-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Sega Genesis/MegaDrive Appreciation Thread: Alien Storm > Golden Axe
- Thread starter IrishNinja
- Start date
coincidentally, i just picked up devil's crash md a few days ago and i've been playing it a lot. right now it's probably my favorite 2d pinball game. they really nailed the physics (for a 16-bit game) and the scrolling/tracking works quite well.
there isn't much 'progression' though, and there aren't really any adventure elements. it's a pretty straightforward score-focused pinball game that takes advantage of being a video game to add some unique obstacles and a bit of visual flair. there's one main 3-tier table, 6 smaller 'boss' tables with 2 variants each, and a final boss. You basically just play until you reach one billion points or clear every bonus table, then fight the last boss. it seems next to impossible (for me at least), but you can use the password system to save your score+ball count at any time which makes the whole thing actually sort of do-able. there isn't a ton of content, but what's there is much better designed than pretty much any other 16-bit pinball games i've played, including naxat's.
also the music is amazing. somehow even after a few hours the main table theme hasn't gotten old, and if you do get bored of it you can use passwords to replace it with music from herzog zwei, thunder force and elemental master.
sixteen-bit
Member
Yeah, the Technosoft arrangements of Toshiaki Sakoda's work is great, and the other tracks are such a nice bonus. Blood-stained Lake for the win.
I tend to skip 1-UPs when I don't plan on dying, like in my Ninja Gaiden 1 vid.=p When I do no continue runs I tend to pick up as many as I can, except for Bucky o Hare since I get a lot of 1-UPs just on points alone.
I really do like how this game pushes the Genesis hardware in areas, was pretty impressive when it 1st came out.
After the hell that was the 2nd stage, it's best to hang up high to avoid those gnomes easier as that stage is tiring, lol.
I am glad I picked the green weapon for the Mad Hatter or else I could had died. It even took some time to master that boss as well because I tend to get hit on most runs against him.
Mr. Freeze's stage is strange, starts off hard but then gets easier.
Lol, I didn't even know that, wow, you learn something new everything.=p
I have more 1CCs coming in the feature as well!!!
Thanks for the recommendations all. Getting Revenge of Shinobi, Contra, Jewel Master and Sonic 3 for now. I wish Alien Soldier wasn't so expensive, it looks sick.
I have played Comix Zone and Sonic 1 in the past, both were quite good.
I have played Comix Zone and Sonic 1 in the past, both were quite good.
The more difficult the better I say. To a point at least.
Not nearly as good as Streets of Rage Remake ;p
Playing Sonic CD again for my podcast and I'm not hating it like I used to.
It is funny how it makes me afraid to go fast. No, I want to stay in the past! Something stop me, please! Oh good, something always does. And on that note, is there any point going anywhere except the past? Are ring counts different for each time period? Like, if you're near the end and lose your rings can you go to the future and go through the whole stage again to get the 50 minimum requirement for the bonus stage? I should try it.
Whenever I see two springs that bounce you back and forth endlessly it makes me think the developers just said "fuck it, here, time travel."
It's almost like playing a different type of platformer that just happens to have Sonic physics. Bizarre.
I quite like the Mode 7 bonus areas, though.
I beat it with a bad ending because I didn't find all the enemy generators/Metal Sonic holograms or get all the time stones.
It is funny how it makes me afraid to go fast. No, I want to stay in the past! Something stop me, please! Oh good, something always does. And on that note, is there any point going anywhere except the past? Are ring counts different for each time period? Like, if you're near the end and lose your rings can you go to the future and go through the whole stage again to get the 50 minimum requirement for the bonus stage? I should try it.
Whenever I see two springs that bounce you back and forth endlessly it makes me think the developers just said "fuck it, here, time travel."
It's almost like playing a different type of platformer that just happens to have Sonic physics. Bizarre.
I quite like the Mode 7 bonus areas, though.
