Satire, right?
Either that or you simply don't grasp the most basic concepts of they discussion.
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Women Characters Redesigned by Women SFF Artists
- Thread starter FlyinJ
- Start date
Satire, right?
Either that or you simply don't grasp the most basic concepts of they discussion.
The complaints for the original Zero Suit Samus don't make sense. Yes, another post about this. It's just like a football player wearing under armour, or any athlete for that matter. Skin tight under garments/suits are nothing new.
The explanation of functionality is not a point that needs to be made. That isn't supposed to be anythig more than an undersuit.
The explanation of functionality is not a point that needs to be made. That isn't supposed to be anythig more than an undersuit.
Dice//
Banned
I'm gonna have to kindly ask.... Huh?
No one is violating anything and this barely resonates with what was/is being discussed.
The reason why she fights in under armor, and the reason why the new design of the suit has heels, and the reason why it's so ridiculously tight (more than a normal tight suit would be) are: Sex Appeal.
Believe me, nobody hates the "practicality" argument more than me, but ZS Samus is bullshit, because it goes stylistically against what Samus' iconic design inferred about her personality.
foxuzamaki
Doesn't read OPs, especially not his own
nope not canon
this is your gravity suit now
Dont be stupid, the super metroid gravity suit was never retconned, god just you saying that the suit from super metroid of all games is "not canon" makes me angry cause it makes no sense!
That Peach design and Samus design both look awesome. But not as Samus and Peach.
Samus outfit is, as many already stated, only to be used under her armor. All that stuff wouldn't fit.
The only real problem I have with the original Zero Suit is high heels. That is just stupid.
And Peach is from a Mario game. No weapons.
She look more like Tank Girl.
When it comes to female characters my favourite is still Chris Lightfellow from Suikoden 3
Samus outfit is, as many already stated, only to be used under her armor. All that stuff wouldn't fit.
The only real problem I have with the original Zero Suit is high heels. That is just stupid.
And Peach is from a Mario game. No weapons.
She look more like Tank Girl.
When it comes to female characters my favourite is still Chris Lightfellow from Suikoden 3
sensui-tomo
Member
travisbickle
Member
Have you seen some of Rembrandt's painted nudes?
RecursiveFault
Banned
Morrigan, Emma Frost, Heavenly Sword Girl, Power Girl are all pretty good. Rest are pretty bleh.
Dice//
Banned
When it comes to female characters my favourite is still Chris Lightfellow from Suikoden 3
Female artist!
Fumi Ishikawa's run as a Suiko artist was great. Generally you need a great artist to draw over 100 unique N/PCs, but I loved her style. Indeed, males, females, fat, skinny, muscular, chubby, busty, duck people, and so on. They were a diverse cast and look great for it quite often.
I also love that Chris' design doesn't have "boob pockets" either in the armor
Her armor differs very little from the rest of the knights. She has a skirt but other than that. Othe small differences as well but she is the commander of them so could just be rank.
And yes there are a lot of great design in all Suikoden games.
Another favourite female character from Suikoden 3 is Queen.
TheRedSnifit
Member
One of my favorite not-actually-in-a-game female armor designs:
I guess it's hard to tell the gender, but hey, it looks cool.
I guess it's hard to tell the gender, but hey, it looks cool.
sensui-tomo
Member
One of my favorite not-actually-in-a-game female armor designs:
I guess it's hard to tell the gender, but hey, it looks cool.
It looks like it should have been in Mass effect as the actual cerberus robots that try to kill you.
Just want to point out if you ever meet any actual witches, they look like that pretty much.
BeatResetsTheWorld
Banned
But it's her superhero title...it's not like Wolverine is an actual wolverine or Cyclops only has 1 eye...
This is what i've thought about samus since this was shown to me.
Ok, let me rephrase:
"[...] Samus iconic design, except for sensui-tomo, who identified her by the crass bikini scene they shoe-horned in the final 3 seconds of the game [...]".
TheRedSnifit
Member
This reminds me of how stupid the Cerberus armor is:
Men:
Women:
The men wear this gigantic power armor while the women wear catsuits.. Then again, I've never really cared for Mass Effect's armor designs, though I can't really figure out why.
