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[BeEatNU]

Warlock.

Most of the Hunter changes make them really fucking annoying in a PUG battleground and not much else.

Although I want to choke you dorks who keep talking about your class being ignored. Four classes are not properly present in the Alpha, because they're still under extensive development. Unsure why Rogue is missing, but I figured Shamans, Paladins and Hunters would be absent at first, as they probably need mechanic make overs if Blizzard wants to continue to push their Arenas.

Back to business; man I'm starting to want a DK. Such cool shit has been shown lately.

Bleh, we need something to balance our our lame ass standardized pets. People bitched and moan about our pets attack speed and running speed now all of them are the same. Once again, Hunters has probably had the most changes to them EVER!

 

[FDLink]

Bleh, we need something to balance our our lame ass standardized pets. People bitched and moan about our pets attack speed and running speed now all of them are the same. Once again, Hunters has probably had the most changes to them EVER!

All pets need better scaling, with hit, crit, haste, resilience, etc. Having your pet killed as a Hunter or Warlock sucks.

 

[Scrow]

Feral

* King of the Jungle (new) - While Enraged in Bear Form or Dire Bear Form, your damage is increased by 5/10/15%, and your Tiger's Fury ability also instantly restores 20/40/60 energy.

love the buff tiger's fury is getting

* Berserk - Changed.
o Old: Removes all Stun, Fear, Snare and Movement Impairing Effects and increases your energy regeneration rate by 100% while in Cat form, and increases your total health by 20% while in Bear form. After the effect ends, the health is lost. Effect lasts 20 seconds.
o New: Reduces the energy cost of your Cat form abilities by 50% while in Cat form, and increases your total health by 30% and causes your Mangle (Bear) and Maul abilities hit up to 3 maximum targets while in Bear form or Dire Bear form. Berserk instantly clears all effects which cause loss of control of your character, and makes you immune to them for the duration. Lasts 20 sec.

awesome

* Lock Jaw (new) - Finishing move that stuns the target and deals damage. Lasts longer per combo point: x points: x+1 seconds (level 75)

this seems really imbal. maim was a nicely balanced CC finisher move... this is a bit much. i don't want feral druids turning into a stunlocking rogue with teeth.

 

[Fonds]

myeh... no.

Sorry WoW lost it for me. Played it for 3 and half years and I loved it all during that time.
But expansions and patches were becoming more 'n more repetative. Plus I hate the fact this game became easier and easier, too much kiddy oriented in the end. Time for something else.

Time for Age of Conan for me.

 

[Fularu]

Yea I'm sure that's it.... Obviously just the most skilled players all play Rogues/Druid/Warriors.

The two classes/spec you find the most players/idiots playing them are hunters and ret pallies. Which is why it's extremely difficult to find good ones.

Unfortunately any idiot can spam harmstring and MS and get to 2k ratings with a competent Druid partner. On the other hand, stupid rogues or stupid druids won't do anything worthwhile in Arena.

Don't blame the class, plenty of extremely skilled hunters have proved that the class is more than fine for high end arena, the huge lack of skills in the base shouldn.t be used as a proof that the class is Underpowered.

 

[Alex]

Age of Conan is pretty fun, but there's not much of a chance with how it's going that I'm going to be playing it more than a couple months. Also, I have to say I'm not exactly seeing it for the innovative flower some other people seem to, it's pretty much the standard gauntlet of leveling and world pvp a launch MMO has. It has some nice novelty concepts but that's not as nice as it should be when a bunch of the core game isn't there.

Big problem for me is when most of my friends cannot run it, and half of the ones that can already, and very easily capped all of the content in the game or were dissuaded by some of the larger bugs/missing content went back to WoW or back to waiting for Warhammer. Game desperately needed another year of development to get in at least a reasonable clip of the shit they talked about, and squash down on the problems/bugs. Moreso than any MMO I've ever seen.

Also, I have to say that it annoys me when people call WoW easy (especially people who are fans of Conan, the hell?) it's not getting easier, it's getting more accessible to those of us with lives. Let the lifeless EQ nerd philosophies die off already.

I really want to try Warhammer mostly. AoC was more of a random purchase for me, but I've already got cash down on WAR. Although I am more interested in having my fill of LK before I do so.

I'm done talking about other games personally though, I don't want this topic to get too far off kilter. The people in the Conan topic already had to deal with too much of that shit.

A new DK Armor set:

 

[Alex]

The two classes/spec you find the most players/idiots playing them are hunters and ret pallies. Which is why it's extremely difficult to find good ones.

Unfortunately any idiot can spam harmstring and MS and get to 2k ratings with a competent Druid partner. On the other hand, stupid rogues or stupid druids won't do anything worthwhile in Arena.

