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[Spring-Loaded]

Because that's the whole point of the zero suit?

Not only does this redesign look like it could fit inside most renditions of the Chozo armor (particularly in art from the earlier games and the Prime series), but it also looks like it has gear that could be stripped away if need be. If she's running around in the Zero Suit, it only makes sense for there to be at least some armor and a holster for her stun gun. If the point of the Zero Suit is to fit inside the Chozo armor, then this is fine.

Is every time we see ZSS when she's inside her ship, or at home alone in her apartment? The one time I remember ZSS being playable was when she was caught unawares in Zero Mission. Who's to say she wouldn't have contingency gear for the Zero Suit?

 

[WhoaIsThatMars]

I REALLY love that Samus

 

[Morrigan Stark]

There are people who enjoy these designs as they are, if you don't like them then no problem there are other games out there with female character designs of your liking.

I fucking wish. The vast majority of female action heroines are designed like the "before" pictures, not the after. That's precisely why those redesigns are a breath of fresh air and why many women are sick of seeing the former.

 

[JBourne]

Some of them are great, others are pretty bad. Love the Emma Frost, absolutely hate the Gamora.

 

[lil]

And yet the zero suit has a) high heels and b) is ubiquitous in SSB. It's annoying how the zero suit is becoming more common than the actual armour.

For a game like SSB, if you want to play as Samus without her power armour, that redesign would be perfect. No, it wouldn't be worn under her power suit, but it's at least combat-ready.

tbh I'll be forever mad that ZSS is actually a thing in SSB, even though she was my Brawl main lol. Like, couldn't we just have this awesome hulking tank lady who you never really saw? She was so perfect in SSB and Melee by virtue of being the only huge female character and they couldn't just let it be, now we have to have this vulnerable, sexualized version of Samus upstaging her and it's annoying.

 

[Doctor Decimate]

I really like the Zero Suit Samus redesign on its own, but when you consider that it's supposed to be something worn under her armor it makes pretty much no sense whatsoever. I'd still probably take it over the original, though.

 

[Corpekata]

We must respect the lore reasons for the Zero Suit! Unless it's a game where she's fighting people in it for some reason, then it's okay.

 

[Kinyou]

Not feeling the Scarlet Witch design at all

 

[Morrigan Stark]

We must respect the lore reasons for the Zero Suit! Unless it's a game where she's fighting people in it for some reason, then it's okay.

lol of course

We must respect the practicality of wearing something slender under the powersuit! Because it's mechanically unsound otherwise!

Unless she's morphing into a ball somehow, then that's okay.

 

[Groof]

Both Samus and Emma Frost are stellar. The Chun-Li... eeeeeehhh

 

[Leunam]

The thing is the Zero Suit isn't supposed to be used in combat. Hell, Samus only uses it because her armor gets completely fucked, and then she only has minimal survivability.

You could argue that stuff like heels are stupid, but the point of the Zero Suit is so she isn't butt naked under the armor and not so she has a fighting chance without it.

What about a chance of survival? Think of it as what a pilot would need in the event they're shot down. Light armor, survival gear, and a sidearm. I think the redesign reflects those thoughts.

 

[Puruzi]

Why do these things always focus on characters they want to change and saying something is wrong with the industry in general when it's just cherry picking?

There are people who enjoy these designs as they are, if you don't like them then no problem there are other games out there with female character designs of your liking.

Thank you, if a game has characters who don't look the way you want then don't play it. Nobody is forcing you to.

 

[Palculator]

This is embarrassing and should be rightly held up as what is wrong with female character design.

Eh. A game can have needlessly oversexualized characters. The problem isn't Quiet herself, the problem is that the majority of female characters are needlessly oversexualized with few alternative portrayals. It's about more diversity in female character design, not having every woman be the same again, just in the opposite direction this time.

Also: Remember EVA? She was sexualized to the point of having quick time tits and ass shots. But it was fine since she was in a game with The Boss and EVA's sexuality made complete sense within the narrative and her character. Therefore I'm having trouble judging Quiet's design until I know the story of Phantom Pain and knowing that Kojima seems to be very aware of how controversial she is.

 

[DorkyMohr]

I see this kind of thought experiment as largely distracting as the problem with designs aren't the designs themselves, it's how ubiquitous the trends in those designs are across all media. Gathering a bunch of characters together for a makeover just leads to a bunch of nitpicks over each divergence from the source material. Even worse when it devolves into arguments over in-world consistency (samus's zero suit is this way because bladity blah).

