Support NeoGAF

Raging Spaniard · Nov 8, 2007

Yeah, its marketing, he wants to keep you guessing until you play the game.

Ness is a popular character, I mean he has a freakin' Home Run bat integrated. Hell make it in. No worries here

layzie1989 · Nov 8, 2007

"Theres a character named Ness who has appeared in the Smash Bros. series up until now"

Ness is gone...TEAM BUMBLEBEE AM BROKEN UP ;_;

Slavik81 · Nov 8, 2007

But Lucass physical combat style is quite different. By which I mean, he does not have the same standard moves.

So awesome...

Oldschoolgamer · Nov 8, 2007

Absinthe said:
I thought it was confirmed that all of the original characters were going to return? If that's the case, then several of the other characters that were in the first game and haven't been announced yet are huge question marks at this point.

I don't think he ever said that.

Man...I really did like using Ness in the N64 game. They broke him in melee, and now he is gone. Oh well...the new guy has an ice move. I like tossing around Mr.Freezies, so this should be fun.

underfooter · Nov 8, 2007

Is it just me, or did the update happen an hour early today?

.......and although Ness is gone, since there are multiple constumes I wouldn't be surprised to see a 'Ness' version of Lucas. I have a feeling the same type of thing will happen to Luigi.

Somnid · Nov 8, 2007

Zeed said:
It's more complicated than that though. We KNOW that Sakurai originally planned in Melee to axe Ness and add Lucas. That's precedent right there.

Sarcasm?

SuperAndroid17 · Nov 8, 2007

NESS IS GONE GONE GONE GONE! stop denying it

Jiggy · Nov 8, 2007

Setting out to get stats now, but has anyone PMed Amir0x yet? I kind of want to see him explode at the relative ambiguity of the wording and complain that Sakurai's out to scare him. >_>

Keru_Shiri said:
I'm pretty sure Ness will be returning. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if Ness was unlockable through Lucas (perhaps defeating Classic mode with Lucas).

At least, that's the feeling I get with this update, otherwise, why all the comparisons?

Pretty much. That old question from October 1st, "Can he surpass even Ness?" would never be answered unless they were in the same game.

Iam Canadian · Nov 8, 2007

underfooter said:
Is it just me, or did the update happen an hour early today?

Welcome to the reality of a post-DST world.

Rindain · Nov 8, 2007

Well, I wonder if we'll be going another full week without a character profile?

ohamsie · Nov 8, 2007

At least this update included ALL of Lucas's moves, and then some. Most move updates only include 3 special moves. :lol

dude · Nov 8, 2007

Absinthe said:
I thought it was confirmed that all of the original characters were going to return? If that's the case, then several of the other characters that were in the first game and haven't been announced yet are huge question marks at this point.

No, only Ness was a question mark because of his likeness to Lucas and that they're from the same series and at the same role. Basically, it makes sense to axe Ness in favor of Lucas because Lucas is the new main character of the Earthbound series, so he's an update to Ness. So you could say all the characters are still returning, only that Ness got updates to keep him with the time (if they actually did replace him)

Jiggy · Nov 8, 2007

underfooter said:
.......and although Ness is gone, since there are multiple constumes I wouldn't be surprised to see a 'Ness' version of Lucas. I have a feeling the same type of thing will happen to Luigi.

ShockingAlberto, where are you?

superbank · Nov 8, 2007

I like Lucas' moves. The rope snake is cool.

edit: Ness is still in. Just do a texture swap and hair swap and you have Ness. He probably has his Melee moves too.

Xeke · Nov 8, 2007

underfooter said:
Is it just me, or did the update happen an hour early today?

.......and although Ness is gone, since there are multiple constumes I wouldn't be surprised to see a 'Ness' version of Lucas. I have a feeling the same type of thing will happen to Luigi.

Daylight Savings Time ended.

Iam Canadian · Nov 8, 2007

Rindain said:
Well, I wonder if we'll be going another full week without a character profile?

NESS PROFILE TOMORROW. BELIEVE.

