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markot · May 23, 2012

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2012-05-23-judge-recommends-us-xbox-360-ban

http://www.courthousenews.com/2012/05/22/46716.htm

Patently absurd!

hehe patently, get it?!

So... like... how many courts are they fighting in >_>?

Germany, ITC, US Federal... Kangaroo?!

Im not quoting or bolding cause its all grade A juicy steak of information for readings.

j0hnny_385 · May 23, 2012

Hanmik · May 23, 2012

he is waiting..

GrizzNKev · May 23, 2012

lol wut

This is getting pretty silly.

Majine · May 23, 2012

Oh Patents warz.

Deadly Joker · May 23, 2012

what the fuck?

is this really being proposed?

Sethos · May 23, 2012

dreamcastmaster · May 23, 2012

Obamas an Xbox gamer, can't see this working out well for Motorola.

joe2187 · May 23, 2012

Sethos said:

This reminds me of Fox and the Hound...

Why did you have to bring up those memories man...Now I'm gonna cry.

subversus · May 23, 2012

hehehehehehe

FieryBalrog · May 23, 2012

judge is a grade-A dolt, "intellectual property rights is far more important than keeping the market competitive" or words to that effect

I swear, some judges just like being powerful.

Cloudius12 · May 23, 2012

A judge has recommended that the Xbox 360 be banned in the US.

Courthouse News reports that Judge David Shaw said the International Trade Commission should use a cease and desist order to ban imports of the Xbox 360 Slim 4GB and 250GB models into the US because, in his view, they infringe on four patents owned by Motorola. He also wants Microsoft to post a bond equal to seven per cent of the value of unsold Xbox 360s in the US.

The patents at the heart of the dispute revolve around how the Xbox 360 decodes video content. Motorola claims ownership on the tech powering this.

Reacting to this latest decision, Microsoft argued the ban would not serve the public interest because it would leave consumers with only two home console options: the PlayStation 3 and the Nintendo Wii. But the judge rejected the claim, saying it was more important to enforce intellectual property rights. Plus, he wasn't convinced Sony and Nintendo wouldn't be able to meet increased demand.

Microsoft said the suggested seven per cent bond was unnecessary, and recommended it be reduced to 2.5 per cent. Motorola wants it increased to a whopping 100 per cent of the value of the unsold Xbox 360s.

So what happens next in this long-running, complex patent dispute? If the ITC makes the judge's recommendation final, President Barack Obama will then have 60 days to review the decision. After that period expires, the next step is the Court of Appeals for the Federal Circuit.

Earlier this month a US judge accused the warring factions of using the US District Court as "a pawn in a global, industry-wide business negotiation".
Judge James Robart said both sides were clearly "driven by an attempt to secure commercial advantage". "To an outsider looking at it, it has been arbitrary, it has been arrogant and frankly it has been based on hubris," he said.

A German court has already ruled in favour of Motorola, granting an injunction prohibiting sales of the console in the country. However, Robart issued a temporary restraining order preventing Motorola from enforcing that decision.

.

JonnyBrad · May 23, 2012

Would expect that with both sides having some enforceable bans now they might just sit down and cross license.

GeneralManager · May 23, 2012

A few days ago.

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sour...Lgmb0u&usg=AFQjCNFUuf1r3ITKGWB2lQi98Ba41RG2nQ

So who wins? Nobody.

Gravijah · May 23, 2012

free ~~darko~~ xbox

markot · May 23, 2012

FieryBalrog said:
judge is a grade-A dolt, "intellectual property rights is far more important than keeping the market competitive" or words to that effect

I swear, some judges just like being powerful.

To be fair, 1 console being withdrawn isnt a big blow to competition. Also, ip for actual things is more important than a console war, no matter how many fanboys are dieing on the battlefields.

mavs · May 23, 2012

Well deserved.

markot · May 23, 2012

GeneralManager said:
A few days ago.

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sour...Lgmb0u&usg=AFQjCNFUuf1r3ITKGWB2lQi98Ba41RG2nQ

So who wins? Nobody.

Whats awesome is how awful the patent for Microsoft is in this case, its one of those stupid word trick ones that has no real justification, whereas the Motoroloa one in this case is for an actual patent and building a standard. Microsoft chose not to license it, and now they pay the price for their patent folly.

Also if you cant patent the heat get out of the kitchen... of patents. (Live by the sword die by it, microsoft has so many stupid patents nibbling at android over the most stupid things)

The more ridiculous this stuff gets, the more hope there is for some patent reform... but dont hold your breath, someone probably has a patent on it >.>!

Speedymanic · May 23, 2012

Non story, ITC won't find in favor of Moto.

Einhander · May 23, 2012

Lame if this ban goes into effect. It wouldn't affect me a whole lot since I own both a 360 and PS3 and these days, most third party games are on multiple platforms, and the ones that aren't would have no choice but to move to a different platform. To be honest, it would be nice, in a way, to have one less platform because I could never decide which platform to buy a certain game on. For example, a third party game released on 360 and PS3.

Hanmik · May 23, 2012

Speedymanic said:
Non story, ITC won't find in favor of Moto.

come on.. why..? please explain..?

itsgreen · May 23, 2012

I am getting so tired of patents...

