing Arc The Lad 2 (For about 13 Hours)upscaled to 720p on my 768p TV with the smoothing disabled. This looked great except for some weird scrolling artifacts and motion blur from the TV. Both of which the TV are responsible for I am assuming at this point.


So at the same time, I had found out about MemcardRex and it's ability to read and write to real memory cards via a Dex Drive

https://github.com/ShendoXT/memcardrex

Oddly enough, there was someone on Amazon selling a *new* dex drive for 11$. So I ordered it and a Prolific RS32 to USB adapter.

Came in the mail today. Transferred the save, tested it out on my PS2. Near perfect 240p(Aside from the red push my CRT has that I can't really fix. Not even via service menu. Kind of shitty in that regard)
and I could make out pixel perfect details that I spent a lot of time looking at and noticing when playing it upscaled to 720p on my PS3. So was surprised at how accurate the upscaled 720p looked to the 240p original image at least considering it's an even 9x multiple. (240 >480>720)

For a 60FPS game though, Arc does have some laggy controls though. Even on original hardware. Obviously not really a problem for such a game though.
 
S

Sixfortyfive

He who pursues two rabbits gets two rabbits.
lostinblue said:
It's not very easy to do, no matter how well you pack it there's risk because dudes doing deliveries throw them around and never respect indications like "this side up" and things like that. I've seen a few plasmas being delivered and they had indications in regards to that, they always ignore them "oh it's fine, we've done thousands of these" yeah, and sometimes it doesn't go right, but... there's insurance and shit for that.

They don't care, heat never reaches their asses in long distance transfers, changes hands 10 times within a trip so one can't fault anyone in specific.
Click to expand...
There's also the matter that small shipment courier services that individual sellers use (UPS, FedEx, USPS, etc.) usually don't belong in the same league as proper freight shipment services that would have been used by the original warehouses when they originally shipped these products, often in high volume. I'd expect that there's more that could go wrong with standard ground shipping.

That, and sometimes just packaging these things for shipping can be an ordeal for an individual seller all by itself.
 
L

lostinblue

Banned
You're right, of course.

I was since properly schooled in regards to how to ship a PVM or just about any TV home and I forgot most of it, but I reckon hearing "ship on wood". And I'm guessing that's a pallet on a boat.

I remember because it confused me.
 
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