OH PLEASE, MY SAKURAI, WHO ART IN NINTENDO.

*Tries to calm self*

apotema · Nov 8, 2007

Oldschoolgamer said:
I don't think he ever said that.

Man...I really did like using Ness in the N64 game. They broke him in melee, and now he is gone. Oh well...the new guy has an ice move. I like tossing around Mr.Freezies, so this should be fun.

I agree with that... Ness was like the best in SSB64, then he became one of the worst characters in Melee

scottnak · Nov 8, 2007

underfooter said:
Is it just me, or did the update happen an hour early today?

.......and although Ness is gone, since there are multiple constumes I wouldn't be surprised to see a 'Ness' version of Lucas. I have a feeling the same type of thing will happen to Luigi.

*sigh* here we go again.
DAYLIGHT SAVINGS = - 1 hour.
Japan DOES NOT observe DST = stays same.

So, ever since sunday... updates are indeed one hour earlier. Has been since sunday!

SuperAndroid17 · Nov 8, 2007

Two PK-thunders in one game? Clones?

I dont think so

Rotanibor · Nov 8, 2007

I honestly believe Sakurai knows what he is doing and is just fucking with everybody. Ness is going to be in the game.

Xeke · Nov 8, 2007

Jiggy37 said:
ShockingAlberto, where are you?

Wait. There are people who think Luigi wont be in? What?

Nickovic · Nov 8, 2007

Luigi better still be in this game.

RagnarokX · Nov 8, 2007

grandjedi6 said:
Woah. This is the first time we've gotten all 4 special moves in one

No it isn't... we got all of Link's in one fell swoop, and then we got all of Meta Knight's.

Iam Canadian · Nov 8, 2007

SuperAndroid17 said:
Two PK-thunders in one game? Clones?

I dont think so

You could easily apply this to Luigi, you know.

Two Super Jump Punches in one game? Clones?

MrCheez · Nov 8, 2007

If Ness IS still in... why did they basically translate his B moves over to Lucas when they had an opportunity to create a unique moveset? (I know the moves are altered (such as the Ice-looking Up-B instead of the green-plasma-whatever up-B) but they are only alterations, not entirely new moves)

I'm not convinced either way at this point, Sakurai always surprises us and anything can happen. This update casts more doubt than it adds confirmation, though. (IMO)

Iam Canadian said:
You could easily apply this to Luigi, you know.

Two Super Jump Punches in one game? Clones?

Yeah but you're talking about a character that's been moved over from the older games. Lucas is brand new.

Plus we don't know how much change Luigi is going to see, anyway.

underfooter · Nov 8, 2007

scottnak said:
*sigh* here we go again.
DAYLIGHT SAVINGS = - 1 hour.
Japan DOES NOT observe DST = stays same.

So, ever since sunday... updates are indeed one hour earlier. Has been since sunday!

That's great!

apotema said:
I agree with that... Ness was like the best in SSB64, then he became one of the worst characters in Melee

I think if you played my friend your opinion would differ. He's quite good with Ness in Melee.

fusoya59 · Nov 8, 2007

Guys

Ness is still in

as an assist trophy.

Iam Canadian · Nov 8, 2007

MrCheez said:
If Ness IS still in... why did they basically translate his B moves over to Lucas when they had an opportunity to create a unique moveset? (I know the moves are altered (such as the Ice-looking Up-B instead of the green-plasma-whatever up-B) but they are only alterations, not entirely new moves)

I'm not convinced either way at this point, Sakurai always surprises us and anything can happen. This update casts more doubt than it adds confirmation, though. (IMO)

Again, Lucas is similar to Luigi. PK Freeze looks to be a quite different attack from PK Flash. Lucas' PK Fire operates differently from Ness'. Lucas seems to lack a yo-yo and a baseball bat. Ness has no rope snake. The two are as different as Mario and Luigi.

MindCollizion · Nov 8, 2007

So like... Japan is living more in the future now? They're beating us more! Damn!

Xeke · Nov 8, 2007

underfooter said:
That's great!