There is nothing inherently wrong with skintight costumes. They are the standard for superheroes. Male and female.
sensui-tomo
Member
I'm sorry, just being a little sarcastic, its in my nature to do that every now and then. But i digress, i actually think of samus as the bounty hunting 6 ft robot killing machine. and i should note that i've never played a metroid game ever, and hell i have fusion, the original and super available to play, and was thinking of buying the prime trilogy pack on the nintendo e-shop.
Yet.
Based Secret Wars.
And the Samus underwear thing is clearly a reference to Ripley in Alien.
I don't think most women would really know what they want. I don't. I'd just have to see something and go "OOOH!" and not "oh." Not very descriptive, but you get the point. People are in a constant start of trying to identify and place themselves, so it's just best to have a bit of everything.
For some reason Impa from Hyrule Warriors is super awesome to me. It might be because she doesn't constantly giggle and prance when she fights.
Badass! D:
For some reason Impa from Hyrule Warriors is super awesome to me. It might be because she doesn't constantly giggle and prance when she fights.
Badass! D:
Laughing Banana
Weeping Pickle
That Peach is atrocious looking.
I like Noriko.
As for Samus, I like it if it's like, a thing that Samus wear if she's, for example, doing a mission without her armor around or something like that. Viewed independently like that, I like it, although I am not quite sure how it'll work if her armor is considered to the mix.
I like Noriko.
As for Samus, I like it if it's like, a thing that Samus wear if she's, for example, doing a mission without her armor around or something like that. Viewed independently like that, I like it, although I am not quite sure how it'll work if her armor is considered to the mix.
Orochinagis
Member
I remember cerberus females whore those armor because they are the only biotics in the entire corps so their main function was to be sniper and cast biotics barriers instead of armor
TheRedSnifit
Member
The snipers don't have any biotic ability. The reason they wear catsuits is because it makes them easier to identify, and sex appeal.
I don't really have an issue with form-fitting armor, it's just that it's rather silly to see how half the Cerberus military are these hulking men in 800 pounds of armor, and the other half are comparatively skinny women in catsuits.
EDIT:
I've always been a big fan of the armor design in F.E.A.R. and Killzone:
If you adjusted the artstyle, the girls at Cerberus wouldn't look nearly as out-of-place next to these guys.
Orochinagis
Member
Actually they had a force palm hit, a biotic gun on her gloves and can use a biotic infused blade but yeah I get your point
Dice//
Banned
I don't think most women would really know what they want. I don't. I'd just have to see something and go "OOOH!" and not "oh." Not very descriptive, but you get the point. People are in a constant start of trying to identify and place themselves, so it's just best to have a bit of everything.
For some reason Impa from Hyrule Warriors is super awesome to me. It might be because she doesn't constantly giggle and prance when she fights.
Badass! D:
I love Impa in Hyrule Warriors. Cool, classy, and kicks ass.
With that said, it's true, I think it's more 'gender conscious' females who really care for what's getting put on them. But I also don't think most girls are stupid and know when sex appeal is clearly pandering to a specific audience. Frequent ass shots, ludicrous attire, and so on. Not just about the occasional cleavage here and there or revealing attire, that's whatever and innocent or innocuous enough... But when a game goes out of its way to demonstrate sex appeal (ass-on-camera entrances), it's noticeable and...just kinda awkward (and again, often exclusive to one gender).
(sorry I honestly didn't mean to pick on ME; ironically I love the idea behind female shepard as a pro-female idea where it doesn't have to be so complicated)
not psycho
Member
I'd be interested to know how they feel about these already existant designs, which (to me) seem far higher quality than the ones on that page.
Although I still prefer classic Chun Li and Gamora to the ones I just posted. Seems more appropriate for a martial artist:
Also, to me personally, skintight/skimpy outfits don't turn a character into a sex object. In comics specifically, I often like them because it seems to make it easier to draw expressive and readable motion. And as for realism, in real life (gymnastics, volleyball, track and field, MMA, etc) athletes do wear tight/skimpy outfits. Tight clothes, bare midriffs, and exposed legs are common and functional for real world professional athletes competing at the top level.
