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The Formula 1 2013 Season |OT| End of the Webber Era
- Thread starter Leunam
- Start date
Myoclonic Jerk
Member
He is big time, and a whiner more than Alonso!! I take back any praise I've given him during last year or specially the year before, which I can easily now say that it wasn't him who's shining it was Hamilton who was screwing up due to his personal life issues..
McLaren disparately need a star!.. Hire Massa.. I'm frikin serious, he's tons better than Button
Hackbert said:
Sloane said:
DBT85 said:
2012 Race Summary
The first European race of the 2012 season began at 12:00 UTC (14:00 local) under cloudy conditions. The ambient temperature was 22 °C (72 °F) while the track temperature was 35 °C (95 °F), 6 °C (11 °F) degrees cooler than the Saturday qualifying. The wind speed was still around the 2.5 m/s mark from the previous days qualifying.
Despite all but the top seven drivers having the option of starting on either compound tyre, all of the grid choose to start on the faster but higher degrading yellow banded soft ‘option’ tyre. As the five red lights went out Fernando Alonso got a great start as the Williams of Pastor Maldonado attempted to push him to the dirty side of the track. Maldonado couldn’t match the Ferrari’s start and aggressiveness and was beaten to the first turn by Alonso who (like 2011) led his home grand prix from the first turn. Finn Kimi Räikkönen led Lotus teammate Romain Grosjean while 5th to the first turn was Sauber’s Sergio Perez. The two Mercedes followed Perez with Sebastian Vettel’s Red Bull and Jenson Button’s Mclaren rounding out the top 8. Red Bull teammate Mark Webber had another poor start from the grid dropping places to both Force India’s, the other Ferrari of Felipe Massa and Jean-Éric Vergne’s Toro Rosso, leaving him in 15th by turn 1.
Turn three saw Grosjean and Perez make contact just enough for Perez to receive a left rear puncture and struggle to avoid the gravel trap. Lewis Hamilton, starting from 24th, was 20th by the end of lap 1 while Vergne and Massa made great starts after promoting themselves to 10th and 11th respectively.
Perez, limping to the pits, chose to fit hard compound tyres, which proved to be quicker (at the time) than the soft tyres used by the rest of the field. Marussia F1's Charles Pic also had a bad start, going into a spin at the rear of the field, but was able to recover and continue the race.
The two Red Bull drivers, Mark Webber and Sebastian Vettel, made very early pit stops on laps 7 and 8 respectively, switching to the harder tyres. After lap 9 the Red Bull and Sauber teams were the only cars to have pitted, all choosing hard compound tyres. Sauber was thought to pit Kamui Kobayashi in order to cover the early-stopping Red Bulls. At this stage the Hamilton was charging his way through the field while the three at the front (Alonso, Maldonado, and Räikkönen) were building a twelve-second gap to 4th-placed Grosjean.
Shortly afterwards, the majority of the other drivers made their first scheduled pit stop, with Lotus, Mercedes and Force India the only front running teams to opt for the soft compound tyre again. On lap 13, Michael Schumacher hit Bruno Senna from behind after misjudging his braking, forcing both of them out of the race. Hamilton, who was using a two-stop strategy, was running as high as 4th place when he finally pitted on lap 15. On the exit of his pit box, Hamilton appeared to run over something. Replays suggested that he could have hit a used tyre that a mechanic was holding. Mark Webber ran into problems on lap 17, losing several places from 13th place before pitting for the second time, where he was fitted with a new nose cone and a new set of hard tyres. Crucially for the Australian, before he lost front wing performance he led a train of six cars all close behind each other.
The next round of pit stops occurred between laps 23 and 28. Come lap 25, Maldonado's stop proved to be faster, and he ‘undercut’ Alonso from the pits to emerge ahead, taking the lead when Räikkönen pitted. Alonso pitted on lap 27 and prior to the pit stop was shown waving his hand in disgust at Charles Pic for not allowing the faster Ferrari to pass the lapped Marussia. Narain Karthikeyan stopped at the end of the pit lane on track during lap 25, one of his wheels apparently not correctly fitted after his pit stop.
Soon after, Sebastian Vettel and Felipe Massa were both handed drive through penalties for failing to slow for a yellow flag warning, presumably for the flags shown at the turn 1 Schumacher/Senna incident.
After the Lotus cars switched back from soft to hard tyres, their pace was visibly more competitive with the leaders and it became clear a strategic error had occurred. Lap 34 saw a daring move from the Japanese driver Kobayashi on 2009 world champion Button where he out braked Button on the inside of turn 5 and gently nudged him further out of his way. Sky Sports commentator Martin Brundle said “you know when you’ve been KK’d” referring to Kobayashi’s initials and his attacking overtaking style.
