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Wii 2 (Project Cafe): Officially Announced, Playable At E3, Launching 2012 [Updated]

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I

Instro

Member
PantherLotus said:
Not at all. I'm saying that they don't build their systems to fit 3rd party needs or wishes, like Sony and Microsoft. They have little need for exclusives 3rd party titles, not that they won't try for them or that 3rd parties won't pursue them.I'm just saying that Nintendo isn't building Wii2 so they can finally get all that magical 3rd party support we've been waiting for.

If it comes, it will be because Nintendo makes a system which makes financial sense for 3rd parties to pursue, and by financial sense I mean focuses on and has a sizable version of their target segmented audiences, has hardware that makes for easier ports, and has a nice profit/licensing model that makes sense for their projected sales.
Click to expand...

Hm Im not sure I agree with that. The Wii is really the only console they have developed that specifically ignored 3rd parties, looking at the more recent 3DS it seems like they are more inclined to go after 3rd party support in the coming generation. Hell they've practically moneyhatted Capcom on the 3DS, and have significant 3rd party support coming over the next year. They've also basically locked up the Dragon Quest franchise for their systems.

The revenue lost by not having major 3rd party titles, whether they be exclusives or multiplatform, is hardly something they can ignore. Whether or not they are consulting more with 3rd parties for their hardware design is up in the air, but I would certainly say that at the very least with the 3DS they have shown some initiative when it comes to getting developers on board.

Also if Nintendo does design a system that is easy to work on and easy to port to like you mentioned, wouldnt that be considered building a system to fit 3rd party wishes?
 
F

Freezie KO

Banned
PantherLotus said:
Well, the pointer thing is basically obsolete with touchscreen technology (save the wonky FPS implementations), I think. And maybe I'm wrong, but we've probably seen the peak of motion controls until we have a holodeck.
Click to expand...

I couldn't disagree more. FPS are the best with pointer controls. I'm still enjoying Blops on Wii. And we've only gotten a taste of solid pointer controls in other genres: star-slinging in Mario Galaxy, environmental platforming in Nyxquest, aiming for S&P2, and more.

There's a lot more you can do when you actually have buttons on your pointing device. Also, it's more comfortable than using your left hand to hit buttons and sticks while still holding the whole device steady, so your right hand can use the stylus on the touchscreen controller.

As for motion in general, I'm not as big a fan, but I wouldn't mind a game mixing Red Steel 2 controls and combat with an overall better game. And let's wait to see what Nintendo does with Skyward Sword.
 
P

Poyunch

Member
Eww I hated that mockup. I hope that's not what Cafe really looks like. It looks really cheap. The plastic and the design. At least the Wii glowed and was super small.

edit: Ah it's fake. It's hard to catch up when there are two threads that have pages popping up so quickly.
 
I

IchigoSharingan

Member
please Nintendo use at least an R770. Turn that 55nm into 45nm with the revamped GPU design.

get me some GDDR5 up in this bitch! Give the Stream some mother fucking balls!
 
L

Lupin the Third

Member
PantherLotus said:
@John Tinker: posted, fake, no wires, nice render based on the IGN "leak"
Click to expand...

Pretty sure the earlier renders (fake "leaked document" photos that were posted a thousand times that showed off controllers) came out before IGN commented on the "SNES-looking hardware design." And I don't remember them coming from IGN, either.
 
G

Gamer @ Heart

Member
PantherLotus said:
@John Tinker: posted, fake, no wires, nice render based on the IGN "leak"



Oh, ok. I was basing mine off of reality.
Click to expand...
But what you described is perfect for attracting third parties. How would none of that be catering to third parties? Eh, i guess i interpreted your post wrong, you are coming off as slightly aggressive so ill drop it.
 
A

Ashodin

Member
I could do a little "pre-game" show where I could go over all the facts, talk about stupid renders and print them out and draw doodles on them, and do crazy stuff while ignoring the chatroom!
 
Pimpbaa

Pimpbaa

Member
Freezie KO said:
I couldn't disagree more. FPS are the best with pointer controls.
Click to expand...

Pointer controls are only good for on rails shooters. It's clumsy and slow in a real FPS (when trying to navigate, not aim).
 
G

Gamer @ Heart

Member
Pimpbaa said:
Pointer controls are only good for on rails shooters. It's clumsy and slow in a real FPS.
Click to expand...
Not if tweeked right. Sadly, its annoying and slightly time consuming to do that in every game, if it even allows it.
 
K

Krowley

Member
Lupin the Wolf said:
Pretty sure the earlier renders (fake "leaked document" photos that were posted a thousand times that showed off controllers) came out before IGN commented on the "SNES-looking hardware design." And I don't remember them coming from IGN, either.
Click to expand...