One thing I disagree with on that page is:
This is so simplified as to be meaningless. First of all, taken literally it implies genders are monoliths. Second, it is not even desirable to please everyone with every depiction. People genuinely have different tastes and preferences. I personally do not interpret tight, skimpy outfits as connoting "sex objects." Others do. None of us is right or wrong, and ideally there would be plenty of art out there for everyone... but not every piece of art can or should work for everyone. That means that to be more inclusive of groups historically under-served, it will almost certainly require historically over-served groups to suddenly have to deal with some styles they don't like. And that's fine, because not everything has to work for everybody. Let's not pretend we're ever going to please everyone with every depiction, that idea only leads to demonizing things you don't like (because, obviously, it was supposed to please you).
Although I still prefer classic Chun Li and Gamora to the ones I just posted. Seems more appropriate for a martial artist:
Also, to me personally, skintight/skimpy outfits don't turn a character into a sex object. In comics specifically, I often like them because it seems to make it easier to draw expressive and readable motion. And as for realism, in real life (gymnastics, volleyball, track and field, MMA, etc) athletes do wear tight/skimpy outfits. Tight clothes, bare midriffs, and exposed legs are common and functional for real world professional athletes competing at the top level.
One thing I disagree with on that page is:
This is so simplified as to be meaningless. First of all, taken literally it implies genders are monoliths. Second, it is not even desirable to please everyone with every depiction. People genuinely have different tastes and preferences. I personally do not interpret tight, skimpy outfits as connoting "sex objects." Others do. None of us is right or wrong, and ideally there would be plenty of art out there for everyone... but not every piece of art can or should work for everyone. That means that to be more inclusive of groups historically under-served, it will almost certainly require historically over-served groups to suddenly have to deal with some styles they don't like. And that's fine, because not everything has to work for everybody. Let's not pretend we're ever going to please everyone with every depiction, that idea only leads to demonizing things you don't like (because, obviously, it was supposed to please you).
ElBoxyBrown
Banned
Well Tecmo had to balance out from what they are typically known for.I don't think most women would really know what they want. I don't. I'd just have to see something and go "OOOH!" and not "oh." Not very descriptive, but you get the point. People are in a constant start of trying to identify and place themselves, so it's just best to have a bit of everything.
For some reason Impa from Hyrule Warriors is super awesome to me. It might be because she doesn't constantly giggle and prance when she fights.
Badass! D:
Comic books are becoming the example of change that female wanted but that's probably due to their readership being around only 200,000 so at this point you might as well take chances on anything. It's why there has been so many female hero redesigns.I love Impa in Hyrule Warriors. Cool, classy, and kicks ass.
With that said, it's true, I think it's more 'gender conscious' females who really care for what's getting put on them. But I also don't think most girls are stupid and know when sex appeal is clearly pandering to a specific audience. Frequent ass shots, ludicrous attire, and so on. Not just about the occasional cleavage here and there or revealing attire, that's whatever and innocent or innocuous enough... But when a game goes out of its way to demonstrate sex appeal (ass-on-camera entrances), it's noticeable and...just kinda awkward (and again, often exclusive to one gender).
(sorry I honestly didn't mean to pick on ME; ironically I love the idea behind female shepard as a pro-female idea where it doesn't have to be so complicated)
Dice//
Banned
I always loved this Chun Li version. It looks a lot less constrictive (complete with some fancy kicks)
Actually, speaking of which:
And well, just about anything beats her outlandish fairy-hooker look in OoT:
Well Tecmo had to balance out from what they are typically known for.
Actually, speaking of which:
I always thought TPs Fairy Queen was incredibly unique and tasteful (despite being PG13 nude --- a first and rare sight in the Zelda series).
And well, just about anything beats her outlandish fairy-hooker look in OoT:
Angelus Errare
Banned
Classic Gamora outfit is stupid as shit because she's a fucking intergalactic assassin.
ElBoxyBrown
Banned
Which one? lol She has two.
Angelus Errare
Banned
Both of them were dumb and existed solely to reemphasize to the male reader that Gamora is "sexy".
Her fishnet one was especially eyerolling.
What answer are you expecting?
ElBoxyBrown
Banned
ehhh her design wasn't that bad. She always came off as a wild party lookin fairy. The sexual moaning every time you summoned her was weird.