Don't blame the class, plenty of extremely skilled hunters have proved that the class is more than fine for high end arena, the huge lack of skills in the base shouldn.t be used as a proof that the class is Underpowered.

It depends on the bracket of arena, every class has some niche they do swell in, but on the whole, ultimately Paladins, Shamans and Hunters are the three classes most needing a shot in the arm. That's blatantly obvious and not even up for debate, IMO. Which is probably why those three are all missing in the Alpha Test.

If Blizzard wants to make their arena game more and more popular, they're going to have to allow every class to excel at some ratio in every bracket. Paladin especially is in a really, really sore spot at the moment for anything but an incredibly awkward role in 5v5.

 

[Twig]

Blizzard has the best artists in the business, on the concept side and technical side.

There's no other explanation for a game with an engine as toasterish as World of Warcraft having the amazing graphics that it does.

Truth.

I just wish I had a reason to come back to WoW. With raids still being too stupid (get rid of the fucking trash mobs, no one enjoys that shit) and PvP no longer being fun (ugh, arenas), I'll just be sticking with Age of Conan. Maybe Warhammer if it's good, but for now AoC.

Hell, as a self-proclaimed PvE-hater, if they fixed the raids to all be more like Onyxia (with very minimal or no trash at all), I might just come back to WoW for the raiding. I liked Onyxia! Gruul added too much trash, but I did that once and enjoyed it. The long raids like Karazhan? I know I could like it if it wasn't so boring. Boss fights? Fun. Pulling a bunch of retarded patrols that are nothing but tank 'n' spank every goddamn time? Ugh.

Sucks, too, because I really, really like Warcraft. I always liked it more than Starcraft (not that I don't love Starcraft, too!).

):

While I'm in semi-rant mode:

Paying for expansions for MMOs is fucking stupid. I'm already paying the subscription fee. FURTHERMORE, the core game should be cheaper, or also free. There's no excuse except greedy corporate bastards.

 

[Hero]

While I'm in semi-rant mode:

Paying for expansions for MMOs is fucking stupid. I'm already paying the subscription fee. FURTHERMORE, the core game should be cheaper, or also free. There's no excuse except greedy corporate bastards.

So I guess the thousands of hours of development time by Blizzard for new content in the expansion should just be given away for free? Or all the content you get in patches that is free doesn't count?

You're the one that seems greedy.

As for class balance via arena:

Shamans are horrible in most cases. Enhancement is a joke, elemental is good for the standard 2345, and resto has its places in certain comps. But for the most part an ele shaman will always get gibbed first because of heroism + [NS+EM] CL. Resto falls over to priests who dispel and mana burn them. They really need some help. No CC sucks.

Paladins are almost in the same boat. Prot is lol, ret is okay in certain comps, and holy is only good in 5's where they get CC'd or burned to death.

With hunters.. I really want to say that this is one of the harder classes to balance. Since they're one of the "easier" classes in the game to play in addition to being popular, there's a statistically larger number of "bad" players who don't fully utilize their abilities and demand buffs. However, the smaller number of "good" players can run circles around most people. It's simply stupid and absurd how easy it is for hunters to kill a clothie in a few seconds at max ranged. Also, frost trap aura is probably the most overpowered snare ability in the game. It's a god damn aura, effects multiple people, and has no way of being removed other than crawling out of it while the hunter is free to snipe you. I still am in disbelief how they removed the deadzone from hunters.

 

[Ysiadmihi]

So I guess the thousands of hours of development time by Blizzard for new content in the expansion should just be given away for free? Or all the content you get in patches that is free doesn't count?

The game costs $15 per month to play. The patch content is not free.

All new content in the expansions should be covered by (already ridiculous) subscription fees as well.

 

[Twig]

Kak, how dare you agree with me! O:<

So I guess the thousands of hours of development time by Blizzard for new content in the expansion should just be given away for free? Or all the content you get in patches that is free doesn't count?

You're the one that seems greedy.

Oh, okay.

Because I'm not still paying the subscription fee, right?

I give them $15 a month for a year. You'd think they could dole out that big update without losing any money at all. (And in Blizzard's case, that is definitely true. Maybe not so much for the smaller MMOs.)

EVE does it. Free expansions, I mean. They have far fewer subscribers.

Don't see how I'm being greedy. I already think the subscription fee is too high for MMOs, but I pay anyway.

I appreciate your entirely reasonable response. \:

 

[Zedsdeadbaby]

Kak, how dare you agree with me! O:<

Oh, okay.

Because I'm not still paying the subscription fee, right?

I give them $15 a month for a year. You'd think they could dole out that big update without losing any money at all. (And in Blizzard's case, that is definitely true. Maybe not so much for the smaller MMOs.)

