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[Tak3n]

Sorry, but the notion that competition isn´t a good thing is not worth discussing.

True, it amazes me people don't se this...

I can only presume you guys don't live in the UK, as if you did you would see a country where consumers have had to have the courts come in because the dominant companies have screwed consumers badly for years

Energy
Water
TV
Banks
Internet

all these sectors were dominated by big companies and consumers were getting conned and all have had the courts go in and tear the companies apart to provide competition.

it is a terrible idea to want the PS4 to dominate, yes at the moment there is competition but if trends continue in 4 years there wont be

 

[Stripper13]

Xbox one and ps4 are same price at jbhifi?

Apologies you are correct, for some reason I thought it was less.

Regardless, I'm not going to argue whether Microsoft have been desperately pushing consoles. A look at any of the offers since the March Titan fall bundle supports the notion that MS is not only price matching, but going beyond to push consoles (free game promotion in US?)

 

[bud23]

Thread is a goldmine of quotes. Among my favourites are the posts implying that Sunset Overdrive is a reason to pick up an Xbox either in September or the next couple of months.

What?

Isn't it? Why? Just because you think so?

No gents, you're not entitled to your opinion, because people just can't seem to divert their opinions.

Sunset overdrive sucks, as XBOne does.

#Truthfacts.

Are you serious m8?

 

[Jack cw]

No that's playing second base. Surrendering brand priority. The urgency is always there, the closer the competitors, the higher the effort. A marathon runner won't aim for first from the back of the back, he'll build his own personal success. The top runners whom are close together will push harder the closer they are and near the finish line.

Too bad this whole business isnt a marathon and only one runner is in front and that by miles. This was a sprint when WiiU failed to sell systems and the bad PR killed xbone before it even launched. There is more than games and simple brand priority. The product has to become a brand, something that is worth buying not only because of its value. Apple shows that pretty clearly when the sell their latest revisions. Last year, all 3 companies showed what they had in store for the next console cycle (note, that these are closed systems and specs wont change anymore) and people chose what they wanted. It was a close race in the first few weeks, but one of your runners clearly had the package the majority of people wanted. Competition.

 

[barit]

Because they dont actually think competition is good they just dont like which side is winning, if it was the other way around they would all be making doomed ps4 articles.

The truth hurts sometimes but pssst don't tell anyone

 

[CrazedProfessional]

Nice in theory, but I feel that PS2 generation was great for me as a consumer. I bought an Xbox a few months after it came out for nearly half the price and with a whole bunch of games.

The PS2 Generation killed a lot of competition. The Gamecube was fading fast and the Xbox had less that 10 hits. Hell, Nintendo had to sell of RARE and refuse a buyout offer form Microsoft in that very special generation. Great for consumers, eventually. competition still shrunk massively.

 

[stoebz]

lol

 

[Psycho_Mantis]

True, it amazes me people don't se this...

I can only presume you guys don't live in the UK, as if you did you would see a country where consumers have had to have the courts come in because the dominant companies have screwed consumers badly for years

Energy
Water
TV
Banks
Internet

all these sectors were dominated by big companies and consumers were getting conned and all have had the courts go in and tear the companies apart to provide competition.

it is a terrible idea to want the PS4 to dominate, yes at the moment there is competition but if trends continue in 4 years there wont be

No.

The market decides what it wants. If they want the PS4 then that should serve as a lesson to MS and Nintendo in what the market wants.

 

[hydrophilic attack]

It should be clear to anyone that has been following gaming news recently that Sony has allowed their success to go to their head and turn into classic Playstation arrogance. While Xbox continues to positively pump out new OS features that makes The One a joy to own, Playstation contents themselves with stability updates and, if we are lucky, a Share Factory update once every four months.

It is also apparent in their approach to releasing games. While Xbox continues to delight gamers, by securing breathtaking exclusives like Sunset Overdrive and Rise of the Tomb Raider or by securing exclusive FIFA experiences, Sony are content to only enter transparent marketing deals for the biggest disappointment of the generation. Playstation arrogance have even gotten to levels where they feel they can stop paying checks to Ubisoft to gimp XBO versions of games to give gamers the impression that PS4 is superior hardware. A gross miscalculation, in my opinion. When AC: Unity releases this fall and looks just as good on The One, gamers will finally realize that the so-called power advantage of the PS4 was a lie all along.