Chun had this cool outfit from the Udon comics that I want to see as an alt in games.
This is her new look from Uncanny Avengers.
That still lokks better than the redesign linked by the OP.
Whatever it is, I have a strong feeling it just may be both tired and hackneyed.
Regarding her hair she can tie it back, the silly sash thing is the same as cape logic, outside of Batman I've never seen the point in them.
The only character I've seen fly with a skirt is Princess Peach and that's a flotation device just like Batman's cape.
It's not about sexiness, even framing pheonix with that skirt in an aerial fight means you're limited to what angles of said fight you can show without there being an "upskirt" shot which brings us back to square one on representation on women in fiction and if she's wearing pants under the skirt then what's the goddamn point in wearing a skirt in the first place?
Angelus Errare
Banned
Wanda's redesign in the OP assumes that Wanda is in Europe somewhere wandering like many Romani do. The dress, hair wrap and hairstyle are the staples of many romani girls.
Angelus Errare
Banned
Ask a woman, because many of them do that. It's called a fashion trend.
Blargonaut
Banned
You and many others in this thread sorely need to understand an inherent law of imagineering:
There should always be a semblance of grounded believability in any fictional work, so as to aid in the distinguishing and appreciation of its fantastical elements.
Skirting a very fine line, you simply cannot contain numerous unexplained and/or impractical features and resolutions in your story, and honestly expect to not be called out for deus ex bullshitting after enough key plot events occur by such inane handwavium.
"Shooting ice rays at space dragons," or whatever the rest of what Samus Aran the character may achieve in the Metroid universe, is definitely a far-fetched feat that is impossible in reality. However, it is still a feat Samus achieves via a realistic means; Samus Aran wasn't written to have to sneeze cryobeams out of her eyebrow pores, no, she was written as having to fire freeze missiles out of her arm-cannon. The act of firing projectiles from a gun is a feat totally achievable in reality, what more, it's her job, she's employed, she does it to get paid; thus, she becomes more relatable to us, the audience, via this mutual combo of realistic abilities and needs, so written by her creator.
Would it be more entertaining, if Samus iced cosmic lizards with cryobeams sneezed from her eyebrow pores? Yes, no doubt it would be; but, I would argue that such a fantasy-based ability (not realism-based at all) would detract from the essence of the interstellar gadget-using bounty hunter character that Samus is. Eye-candy for eye-candy's sake will only get you so far. Eventually, you're going to have to explain your shit, get real, roll that charisma/intelligence check, if you really really want your apostles to follow you further down the valleys of your mindscape.
By dismissing all "realism" from your fiction, you shit out 100% null chaos. You shit on it as you shit it. The product is insubstantial yet impenetrable to understanding and constructive criticism, just layers upon layers of spineless, foundation-less bullshit. It becomes baseless. Don't dismiss "realism" from fiction. For stories, it's a yin-yang relationship.
---
With this in mind, take another look at that Samus redesign:
Of course, detail for the sheer sake of detail will often negatively detract from any experience due to all that unnecessary visual noise; but, I don't think that applies to this particular fan re-design of Samus. Its aesthetic follows a more contemporary astronaut/pilot theme, evident from the air force pilot-esque parachute-style strapping, pressure-maintaining head cowl and air supply tubing. I assume the artist imagined her version of Samus owning a more vehicular version of her staple Power Armour; a larger version that is not worn, but is instead sat in and piloted like a mech, which would explain away the fitting issue born from the extra equipment she is wearing on top of her Zero Suit.
In the end, it's not so much about prudishness as it is about practicality in context.
Use your own imagination, imagine this re-design existing in the context of a prequel or alternate Metroid universe. For example, it could also be one where she does not yet possess her original Power Armour and this is how she equipped herself as a bounty hunter beforehand.
It is in the imagining of this re-design's existence in such other possible contexts, that is why others may appreciate it alongside the official design.
You seem to vaunt fantasy so, yet your own opinion seems limited by the mundane, ironically bound in that realism you so disdain; you, clinging onto the reality of the official design like an uneasy child might to their favourite stuffed animal, no matter how antiquated and worn-out it may be.