 

[LiK]

We must respect the lore reasons for the Zero Suit! Unless it's a game where she's fighting people in it for some reason, then it's okay.

you must mean Smash, cuz it was definitely done for fan service purposes only.

 

[akidnamededdy]

I really like the Zero Suit Samus redesign on its own, but when you consider that it's supposed to be something worn under her armor it makes pretty much no sense whatsoever. I'd still probably take it over the original, though.

Exactly, it's a neat idea for something else but not as a replacement for the Zero Suit. There's a fair bit you can do to make the Zero Suit look less ridiculous without slapping hockey pads and a helmet over it.

 

[Vermillion]

Not only does this redesign look like it could fit inside most renditions of the Chozo armor (particularly in art from the earlier games and the Prime series), but it also looks like it has gear that could be stripped away if need be. If she's running around in the Zero Suit, it only makes sense for there to be at least some armor and a holster for her stun gun. If the point of the Zero Suit is to fit inside the Chozo armor, then this is fine.

Is every time we see ZSS when she's inside her ship, or at home alone in her apartment? The one time I remember ZSS being playable was when she was caught unawares in Zero Mission. Who's to say she wouldn't have contingency gear for the Zero Suit?

Cause these days she can summon the armor with a thought. That's another thing that annoys me in SSB. The only contingency she has in-game is the Paralyzer. She is superhuman without the suit and a WMD with it.

 

[Stone Ocean]

Not only does this redesign look like it could fit inside most renditions of the Chozo armor (particularly in art from the earlier games and the Prime series), but it also looks like it has gear that could be stripped away if need be. If she's running around in the Zero Suit, it only makes sense for there to be at least some armor and a holster for her stun gun. If the point of the Zero Suit is to fit inside the Chozo armor, then this is fine.

The redesign looks like overalls and the inside of the power suit is basically skin-tight.

Sure, the redesign would work if as an armor-less version of Samus, but the Zero Suit is basically underwear.

 

[ElBoxyBrown]

We must respect the lore reasons for the Zero Suit! Unless it's a game where she's fighting people in it for some reason, then it's okay.

I mean if we're gonna talk about practicality in a Smash game then how the hell does Little Mac survive against half the roster with no armor?

 

[MMaRsu]

Because it's embarrassing. These characters (male and female) are often born from manifestations of male fantasies. Women are fine with curves and sexuality. As a matter of fact, many of the alternatives proposed still accentuate breasts and butt. However they mostly have one thing in common: they are much classier than some heroine wearing tights that would make a stripper blush.

What is wrong with breasts and butts?

Is there something wrong with a man exposing his chest as well?

I don't see how it's embarrassing. For who is it embarassing exactly?

 

[Riposte]

I don't know if I would call many of these great upgrades. Like I wouldn't be interested in seeing them beyond some goofy 1 image challenge. Some of them have nice art (some really don't). I see the love of jackets over spandex continues with the Power Girl one (maybe the one I like the most?).

I was expecting something worse. There are some real horrors out there surrounding this concept.

 

[Corpekata]

you must mean Smash, cuz it was definitely done for fan service purposes only.

Yes.

Zero Suit is VASTLY more associated with Smash (and is likely where the artist is coming from) than it is with the Metroid series proper, so it seems silly to worry about things like lore viability. Let her have some armor.

 

[Orochinagis]

lol of course

We must respect the practicality of wearing something slender under the powersuit! Because it's mechanically unsound otherwise!

Unless she's morphing into a ball somehow, then that's okay.

Space pirates tried to replicate the morph ball with really bad twisted results

 

[Spring-Loaded]

Because it was stated as a redesign of the Zero Suit, which is what she wears under her power armor... Let's not be willfully ignorant here.

Then why is it being compared to Zero Suit?

...the person who drew it and said "this is my idea for a Zero Suit redesign"?

1) The Varia suit is big enough in most depictions to fit this whole redesign inside and 2) there's clearly armor plating that could stripped off if there wasn't room for it inside the suit.