I beat it with a bad ending because I didn't find all the enemy generators/Metal Sonic holograms or get all the time stones.
Sixfortyfive
He who pursues two rabbits gets two rabbits.
Sonic CD and 3&K are roughly tied for my 2nd-favorite entry of the Genesis era, mostly dependent on whether I'm in the mood for a short game or a long game at the moment.
The time travel is hit-and-miss for a lot of different reasons, but I mostly like that it imposes a reward and consequence on your platforming skills in general. I'm a weirdo who thinks that the addition of the spindash was a small step back for the series; being able to go from 0 to max speed at will leads to lazy stage design at times and thus lazy play. Being forced to maintain speed in SCD actually discourages random spindashing so that you have more control and can better react to obstacles.
But then there are those areas with dueling spring boards like you said, lol.
I also appreciated that there was more thought put into the bosses in that game than usual, some exceptions aside (Quartz Quadrant LOL). Metal Sonic really is a highlight. The special stages were above average, too.
The only part of the game that really falls flat IMO is the last zone. Really anti-climactic coming off the heels of Stardust Speedway.
The time travel is hit-and-miss for a lot of different reasons, but I mostly like that it imposes a reward and consequence on your platforming skills in general. I'm a weirdo who thinks that the addition of the spindash was a small step back for the series; being able to go from 0 to max speed at will leads to lazy stage design at times and thus lazy play. Being forced to maintain speed in SCD actually discourages random spindashing so that you have more control and can better react to obstacles.
But then there are those areas with dueling spring boards like you said, lol.
I also appreciated that there was more thought put into the bosses in that game than usual, some exceptions aside (Quartz Quadrant LOL). Metal Sonic really is a highlight. The special stages were above average, too.
The only part of the game that really falls flat IMO is the last zone. Really anti-climactic coming off the heels of Stardust Speedway.
Yeah, I forgot to mention it in my post but the boss fights are some of the most creative Eggman fights in the entire series up to and including today. Definitely a highlight.
I'm going to look up some maps and work out some routes, see if I can get this game down to mastered before I give any real opinion on it.
My biggest gripe so far is that there's a lot of work that needs to be put in on your first, exploratory playthrough, which is what I just did.
1) find the past signs
2) find an area that will let you maintain speed and travel to the past
3) backtrack and fully explore the past to find two items
Once you know the best signs, the best speed areas, and the general location of the two items you're looking for the game feels a lot more relaxed. Without that stuff, it's actually a really easy game to just play through. I think I died once, ever, by falling into a bottomless pit near the end of the game and being really surprised by it.
I'm going to look up some maps and work out some routes, see if I can get this game down to mastered before I give any real opinion on it.
My biggest gripe so far is that there's a lot of work that needs to be put in on your first, exploratory playthrough, which is what I just did.
1) find the past signs
2) find an area that will let you maintain speed and travel to the past
3) backtrack and fully explore the past to find two items
Once you know the best signs, the best speed areas, and the general location of the two items you're looking for the game feels a lot more relaxed. Without that stuff, it's actually a really easy game to just play through. I think I died once, ever, by falling into a bottomless pit near the end of the game and being really surprised by it.
Sixfortyfive
He who pursues two rabbits gets two rabbits.
I'm grateful that we're given two options for the good ending: either destroy the robot generators in the past, or collect all the emeralds time stones like a normal Sonic game. I much prefer the latter, even if it diminishes what makes the game unique in the first place. Hunting down the generators is an interesting twist on the formula, but having to do it in every stage is just a little too tedious.
IrishNinja
Member
oh wow, i didn't know you had the option - i wanna say i used to do both methods
Shadow Hog
Member
Wacky Workbench is annoying, but even it pales in comparison to Dimps level design at its Dimpsiest.
theSlacker
Member
Why you doing this to us? I mean I'm happy I even have a copy of it even though I'm pretty sure the cover art is a print job. :c
Sixfortyfive
He who pursues two rabbits gets two rabbits.