I think if you played my friend your opinion would differ. He's quite good with Ness in Melee.

Yeah, but there are people who are good with Mewtew too, that doesn't make him a good character compared to Fox or Sheik.

Insaniac · Nov 8, 2007

Goodbye Ness?

Jiggy · Nov 8, 2007

I'm still trying to figure out why some people seem to think clones--and even not-really-clones-at-all like Ike/Marth--are an intrinsic impossibility in SSBB because the game is too good for them. It's not like Sakurai and co. had any qualms with putting bunches of them in SSBM.

MrCheez said:
If Ness IS still in... why did they basically translate his B moves over to Lucas when they had an opportunity to create a unique moveset?

Too much effort exerted to create the unique movesets for all three of Pokemon Trainer's Pokemon and all three of the Ouendan team

believe

, so they had to cut back somewhere and just give Lucas new A moves. >_>

Koomaster · Nov 8, 2007

I'm liking Lucas' moves; I know I'll enjoy playing with him. Ness was my favorite in Melee tho, so I hope it's just an odd translation that is making it seem like Ness is out.

Nintaiyo · Nov 8, 2007

R.I.P Ness

MrCheez · Nov 8, 2007

Iam Canadian said:
Again, Lucas is similar to Luigi. PK Freeze looks to be a quite different attack from PK Flash. Lucas' PK Fire operates differently from Ness'. Lucas seems to lack a yo-yo and a baseball bat. Ness has no rope snake. The two are as different as Mario and Luigi.

I'm just worried that Lucas represents an upgraded Ness (a la Link's upgrades from Melee to Brawl, or Mario's) rather than "Ness's Luigi"

RagnarokX · Nov 8, 2007

Iam Canadian said:
Again, Lucas is similar to Luigi. PK Freeze looks to be a quite different attack from PK Flash. Lucas' PK Fire operates differently from Ness'. Lucas seems to lack a yo-yo and a baseball bat. Ness has no rope snake. The two are as different as Mario and Luigi.

I don't think so. PK Freeze is only different in that it freezes enemies but it looks like the animation for it is pretty much the same.

underfooter · Nov 8, 2007

Xeke said:
Yeah, but there are people who are good with Mewtew too, that doesn't make him a good character compared to Fox or Sheik.

Yeah I guess, I never really got into that whole 'top tier elite' scene. Anyone with the right tactics in the right level with a little item luck had as good a chance as anyone. I really hope, for some of the more obsessed people (and online players), that they balance the characters a bit more this time around.

I heard they gimped fox

Jiggy · Nov 8, 2007

Koomaster said:
I hope it's just an odd translation that is making it seem like Ness is out.

That's a possibility. Anyone read German, French, Japanese, Spanish, or Italian?

justchris · Nov 8, 2007

Oh, awesome, Ness is still in. And Lucas looks pretty cool, too, with PK Freeze.

Malfunky · Nov 8, 2007

Aren't the Mother protagonists essentially the same character, just as the Links are in Zelda? Different people, same role, same purpose.

So, couldn't this just be seen as Ness(or "Mother protagonist") with an updated moveset?

Firestorm · Nov 8, 2007

underfooter said:
I think if you played my friend your opinion would differ. He's quite good with Ness in Melee.

No Ness would still stuck. People need to realize that their friends aren't as great as they think. Sure, my friend can kick my ass with Kirby. That has more to do with his skill compared to mine than Kirby though. Kirby in Melee is ass. So is Ness. So is Pikachu. All three went from being the best of the best in SSB64 to low tier in SSBM.

Iam Canadian · Nov 8, 2007

And people using the "Lucas was meant to replace Ness in Melee" line...for Melee, Sakurai was limited by time constraints which were harshly imposed by Nintendo. He may not have had time to implement both.

