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[Trojita]

http://www.cnn.com/2012/03/16/justice/new-jersey-rutgers-trial/index.html?hpt=hp_t1

The jury found Ravi not guilty on several questions within the verdict sheet, but because he was found guilty on at least one question of whether his actions constituted bias discrimination, he could now face the maximum penalty: Up to 10 years in jail and deportation to his native India.

Ravi, 20, also was found guilty of witness tampering, hindering apprehension and tampering of physical evidence.

A verdict has been reached in the trial of a former Rutgers University student accused of spying on and intimidating his gay roommate by use of a hidden webcam.

If convicted, Dharun Ravi could face up to 10 years in prison and deportation back to his native India.

Ravi, 20, has been on trial on a 15-count indictment that includes charges of bias intimidation, invasion of privacy, tampering with physical evidence, witness tampering and hindering apprehension.

His roommate, Tyler Clementi, an 18-year-old freshman, killed himself in September 2010 by jumping off the George Washington Bridge, which spans the Hudson River between New York and New Jersey, after learning that Ravi had secretly spied on his sexual encounter with another man.

Clementi's death stirred discussion about bullying, with Obama releasing a videotaped message less than a month later condemning it. A few months later, New Jersey legislators enacted stricter laws to better protect against bullying in schools.

The most serious charges in the Rutgers case centered on whether Ravi's actions had constituted bias intimidation, meaning that he was motivated to inspire fear in the Ridgewood, New Jersey, native because of his sexual orientation. Those charges carry jail time of up to 10 years and possible deportation back to India.

Prosecutors have said that Ravi tried to embarrass Clementi because he was gay.

"These acts were purposeful, they were intentional, and they were planned," prosecutor Julia L. McClure told the jury on the first day of the trial. Ravi "was bothered by Tyler Clementi's sexual orientation," she later said more bluntly.

Ravi's attorneys have argued that their client acted thoughtlessly, portraying him as an immature college student who made a mistake, and that his actions were not based on homophobia.

"He hasn't lived long enough to have any experience with homosexuality or gays," said attorney Steven Altman in closing arguments earlier this week. "He doesn't know anything about it. He just graduated high school."

Ravi and fellow student Molly Wei -- who admitted joining Ravi to watch the surreptitious webcam encounter, which others were also alerted to via social media -- were charged in the wake of Clementi's suicide. They were not, however, charged directly with his death.

Facing two counts of invasion of privacy, Wei reached a plea deal in May 2011 that required her to testify against her friend and former high school classmate, as well as to complete a three-year program on cyberbullying and do 300 hours of community service.

Ravi turned down a plea deal offered by Middlesex County prosecutors that would have allowed him to avoid jail time in exchange for undergoing counseling, doing 600 hours of community service and disposing of any information that could identify the man who appeared in the web video with Clementi.

I can't believe he denied the plea deal.

 

[DarkKyo]

Guy's an asshole for doing that so I have no issues with the verdict and the possible sentencing.

 

[derder]

I still don't think it was as big of a deal as it turned out to be. Had he known that his roommate would have killed himself, I seriously doubt that he'd have done it. I'm sure he just thought that it was funny and that he'd have a verbal argument with this stranger that he was assigned to live with.

This would be a justifiable sentence had this guy been an openly homophobic bigot with a history of discrimination.

 

[Freshmaker]

I still don't think it was as big of a deal as it turned out to be. Had he known that his roommate would have killed himself, I seriously doubt that he'd have done it. I'm sure he just thought that it was funny and that he'd have a verbal argument with this stranger that he was assigned to live with.

This would be a justifiable sentence had this guy been an openly homophobic bigot with a history of discrimination.

So if someone secretly taped you having sex and then dumped it on the net, you'd just write it off as a wacky prank?

 

[Count Dookkake]

I still don't think it was as big of a deal as it turned out to be. Had he known that his roommate would have killed himself, I seriously doubt that he'd have done it. I'm sure he just thought that it was funny and that he'd have a verbal argument with this stranger that he was assigned to live with.