There should be a major rethinking of the patent system

GDGF · May 23, 2012

This would be the most fucked up thing ever to happen in the history of videogames if it went through.

Byronic Hero · May 23, 2012

So the Judge hates US based VG conglomerates?

US = bad, Japanese = good?

Kokonoe · May 23, 2012

I'd be surprised if this actually happens.

markot · May 23, 2012

Speedymanic said:
Non story, ITC won't find in favor of Moto.

Why? Microsoft, as far as is known by me who has done no reasearch into the topic, has not licensed a technology it uses, Motoroala may be asking for too much now after years of abuse at the hands of microsoft, but microsoft has broken the first rule of patents. ignoring them!

Freezie KO · May 23, 2012

Nintendo ninjas clearly visited this judge's house.

markot said:
The more ridiculous this stuff gets, the more hope there is for some patent reform... but dont hold your breath, someone probably has a patent on it >.>!

That was pretty funny. And yeah, everyone does play this game.

KAOz · May 23, 2012

GDGF said:
This would be the most fucked up thing ever to happen in the history of videogames if it went through.

Indeed. This is pretty fucked up overall really.

Fucking patents.

Kusagari · May 23, 2012

Everyone that matters in enforcing something like this will look at the judges decision and lol.

bakedpony · May 23, 2012

markot said:
Why? Microsoft, as far as is known by me who has done no reasearch into the topic, has not licensed a technology it uses, Motoroala may be asking for too much now after years of abuse at the hands of microsoft, but microsoft has broken the first rule of patents. ignoring them!

If this is true then they deserve to have the 360's banned. That's simply stupid of them.

JonnyBrad · May 23, 2012

Byronic Hero said:
So the Judge hates US based VG conglomerates?

US = bad, Japanese = good?

Nothing to do with it. It's a US company sueing a US company.

markot · May 23, 2012

Kusagari said:
Everyone that matters in enforcing something like this will look at the judges decision and lol.

Yeah, cause Judges are like totally not given any authority in society... and dont have a job... to judge... on things...

Gustav · May 23, 2012

For some weird reason I really wish a ban would happen.

Mario007 · May 23, 2012

FieryBalrog said:
judge is a grade-A dolt, "intellectual property rights is far more important than keeping the market competitive" or words to that effect

I swear, some judges just like being powerful.

It's funny that you did not mention the rest of the piece. MS failed to show that PS3 and Wii would not be able to accommodate the demand and needs of consumers.

Also this isn't about the judge being powerful or the judge being a bastard because he happened to rule against your favourite company. Simply IP rights are tremendously important when it comes to innovation in the IT industry and simply eliminating 2 out 3 models of one company who is infringing on IP rights of a company that is not even its direct competitor is a fair and reasonable step. The fact that the competitors benefit from this move is a side-effect. That's like saying Samsung's tablets shouldn't be banned (if they breach Apple's IP rights) as that would make Asus the dominant android tablet maker.

bakedpony · May 23, 2012

Gustav said:
For some weird reason I really wish a ban would happen.

Maybe it will reduce MS's arrogance this gen.

Femmeworth · May 23, 2012

I really hope this happens. Perhaps with Microsoft lobbying for it, there will be actual patent reform.

TheOddOne · May 23, 2012

WASHINGTON (CN) - The International Trade Commission should ban import of some Microsoft Xbox gaming consoles into the United States because they infringe on Motorola patents, an administrative law judge said.

The recommendation is limited to the 4GB and 250GB versions of the Xbox 360 S console.

Judge David Shaw also recommended that the commission prevent sale of the consoles with a cease-and-desist order, and that Microsoft post a bond equal to 7 percent of the declared value of unsold Xbox inventory already in the country.

Shaw's recommendation decision follows his April determination that Microsoft had infringed on four Motorola patents related to secure wireless communication and transmission of video content between controller devices and game consoles.

The public version of Shaw's initial determination has not been released while the companies petition to remove any proprietary information.

Motorola filed its initial complaint with the ITC in November 2010, claiming that the Xbox used Motorola-developed technology that allows set-top boxes to decode transmissions between its Droid2 and DroidX mobile devices.

Microsoft argued that Shaw's exclusion order does not serve the public interest because it would leave consumers of video game consoles with only two options to satisfy their needs: the Sony Playstation and the Nintendo Wii.

Shaw rejected that argument, finding that the public interest in enforcing intellectual property rights outweighs any potential economic impact on video game consol buyers. Moreover, he said, Microsoft did not even try to show that its competitors were incapable of meeting demand for the consoles.

Microsoft and Motorola were also diametrically opposed to the bond value needed to prevent sales of the devices during a presidential review period.

While Microsoft called a bond unnecessary, Motorola argued that the bond should be worth 100 percent of the declared value of unsold Xbox inventory.

Microsoft said Motorola failed to show that anyone bought Xboxes in lieu of Droids or set-top converters, but it argued that a more reasonable bond would be equal to the value of a reasonable license for the technology at issue. It estimated that figure at 2.5 percent of the wholesale value of the consoles.