EVE does it. Free expansions, I mean. They have far fewer subscribers.

Don't see how I'm being greedy. I already think the subscription fee is too high for MMOs, but I pay anyway.

I appreciate your entirely reasonable response. \:

The servers cost a phenomenal amount to run. There's also the forums, technical support, games master service, maintenance, upkeep fees, development on Starcraft 2 and Diablo 3 needs to be supported, and way way more. It's also called 'Business' 'revenue stream' and 'making a profit'.

 

[Twig]

The servers cost a phenomenal amount to run. There's also the forums, technical support, games master service, maintenance, upkeep fees, development on Starcraft 2 and Diablo 3 needs to be supported, and way way more. It's also called 'Business' 'revenue stream' and 'making a profit'.

Uh-huh.

So, you're saying that Blizzard is just breaking even right now, with its ten million subscribers?

Doubtful.

 

[Hero]

The game costs $15 per month to play. The patch content is not free.

All new content in the expansions should be covered by (already ridiculous) subscription fees as well.

Kak, how dare you agree with me! O:<

Oh, okay.

Because I'm not still paying the subscription fee, right?

I give them $15 a month for a year. You'd think they could dole out that big update without losing any money at all. (And in Blizzard's case, that is definitely true. Maybe not so much for the smaller MMOs.)

EVE does it. Free expansions, I mean. They have far fewer subscribers.

Don't see how I'm being greedy. I already think the subscription fee is too high for MMOs, but I pay anyway.

I appreciate your entirely reasonable response. \:

Zed already stated it, but let me reiterate. Your "expensive" monthly fee of 15 dollars a month doesn't even pay for ONE Game Master's hourly salary. Now think about how many GM's there are 24/7 and how much bullshit they have to wade through. You open up ONE ticket a month and Blizzard doesn't see any profit off of your "expensive" monthly fee.

Also, do you think maintaining, upkeeping, and adding servers is free? Do you know how much shit there is going on behind the scenes to keep the game up and running?

How about you calculate how many hours you play the game a month and you will see that the cost per hour of you playing WoW is PALTRY compared to other games.

 

[Twig]

How about you calculate how many hours you play the game a month and you will see that the cost per hour of you playing WoW is PALTRY compared to other games.

That is incorrect.

You can play the defensive fanboy all you want, but it won't change how I feel. Disagree, but there's no reason to be so hostile.

 

[Hero]

That is incorrect.

You can play the defensive fanboy all you want, but it won't change how I feel. Disagree, but there's no reason to be so hostile.

I'm not playing defensive fanboy, I'm playing the cards called LOGIC and UNDERSTANDING BUSINESS.

Even if you only played 1 hour a day (which is extremely casual), that's 30 hours (on a short month even!) which equates to 50 cents per hour. How many other games can compare to something like that?

Protip: Don't name a game that has paid DLC.

 

[krzyspc]

That is incorrect.

You can play the defensive fanboy all you want, but it won't change how I feel. Disagree, but there's no reason to be so hostile.

Its because you are ugly. Until you post a pic otherwise my point stands.

I dunno what they are doing with the expansion, it sounds like better filler then AoC until warhammer hits retail.

 

[Twig]

Its because you are ugly. Until you post a pic otherwise my point stands.

I dunno what they are doing with the expansion, it sounds like better filler then AoC until warhammer hits retail.

I'm not playing defensive fanboy, I'm playing the cards called LOGIC and UNDERSTANDING BUSINESS.

'Kay.

 

[Ysiadmihi]

Zed already stated it, but let me reiterate. Your "expensive" monthly fee of 15 dollars a month doesn't even pay for ONE Game Master's hourly salary. Now think about how many GM's there are 24/7 and how much bullshit they have to wade through. You open up ONE ticket a month and Blizzard doesn't see any profit off of your "expensive" monthly fee.

Also, do you think maintaining, upkeeping, and adding servers is free? Do you know how much shit there is going on behind the scenes to keep the game up and running?

Do you really think anyone is ignoring the costs of keeping the game running? You're just looking for an easy way to prove your point :lol

 

[PatzCU]

As for class balance via arena:

Shamans are horrible in most cases. Enhancement is a joke, elemental is good for the standard 2345, and resto has its places in certain comps. But for the most part an ele shaman will always get gibbed first because of heroism + [NS+EM] CL. Resto falls over to priests who dispel and mana burn them. They really need some help. No CC sucks.

Paladins are almost in the same boat. Prot is lol, ret is okay in certain comps, and holy is only good in 5's where they get CC'd or burned to death.