This would be a justifiable sentence had this guy been an openly homophobic bigot with a history of discrimination.

Shit happens.

You can't predict how shit will happen, so it's in your best interest to think before undertaking a series of actions against a person and their privacy.

Here's hoping more shit happens and continues to happen to this joker.

 

[teruterubozu]

They know he's getting deported, so they threw him the whole book. Although I bet he appeals.

 

[dinazimmerman]

So if someone secretly taped you having sex and then dumped it on the net, you'd just write it off as a wacky prank?

I probably wouldn't condemn the guy to 10 years of prison though, but that's just me. If I were the mother of the guy who killed himself, I would probably wouldn't mind severe retribution, though.

 

[Fantomex]

So if someone secretly taped you having sex and then dumped it on the net, you'd just write it off as a wacky prank?

I don't see this guy complaining

 

[B!TCH]

Deportation back to India? You as cold as ice, judge.

 

[sangreal]

I still don't think it was as big of a deal as it turned out to be. Had he known that his roommate would have killed himself, I seriously doubt that he'd have done it. I'm sure he just thought that it was funny and that he'd have a verbal argument with this stranger that he was assigned to live with.

This would be a justifiable sentence had this guy been an openly homophobic bigot with a history of discrimination.

Was any evidence even presented that the suicide was related? I seem to recall that he left no note. I only followed the case when it was first (mis)reported

 

[Pachterballs]

convict his ass.

 

[sangreal]

So if someone secretly taped you having sex and then dumped it on the net, you'd just write it off as a wacky prank?

Well, that didn't happen for starters. No recording or broadcast was actually made (except the "test" which he broadcast to himself/girlfriend)

 

[freddy]

Ravi turned down a plea deal offered by Middlesex County prosecutors that would have allowed him to avoid jail time in exchange for undergoing counseling, doing 600 hours of community service and disposing of any information that could identify the man who appeared in the web video with Clementi.

Derp?

 

[OverHeat]

The guy was ashame of being gai or what? I could not care less if someone posted a makeout session between me a girl.

 

[Count Dookkake]

The guy was ashame of being gai or what? I could not care less if someone posted a makeout session between me a girl.

Derr.

 

[Trojita]

Thanks mod for the thread title fix!

 

[apana]

Well, that didn't happen for starters. No recording or broadcast was actually made (except the "test" which he broadcast to himself/girlfriend)

I think he also did something else. Maybe tried to get video of him a second time? I don't remember the details.

The guy was ashame of being gai or what? I could not care less if someone posted a makeout session between me a girl.

Nobody would be ashamed of being Gai.

 

[brucewaynegretzky]

Overreactions are overreaction. This kid got screwed because his roommate killed himself. Ravi was a shitty roommate and pretty crappy person overall, but this is such bullshit. If we held EVERYONE to the same standard that Ravi is being subjected to we would have A LOT more convictions for privacy violations. Hell most freshman dorms would basically become entrapment for 18 year olds. This is an overprosecution by a DA who took advantage of a sympathetic situation where a kid tragically took his own life, which should not be blamed entirely (or even mostly) on Ravi.

PS Clementi's mom didn't exactly support him when he came out to her months before the suicide. There were plenty of motivators for Tyler.

 

[btkadams]

The guy was ashame of being gai or what? I could not care less if someone posted a makeout session between me a girl.

it's a MYSTERY!

 

[backflip10019]

The guy was ashame of being gai or what? I could not care less if someone posted a makeout session between me a girl.

No, he killed himself because he was proud to be gay.

 

[Trojita]

I updated the OP with the charges.

 

[Taco_Human]

Deported to India? Lol.

 

[Escape Goat]

Bye, Ravi. Your parents must be so proud.

 

[RawPower]

Ravi is a piece of shit, don't get me wrong. But deportation back to India? Really?

 

[Freshmaker]

I think he also did something else. Maybe tried to get video of him a second time? I don't remember the details.

He was claiming that he was going to stream the next session live.