Perhaps most embarrassing of all is how Sony envisioned Driveclub to be a big exclusive that would help drive sales throughout the Holiday season. With gameplay stuck in the 1900s and next to no customization options how did they expect anyone to pick that game up in 2014? And don’t get me started on the multiplayer and PS+ version fiasco. Rather than propel PS4 sales, I expect the bad word-of-mouth from the Driveclub fiasco will negatively affect PS4 sales well into 2015. I am willing to commit to the following bet here and now: Driveclub will be a huge disappointment that will not even chart in the NPD to be released this week. If it does, I will eat my hat. You can laugh all you want, but I expect to be the one still laughing on Thursday night, and you can quote me on that.

 

[Stripper13]

What?

Isn't it? Why? Just because you think so?

No gents, you're not entitled to your opinion, because people just can't seem to divert their opinions.

Sunset overdrive sucks, as XBOne does.

#Truthfacts.

Are you serious m8?

I don't think it sucks? If it makes you feel and better, I think infamous is in the same boat. Quality title sure. An influence on sales in pushing a struggling console past the leading console? Nope.

 

[GAMEPROFF]

I dont think this is actually the case. Not in the month where Destiny launched and we already hat the news that this moved tons of PS4-SKUs. Next month its more likely I think, due to Halo, but then again, Christmas is coming and I think more people will buy a PS4 for this... But I can be wrong.

Why? PSN is still a joke compared to Live. MS have been updating the thing like nothing we have seen before, not to mention the heavy focus on exclusives and price cuts.

Yes, there are a lot of maintenance problems and they fucked up Driveclub extremly, but I dont think that most people outside of our gamer filtrebubble care that much, when the PSN is down one day a month.

But its not deniable, that MS really makes a fantastic job with the firmware releases.

 

[FeiRR]

MS price matching their competitor with a different sku is giving the console away? You're right the quotes in this thread are great.

We know that their console costs more to produce due to ESRAM. They had to remove Kinect to get any profit margin with their price matched units. Bundling game with no price increase is costing them double (firstly they have to pay the publisher, secondly they lose their royalty fee on every copy). Spinning it like a win for them is not really a good idea.

 

[plasmawave]

It should be clear to anyone that has been following gaming news recently that Sony has allowed their success to go to their head and turn into classic Playstation arrogance. While Xbox continues to positively pump out new OS features that makes The One a joy to own, Playstation contents themselves with stability updates and, if we are lucky, a Share Factory update once every four months.

It is also apparent in their approach to releasing games. While Xbox continues to delight gamers, by securing breathtaking exclusives like Sunset Overdrive and Rise of the Tomb Raider or by securing exclusive FIFA experiences, Sony are content to only enter transparent marketing deals for the biggest disappointment of the generation. Playstation arrogance have even gotten to levels where they feel they can stop paying checks to Ubisoft to gimp XBO versions of games to give gamers the impression that PS4 is superior hardware. A gross miscalculation, in my opinion. When AC: Unity releases this fall and looks just as good on The One, gamers will finally realize that the so-called power advantage of the PS4 was a lie all along.

Perhaps most embarrassing of all is how Sony envisioned Driveclub to be a big exclusive that would help drive sales throughout the Holiday season. With gameplay stuck in the 1900s and next to no customization options how did they expect anyone to pick that game up in 2014? And don’t get me started on the multiplayer and PS+ version fiasco. Rather than propel PS4 sales, I expect the bad word-of-mouth from the Driveclub fiasco will negatively affect PS4 sales well into 2015. I am willing to commit to the following bet here and now: Driveclub will be a huge disappointment that will not even chart in the NPD to be released this week. If it does, I will eat my hat. You can laugh all you want, but I expect to be the one still laughing on Thursday night, and you can quote me on that.

That's not really a fair bet now is it?

 

[Ace001]

What if competition results in these companies trying to win our business at all costs. This results in them losing money and having a negative effect on the industry...

I don't know, just thinking out loud

 

[Saty]

Also:

Wedbush Morgan analyst Michael Pachter is predicting that The NPD Group, which tracks sales of new games at U.S. retailers, will reveal that new software generated $435 million last month. That would represent a 42-percent drop in revenues from $754 million in a similar period in 2013.