Yeah, Oil Ocean is definitely a downer but everything to that point was smooth and fantastic. The bosses in general are boring, easy, and a stark contrast to the creativity of Sonic CD's bosses.
I don't mind Wing Fortress so much but it has like, the worst fucking music of all Sonic anything. For a series with excellent music in nearly every entry it's a bit of a shock.
blast processed
Member
Oil Ocean is great and the music is awesome! Winged fortress has the worst song of any Sonic level, ever.
Which is odd since the stage before it has one of my fav music in the series...wish the stage was longer as well to listen to more of that song...thank god for sound tests back then.
Its just crazy how things can skyrocket. Unless I got lucky then, i'd think videos were out about the game from big youtubers?
Agreed. I was really disappointed in CDs bosses. Especially the final boss, it doesn't even come close to comparison with the boss of Sonic 2 or 3&K.
Sixfortyfive
He who pursues two rabbits gets two rabbits.
Most of Sonic CD's bosses are good because you can't cheese them to death like most other bosses in the series. In Sonic 2 & 3 it's not uncommon to be able to take 4 or more easy swipes in rapid succession, but in a lot of the CD bosses you have to work for the hit.
There are exceptions in either direction, of course.
There are exceptions in either direction, of course.
Beat Sonic 2 as Super Sonic and then played through Sonic 2 and Knuckles just for good measure. Knuckles doesn't lose rings after a bonus area and his ring requirements inside are lower; it's crazy. I had 5 stones by Chemical Plant Zone. I was stuck on the 6th stone with Sonic for like half the game before getting the requirements. The 7th wasn't as hard for me for whatever reason. Time to forget the layouts again until I come back to this game in a few years =P
The final Eggman mech is a much longer fight since Knuckles's jump is lower than Sonic's. I was also having a tough time because if you hit Eggman too early as he crouches from his ground pound you won't bounce off him and will die inside his sprite. Annoying.
Gotta say I fell through the ground and encountered more bugs in Sonic 2 than Sonic CD, though.
I think I'm as ready as I'll ever be to compare these two. I like the design philosophy behind Sonic 2 more than Sonic CD, and I'm glad 3 and Knuckles followed suit.
EDIT: Just looked it up and the special stages in Sonic 2 were harder than I remember because I didn't turn off Tails this time around. Some of the ring requirements (basically are the hard ones) are HIGHER when Tails is there even though that idiot is just going to get hit and lose them all anyway. No wonder.
The final Eggman mech is a much longer fight since Knuckles's jump is lower than Sonic's. I was also having a tough time because if you hit Eggman too early as he crouches from his ground pound you won't bounce off him and will die inside his sprite. Annoying.
Gotta say I fell through the ground and encountered more bugs in Sonic 2 than Sonic CD, though.
I think I'm as ready as I'll ever be to compare these two. I like the design philosophy behind Sonic 2 more than Sonic CD, and I'm glad 3 and Knuckles followed suit.
EDIT: Just looked it up and the special stages in Sonic 2 were harder than I remember because I didn't turn off Tails this time around. Some of the ring requirements (basically are the hard ones) are HIGHER when Tails is there even though that idiot is just going to get hit and lose them all anyway. No wonder.
Sixfortyfive
He who pursues two rabbits gets two rabbits.
That's a really good tip. Luckily I had like 22 lives to fuck with and figure it out.
I got Metal Sonic down to a science. Spin dash away from him as he floats down to get 4 hits, jump the saw, bounce off him twice as he revs up, then stand your ground and jump at the last second as he charges you twice to damage him and go through unharmed. Down.
ienjoyrawfish
Member
Wacky Workbench sucks, but one bad level doesn't detract from the many, many good things Sonic CD does. For me, as far as the classics go, it's:
1) Sonic 3 and Knuckles
2) Sonic CD
3) Sonic 1
4) Sonic 2
Sonic 2 should be remembered as the worst for many reasons, not least of which are the special stages, which are absolutely beyond-words appalling. I honestly can't fathom why that game gets so much love and seems to be the Sonic game that most consistently appears in various 'best ever' lists.