They didn't. They just got posted in the same thread as the IGN hardware rumor.
 
B

Beth Cyra

Member
Pimpbaa said:
Pointer controls are only good for on rails shooters. It's clumsy and slow in a real FPS.
Click to expand...

This idea is why I couldn't stand to listen to any more podcasts because I kept hearing people try to say this and I couldn't disagree more. Prime 3 would have been awful with dual analog compared to the pointer controls it had.
 
S

ShockingAlberto

Member
Pimpbaa said:
Pointer controls are only good for on rails shooters. It's clumsy and slow in a real FPS.
Click to expand...
Not to say you're wrong, but I am not sure you've used it in a game that does it well.

Like all things, it comes down to design. Dual-analogs and even mice can be terrible if the developer fucks things up enough and fails to provide options for fixing it. Sadly, this is what a lot of Wii FPSes did for the first few years.
 
L

Lupin the Third

Member
Already posted?

From WarioWorld.com (via a couple Nintendo fansites):
cafe_high.jpg

https://www.warioworld.com/images/splash/cafe_high.jpg

Who's a cute lil Nintendo bunny?
 
A

abstract alien

Member
That shit would be like gold if the sides do detach into separate controllers to mimic the wiimote style. I would miss the nunchuck though....damn its comfortable as hell :^(
 
L

Luigiv

Member
Freezie KO said:
I couldn't disagree more. FPS are the best with pointer controls. I'm still enjoying Blops on Wii. And we've only gotten a taste of solid pointer controls in other genres: star-slinging in Mario Galaxy, environmental platforming in Nyxquest, aiming for S&P2, and more.

There's a lot more you can do when you actually have buttons on your pointing device. Also, it's more comfortable than using your left hand to hit buttons and sticks while still holding the whole device steady, so your right hand can use the stylus on the touchscreen controller.

As for motion in general, I'm not as big a fan, but I wouldn't mind a game mixing Red Steel 2 controls and combat with an overall better game. And let's wait to see what Nintendo does with Skyward Sword.
Click to expand...
Well I'd take a touchpad over a pointer for FPS's but yeah pointers definitely have the advantage when it comes to cursor control.
 
Pimpbaa

Pimpbaa

Member
Gamer @ Heart said:
Not if tweeked right. Sadly, its annoying and slightly time consuming to do that in every game, if it even allows it.
Click to expand...

I could never get MAG to feel right. And I really tried to get that tweaked right. Aiming was fine but moving around was terrible.
 
I

Instro

Member
Soulscribe said:
How much will a controller cost then? Jesus.

Otherwise I'm game.
Click to expand...

$60 maybe? The screen is the most expensive piece, but I dont see why it would be super expensive. I doubt Nintendo wants to sell it at a overly high price either so they would probably sell it relatively close to cost.
 
K

Krowley

Member
TruePrime said:
This idea is why I couldn't stand to listen to any more podcasts because I kept hearing people try to say this and I couldn't disagree more. Prime 3 would have been awful with dual analog compared to the pointer controls it had.
Click to expand...

This is true, but if prime 3 hadn't been designed around pointer controlls at all, it would have been even better (and I say this as a moderate fan of the pointer)

The emphasis on shooting dozens of weak enemies and aiming at everything was a distraction, and one of the reasons it pales compared to the first and second games.
 
P

PantherLotus

Professional Schmuck
Instro said:
Hm Im not sure I agree with that. The Wii is really the only console they have developed that specifically ignored 3rd parties, looking at the more recent 3DS it seems like they are more inclined to go after 3rd party support in the coming generation. Hell they've practically moneyhatted Capcom on the 3DS, and have significant 3rd party support coming over the next year. They've also basically locked up the Dragon Quest franchise for their systems.

The revenue lost by not having major 3rd party titles, whether they be exclusives or multiplatform, is hardly something they can ignore. Whether or not they are consulting more with 3rd parties for their hardware design is up in the air, but I would certainly say that at the very least with the 3DS they have shown some initiative when it comes to getting developers on board.

Also if Nintendo does design a system that is easy to work on and easy to port to like you mentioned, wouldnt that be considered building a system to fit 3rd party wishes?
Click to expand...

1. The Wii is the only console that ignored 3rd parties? I think you're overlooking more or less the entire history of Nintendo, where Nintendo designed their consoles and the 3rd parties had to follow suit. Only after the PS1 were their feelings/thoughts ever considered, and even then only remotely.

2. I wonder how DQ was "locked up." Was it based on an agreement, a contract? Or off momentum? Off current sales at the time of the decision? Looking at ... basically every DQ ever made, I'm going with the latter.