The Zero Suit was likely created to be an excuse to draw Samus being practically naked. If this particular redeisgn was made cannon, it would be practical if she ever has to fight outside of her Varia suit, it could reasonably fit inside the Varia suit and fan artists could still draw her in the zentai catsuit all they want. There's nothing canonically wrong with this redesign.

lol of course

We must respect the practicality of wearing something slender under the powersuit! Because it's mechanically unsound otherwise!

Unless she's morphing into a ball somehow, then that's okay.

Not only that, but it can fit within the series canon. People are just devoted to the impossibly form-fitting catsuit.

 

[Shaanyboi]

What.

I don't know why you think that, or how you came to that conclusion but I will firmly disagree with this notion right here.

Character design is inherently influenced and reflective of our cultural attitudes and values. Women continually being sexualized in specific ways didn't happen purely out of coincidence. Denying that is like denying the sky is blue.

 

[angrygnat]

Some of the designs are really interesting. The Samus design in particular. What I did notice though is the fantasy aspect of it all. The designs are still impractical for the most part. Body types are still thin, youthful, mostly white. What would be even more interesting would be redesigns of the men.

 

[Angelus Errare]

Why would Samus wear an armor under her armor? Who's got pants under their pants?

Well if she's in combat wearing the zero suit, one would hope she'd have some kind of intermediate armor on until she can get to the power suit.

Not really that hard to come up with a logical explanation.

 

[MoogleWizard]

Not only does this redesign look like it could fit inside most renditions of the Chozo armor (particularly in art from the earlier games and the Prime series), but it also looks like it has gear that could be stripped away if need be. If she's running around in the Zero Suit, it only makes sense for there to be at least some armor and a holster for her stun gun. If the point of the Zero Suit is to fit inside the Chozo armor, then this is fine.

Is every time we see ZSS when she's inside her ship, or at home alone in her apartment? The one time I remember ZSS being playable was when she was caught unawares in Zero Mission. Who's to say she wouldn't have contingency gear for the Zero Suit?

No, it wouldn't fit. Just call it "Alt suit" then.

lol of course

We must respect the practicality of wearing something slender under the powersuit! Because it's mechanically unsound otherwise!

Unless she's morphing into a ball somehow, then that's okay.

If we shouldn't plain about practicality, why are you complaining about the practicality of the zero suit for SSB? Do you also complain about the practicality of Shulk's swimming trunks? Fan service in a fan service game. The horror!

 

[Mesoian]

Some of these miss the point of the outfits dramatically (that ZZS is terrible and is a great example of how people have forgotten what Samus is because Nintendo keeps putting that thing on the forefront of who she's supposed to be). The Scarlet Witch one misses the mark by a pretty wide margin as well.

Some of these are pretty great though. That Emma Frost one and the Morrigan one are top notch.

Yes.

Zero Suit is VASTLY more associated with Smash (and is likely where the artist is coming from) than it is with the Metroid series proper, so it seems silly to worry about things like lore viability.

To the point where a lot of people who haven't played through the prime series are starting to think that Samus in her suit and out of her suit ARE DIFFERENT PEOPLE.

Both Samus and Emma Frost are stellar. The Chun-Li... eeeeeehhh

She just wants the alpha outfit back.

I want the alpha outfit back.

This was always better.

 

[FluxWaveZ]

1) The Varia suit is big enough in most depictions to fit this whole redesign inside and 2) there's clearly armor plating that could stripped off if there wasn't room for it inside the suit.

The Zero Suit was likely created to be an excuse to draw Samus being practically naked. If this particular redeisgn was made cannon, it would be practical if she ever has to fight outside of her Varia suit, it could reasonably fit inside the Varia suit and fan artists could still draw her in the zentai catsuit all they want. There's nothing canonically wrong with this redesign.

So... she's wearing it under her power armor.

 

[DarkKyo]

I love that Zero Suit Samus redesign! But like others I take issue with that Peach redesign. With ZSS it is a redesigned costume concept so she's not so needlessly skimpy looking and it's a vast improvement because it's more realistic and it just looks cooler than a boring body silhouette. The Peach re-concept fails because it is almost a polar opposite of the original character. Peach is the archetype of the Princess that needs saving. Much more so than someone like Zelda. This could be seen as a sexist role and design by todays standards but it's a take on an archetype that originated centuries ago, so it's to be expected. Making her a gun-toting, gruff chick that can save herself is almost like making an "anti-Peach". Besides that style is so much more lore-defying than most of the other redesigns there.