“We estimate Destiny’s NPD unit sales figures for September will be 2.75 million units,” said Pacther. “That’s well below Grand Theft Auto V’s roughly 7 million unites last year.”

http://venturebeat.com/2014/10/13/d...predicts-big-dip-in-september-software-sales/

 

[Tak3n]

No.

The market decides what it wants. If they want the PS4 then that should serve as a lesson to MS and Nintendo in what the market wants.

you miss my point (my bad)

it is not about what the market wants, it is about how Sony react having dominance, that is the question and that is where no competition becomes bad..

Does a runner who is 50 metres ahead of his competition with 100 metres to go push as hard as if his main competitor is on his shoulder...

YOU are trusting Sony not to take their foot of the pedal, not a good idea

 

[GlamFM]

No.

The market decides what it wants. If they want the PS4 then that should serve as a lesson to MS and Nintendo in what the market wants.

What if competition results in these companies trying to win our business at all costs. This results in them losing money and having a negative effect on the industry...

I don't know, just thinking out loud

The consumer is the one that loses though. When you don´t face competition you don´t have to push - it´s simple as that.

Game quality decreases, prices increase and so on.

There is a reason why governments prevent monopolies from happening/existing.

History has shown that everybody will abuse his power eventually if he has too much of it.

Its human nature.

 

[SmokyDave]

lol

I could sneeze on my fucking keyboard and make a better contribution than this. Step your game up.

 

[RandyBobandy]

This thread has actually made me more curious about NPD then I have been since they stopped showing numbers

 

[Knuf]

What amazes me the most are not the terrible posts of both "sides" in this thread, but that a man terrible at doing his job, regardless of the inside knowledge one in his position should have, still manages to get paid: many coworkers I know got laid off even if they were very good at their job.

 

[El-Pistolero]

Sorry, but the notion that competition isn´t a good thing is not worth discussing.

Sorry, but you seem to conflate winning comfortably with creating a monopoly. The first is the possible outcome of a healthy competition; the second is the result of barriers of entry generally imposed by companies that bend the rules to their will. Sony is in no financial position to force their will upon the market. They have just played their cards smartly...
If MS were to establish a hegemony, they would force Sony out following a war of attrition, only to vacate a slot that no entity would occupy, imo. The gradual shift in videogames consumption is threatening the traditional way of playing, and I honestly think that if it were not for the conservative ways of Sony -by realeasing a conventional gaming console-, the virtues and disadvantages of which could be debated (The PS4 is an interesting machine, albeit a known quantity, with no ambition other than perfecting an old receipe), MS would have slowly started moving away from the hardcore market.

 

[Footos22]

I can see this being right. But not by that margin lol. 20000 at the most.

Worldwide though its gonna be a slaughter.

 

[Coulomb_Barrier]

The consumer is the one that loses though. When you don´t face competition you don´t have to push - it´s simple as that.

Game quality decreases, prices increase and so on.

There is a reason why governments prevent monopolies from happening/existing.

History has shown that everybody will abuse his power eventually if he has too much of it.

Its human nature.

Yeah but your argument ain't about 'competition' in all forms though, let's be honest.

It's 'I want Xbox One to sell better. Because I like it'.

Unfortunately, you don't get to decide for the people what they choose in this competition between the PS4 and Xbone, they do.

Here is what competition is anyway:

One console with a slower graphics card and slow DDR3 memory being sold at the same price as another console with a faster graphics cards and more expensive GDDR5 memory is being outsold by the more valuable machine. The market has decided.

 

[El-Pistolero]

It should be clear to anyone that has been following gaming news recently that Sony has allowed their success to go to their head and turn into classic Playstation arrogance. While Xbox continues to positively pump out new OS features that makes The One a joy to own, Playstation contents themselves with stability updates and, if we are lucky, a Share Factory update once every four months.

It is also apparent in their approach to releasing games. While Xbox continues to delight gamers, by securing breathtaking exclusives like Sunset Overdrive and Rise of the Tomb Raider or by securing exclusive FIFA experiences, Sony are content to only enter transparent marketing deals for the biggest disappointment of the generation. Playstation arrogance have even gotten to levels where they feel they can stop paying checks to Ubisoft to gimp XBO versions of games to give gamers the impression that PS4 is superior hardware. A gross miscalculation, in my opinion. When AC: Unity releases this fall and looks just as good on The One, gamers will finally realize that the so-called power advantage of the PS4 was a lie all along.