Here, though, Sakurai has seemingly all the time he needs. Not to mention that Mother 2 has received greater exposure (in Japan, at least) due to the release of Mother 1+2. With Sakurai adding characters left and right (he TRIPLED Kirby's roster, for God's sake), there's absolutely no reason to believe he'd continue to limit Mother to one character. Unlike some one character franchises (Ice Climber), Mother actually has a wealth of eligible fighters for this game.

jj984jj · Nov 8, 2007

Ness is probably an alternate option for Lucas.

MrCheez · Nov 8, 2007

Jiggy37 said:
I'm still trying to figure out why some people seem to think clones--and even not-really-clones-at-all like Ike/Marth--are an intrinsic impossibility in SSBB because the game is too good for them. It's not like Sakurai and co. had any qualms with putting bunches of them in SSBM.

Well, I myself am not saying it's a fact that we won't see clones. I will go on record saying I don't expect it, though.

The main evidence: Clones were the result of packing in more characters into Melee without much time to do so (deadline). Brawl just seems like it has been much more planned out than that from the start... Sakurai right from the start stated he is aiming for a specific amount of characters, and he's also gone on record saying that the final roster for Melee was not planned from the start.

But clones could happen, none of us can know for sure. We'll all find out soon enough!

Beezy · Nov 8, 2007

Bwahaha!

Peace out Ness!

ohamsie · Nov 8, 2007

I wonder what projectile Charizard is using here. It doesn't look like flamethrower to me.

Also, where is the trainer at?

Xeke · Nov 8, 2007

underfooter said:
I heard they gimped fox

Thats cause they are holding out the good shit for my boy Falco!

SuperBanjo · Nov 8, 2007

I might be able to swallow Lucas as Ness' replacement if, you know, the rest of the world could actually play the game he was in.

But surely Sakurai and the developers aren't stupid enough to dump a series veteran... right? That statement has to be a translation typo.

Iam Canadian · Nov 8, 2007

Malfunky said:
Aren't the Mother protagonists essentially the same character, just as the Links are in Zelda? Different people, same role, same purpose.

So, couldn't this just be seen as Ness(or "Mother protagonist") with an updated moveset?

Ninten (the Mother 1 protagonist) and Ness are largely the same character. Same design, same weapons (though Ninten got a boomerang). Only a few different PK spells (Ninten got PK Beam and 4'th D Slip) separated the two.

Lucas, on the other hand, is a much more unique character. Not to mention he (I think, seeing as I haven't played Mother 3 extensively) shares the spotlight as protagonist more evenly.

Firestorm · Nov 8, 2007

MrCheez said:
Well, I myself am not saying it's a fact that we won't see clones. I will go on record saying I don't expect it, though.

The main evidence: Clones were the result of packing in more characters into Melee fast enough to meet deadline. Brawl just seems like it has been much more planned out than that from the start... Sakurai right from the start stated he is aiming for a specific amount of characters, and he's also gone on record saying that the final roster for Melee was not planned from the start.

But clones could happen, none of us can know for sure. We'll all find out soon enough!

Well, here's hoping that he planned to cram in some extra characters. Clones are great bang for their buck. Less time for new character that open up entirely new gameplay possibilities. I mean, other than the idiots who can't get past the "OMG THE ANIMATION IS THE SAME!" people are happy with new characters.

Support NeoGAF

Smash Bros Brawl Dojo Official Update Thread: Goodbye, Cherry-don

If they are Dutch, upright and breathing they are more racist than your favorite player

Member

Member

The physical form of blasphemy

Banned

Member

Member

Member

and have the worst user name EVER

Banned

Member

dude

Member

The definition of front-butt.

Banned

and have the worst user name EVER

Member

Member

Member

Member

Banned

Member

Member

and have the worst user name EVER

President/Creative Director of Grumpyface Studios

Banned

Member

and have the worst user name EVER

Member

Banned

Member

Member

Member

Member

President/Creative Director of Grumpyface Studios

Member

Banned

Member

Member

Member

Member

and have the worst user name EVER

He's a pretty swell guy in my books anyway.

President/Creative Director of Grumpyface Studios

Member

Member

Banned

Member

and have the worst user name EVER

Member

Similar threads