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[Zukkoyaki]

The parts of the trailer demonstrating the game in motion looked solid to me.

So long as the game is as fun and immersive as Skyrim, I'm all in on this game. Should be fantastic!

 

[Raptor]

Gore, real time, lovely graphics, whats not to like right guys..... guys?

 

[Lautaro]

Mature? lol what?

Valid criticism never bothers me, even if I might disagree with it. But posts like this "Wow I'm dissapointed, the game looks really ugly. I was hoping to make this my first fallout game but I can't get myself to play a play something so bland looking, it looks like something that could've been done on the PS3." Do, because that's just a fucking dumb post. And this thread is full of shite like it. And that bums me out, yes. So sue me?

That's a yes then, you do need validation for your hype.

Stop attacking people just because they disagree, they haven't attacked you because you are Ok with the current graphics, right?

 

[King Cobra]

hey friend what about these bits?

SOLID SAMUS CLEAN UP AT AISLE 127!!!

Those were actually the only parts I thought looked current gen. Most likely PC shots, well I hope they improve the graphics by the time they ship it out. No doubt they are seeing the public opinion on it.

 

[mazpratim]

Looks like a crossgen game

 

[ironcreed]

I went back and played some New Vegas tonight. Still just as amazing as ever, but this is a huge leap in terms of visuals. To say the least.

 

[fuzzyreactor]

Art direction looks great to me. much better than FO3

 

[njean777]

Wow I'm dissapointed, the game looks really ugly. I was hoping to make this my first fallout game but I can't get myself to play a play something so bland looking, it looks like something that could've been done on the PS3.

This has to be a joke right? if it isn't, my word you need to go play Fallout 3 and New Vegas on ps3 and then come back. You are so wrong. That is all there is to say.

 

[mgs2master2]

You do realize there are performance tradeoffs right? Look up draw calls in relation to performance.

A Bethesda game has a massive amount of draw calls because almost every object is dynamic (meaning it is not baked into the environment thus saving draw calls).

Every single mesh that can be moved is a draw call and if they don't use texture atlasing then you can say that every single mesh is 2 draw calls (mesh and material). But wait then you have to add shadows which, depending on the method can add at least 1 more draw call.

So lets say they use texture atlasing for all the small objects. That still means that there are at least 2 draw calls per movable object. Remember that just about everything in the game can be moved (everything that isn't is likely batched into one big mesh to save on draw calls when possible).

Walk into a house in FO:NV and you might find 50 objects you can mess with. Thats at bare minimum 100 but more than likely closer to 200 draw calls, then you have to take into account the draw calls the house itself and all the non movable objects that are not batched. The UI itself is probable 3 or more draw calls.

Beyond that you also have the character and weapon (likely 10 draw calls) and any enemies which would be 4-10 draw calls each. Add into that the draw calls from outside the house which depending on LOD distance can balloon out into 2000+ easy if there is grass and trees.

Culling can help with some of the draw calls but it has its own performance cost.

Now with all of this we still haven't gotten to post processing, Textures sizes, AI, scripting, physics (Beth games have dynamic physics which eats the CPU like nothing), and the lighting engine.

Are there multiple lights in the house casting multiple shadows? Whelp if there are then you can go ahead and double your shadow draw calls.

Do you not see how a Beth style game balloons out into a performance nightmare?

How do other games look so good (Witcher 3)?

Well they use a hell of a lot of static assets that can be batched (combined in both mesh and texture) to vastly limit draw calls which allows them to have better "graphics". Ever notice how almost all loot in the witcher games is found in chests? Well, that is another way to limit draw calls, keeping dynamic objects off the map (lower draw calls, lower physics budget, ect).

People need to educate themselves on how games are made before they start frothing at the mouth over OMG bad graphics. Not every game has the same base, or even the same goals.

just quoting for those who missed this.

 

[Seventy70]

They should just cancel it since the graphics aren't amazing.

/s

These people know what they are doing. If there is a compromise with graphics, it's power/resources that are going to be used elsewhere. We get a Fallout game so hard and all people can do is complain SMH

 

[Grimm Fandango]

Man those city shots are fucking amazing. Can't wait.

edit: just realized, is that the Mysterious Stranger in the dark :0

 

[Solid Samus]

Man those city shots are fucking amazing. Can't wait.