The public version of Shaw's remedy recommendation redacts the data he used to calculate the 7 percent figure because.

Microsoft and Motorola have been in a patent war for several years, with Microsoft claiming that Motorola refuses to abide by requirements set by the Institute of Electrical and Electronics Engineers Standards Association to set reasonable license fees of essential technology.

Earlier this month a federal judge in Seattle blocked an attempt by a judge in Germany to ban sales of several Microsoft products that the German court found infringed on Motorola's video-compression technology.

Under section 337 of the Tariff Act, administrative law judges investigate allegations of intellectual property infringement against goods imported into the United States. Their initial determinations and recommended remedies then go to ITC commissioners for consideration.

The commissioners can let the initial determination stand, in which case it becomes the official determination of the ITC. Commissioners can also adopt the determination, amend it or send it back for further consideration.

If Shaw's determination and recommendation become final, President Barack Obama will have 60 days to review the decision. After the 60 days lapse ITC orders can only be appealed to the Court of Appeals for the Federal Circuit.

.

Ohh patents.

GraveRobberX · May 23, 2012

I know it will be hella rare for a console ban, but doesn't it make the X720 more susceptible to these patent infringements

Back to the Drawing Board MS goes?, I mean that will hurt more than the 360's in the wild, a complete re-haul of the console with all that R&D gone to waste
Just speculating

Gustav · May 23, 2012

bakedpony said:
Maybe it will reduce MS's arrogance this gen.

I just want to tell the story of the BANNED CONSOLE in twenty years.

FieryBalrog · May 23, 2012

markot said:
To be fair, 1 console being withdrawn isnt a big blow to competition.

I hope you're kidding.

markot said:
Also, ip for actual things is more important than a console war, no matter how many fanboys are dieing on the battlefields.

It really isn't. It should be calculated in damages anyway, this injunction serves no purpose for society which goes against the way IP law should be applied.

markot · May 23, 2012

Gustav said:
I just want to tell the story of the BANNED CONSOLE in twenty years.

More than likely youll be telling your kids about 'consoles' themselves.

And make a tv show based on you telling your kids that story. How I remember consoles. And one episode could deal with the banning I guess.

Kusagari · May 23, 2012

markot said:
Yeah, cause Judges are like totally not given any authority in society... and dont have a job... to judge... on things...

He said he recommends the ITC ban the console. What is he going to do when they they don't?

bakedpony · May 23, 2012

Gustav said:
I just want to tell the story of the BANNED CONSOLE in twenty years.

This is a first for the video game industry right?

Speedymanic · May 23, 2012

markot said:
Why? Microsoft, as far as is known by me who has done no reasearch into the topic, has not licensed a technology it uses, Motoroala may be asking for too much now after years of abuse at the hands of microsoft, but microsoft has broken the first rule of patents. ignoring them!

Years of abuse? Hyperbole much.

It's a non story because of what Moto wants to happen, the ITC won't recommend a ban on the selling/importing of 360 consoles. They might find in favor of Moto getting some money, but even that will be taken to the CoA where it will be tied up for years and years and years.

The only logical thing that can happen is that they will reach a settlement, 360 consoles won't be banned and everyone will walk away happy.

chickdigger802 · May 23, 2012

I know courts are slow as balls... but just imagine how interesting E3 will be this year if 360 got banned...

1-2 hr talk about games for windows and win 7 mobile gaming!

GraveRobberX · May 23, 2012

bakedpony said:
This is a first for the video game industry right?

N-Gage... hehe, even the company said "Why did we do this?", self-impose ban, LOL

TheOddOne · May 23, 2012

bakedpony said:
Maybe it will reduce MS's arrogance this gen.

Arrogance? Dunno, I've seen worse this generation.

markot · May 23, 2012

FieryBalrog said:
I hope you're kidding.

It really isn't. It should be calculated in damages anyway, this injunction serves no purpose for society which goes against the way IP law should be applied.

IP law isnt to protect society, its to protect ip. In this case, some video stuff magic. Microsoft apparently ignored the patent, and built consoles that infringed. Motorola is seeking damages and I assume a ban on the products until the issue is sorted out.

I have a hard time caring honestly, because all these companies do the same things to each other. If Microsoft want not actively threatening linux devs, android manufacters, and doing the same crap to them over the most ridiculous of patents, maybe I would shed a tear for the plight of the common xbox.

As it is, lets take it to 11.

bakedpony · May 23, 2012

TheOddOne said:
Arrogance? Dunno, I've seen worse this generation.

There are indeed worse but the whole ads extravaganda on the dash for paying subscribers really pisses me off.

itsgreen · May 23, 2012

markot said:
Why? Microsoft, as far as is known by me who has done no reasearch into the topic, has not licensed a technology it uses, Motoroala may be asking for too much now after years of abuse at the hands of microsoft, but microsoft has broken the first rule of patents. ignoring them!

Well MS can ignore them for a while.

Until they can't anymore. That moment has passed some time, and they haven't since...

The problem is that Motorola isn't asking a reasonable and fair amount for their patents that are crucial for playing H264 content...

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