With hunters.. I really want to say that this is one of the harder classes to balance. Since they're one of the "easier" classes in the game to play in addition to being popular, there's a statistically larger number of "bad" players who don't fully utilize their abilities and demand buffs. However, the smaller number of "good" players can run circles around most people. It's simply stupid and absurd how easy it is for hunters to kill a clothie in a few seconds at max ranged. Also, frost trap aura is probably the most overpowered snare ability in the game. It's a god damn aura, effects multiple people, and has no way of being removed other than crawling out of it while the hunter is free to snipe you. I still am in disbelief how they removed the deadzone from hunters.

Well put. I currently play a Ret Pally, and I've found ways to make it work up to a certain point. Unless I have a really well played Druid/Warrior, I'm not likely to see the upper echelons of the 3s bracket. My core group of friends have actually made RetPal/War/Mage/RestoDru/EleSham work pretty well for a 4 dps 5s. Lots of burst and the ability to switch targets very easily to catch the other team's healers off guard. However, I would definitely say Paladin and Shaman both need some work. Both classes are extremely susceptible to CC/Interrupts. I'm hoping Blizzard comes up with a creative way around this, maybe some kind of skill/twitch based window of time to 'counter' a counterspell, who knows. I'm ok with the lack of HoTs, but it needs to be compensated with some CC-averse talents.

As for Hunters, honestly, they just seem ghetto because there are soooo many bad hunters out there. You can jump in a PUG BG, calculate the ratio of hunters, if you have more than 25% in your BG, your team will lose. But in arena, if you encounter a good hunter, it's just ridiculous. We used to pick hunters as a first target, but no longer. They can just lay down their damn frost aura and mock you while they keep you at range the entire fight. Blizzard needs to consider the fact that a good hunter is unbelievably deadly.

 

[Scrow]

Even if you only played 1 hour a day (which is extremely casual), that's 30 hours (on a short month even!) which equates to 50 cents per hour. How many other games can compare to something like that?

counter strike?

team fortress 2?

 

[Scrow]

With hunters.. I really want to say that this is one of the harder classes to balance. Since they're one of the "easier" classes in the game to play in addition to being popular, there's a statistically larger number of "bad" players who don't fully utilize their abilities and demand buffs. However, the smaller number of "good" players can run circles around most people. It's simply stupid and absurd how easy it is for hunters to kill a clothie in a few seconds at max ranged. Also, frost trap aura is probably the most overpowered snare ability in the game. It's a god damn aura, effects multiple people, and has no way of being removed other than crawling out of it while the hunter is free to snipe you. I still am in disbelief how they removed the deadzone from hunters.

arcane shot having a dispel effect is insane too. especially since it dispels and then does its damage... geeze sorry priests and mages, but your shield is now useless against hunters. gg

aimed shot having a mortal strike effect and it's cast time reduced? wtf?!

freezing trap is no longer limited to one target at a time... huh? no really, i don't understand what that means... how does it work? multiple people can be frozen in the same trap?

mend pet buff to dispel all manner of debuffs wasn't necessary.

traps being set in combat is bullshit

no deadzone

combine all this with their insane DPS output and you have the most imbal class in the game.

almost every class has a rock to their scissors. for example on my warlock i'm always scared of warriors and rogues. they walk all over me. but a warlock can usually hold their own against a bunch of other classes. that's called balance.

but is there any class that a hunter is typically "scared" of? does an anti-hunter class exist?

 

[firex]

I kind of feel the opposite about hunters in pvp. I'm just competent with them but that's enough to make me deadly in BGs since they have so many escapes, snares and CC. But before they removed the dead zone it was really easy to los/fuck up their range and make them pretty much useless in arena.

I just wonder what they're going to get in WotLK, because I can't really think of much they'd want to add from Warcraft games aside from immolation/frost arrows. and honestly, frost arrows would be crazy overpowered and immo arrows seem kind of pointless... Maybe that's why Blizzard hasn't revealed anything on them yet. I assume with Paladins they're going to work to make ret more group-friendly in pve and probably buff prot a little more (even though I think prot is almost perfect now) and either ignore holy or potentially redesign the way holy works, since holy is the most crippled by the whole divine shield crap.

As far as shamans go, I'm positive they're retooling the class... probably buffing elemental/redesigning elemental's talents to make them more like the druid balance talents, possibly putting in either some CC of their own or a reliable CC counter (unnerfing grounding totem would help) and hopefully making totems in general a less annoying mechanic to deal with by making the buffs portable somehow.