At this stage of the race, Maldonado, Alonso or Räikkönen looked to be the only drivers with a realistic chance of winning the grand prix. Webber, after his front wing replacement, was stuck behind Nico Hülkenberg in the second Force India and could not find enough straight line speed to pass him under DRS. Many cars hit the rev limiter down the front straight early and relied on delayed braking complete a pass.
Hamilton made his second and final pit stop from 7th place on lap 36, rejoining the race in 14th place. Soon afterwards, Charles Pic withdrew from the race with mechanical problems, having just been handed a drive through penalty for ignoring blue flags for the Alonso incident. The final retirement occurred on lap 40, when a botched pit stop and transmission problems ended Sergio Pérez's race.
At the head of the field, Alonso was making steady inroads into Maldonado's lead, cutting it to 6 seconds by lap 38. On Maldonado’s final pit stop, a slight delay occurred when there was trouble with the left rear wheel. This delay cost him 2-3 valuable seconds and, it was thought at the time, perhaps the race. Unusually, the other Red Bull, Vettel, also got his front wing changed on lap 44. Following his final pit stop (lap 49), Räikkönen also began to make up ground on the two leaders.
Räikkönen after his final it stop was 22.809 seconds down on the leader but fresher tyres meant that he would have a speed advantage for the last 16 laps. Alonso eventually caught the back of Maldonado but did not have the ability to overtake him. Maldonado was clear on his focus of tyre preservation. The gap hovered around one second for some time until Alonso started dropping off.
Räikkönen was consistently gaining one second a lap on the leaders and his team thought that they would be in the best position for the win when Maldonado and Alonso’s tyres hit the performance ‘cliff’. Meanwhile, Kobayashi took 5th from Rosberg at turn 10 under brakes and Webber was still stuck right behind the Force India of Hülkenberg. All the while a fast Vettel passed Hamilton and Rosberg in the closing stages to eventually claim 6th behind the sole remaining Sauber.
It appeared that the more experienced Alonso would eventually regain the lead, but Maldonado withstood the pressure and eventually Alonso decided to settle for second, rather than risk losing any more traction on his tyres. Räikkönen's late surge proved insufficient to take second place. The win for Maldonado was his first in Formula One and eclipsed his previous best result - 8th in China. In fact it was only his third ever points scoring finish in 24 races. It was also Williams best result since the 2004 Brazilian Grand Prix.
Räikkönen's team-mate Romain Grosjean finished 4th, driving a steady race after the first lap incident with Pérez. Kamui Kobayashi and Sebastian Vettel overtook Nico Rosberg late in the race for 5th and 6th places respectively. Lewis Hamilton finished a meritorious 8th after starting from the back of the grid, with Jenson Button and Nico Hülkenberg (who had kept Mark Webber (11th) behind from lap 22 until the end) taking the final points. It was also Kamui Kobayashi's equal best result of his Formula One career, matching his previous best of 5th from the 2011 Monaco Grand Prix.
ramparter said:
Circuit Info
[Click map for onboard lap]
Laps
66
Circuit length4.655 km (2.892 mi)
Race length307.104 km (190.825 mi)
Lap RecordKimi Räikkönen - Ferrari - 2008 - 1:21.670
Most Wins (Drivers)Michael Schumacher (6)
Most Wins (Constructors)Ferrari (11)
Previous Winners & Pole Positions
2012 - Winner: Pastor Maldonado - Williams Renault
Pole: Pastor Maldonado - Williams Renault - 1:22.285
2011 - Winner: Sebastian Vettel - Red Bull RenaultPole: Mark Webber - Red Bull Renault - 1:20.981
2010 - Winner: Mark Webber - Red Bull RenaultPole: Mark Webber - Red Bull Renault - 1:19.995
2009 - Winner: Jenson Button - Brawn-MercedesPole: Jenson Button - Brawn-Mercedes - 1:20.527
2008 - Winner: Kimi Räikkönen - FerrariPole: Kimi Räikkönen - Ferrari - 1:21.813
2007 - Winner: Felipe Massa - FerrariPole: Felipe Massa - Ferrari - 1:21.421
2006 - Winner: Fernando Alonso - RenaultPole: Fernando Alonso - Renault - 1:14.648
2005 - Winner: Kimi Räikkönen - McLaren MercedesPole: Kimi Räikkönen - McLaren Mercedes - 2:31.421 (Aggregate)
Video Highlights
Highlights from the 2003 Spanish Grand Prix
Highlights from the 2010 Spanish Grand Prix
Highlights from the 2012 Spanish Grand Prix
MotoGP: Jorge Lorenzo vs Valentino Rossi, Masterclass in Racing
Changes from 2012
-The leading edges of the combination kerbs on the apices of turns 13, 14 and 15 have been chamfered to remove a step.
GP Facts
-Pastor Maldonado’s Spanish Grand Prix victory last year saw a number of ‘firsts’ recorded. It was his first start from pole position, his first victory, and the first win for a Venezuelan in Formula One.
