YosemiteHam
Member
It only "sells well" in relation to its budget...
You do realize that's good, right? Selling well in relation to a game's budget is success to literally everyone except EA, Activision, Ubisoft, and Square Enix.
It only "sells well" in relation to its budget...
Ease up on the Saturday morning anime tropes and designs.
Less moe pandering.
Better writing.
The thread is about popularity, not profitability.You do realize that's good, right? Selling well in relation to a game's budget is success to literally everyone except EA, Activision, Ubisoft, and Square Enix.
It's sold around 2.3 million. That's not Skyrim level, but that's still pretty good.Did that really sell well in the west?
I know it has a big hardcore following online. But I assumed it was just a niche title--for more casual/mainstream gamers like me who are aware of it like me, the difficulty is a big turn off.
I understand your point, and agree to an extent, there are gooduns out there but compared to the output of previous gens jrpgs just ain't what they used to be. It would be hard to argue that moe pandering isn't becoming more prevalent in the genre.None of those are moe, except for Neptunia, which falls into that weird subcategory of JRPGs that doesn't represent the genre at all. And for every disappointment like FFXIII there's a stellar Last Story, Ni no Kuni, Valkyria Chronicles, Lost Odyssey, etc.
Yup, they'd have to jettison much of what makes them appealing to their current fans. I don't think Bandai-Namco, Square-Enix, etc... want to destroy their current fanbases to risk appealing to people who don't have an interest in the genre.
JRPGs were never as popular in the west as some people seem to suggest, outside of Final Fantasy and Pokemon. The impression that JRPGs have fallen from relevancy seems to come from Square Enix's shitty output this gen.
Turn-based combat and JRPGs don't inherently go together. I've actually seen complaints on GAF and elsewhere that too many JRPGs don't use turn-based systems anymore.
You do realize that's good, right? Selling well in relation to a game's budget is success to literally everyone except EA, Activision, Ubisoft, and Square Enix.
What about localize them first ?
I understand your point, and agree to an extent, there are gooduns out there but compared to the output of previous gens jrpgs just ain't what they used to be. It would be hard to argue that moe pandering isn't becoming more prevalent in the genre.
Also, is VC even really an rpg? Isn't it more of a strategy game?
Ease up on the Saturday morning anime tropes and designs.
Less moe pandering.
Better writing.
and this is a problem how?
Yeah, what he said.This whole theory might just be based on my personal preferences but here we go:
TL;DR: More stuff like Megaten, Ivalice, Yakuza, Metal Gear, and seinen manga. Less FFXIII and other stuff that falls on the same shonen tropes over and over. Basically, try to make more JRPGs for the 16-35 demographic. Japan is definitely capable of it. Maybe if they hire more professional writers in that area.
Long version: Japanese developers making RPGs for the west in my opinion should do one thing and one thing only -- recognize that people who play RPGs in the west are mostly adults and not teenagers.
Most JRPGs are still mainly made for Japanese audineces a a lot of the time that means kids and teenagers, and at most people in their 20's. A lot of that stuff falls into the shonen area (which I imagine is the most popular sector of manga in Japan). I'm not saying that stuff is bad, it's just not a great fit for the majority western console gamers.
But there are a number of Japanese video game and other media franchises that seem to be written for older audiences and as a result get a bit more notoriety in the west, or at least more critical acclaim. In anime stuff like Akria and Ghost in the Shell are the most famous examples, the latter of which I think at one time was more popular in the US than in Japan. In manga you have Berserk. I think Kojima has admitted Metal Gear also makes more money in the west than in Japan.
In RPGs specifically people have lauded Final Fantasy Tactics and the other games in Yasumi Matsuno's Ivalice universe for the maturity in their narratives, or at least their dialogue, characters, and worlds. The same goes for games like Dark Souls.
Another good example is Yakuza which leverages professional writing. Yes its intensely Japanese setting has limited its western sales potential, but western critics have still praised the narrative in each game, some of which I believe were written by an actual Japanese crime novelist. Contrast that to Toriyama's writing in FFXIII.
Big western developers have been contracting professional writers for a while now, but in most of those games the story is more like window dressing. Japanese developers seem much more prone to letting the story drive drive the game, especially in RPGs, so I think one written by a professional writer (not the people who do those light novels) on the level of Haruki Murakami (1Q84) would benefit a lot. JRPG developers have often gotten manga artists to design characters. Why not have them write the stories too?