 

[Crocodile]

How so? The point of these characters are to be powerful warriors. Dressing them up in kinky gear to begin with was missing the point; these redesigns fixed that.

Noriko is certainly infinitely better. She's dressed comfortably and looks like a more believable warrior.

A) Heavy Metal, to my understanding and of what little of it I've been exposed to, is a pulpy, trashy series. It never struck me as something produced to be appealing to all audiences. They were supposed to be powerful characters, and their actions back this up, but the the chainmail bikinis always seemed to be a part of fantasy grunge aesthetic that the author(s) were aiming for.

B) Again, I like the redesign. I just don't think its stands as leaps and shoulders above the original. While there are obviously limits, I don't value practicality that highly for either gender when it comes to character design. I think its more important that if the character is supposed to look fearsome or imposing that they accomplish that - that seems to be the most important part of Noriko's overall design and the redesign doesn't do it much better than the original.

 

[butalala]

Someone around here has a picture of Peach wearing an overalls dress thing over a pink shirt. I think that would be a nice adventuring costume for a game like SM3DW. Peach is in dire need of a design and personality update.

Regarding ZSS, here's what real space people wear under their spacesuits:

so, maybe the zero suit can be form fitting, just not so form fitting that it hugs her boobs and buns so tight. The best thing about the ZSS redesign is the helmet/hood. It looks like the Snoopy Cap that real astronauts wear.

I think it would make sense and look futuristic. How else does she keep all that long ass hair under control?

I like many of the other redesigns. I'm all for character designs that wouldn't embarrass my grandma or make my girlfriend roll her eyes.

 

[Hexa]

There isn't a single design in there that I can say I definitely like better and would like them to change. Some of them are OK and I wouldn't particularly care either way. Some of them are awful though. Especially Peach and Samus. Bleh...

 

[Stone Ocean]

lol of course

We must respect the practicality of wearing something slender under the powersuit! Because it's mechanically unsound otherwise!

Unless she's morphing into a ball somehow, then that's okay.

Isn't one of the big arguments against some gaming designs that they aren't practical?

"Boob plates aren't practical! Sexy armor isn't practical!" Well guess what, wearing bulky shit under skin-tight armor isn't practical.

 

[DarkKyo]

Some of these miss the point of the outfits dramatically (that ZZS is terrible and is a great example of how people have forgotten what Samus is because Nintendo keeps putting that thing on the forefront of who she's supposed to be).

We all know Power Suit Samus is superior in every way, but I think the idea here is if we have to deal with ZSS then a more utilitarian design is a better take on her.

 

[ElBoxyBrown]

The only way the ZSS armor would work is if they made the Varia suit bigger and bulkier like something close to Master Chief size Spartan armor. It's the only way they can justify how she would be able to fit all that inside.

 

[Man Called Aerodynamics]

Still think it's kind of funny that it needed to be pointed out that Jeri Ryan is an actual woman and that's her actual body, not something dreamed up by a male character designer.

 

[Ansatz]

I fucking wish. The vast majority of female action heroines are designed like the "before" pictures, not the after. That's precisely why those redesigns are a breath of fresh air and why many women are sick of seeing the former.

The playable protagonist? Maybe you have a case.

Female character designs in video games in general though. Even if it's 5 seconds of screentime of some background character. I don't think so. There are so many good examples in games. I mean what's wrong with Malon from Lon Lon Ranch (Ocarina of Time)? It's a normal young girl.

What about Red from Transistor?

 

[Auto-Reply]

Poor Chun Li, she used to kick so high into the air.

 

[Hexa]

Isn't one of the big arguments against some designs that they aren't armor?

"Boob plates aren't practical! Sexy armor isn't practical!" Well guess what, wearing bulky shit under skin-tight armor isn't practical.

Practicality is stupid in almost all games. They're not trying to be realistic at all. Why should that particular matter be realistic?
On that note aesthetics > practicality in all cases imo.

 

[Crossing Eden]

Someone around here has a picture of Peach wearing an overalls dress thing over a pink shirt. I think that would be a nice adventuring costume for a game like SM3DW. Peach is in dire need of a design and personality update.

Regarding ZSS, here's what real space people wear under their spacesuits:

so, maybe the zero suit can be form fitting, just not so form fitting that it hugs her boobs and buns so tight. The best thing about the ZSS redesign is the helmet/hood. It looks like the Snoopy Cap that real astronauts wear.