-Maldonado is the only driver to win a grand prix at the Circuit de Catalunya and for that to be his solitary victory of the season.
-Maldonado’s win, however, should not be regarded as surprising. Taking pole position (after Lewis Hamilton was excluded from the qualifying result) made him a favourite. Starting from pole at this circuit has historically been the key to victory: 18 times from the 22 races, the driver starting P1 has won the race. Of the four drivers to buck the trend, Mika Häkkinen, Nigel Mansell, and Sebastian Vettel were all front-row starters.
-…leaving Michael Schumacher the distinction of being the only driver to win the Spanish Grand Prix at the Circuit de Catalunya having started without a clear track in front of him. In 1996 he qualified third. With the race affected by torrential rain, he made light work of the terrible conditions to record his first victory for Ferrari. Another 71 would follow.
-The Circuit de Catalunya is a preferred testing venue for F1 teams. The driver with the most testing mileage at this circuit is McLaren’s Jenson Button. The 2009 World Champion has completed a staggering 34,706 testing kilometres at this circuit.
Addnan said:
Drivers Championship Standings
Constructors Championship Standings
Fantasy Championship Standings
True, Button is running out of excuses. New driver to the team outperforming you is unacceptable and then blaming the car.
Myoclonic Jerk
Member
I'm just thinking how much faster that Brawn GP car could've gone if it had a decent driver in it?! lol
More dominant than Vettel's second.
brotkasten
Member
Button won six out of the first seven GPs in 2009 (finished 3rd in the third GP). It doesn't get more dominant than that. Then in Silverstone, the teams brought their big upgrades, while Brawn didn't have much money left to develop the car. Button won only two more GPs and finished somewhere in the midfield for the rest of the season, except for the last race in Abu Dhabi, where he finished 3rd.
Meh. Perez has beaten Button once so far, if he actually starts beating him consistently, then Button has some 'splaining to do. Button was never great in quali either, lets wait and see how it goes tomorrow.
Button is also unable to drive around a not perfect balance unlike other top drivers. So he suffers when everything isn't perfect more than most. The likes of Alonso and Hamilton and Vettel just get on with it.
Tenacious-V
Thinks his PR is better than yours.
You can also see it as the car was so good out of the gate, it would have been a damn good title contender if it was still powered by Honda!
I look at that season with 2 big sad points. It was Barichello's last chance at a title (I would have preferred he take it over Button), and how the people at Honda must have felt... Watching all of the time and money they poured into that beast and years of losing, only to take the championship with a last minute slapped in Merc engine when you decided to quit....
RomanticHeroX
Member
Button is outqualified for the first time this season by his teammate and now his career is all but over? That's fast.
Err, nope, not in 2009.
Reubens went on to win two more races for the team, but Button was struggling from Silverstone onwards.
People have been overrating Button ever since 2009; yes he's quick, but he's in the same tier as Webber and always has been.
I was saying through throughout the entire latter half of 2011 and people kept telling me I was full of shit. Please ;___________________________________________;
To clarify; I'm not saying Button didn't shine in the latter part of 2011, that has definitely been the most impressive leg of any championship of his career imo, but Hamilton was severely hampered by his personal issues.
zomgbbqftw
Banned
His team mate who is brand new to the team, beat him in the previous race and has only had one full season in F1 before joining McLaren.
Also, Button's career at a top team should have been over a long time ago, McLaren/Whitmarsh should never have signed him on a long term deal. Button would not get a drive at a top team other than McLaren. No other team would touch him with a barge pole, while Kimi, Lewis, Vettel and Alonso would all walk into another top team should every contract suddenly be voided and Perez, Di Resta, Hulk and Grosjean would find second seats at the top teams. Button just doesn't even enter the equation. Unless of course your name is Martin Whitmarsh...
KillerMan91
Member
Didn't Button actually also outscore Hamilton during the years they were teammates? Hardly a bad driver.
zomgbbqftw
Banned
Nah, I just think he is very overrated and doesn't deserve to be driving at a top team like McLaren. Should be at a midfield team like Sauber or Williams.
Psychotext
Member
So I wonder if tomorrow will see the first ever winner at Barcelona who didn't start from the front row. I still don't really fancy the odds of the Mercs.
RomanticHeroX
Member
Yeah but don't you see, Lewis was so unhappy during those years. Totally doesn't count. If only he had a hilarious little dog I bet he would've destroyed Button.
Did the king Schumi not do that already
Psychotext
Member
Ahh yes, I missed that bit.
Rather then, the first driver outside of the top three.
Rather then, the first driver outside of the top three.
Nicktendo86
Member
Couple more years like this and Mclaren WILL be a midfield team. Button is just ahead of the curve.