I definitely don't think JRPG developers should change their gameplay too much. JRPGs are already incredibly unique from one another anyway. That's really a game-to-game case. Some games are action-oriented, some games are turn-based. That's an area where they need to stick to what they're good at.
Too many attractive women. They need to replace them all with bald bad ass dudes
In the west? Is that really true? I honestly don't know what the sales figures are.JRPGs are unpopular? Since when? They're doing just fine.
Saying JRPGs need to be less childish/moe because of Neptunia is like saying shooters need to be less buggy/incoherent because of Aliens: Colonial Marines.Seriously, this is the problem. Fucking moe bullshit. Any medium or genre that wants to be taken seriously by people over the age of 8 can't have this childish shit in it. Also the names need to be... well, not terrible. "Hyperdimension Neptunia." What? Why?
Now tell him to go back to Call of Duty or Madden.Nice picking out a game no one with taste would ever even touch. Sounds great to make disparaging remarks about a whole genre! What's next? Oh, I know, the entire first person shooter genre sucks because of ZenoClash.
Tell me, what was the last jrpg you bought.
I bet it started with the letter F.
Ease up on the Saturday morning anime tropes and designs.
Less moe pandering.
Better writing.
JRPGs are unpopular? Since when? They're doing just fine.
Many games that game out are just flat out bad tho.
Pretty much this. JRPGs were never as prevalent as fans make them to be in the west.
Seriously, this is the problem. Fucking moe bullshit. I can't even play most JRPGs from the last decade or so because it's flat out embarrassing. Any medium or genre that wants to be taken seriously by people over the age of 8 can't have this childish shit in it. Also the names need to be... well, not terrible. "Hyperdimension Neptunia." What? Why?
Basically, remove the obvious incompatible Japanese cultural stuff from the games.
The older games worked because the Japaneseness of them wasn't as obvious. When the fidelity got so good that they could create their imaginary anime idols and J-pop stars in all their "glory" it became off-putting. Nobody can relate to these characters in the west. Nobody wants to be these characters in the west.
Jrpgs can still be clearly Japanese without resorting to being overtly anime.JRPG survived in the West in the Nintendo era and the Playstation era because back then you couldn't really see how anime it was since graphics were low then. but since graphics have increased, West are not interested in "anime-rpg" games.
basically, be less "anime", but then that disrupts your eastern market and makes them believe you are pandering more to the West. so its kinda a Win-Lose situation, imo.
I kinda hope SE goes under
JRPG survived in the West in the Nintendo era and the Playstation era because back then you couldn't really see how anime it was since graphics were low then. but since graphics have increased, West are not interested in "anime-rpg" games.
basically, be less "anime", but then that disrupts your eastern market and makes them believe you are pandering more to the West. so its kinda a Win-Lose situation, imo.
Seriously, this is the problem. Fucking moe bullshit. I can't even play most JRPGs from the last decade or so because it's flat out embarrassing. Any medium or genre that wants to be taken seriously by people over the age of 8 can't have this childish shit in it. Also the names need to be... well, not terrible. "Hyperdimension Neptunia." What? Why?
My opinion is that I would like them to localize more JRPG's and when they do, also localize the damn titles. The words Ni No Kuni have no meaning here nor does Shin Megami Tensei.
I'm not sure if hating XIII/XIV is a good enough qualification for hoping a few hundred people lose their jobs or get shackled to making social/mobile games for 10 years
I love the posters saying to remove the the things that the most popular JPRGs have.
What do I need to be a card carrying member of Jrpg gaf to post in this thread and have my opinion counted?Given your initial post in the thread about moe and cartooon tropes, I don't even have to guess your last jrpg. You certainly don't show up in jrpg threads. I wonder why your voice is suddenly one of relevance despite so obviously not playing the genre you're discussing?
JRPG survived in the West in the Nintendo era and the Playstation era because back then you couldn't really see how anime it was since graphics were low then. but since graphics have increased, West are not interested in "anime-rpg" games.
basically, be less "anime", but then that disrupts your eastern market and makes them believe you are pandering more to the West. so its kinda a Win-Lose situation, imo.
Mario anything sells in the westMario & Luigi games do pretty well in the West don't they?
Sometimes I wonder if the people who say things like this actually play JRPGs.