 

[Scrow]

and hopefully making totems in general a less annoying mechanic to deal with by making the buffs portable somehow.

i've got a possible solution for totems.

they need to make totemic recall actually... you know, recall totems.

currently using totemic recall will consume any active totems and return a portion of their mana cost.

what i'm suggesting is that using totemic recall again will resummon all of the totems it previously destroyed in a single action, only activating GCD once.

so in arenas while still in the preparation area you could place the 4 totems you think you're going to want at the start of the fight. use totemic recall to destroy them. once the fight actually begins you press totemic recall again to resummon the four totems it had last destroyed.

putting out other totems and using totemic recall on them will reset it's "memory" to the new totems you have placed and destroyed.

it's either that or completely retool how shaman buffs are handled.

 

[Alex]

Whatever they change with Shaman, I just hope they keep the class as fun as it is. It certainly needs some tweaks and changes, but I will say despite it's lack of power it's probably my favorite class to play. Looking towards LK, I'm either going to play a Priest or a Resto Shaman for my main character, so I'm pretty eager to see what changes occur.

 

[Ariexv]

arcane shot having a dispel effect is insane too. especially since it dispels and then does its damage... geeze sorry priests and mages, but your shield is now useless against hunters. gg

Several other classes have dispels as well.... hunters is the only one on a CD.

aimed shot having a mortal strike effect and it's cast time reduced? wtf?!

Still incredibly hard to stick on a target that knows what they're doing.... in 2v2s you pretty much to coordinate w/ a Druid so your Aimshot lands as they leave cyclone

freezing trap is no longer limited to one target at a time... huh? no really, i don't understand what that means... how does it work? multiple people can be frozen in the same trap?

It never has been.... since Wow release you've been able to trap multiple targets.

mend pet buff to dispel all manner of debuffs wasn't necessary.

It's done this for a long long time.... it was just channeled before making it useless

traps being set in combat is bullshit

Converting traps from OoC to in combat was a HUGE nerf to any competent hunter, the CD doubled and the 2 sec "arming" time was added.

no deadzone

The deadzone made hunters almost useless in the arena, and you can still get in close and hunters are forced to Melee.

combine all this with their insane DPS output and you have the most imbal class in the game.

Hunters have the lowest "burst DPS" class of almost every single DPS class/spec.

but is there any class that a hunter is typically "scared" of? does an anti-hunter class exist?

A good rogue can destroy a hunter, especially a Shadowstep rogue, a good druid of pretty much any spec can beat a hunter, and a Warrior stands a pretty good chance depending on who gets the drop on who and what CDs are up, Warlocks depends on the spec but usually both the hunter and the lock dies, Mages can beat hunters, Shamans of anything but Enhancement can beat hunters.... Paladins can do a damn good job as well. Hell before Hunters got MS a Paladin could literally sit their and spam heals and a Hunter would run OoM LONG before the paladin dies.




You guys can cry "OP" all you want but at the end of the day Hunters, Along with Paladins and Shamans really need help in pvp. Even Megatf arguably the best hunter in the world will tell you hunters need some serious help.

The only place hunters are even remotely "OP" is battlegrounds and seriously they matter about as much to balance as Deadmines does.

 

[VaLiancY]

but is there any class that a hunter is typically "scared" of? does an anti-hunter class exist?

Everything. I can't say "Oh they got a X coming down, I'm on him, He's dead on arrival" If someone is skillful in their class I'm dead, I have to make sure my Ravager gets into melee range for casters.

I hate Warriors, I can kite but their intercept breaks the snare trap. I hate Rogues, no need to explain. If a Mage can get off that six second cast(Pyroblast), I'm fucked. Ele-Shamans, Chain Lighting crit some how gets me first all the time. With Locks, I can kill them but they take me down with them.

 

[Fularu]

lmao do You even play Wow? So that "most OP class" in the game is one of the lowest used teams in the Arena? The only Pvp zone where balance really even matters..... As for the "Anti-Hunter" class several classes can compete and beat hunters actually... A good rogue with the right CDs can(though a good rogue can beat almost every class 1v1) A warrior has a good chance, A Druid of any kind has a really good chance, as do Shamans.

You guys can cry "OP" all you want but at the end of the day Hunters, Along with Paladins and Shamans really need help in pvp. Even Megatf arguably the best hunter in the world will tell you hunters need some serious help.

No, their players need to learn to play their class.

The term "huntard" isn't used for nothing. The amount of incredibly bad hunters is stagering.

There's very little way to buff the hunter class withotu making it absolutely ridiculously overpowered.

The class went from lousy PVE/PVP abilities at the start of BC to the highest damage dealing class in PVE and one of the scariest class in PVP. They definitely need to be toned down.

(lol at 3.2k DPS on brut with the legendary bow.. And people were crying over 2k DPS dual glaived rogues)

A good rogue can destroy a hunter, especially a Shadowstep rogue, a good druid of pretty much any spec can beat a hunter, and a Warrior stands a pretty good chance depending on who gets the drop on who and what CDs are up, Warlocks depends on the spec but usually both the hunter and the lock dies, Mages can beat hunters, Shamans of anything but Enhancement can beat hunters.... Paladins can do a damn good job as well. Hell before Hunters got MS a Paladin could literally sit their and spam heals and a Hunter would run OoM LONG before the paladin dies.