Overreactions are overreaction. This kid got screwed because his roommate killed himself. Ravi was a shitty roommate and pretty crappy person overall, but this is such bullshit. If we held EVERYONE to the same standard that Ravi is being subjected to we would have A LOT more convictions for privacy violations. Hell most freshman dorms would basically become entrapment for 18 year olds. This is an overprosecution by a DA who took advantage of a sympathetic situation where a kid tragically took his own life, which should not be blamed entirely (or even mostly) on Ravi.

You make it sound like privacy is a bad thing.

 

[twobear]

Ravi is a piece of shit, don't get me wrong. But deportation back to India? Really?

isn't that pretty much standard fare for illegal acts committed by people on visas?

 

[Barrett2]

Shoulda taken that plea. lol.

 

[LJ11]

Shoulda taken that plea. lol.

Yeah, if that deal was actually on the table he's crazy for not taking it.

 

[Trojita]

So did it ever come to light whether he really did broadcast the feed to the internet?

Supposedly he also sent a text message to Clementi before he died.

Ravi had apparently tried to make amends with his estranged roommate that same night, according to text messages revealed in court.

"I've known you were gay and I have no problem with it," Ravi wrote said in messages sent after he apparently learned his roommate had requested a dormitory room change.

 

[piddledy]

He was claiming that he was going to stream the next session live.



You make it sound like privacy is a bad thing.

If the guy hadn't killed himself, this would have been a matter settled by the university.

 

[RumblingRosco]

Shoulda taken that plea. lol.

Yeah seriously, that plea, albeit 600 hours or whatever, is still not bad if he knew it was between that or possibly facing jail time. Dumb person.

 

[brucewaynegretzky]

You make it sound like privacy is a bad thing.

No I make it sound like this is a cherry picked case that we would never litigate against most people because it would be a waste of resources. Instead we go after the guy whose roommate killed himself. The circumstances are unfortunate, but no more criminal than a million other things that happen everyday that we turn our heads to because it would be unrealistic for them to get prosecuted. Hell most illegal shit that goes on in college dorms gets handled by residential services.

EDIT: The hate crime aspect is just laughable. It's pretty clear that there was no intent to induce fear. They were two roommates who didn't get along. Ravi was making fun of Clementi in his online trail well before he knew Clementi was gay.

 

[sangreal]

So did it ever come to light whether he really did broadcast the feed to the internet?

Yes, it is accepted fact that he did not. The defense says he turned his computer off, and the prosecutor says Clementi did.

I believe the latter is true, since at the time of the incident there were forum posts allegedly from Clementi saying as much.

 

[Songbird]

EDIT: The hate crime aspect is just laughable. It's pretty clear that there was no intent to induce fear. They were two roommates who didn't get along. Ravi was making fun of Clementi in his online trail well before he knew Clementi was gay.

The supposed intention to stream and share additional footage wasn't meant to induce fear? It seemed to have that effect.

 

[Tenks]

His thought process always struck me as odd. Ok so your room mate is gay. So you are going to tape him having gay sex to show how gay he is. Got ya.

 

[Qwomo]

No, he killed himself because he was proud to be gay.

haha

 

[brucewaynegretzky]

The supposed intention to stream and share additional footage wasn't meant to induce fear? It seemed to have that effect.

It wasn't related to Clementi's sexual orientation though. It was aimed at he had a roommate he wanted to expose having sex. Irregardless of orientation. I knew people who busted in on roommates having sex in undergrad too. Had nothing to do with orientation.

 

[giga]

Ravi turned down a plea deal offered by Middlesex County prosecutors that would have allowed him to avoid jail time in exchange for undergoing counseling, doing 600 hours of community service and disposing of any information that could identify the man who appeared in the web video with Clementi.

Why would you not do this…

 

[brucewaynegretzky]

Why would you not do this…

Because he didn't want to plead guilty....?

 

[Stinkles]

Why would you not do this…

amazing.

 

[j_k_redtail]

Shit happens.

You can't predict how shit will happen, so it's in your best interest to think before undertaking a series of actions against a person and their privacy.