Perhaps most embarrassing of all is how Sony envisioned Driveclub to be a big exclusive that would help drive sales throughout the Holiday season. With gameplay stuck in the 1900s and next to no customization options how did they expect anyone to pick that game up in 2014? And don’t get me started on the multiplayer and PS+ version fiasco. Rather than propel PS4 sales, I expect the bad word-of-mouth from the Driveclub fiasco will negatively affect PS4 sales well into 2015. I am willing to commit to the following bet here and now: Driveclub will be a huge disappointment that will not even chart in the NPD to be released this week. If it does, I will eat my hat. You can laugh all you want, but I expect to be the one still laughing on Thursday night, and you can quote me on that.

This is the most idiotic post I have real in the last month or so...Respect!

 

[EGM1966]

It should be clear to anyone that has been following gaming news recently that Sony has allowed their success to go to their head... While Xbox continues to delight gamers, by securing breathtaking exclusives like Sunset Overdrive and Rise of the Tomb Raider or by securing exclusive FIFA experiences... When AC: Unity releases this fall and looks just as good on The One, gamers will finally realize that the so-called power advantage of the PS4 was a lie all along.

I honestly can't tell if this is terrific sarcasm troll or awful biased based troll or what.

It sure is full on though.

 

[Psycho_Mantis]

The consumer is the one that loses though. When you don´t face competition you don´t have to push - it´s simple as that.

Game quality decreases, prices increase and so on.

There is a reason why governments prevent monopolies from happening/existing.

History has shown that everybody will abuse his power eventually if he has too much of it.

Its human nature.

We all know why monopolies are detrimental to consumers but looking specifically at game development is a dev suddenly not going to put as much effort into their game just because the console they are working on is selling well? I don't buy the game quality decreases bit at all. Frequency of price drops makes sense but the other doesn't to me.

you miss my point (my bad)

it is not about what the market wants, it is about how Sony react having dominance, that is the question and that is where no competition becomes bad..

Does a runner who is 50 metres ahead of his competition with 100 metres to go push as hard as if his main competitor is on his shoulder...

YOU are trusting Sony not to take their foot of the pedal, not a good idea

yes and due to PS4 dominating you are now seeing MS issuing all these great bundles.

Are you saying that it would be better if MS and Sony were neck and neck? I can see were you're coming from but that would mean that the MS may not learn from its mistakes. Now that the PS4 is outselling the XB1 2:1 or whatever what do you think MS will be wary of next time when launching a console?

 

[Chobel]

Competition =/= no dominance. MS is already competing, just not winning.

The consumer is the one that loses though. When you don´t face competition you don´t have to push - it´s simple as that.

Game quality decreases, prices increase and so on.

There is a reason why governments prevent monopolies from happening/existing.

History has shown that everybody will abuse his power eventually if he has too much of it.

Its human nature.

I didn't know PS2/PS1 era games were shit.

 

[GlamFM]

Yeah but your argument ain't about 'competition' in all forms though, let's be honest.

It's 'I want Xbox One to sell better. Because I like it'.

That´s just entirely made up.

 

[John Bender]

Why? PSN is still a joke compared to Live. MS have been updating the thing like nothing we have seen before, not to mention the heavy focus on exclusives and price cuts.

Why? Because "Common Sense".
White PS4 + Black PS4 + Destiny Launch.
The Xbox won't even be near the PS4 sales in september.
The Xbox + free game deal was only there to counter the White PS4 bundle.
So think about it.

Man, I will have a field day in two days. Quoting people like you in the upcoming NPD thread will be fun ;P

 

[joey_bone_bomb]

This is the most idiotic post I have real in the last month or so...Respect!

Come on, it's so obviously a joke post. How can you fall for this?

 

[stryke]

Lol Sony isn't going to have a monopoly

 

[GYNGA]

Why would PS4 be only 250k in september? Didn't it sell nearly 200k in august?

 

[El-Pistolero]

Competition =/= no dominance. MS is already competing, just not winning.



I didn't know PS2/PS1 era games were shit.