I think we got it, you are just terrible at PVP

 

[BeEatNU]

No, their players need to learn to play their class.

The term "huntard" isn't used for nothing. The amount of incredibly bad hunters is stagering.

There's very little way to buff the hunter class withotu making it absolutely ridiculously overpowered.

The class went from lousy PVE/PVP abilities at the start of BC to the highest damage dealing class in PVE and one of the scariest class in PVP. They definitely need to be toned down.

(lol at 3.2k DPS on brut with the legendary bow.. And people were crying over 2k DPS dual glaived rogues)



I think we got it, you are just terrible at PVP

Overpowered? LOL!

you should make a Hunter to verify that, and Hunters are just adjusted to whats going on out there, people always complain about Hunters, thus why we had the most changes then any other class IMO.

I've been playing a Hunter since beta so I know how to play my class but its easily mistaken skill for being overpowered. There is not that many "Huntards" that people thing there is but I will agree there is alot of them.

 

[BlackMage]

Uh-huh.

So, you're saying that Blizzard is just breaking even right now, with its ten million subscribers?

Doubtful.

Wait, are you against companies making a profit?

 

[Ariexv]

No, their players need to learn to play their class.

The term "huntard" isn't used for nothing. The amount of incredibly bad hunters is stagering.

There's very little way to buff the hunter class without making it absolutely ridiculously overpowered.

The class went from lousy PVE/PVP abilities at the start of BC to the highest damage dealing class in PVE and one of the scariest class in PVP. They definitely need to be toned down.

(lol at 3.2k DPS on brut with the legendary bow.. And people were crying over 2k DPS dual glaived rogues)

So you went from arguing about Pvp to Pve? So a hunter with a LEGENDARY bow can win in DPS? Just like any rogue w/ Warglaives would dominate up until now? What other classes besides rogue should out DPS hunters?

It's nothing about the hunters that need to learn to play the class, there's the top hunters in the world saying hunters need serious help. The top end of the game is what should be balanced not BGs, World Pvp, or 1500 arena teams. There's incredibly "bad" people in every class, hunters it's just more obvious because a Good hunter has to do remarkably more then any other class to be considered "good"

I think we got it, you are just terrible at PVP

Yep totally, I'm not the best hunter in the world but I played on one of the best WSG teams world-wide Pre-BC, and I've hit 2k+ Post-BC. I've played w/ Megatf and even he will tell you hunters need serious help. I'm guessing you either only World Pvp/battlegrounds or play on a Sub-1800s team with how you seem to think pvp works...

 

[dave is ok]

Hunters need help?

:lol :lol :lol :lol

 

[BlackMage]

Yeah, Hunters suck at arena, but who gives a shit? Arena was the stupidest addition to WoW ever.

 

[Ariexv]

Yeah, Hunters suck at arena, but who gives a shit? Arena was the stupidest addition to WoW ever.

Arena is pretty much the only Place Pvp balance matters ATM, you can complain it was a stupid idea but its what Pvp balance is and should be balanced around.

Even if you hate Arenas though there's no arguing it's miles better then the old Pvp system.

 

[J-Rzez]

You guys can cry "OP" all you want but at the end of the day Hunters, Along with Paladins and Shamans really need help in pvp. Even Megatf arguably the best hunter in the world will tell you hunters need some serious help.

The only place hunters are even remotely "OP" is battlegrounds and seriously they matter about as much to balance as Deadmines does.

I disagree. Hunters are one of the 2 most OP classes in the game atm. Hunters don't necessarily have a solid enough counter, just like druids, and that's the problem. Hunters can easily shut down casters and melee alike. Blizzard kept buffing them to help them in PVE and that in effect influenced PVP. That class is not broken as someone who knows how to play them are almost as unstoppable as Druids. They have the most tricks of the trade, more cc than any other class, and multiple things for use against anyone, plus, they wear mail on top of it.

Druids are absolutely out of control, and there's basically no counter to them. When a Resto class is running around solo killing Wars, Rogues, Mages, Locks, heck everything, there's a major problem with the class.

My personal scale of OP
Druids -------------Hunters-----Priests/Wars/Rogues/locks/Mages ---Pallies --- Shammies.

 

[Ariexv]

I disagree. Hunters are one of the 2 most OP classes in the game atm. Hunters don't necessarily have a solid enough counter, just like druids, and that's the problem. Hunters can easily shut down casters and melee alike. Blizzard kept buffing them to help them in PVE and that in effect influenced PVP. That class is not broken as someone who knows how to play them are almost as unstoppable as Druids. They have the most tricks of the trade, more cc than any other class, and multiple things for use against anyone, plus, they wear mail on top of it.