3. Hey, I'm not saying they're not making a more-outsider-friendly console. I'm not saying that at all. But I AM saying that they're not designing anything with that purpose in mind as a first objective. I say this often, but maybe I'm so wrong I should be fired on the spot. Maybe the Wii was made to differentiate their brand and the Wii2 is made to get everyone else on board? That's possible, I guess, but designing yet another interface doesn't seem like the way to do that.

4. Nintendo, consulting with 3rd parties on hardware decisions? LMAO.
 
N

neoanarch

Member
JohnTinker said:
?

http://i.imgur.com/vCyqE.jpg[/img]

http://i.imgur.com/G7vpv.jpg[/img]


EDIT: see they've been posted. someone has a LOT of time
Click to expand...


No disc drive and no shots from behind. Totally fake.
 
C

carlo6529

Member
PantherLotus said:
I'm sure they will be back -- on the touchscreen.
Click to expand...

My whole argument is based on the fact that the system will be compatible with Wii.

What your saying can't be done without eliminating using the big screen tv altogether for exsisting Wii games. For example, how are you supposed to click on the touch screen in the right spot to shoot someone while still looking at the tv screen. Looking up then down constantly in that type of situation is not practical.

Unless the controller screen can detect a stylus hovering just above it so a cursor can be seen on the television, I don't see pointer controls being eliminated; and even then, thats new controls that wouldn't be compatible.
 
D

DXB-KNIGHT

Member
I hope there is at least the option for pointer controls since I can't stand going back to play FPS games with two analog sticks.
 
P

-Pyromaniac-

Member
Maybe it's just me but the screen thing seems like one of those neat features that I end up using once in a blue moon. Seems like it's gonna take up a lot of the controller though :/ I guess I can hope for good uses of it to enhance gaming normally (on the tv).

Just thinking out loud.
 
B

Beth Cyra

Member
Krowley said:
This is true, but if prime 3 hadn't been designed around pointer controlls at all, it would have been even better (and I say this as a moderate fan of the pointer)

The emphasis on shooting dozens of weak enemies and aiming at everything was a distraction, and one of the reasons it pales compared to the first and second games.
Click to expand...
I didn't have to do that, you could avoid almost everything pretty easily, I just chose to.

I personally think Prime 3 is a far better game then 1 or 2 are in pretty much everyway.
 
Pimpbaa

Pimpbaa

Member
TruePrime said:
This idea is why I couldn't stand to listen to any more podcasts because I kept hearing people try to say this and I couldn't disagree more. Prime 3 would have been awful with dual analog compared to the pointer controls it had.
Click to expand...

I loved Prime 3, but I never felt it controlled any better than a game using dual analog. Neither are optimal for the genre anyway, so it's a moot point.
 
A

Ashodin

Member
Yep totally doing a webstream tomorrow night. Deets and times of funtimes and awesomehappenstance will be relayed within this thread. Then you get to watch me watch the internet and react with first-hand audio speculation of what I think about what was talked about.
 
J

Jarmel

Banned
This sounds so implausible. Can anyone explain to me how a console could stream 3200x2000 pixels at once without the games looking like absolute garbage?
 
C

Chet Rippo

Member
GoldenEye 007 said:
It's in the first post...
Click to expand...
I think he means that specific image, which is slightly different hen the other Wario one. Being smaller and showing more of the cup. Though I suppose by the time I type this out someone would have already answered this...
 
I

IchigoSharingan

Member
So the controller can stream games....

video and audio right?

Wonder what else it'll stream.... Nintendo must have put a ton of R&D into the streaming tech. Wonder if the big surprise is buried in there.
 
T

TheHeretic

Banned
ShockingAlberto said:
Not to say you're wrong, but I am not sure you've used it in a game that does it well.

Like all things, it comes down to design. Dual-analogs and even mice can be terrible if the developer fucks things up enough and fails to provide options for fixing it. Sadly, this is what a lot of Wii FPSes did for the first few years.
Click to expand...

The Wiimote has a problem with turning in FPS, so the accuracy from a standing position is higher than dual sticks, lower than a mouse but actual movement always felt clumsy and slow. I don't really accept the proposition that it was a great setup for FPS, or even significantly better than dual sticks.
 
Pimpbaa

Pimpbaa

Member
Gamer @ Heart said:
Do you feel the issue was speed or the bounding box size?
Click to expand...

I fiddled with both, couldn't find any setting I felt comfortable with. I could aim good as long as people were in my field of view. But anyone behind me and I would get owned.
 
D

DXB-KNIGHT

Member
Jarmel said:
This sounds so implausible. Can anyone explain to me how a console could stream 3200x1600 pixels at once without the games looking like absolute garbage?
Click to expand...
This is what I thought when Nintendo announced 3D screens w/o glasses but it was possible.
 
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