Yep, that should be the case following his weak argument. Interesting how those generations produced the greatest number of hits in the history of videogames. The hypothesis is rejected!

 

[MRMagoo]

What?

Isn't it? Why? Just because you think so?

No gents, you're not entitled to your opinion, because people just can't seem to divert their opinions.

Sunset overdrive sucks, as XBOne does.

#Truthfacts.

Are you serious m8?

You are doing the same thing you are accusing people of.

 

[Hindle]

Also:

http://venturebeat.com/2014/10/13/d...predicts-big-dip-in-september-software-sales/

2.75m for Destiny, Good or bad?

Personally I think it's mediocre.

 

[John Bender]

It should be clear to anyone that has been following gaming news recently that Sony has allowed their success to go to their head and turn into classic Playstation arrogance. While Xbox continues to positively pump out new OS features that makes The One a joy to own, Playstation contents themselves with stability updates and, if we are lucky, a Share Factory update once every four months.

It is also apparent in their approach to releasing games. While Xbox continues to delight gamers, by securing breathtaking exclusives like Sunset Overdrive and Rise of the Tomb Raider or by securing exclusive FIFA experiences, Sony are content to only enter transparent marketing deals for the biggest disappointment of the generation. Playstation arrogance have even gotten to levels where they feel they can stop paying checks to Ubisoft to gimp XBO versions of games to give gamers the impression that PS4 is superior hardware. A gross miscalculation, in my opinion. When AC: Unity releases this fall and looks just as good on The One, gamers will finally realize that the so-called power advantage of the PS4 was a lie all along.

Perhaps most embarrassing of all is how Sony envisioned Driveclub to be a big exclusive that would help drive sales throughout the Holiday season. With gameplay stuck in the 1900s and next to no customization options how did they expect anyone to pick that game up in 2014? And don’t get me started on the multiplayer and PS+ version fiasco. Rather than propel PS4 sales, I expect the bad word-of-mouth from the Driveclub fiasco will negatively affect PS4 sales well into 2015. I am willing to commit to the following bet here and now: Driveclub will be a huge disappointment that will not even chart in the NPD to be released this week. If it does, I will eat my hat. You can laugh all you want, but I expect to be the one still laughing on Thursday night, and you can quote me on that.

New Neogaf meme being born, right in front of our eyes.
This thread is a goldmine.

 

[Chobel]

Lol Sony isn't going to have a monopoly

Didn't you hear? Selling better than your competition means you have a monopoly.

 

[Coulomb_Barrier]

That´s just entirely made up.

So what's your argument then?

You want to see some arbitrary hardware sales 'parity' (you don't work for Ubisoft do you?) so that each console manufacturer can tickle each other's armpits at the top of the sales charts in complete equality, and everyone is happy?

That's not how it works son.

Again:

More powerful machine v less powerful machine at the same price-point. The more powerful machine sells more. For some reason, you have a problem with that and would like to see the weaker machine propped up, for 'competitions sake'!

What you are witnessing is exactly the product of competition for god sakes man.

 

[Imouto]

It should be clear to anyone that has been following gaming news recently that Sony has allowed their success to go to their head and turn into classic Playstation arrogance. While Xbox continues to positively pump out new OS features that makes The One a joy to own, Playstation contents themselves with stability updates and, if we are lucky, a Share Factory update once every four months.

It is also apparent in their approach to releasing games. While Xbox continues to delight gamers, by securing breathtaking exclusives like Sunset Overdrive and Rise of the Tomb Raider or by securing exclusive FIFA experiences, Sony are content to only enter transparent marketing deals for the biggest disappointment of the generation. Playstation arrogance have even gotten to levels where they feel they can stop paying checks to Ubisoft to gimp XBO versions of games to give gamers the impression that PS4 is superior hardware. A gross miscalculation, in my opinion. When AC: Unity releases this fall and looks just as good on The One, gamers will finally realize that the so-called power advantage of the PS4 was a lie all along.

Perhaps most embarrassing of all is how Sony envisioned Driveclub to be a big exclusive that would help drive sales throughout the Holiday season. With gameplay stuck in the 1900s and next to no customization options how did they expect anyone to pick that game up in 2014? And don’t get me started on the multiplayer and PS+ version fiasco. Rather than propel PS4 sales, I expect the bad word-of-mouth from the Driveclub fiasco will negatively affect PS4 sales well into 2015. I am willing to commit to the following bet here and now: Driveclub will be a huge disappointment that will not even chart in the NPD to be released this week. If it does, I will eat my hat. You can laugh all you want, but I expect to be the one still laughing on Thursday night, and you can quote me on that.