Druids are absolutely out of control, and there's basically no counter to them. When a Resto class is running around solo killing Wars, Rogues, Mages, Locks, heck everything, there's a major problem with the class.

My personal scale of OP
Druids -------------Hunters-----Priests/Wars/Rogues/locks/Mages ---Pallies --- Shammies.

Yea they're so OP.... A hunters strongest Arena bracket is 2v2....yet looking @ the top 20 teams on bloodlust(Pretty much the #1 Battlegroup) there is exactly 1 hunter on the team thats ranked 16th....who shares half his games w/ a lock.

Also on your list of "OPness" Locks/Rogues/Wars/Shammies can all beat hunters 1v1, and paladins need more help then shamans do.

http://www.wowarmory.com/arena-ladder.xml?b=Bloodlust&ts=2

 

[-tetsuo-]

Uh-huh.

So, you're saying that Blizzard is just breaking even right now, with its ten million subscribers?

Doubtful.

Of course they arent breaking even. How could they continue to make games or run the company if they spents countless man hours running a game for 10 million people and didnt may a profit off of it? Dont forge tthe other projects that they have going as well...

 

[firex]

Whatever they change with Shaman, I just hope they keep the class as fun as it is. It certainly needs some tweaks and changes, but I will say despite it's lack of power it's probably my favorite class to play. Looking towards LK, I'm either going to play a Priest or a Resto Shaman for my main character, so I'm pretty eager to see what changes occur.

yeah, I actually enjoy the class a lot. I just wish it was able to survive the CC onslaught in pvp and I wish elemental/enhance were a bit stronger. Resto is pretty good, especially in arena, it's just annoying in BGs where I run into multiple dispel classes at once.

 

[Twig]

Wait, are you against companies making a profit?

That is exactly what I said.

I am so glad you have such great reading comprehension, otherwise I may have had to explain it to you.

Of course they arent breaking even. How could they continue to make games or run the company if they spents countless man hours running a game for 10 million people and didnt may a profit off of it?

Oh my god...

Why?

WHY?!

 

[Ariexv]

Whatever they change with Shaman, I just hope they keep the class as fun as it is. It certainly needs some tweaks and changes, but I will say despite it's lack of power it's probably my favorite class to play. Looking towards LK, I'm either going to play a Priest or a Resto Shaman for my main character, so I'm pretty eager to see what changes occur.

From the early spell datamining seems like Enhance at the least are getting a pretty decent overhaul, there's spells that look like they could be for shamans that give them a Judgement type system similar to a paladins for melee.

 

[Amankhan]

Even if you hate Arenas though there's no arguing it's miles better then the old Pvp system.

I had tons more fun with pre-BG world PvP. I'm sure someone will post up a long list of reasons why world PvP was imbalanced/unfair/not fun, but regardless I had a lot more fun fighting Alliance in Hillsbrad than I did in any BG or Arena.

 

[Grecco]

Hunters need help? Lol

 

[Alex]

There are actually people who think Hunter is overpowered in Arena? That's almost as horrible as the last guy who was trying to say the fucking Paladin was overpowered.

Hunter is a good battleground class, and has it's nice niche in 5v5 Drain Teams. Outside of that, it's got little, that's problem with several classes though. Representation for 2v2 and 3v3 needs to fly up for Hunter, Paladin and Shaman. Just because they can run around in a PUG BG throwing up mortal shots or sucking out all of the mana of a stupid 5v5 isn't enough to quell a lot of folks.

I absolutely abhor Hunters/Rangers in MMO's, especially in WoW, but I've no problem sticking up for the nitwits for the sake of breaking the continual dropping of cookie cutter arena combos. (that and 2345 or 4 DPS is so much more fun than fucking Drain Teams. I HATE PLAYING ON A DRAIN TEAM)

I don't think it's broken though. I don't think anything is broken though, every class levels well, dungeons well, raids well, bgs well and can do arenas in some method. But it's no fun only being able to do one piece of arena when some classes *coughPriestcough* rule over all brackets with an iron fist.

Fix up the pets, offer something up for more reasonable escapage or anti-LoSing, and you wouldnt really need anymore. But since the current game is on it's way out, it's probably pointless atm.

Hunters are an easy fix though, I'm more interested in seeing what the good ol' Pallies and Shammies get. A new healing model for Pally, some mild CC and a new totem system for Shaman would be beautiful.

 

[Haly]

Nothing revives a WoW thread like a good argument over PvP balance.