Here's hoping more shit happens and continues to happen to this joker.

We have a winner. Well put.

"I didn't know he would kill himself." So?

 

[GungHo]

Ravi is a piece of shit, don't get me wrong. But deportation back to India? Really?

Yes. That's what happens when you commit crimes when you're here on an H1. First they put you in prison. Then they put you on a plane. They don't count the time you serve in prison as residency, either. A lot of kids on H1s get the fear of God put in them regarding what it means if they commit a crime while they're here, to the point where they're scared to get speeding tickets.

 

[brucewaynegretzky]

We have a winner. Well put.

"I didn't know he would kill himself." So?

The kid killing himself is legally irrelevant to the conviction I'm pretty sure. What IS relevant is the motivation. And all the evidence suggested it was because he disliked Clementi, not because he disliked gays.

 

[Stinkles]

Because he didn't want to plead guilty....?

Well, how did that work out for him?

 

[Barrett2]

Why would you not do this…

My understanding is that his parents felt that because the over-zealous prosecutor had thrown so many charges against Ravi, his life would basically be ruined if he plead and had those crimes on his record.

I can't believe they didn't back down. I'll give them credit for sticking to their guns, but ultimately they should have realized their kid was fucked either way. Either he has this stuff on his record and will be a pariah the rest of his life, or go to prison for 10 years.

 

[Sho_Nuff82]

I was reading the updates on CNN the other day and I could not believe this clown didn't cop the plea after his friend from HS sold him out to the DA's office. What terrible legal advice was his lawyer giving him?

600 hrs of community service vs 10 years and deportation isn't a hard decision at all.

brucewaynegretzky, just because illegal shit gets a slap on the wrist at universities all the time doesn't mean it's a good idea to keep doing it.

This kid got screwed because his roommate killed himself.

Yeah, his roommate offed himself because he was a cruel asshole, and he's the victim, right. How fucking backwards do your morals have to be on bullying to post that tripe?

The kid killing himself is legally irrelevant to the conviction I'm pretty sure. What IS relevant is the motivation. And all the evidence suggested it was because he disliked Clementi, not because he disliked gays.

Explain the Twitter posts and text messages then.

Ravi said that he was "creeped out" by the September 19 romantic encounter between Clementi and another man, which he suggested he witnessed -- via his hidden camera -- with several others.

"Keep the gays away," he wrote, according to a text message that was shown on a screen in the courtroom.

 

[Special J]

roommates can be annoying. and the fact that they're in a shared space like that would you want someone doing that in a small ass dorm room?

 

[kehs]

Because he didn't want to plead guilty....?

You don't necessarily have to plead guilty for a plea agreement.

 

[brucewaynegretzky]

I was reading the updates on CNN the other day and I could not believe this clown didn't cop the plea after his friend from HS sold him out to the DA's office. What terrible legal advice was his lawyer giving him?

600 hrs of community service vs 10 years and deportation isn't a hard decision at all.

brucewaynegretzky, just because illegal shit gets a slap on the wrist at universities all the time doesn't mean it's a good idea to keep doing it.

Yeah, his roommate offed himself because he was a cruel asshole, and he's the victim, right. How fucking backwards do your morals have to be on bullying to post that tripe?

Wait you think he killed himself because of Ravi? Not because his mother gave him a lukewarm reception when he came out that devastated him, he had very few friends, or a million other things? It was Ravi. Got it. Let's saddle him with the blame.

You're missing the point here. I'm saying Ravi is getting held to a different standard. That's the bottom line. I don't think it's reasonably possible to disagree with that. If you're cool with WHY he got that standard... well then whatever. I think you're going more off emotion than any sort of rational analysis though.

And what Twitter posts? He was making fun of Clementi prior to finding out he was gay. His orientation was just another element.

 

[TheSeks]

Guy's an asshole for doing that so I have no issues with the verdict and the possible sentencing.

I do. Ten years is a drop in the bucket and him being deported back to India is just a slap on the wrist for the fact he basically killed another kid for being gay.