So we're gonna sit here and act like McLaren didn't fuck up Lewis' title run last year?
I was going to get a little aggravated at your crap opinions, but then I realized you just dont know what the fuck you're talking about.
Where did the nasty Lewis touch you?
Nicktendo86
Member
Sorry if this was already mentioned but McLaren are not using their new front wing as they couldn't get the fia to test it in time. This team is really so incompetent it is not funny.
zomgbbqftw
Banned
I had successfully blocked the 2011 season out of my head, two seasons in F1 for Perez. Wow, big difference.
It is funny in a way, I'm just happy Lewis got out of there into a team where he is able to fight for podium places and hopefully race wins by the end of the season. Plus in Nico he has a team mate with whom he gets on and who pulls his weight with the engineers unlike Button who just whines and moans.
Autosport have an article up saying Whitmarsh had to deny he should step down, so clearly people are talking about it. That kind of chatter normally comes from board level, it's a bit of a sighter, they get someone to ask whether he will resign so they don't have to pay out millions in compensation if they fire him.
I would love to see Whitmarsh out and Brawn in. RB could get attract top engineering talent to McLaren and drivers, to this day, want to race in a RB team and with the Telmex money coming in they will have the ability to invest in a decent car.
Adam Scott Aukerman
Member
I've got a couple of responses to this:
1. There has been 'chatter' about Whitmarsh stepping down for years, that's what happens when a team struggles, regardless of what's actually the root of the team's problems. Brawn and Domenicali are also no stranger to this.
2. Look at the relative performance of McLaren since Whitmarsh took over and that of Honda/Brawn/Mercedes since Brawn joined. With this in mind, I'm not sure why you'd hold Brawn in such high regard as a team manager over Whitmarsh. You also seem to confusing Mercedes' barrels of cash with Brawn's power of personality.
----
Anyone remember that bet between Tony Fernandes and Richard Branson? Seems they still do: http://www.heraldsun.com.au/travel/...ssengers-a-serve/story-e6frfhbf-1226640594206
moojito
Member
Terrifying.
Nicktendo86
Member
I'm finding that more across the board on GAF to be honest
wuhu race sunday is here. just about 90 minutes to go. Mercs pls don´t loose to many places! Show them ....
Rosberg podium would be nice to see. Rai/Vettel battle for P1 i guess and therefore my friday prediction of an Alonso victory out of the window.. sigh.
But we will see. Ferraris race pace should be equal to Lotus and RBR mostly
Rosberg podium would be nice to see. Rai/Vettel battle for P1 i guess and therefore my friday prediction of an Alonso victory out of the window.. sigh.
But we will see. Ferraris race pace should be equal to Lotus and RBR mostly
Why are you ruling out Alonso? He's right behind Raikkonen, will probably jump him at the start and has almost as good race pace as the Lotus.
read again, my nearly identical thought. I am not ruling him out. But i expected friday a dominant Ferrari Pole. I know of their pace and hope for a great (dry) race.
brotkasten
Member
I don't see Alonso fighting for the win today. The race pace is good, but he's going to have the worst luck again. P3 at best.
Adam Scott Aukerman
Member
Ferrari's qualifying pace in recent years is about as deceptive as that of Mercedes, in opposite land.
Even without bad luck I don't see him winning. Pretty sure Vettel has this, while Kimi, the Mercs and Alonso will fight for the podium, depending on how bad the Mercs really are today. Weather should help them though.
Kinda hoping for a crazy race actually -- bring it, Grosjean!
criesofthepast
Member
I find it still to be the most welcoming of all sports GAF communities. I have loved the sport my while life but went through a few years of not watching until I started back up again last year and started posting in F1GAF. I admittedly still have a lot to learn and I'm not the best with all the terminology, but no one has ever judged me in here and everyone has been very cool and helpful. I lurk mostly during the week/off weeks and post on quali/race days. I haven't noticed an abnormal amount of hostility in here this year.
Anyone predict a Massa win this year? I am. Just not today, though. I don't know who wins today. Have a feeling it won't be Vettel or Alonso. I wouldn't mind Lewis and Merc finding a way to keep pace today and pull it off.
Nice work on the race preview Leunam, forgot to say thanks!!
Is Formula1.com not loading for anyone else?
Yeah, it is one of the best GAF sports threads, I just worry it will become like the others before long.
Is Formula1.com not loading for anyone else?
Yeah, it is one of the best GAF sports threads, I just worry it will become like the others before long.
Adam Scott Aukerman
Member
I think Force India have more chance of winning a race this year than Massa.
Oh, just fuck off, won't you?
From what I can gather, during races it kind of *is* like some of the other threads. It's just that between weekends the typical blow-ins don't actually blow-in and it's fine.
Which other threads?
I only really know NFL-GAF, where there's a lot of trash talk, but also a lot of love.