I will eat my shoe if this is not a parody or joke post of some sort.

There is no way, right?

 

[Psycho_Mantis]

I will eat my shoe if this is not a parody or joke post of some sort.

There is no way, right?

I read it as a joke at first but then I clicked his tag......I don't know anymore.

 

[CrazedProfessional]

This thread is the reason Neogaf-on-Sony's-payroll conspiracy theories exist.

 

[Xando]

competition is king....

all the people hoping for PS4 to wipe the floor with Sony, will in the end regret it, history is littered with evidence of how bad companies can act when they are the dominant force..

One could argue that is already happening depending on how you view things...

Firmware updates?

Features added?

PSN is just well.... a joke and Xmas is looming and will likely get even worse

of course Sony would deny any link to those not being updated because of their dominance...

but that is not the question, the question should always be..

Would the PS4 still be as it is if they were in Microsoft position in terms of sales?

These threads always give us gold posts like this one <3

 

[mocoworm]

When you wrote this, did you for one moment consider taking into account current and upcoming ps4 games?

I like how he listed Xbox One launch itlesand future titles for Microsoft, but only the white Playstation 4 Destiny Bundle for Sony as his argument for the overall systems' value.

Did you even read my post? I was talking about exclusives available in 2014. Do you want me to define the term 'context' for you?

I also added this in my next post, which you seem to have conveniently skimmed over.

I know that PS4 has exclusives out, but SONY are pushing Destiny as their main game with nothing of note really dropping until 2015. It just seems like the MS exclusive software offering is far more appealing to people who are looking to pick up a console for the holidays, and their marketing is much more prominent... at least it is here in the UK.

 

[Ashler]

I read it as a joke at first but then I clicked his tag......I don't know anymore.

My thoughts exactly.

 

[Son of Sam]

This thread is the reason Neogaf-on-Sony's-payroll conspiracy theories exist.

i know. so so so much animosity up in here. you would have thought Patcher kicked someones dog

 

[SaucyJack]

Sorry, but you seem to conflate winning comfortably with creating a monopoly. The first is the possible outcome of a healthy competition; the second is the result of barriers of entry generally imposed by companies that bend the rules to their will. Sony is in no financial position to force their will upon the market. They have just played their cards smartly...
If MS were to establish a hegemony, they would force Sony out following a war of attrition, only to vacate a slot that no entity would occupy, imo. The gradual shift in videogames consumption is threatening the traditional way of playing, and I honestly think that if it were not for the conservative ways of Sony -by realeasing a conventional gaming console-, the virtues and disadvantages of which could be debated (The PS4 is an interesting machine, albeit a known quantity, with no ambition other than perfecting an old receipe), MS would have slowly started moving away from the hardcore market.

Like, for example, PC Operating Systems and Office productivity software

 

[Coulomb_Barrier]

The Xbone and Wii U sell badly compared to the Neogaf favorite and people think it's a good thing. The more competition the more gamers are valued.

This thread is the reason Neogaf-on-Sony's-payroll conspiracy theories exist.

Yeah I'd be careful with that crap if I was you. Everyone's just having a debate here.

Spoiler

Well, apart from Mocoworm.

 

[GnawtyDog]

This thread is the reason Neogaf-on-Sony's-payroll conspiracy theories exist.

Not sure if serious?

 

[mrklaw]

so PS4 will definitely be higher than Pachter's prediction because of 5 weeks plus destiny bundle meaning it'll definitely be more than August/4*5

reports from the field from our friends in retail suggest that PS4 demand is still very strong.

Amazon seems to mirror NPD fairly well and that shows PS4 doing better than Xbox

He gets paid for this stuff right?

 

[NemesisPrime]

One console with a slower graphics card and slow DDR3 memory being sold at the same price as another console with a faster graphics cards and more expensive GDDR5 memory is being outsold by the more valuable machine. The market has decided.

I hope you bought a C64, SNES, N64, PS1, Original XBox and a 360 then.