I think it would make sense and look futuristic. How else does she keep all that long ass hair under control?

I like many of the other redesigns. I'm all for character designs that wouldn't embarrass my grandma or make my girlfriend roll her eyes.

Do we really? I mean consider the series we're talking about. It's not some deep drama. Peach's design is obe of the most memorable character designs in game history, that redesign seems to miss the point of not only peach but also of the mario aesthetic in general. Hate the current rendition of zero suit tho, it's like, what happened? She got breast surgery and a random beauty mark out of no where compared to how it originally looked.

 

[Morrigan Stark]

What is wrong with breasts and butts?

Everything. Clearly the women who drew these pictures hate their bodies. They're probably prudes who hate sex, too.

If we shouldn't plain about practicality, why are you complaining about the practicality of the zero suit for SSB? Do you also complain about the practicality of Shulk's swimming trunks? Fan service in a fan service game. The horror!

You're missing the point. People are bitching at this new design because it's supposedly "not practical" or "not canon", which is the ultimate hypocrisy because practicality is completely dismissed as an argument when sexy designs are criticized ("practicality doesn't matter, it's just fantasy!" etc.). I'm just making fun of the irony.

 

[Orochinagis]

The playable protagonist? Maybe you have a case.

Female character designs in video games in general though. Even if it's 5 seconds of screentime of some background character. I don't think so. There are so many good examples in games. I mean what's wrong with Malon from Lon Lon Ranch (Ocarina of Time)? It's a normal young girl.

What about Red from Transistor?

Red actually took of her dress and put her

Spoiler

lover

jacket.

 

[ElBoxyBrown]

She just wants the alpha outfit back.

I want the alpha outfit back.

This was always better.

PREACH! Bless the Alpha outfit even though it's basically a one piece tracksuit with some attachable top. lol

 

[jett]

A lot of those redesigns are not only really cool, they're also decidedly better looking than the original, especially the comic book characters, which are all almost universally awful. Some not so great, kinda ugly.

I thought this thread would be more about personality and actual characterization though.

 

[LiK]

Isn't one of the big arguments against some designs that they aren't armor?

"Boob plates aren't practical! Sexy armor isn't practical!" Well guess what, wearing bulky shit under skin-tight armor isn't practical.

my point exactly. people can't have it both ways. I understand people don't like the skintight suit but it's what would make sense in the Varia Suit. her redesign would be a cool alt outfit for her if she happens to lose her armor.

PREACH! Bless the Alpha outfit.

hell yea, still my fave Chun Li outfit. Love the gymnastics look.

 

[MMaRsu]

Character design is inherently influenced and reflective of our cultural attitudes and values. Women continually being sexualized in specific ways didn't happen purely out of coincidence. Denying that is like denying the sky is blue.

Yes you are right about that. The question is for who is it embarassing that these FICTIONAL characters dress like this?

Can we not go after the good women like Rihanna and Miley Cyrus for actually oversexualizing women and setting the wrong example for little girls?

Because there are a ton of women who dress sexy because they find that comfortable. Or they dress sexy because they think it's normal.

Just because Storm or Red Sonja is wearing a skimpy outfit, does not inmediate reflect on women in the real world. That's why I disagreed with that one guy's statement that fictional characters influence how we see and treat real people.

I find that hilarious.

 

[Principate]

Well if she's in combat wearing the zero suit, one would hope she'd have some kind of intermediate armor on until she can get to the power suit.

Not really that hard to come up with a logical explanation.

That's not a Zero Suit then. Keep mind she starts fighting in Zero suit after basically exploding her armour in brawl (so it wouldn''t make sense for her to suddenly have armour). It would make sense for SSB4 though.

 

[SerTapTap]

Do we really? I mean consider the series we're talking about. It's not some deep drama. Peach's design is obe of the most memorable character designs in game history, that redesign seems to miss the point of not only peach but also of the mario aesthetic in general.

Peach needs to stop being kidnapped and keep being playable, a la SM3DW. That is the only change she needs IMO. Daisy's personality is better, but at worst she's no worse than Mario who's...I mean what even is Mario. He's just Mario. He's completely devoid of anything. And that's fine. As long as I get a character select with Not Mario in it.