S3&K is miles superior in every conceivable way (graphics, art direction, scope, power-ups, sound design, special stages, level design etc.). It's also the only Sonic game that can genuinely stand toe-to-toe with 2D Mario in its pomp. It actually does some things better than SMW/Yoshi's Island.
The levels still look and feel like they were patched together by a computer that hates you.
I'm half convinced that the love that Sonic CD gets is by people who feel special for having played it back in the day when not everybody had a Sega CD. Like they praise it in order to justify their Sega CD purchase or they felt special that they got to play something that everybody else wanted to play but couldn't.
In reality, it has the absolutely worst level design of all the classic 2D Sonic games. Not just for Wacky Workbench. It's true that Sonic is not all about speed in the old games but he definitely is about momentum. And there is no momentum in Sonic CD. All you do is just dick around in the clusterfuck of the levels trying to memorize where the objectives are, all the while you have the holdover 10 minute time limit that really prohibits you from doing so. It is a game that is in war with itself. Massively overhyped.
In reality, it has the absolutely worst level design of all the classic 2D Sonic games. Not just for Wacky Workbench. It's true that Sonic is not all about speed in the old games but he definitely is about momentum. And there is no momentum in Sonic CD. All you do is just dick around in the clusterfuck of the levels trying to memorize where the objectives are, all the while you have the holdover 10 minute time limit that really prohibits you from doing so. It is a game that is in war with itself. Massively overhyped.
blast processed
Member
It's horrible! This should've been the front cover.
Shadow Hog
Member
There was a Windows 95 version tho
Gonna disagree with that, honestly. It still had plenty of places where you get to use your momentum to ramp around places, and I thought the platforming presented was pretty good. The level design's definitely scatter-brained at points, but I never really had a problem with it.
Also, the stages aren't that big such that the 10-minute limit becomes an issue; only level I can recall that potentially being a problem in was Metallic Madness 2.
ienjoyrawfish
Member
I honestly found them to be tedious cheap memorisation fests with some of the most stupid annoying music I've ever heard in a 16-bit Sonic game. Trying to do them with Tails lagging behind you crashing into the bombs you avoid and losing all your rings is about as fun as rolling around naked over broken glass.
ZealousD said:
This is all anyone needs to do that:
NoFaceNico
Member
I searched and didn't see that anyone had posted this.
Apparently, Sega sent Howard Stern an early Sega Channel but he had to return it because they weren't a sponsor.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z437fujpBwg&list=WL&index=18
It's pretty funny and it's an interesting look at what goes on behind the scenes in product promotion.
Apparently, Sega sent Howard Stern an early Sega Channel but he had to return it because they weren't a sponsor.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z437fujpBwg&list=WL&index=18
It's pretty funny and it's an interesting look at what goes on behind the scenes in product promotion.
I honestly found them to be tedious cheap memorisation fests with some of the most stupid annoying music I've ever heard in a 16-bit Sonic game. Trying to do them with Tails lagging behind you crashing into the bombs you avoid and losing all your rings is about as fun as rolling around naked over broken glass.
This is all anyone needs to do that:
So...you're saying I need to buy a Justifier in preparation for my eventual owning Snatcher. Got it.
I can't tell if this cover is amazing or horrible.
Oh dear. Looks like I tried to draw it. That is not a compliment.
I've got Verytex but I dunno if thats rare?
sixteen-bit
Member
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=123097889&postcount=7533
That whole page is ballin' outta control tho. Like Neo Geo folks decided to break into Genesis collecting haha. High Rollers club.
Bar81
Member
Small world. I see my spare MUSHA in there - really clean copy (only gave it up cause I got a new one).