 

[Twig]

Nothing revives a WoW thread like a good argument over PvP balance.

There's PvP in WoW?

O_O

 

[Ariexv]

I had tons more fun with pre-BG world PvP. I'm sure someone will post up a long list of reasons why world PvP was imbalanced/unfair/not fun, but regardless I had a lot more fun fighting Alliance in Hillsbrad than I did in any BG or Arena.

I won't argue with World Pvp being more fun..... it totally is, it's just not really feasible to add in the gear you get in Arenas to a world Pvp system without it totally sucking like Pre-BC's system or being to easy. The best times I had in Wow though was taking 5->10 people and taking over Ogrimmar

 

[Amankhan]

it's just not really feasible to add in the gear you get in Arenas to a world Pvp system without it totally sucking like Pre-BC's system or being to easy.

Sure its feasible. Make Resilience (god I hate even typing that word) only work in BGs/Arenas/instances, which is a change that's coming with WoTLK anyways.

 

[Fularu]

So you went from arguing about Pvp to Pve? So a hunter with a LEGENDARY bow can win in DPS? Just like any rogue w/ Warglaives would dominate up until now? What other classes besides rogue should out DPS hunters?

It's nothing about the hunters that need to learn to play the class, there's the top hunters in the world saying hunters need serious help. The top end of the game is what should be balanced not BGs, World Pvp, or 1500 arena teams. There's incredibly "bad" people in every class, hunters it's just more obvious because a Good hunter has to do remarkably more then any other class to be considered "good"

Yep totally, I'm not the best hunter in the world but I played on one of the best WSG teams world-wide Pre-BC, and I've hit 2k+ Post-BC. I've played w/ Megatf and even he will tell you hunters need serious help. I'm guessing you either only World Pvp/battlegrounds or play on a Sub-1800s team with how you seem to think pvp works...

I don't think I have a facepalm big enough for this wall of crying.

Megatf is ranked first of his BG on his 2V2, 3V3 and 5V5 team, but somehow the class needs help?

HOW, what do you want? You have an 11 points talent MS, you have an AoE undispellable snare, you have a single target trap AND if someone somehow manages to get in melee range (say a warrior, enhance shaman, druid or rogue) you can wing clip them to get away. Your class can ditch out an incredible amount of DPS, can purge, drain, CC two targets at once and even have a pet attacking a third one (say healer) to spell pushback.

Yet somehow, with all that, you need help? No seriously, learn to play.

Megatf, like prety much every big mouth in Vulgar, is a QQing idiot. He single handedly proved that a good hunter is unstoppable, but somehow, because of the lack of representation in high end brackets, your class seriously needs help?

As for the PVE argument, the best rogues in the world, with BOTH glaives, with every best in slot item, can pull 2.7k DPS with multiple lusts. A hunter without anything but your typical 8/8 T6 and Archimonde's bow can pull 2.8k. Are you still trying to talk abotu PVE balance when hunters :

- Give a group buff when specced BM
- Give a raid buff when specced Survival
- Increase tremendously the threat treshold with proper use of a missdirect rotation

No one cares about what you did in vanilla wow or that you got carried in PVP, the reality is that the last thing hunters need is more freebies because of the 43 42 43 number.

 

[Hero]

No, their players need to learn to play their class.

The term "huntard" isn't used for nothing. The amount of incredibly bad hunters is stagering.

There's very little way to buff the hunter class withotu making it absolutely ridiculously overpowered.

The class went from lousy PVE/PVP abilities at the start of BC to the highest damage dealing class in PVE and one of the scariest class in PVP. They definitely need to be toned down.

(lol at 3.2k DPS on brut with the legendary bow.. And people were crying over 2k DPS dual glaived rogues)

Pretty much this. Hunters are godly in PVE and in BG/worldPVP are one of the top classes, it's just in arena where they're not as strong due to healer + hunter not being as powerful as healer+warrior/rogue.

You can't have one class at the top of the food chain in every aspect of the game. There is no possible way to buff hunters in the arena aspect without buffing the class in other regards where they're already absurdly strong. A class that wears mail, sits at the longest range in the game and can pump out that much dps is silly. Don't complain about LOS issues in arena since Blizzard removed your stupid deadzone which actually gave your class a quantifier/identifier of skill.

 

[Amankhan]

some mild CC and a new totem system for Shaman would be beautiful.

I've played a Shaman since beta. At this point, I'd be happy with not having to take up 4 bag slots with totems. I absolutely hate & loathe the totem system, for a number of reasons, but its pretty apparent at this point that for whatever absurd reason Blizzard isn't going to do away with it.

Amazes me how poorly itemized & balanced our totem selection system is. Quite a few that are very good, and a few that are almost useless (Sentry, Windwall).