That city looks huge and dense and I'm loving it.

 

[Fix The Scientist]

That's a yes then, you do need validation for your hype.

Stop attacking people just because they disagree, they haven't attacked you because you are Ok with the current graphics, right?

I thought his response was fair. "Looks like a ps3 game" posts are so tiresome.

 

[njean777]

just quoting for those who missed this.

People tend to not educate themselves before they speak. It is the internet thing to do. Complain first until somebody calls you out and explains to you why you are wrong. Its tiresome, but unfortunately people are lazy and will not research themselves.

 

[DietRob]

Please tell me we get to play as an armor wearing dog!

Doesn't look very next-gen tho. I might be burnt on the fallout games tho so something will have to happen to make me HAVE to get this.

 

[triplestation]

draw calls 4 lyf3

 

[Trickster]

That's a yes then, you do need validation for your hype.

Stop attacking people just because they disagree, they haven't attacked you because you are Ok with the current graphics, right?

I litterally just said I have no problem with valid criticism, only shitposting. Unfortunately this thread is full of those, and I think that's annoying yes. Not sure why that's such a crazy concept

 

[Sticky&Sweet]

hey friend what about these bits?

SOLID SAMUS CLEAN UP AT AISLE 127!!!

This looks so good. The next Elder Scrolls game is going to look mind blowing.

 

[Lautaro]

You do realize there are performance tradeoffs right? Look up draw calls in relation to performance.

A Bethesda game has a massive amount of draw calls because almost every object is dynamic (meaning it is not baked into the environment thus saving draw calls).

Every single mesh that can be moved is a draw call and if they don't use texture atlasing then you can say that every single mesh is 2 draw calls (mesh and material). But wait then you have to add shadows which, depending on the method can add at least 1 more draw call.

So lets say they use texture atlasing for all the small objects. That still means that there are at least 2 draw calls per movable object. Remember that just about everything in the game can be moved (everything that isn't is likely batched into one big mesh to save on draw calls when possible).

Walk into a house in FO:NV and you might find 50 objects you can mess with. Thats at bare minimum 100 but more than likely closer to 200 draw calls, then you have to take into account the draw calls the house itself and all the non movable objects that are not batched. The UI itself is probable 3 or more draw calls.

Beyond that you also have the character and weapon (likely 10 draw calls) and any enemies which would be 4-10 draw calls each. Add into that the draw calls from outside the house which depending on LOD distance can balloon out into 2000+ easy if there is grass and trees.

Culling can help with some of the draw calls but it has its own performance cost.

Now with all of this we still haven't gotten to post processing, Textures sizes, AI, scripting, physics (Beth games have dynamic physics which eats the CPU like nothing), and the lighting engine.

Are there multiple lights in the house casting multiple shadows? Whelp if there are then you can go ahead and double your shadow draw calls.

Do you not see how a Beth style game balloons out into a performance nightmare?

How do other games look so good (Witcher 3)?

Well they use a hell of a lot of static assets that can be batched (combined in both mesh and texture) to vastly limit draw calls which allows them to have better "graphics". Ever notice how almost all loot in the witcher games is found in chests? Well, that is another way to limit draw calls, keeping dynamic objects off the map (lower draw calls, lower physics budget, ect).

People need to educate themselves on how games are made before they start frothing at the mouth over OMG bad graphics. Not every game has the same base, or even the same goals.

I think I know a bit about how games are made and I can tell you that this post ignores concepts like occlussion, that you have a world full of dynamic objects doesn't mean that you are always rendering them or simulating them only the ones that the player can see. Any modern engine should also have batching (static and dynamic) so the draw calls are reduced. If Unity can pull it off then Bethesda should have an engine that can take advantage of that too.

Besides the problem is not the lack of lightmapping, the problems is that they are not even using modern shaders (PBR) so the models could look better with the illumination of the scene nor improved animations.

But of course, unless any of us have insider information this is only amateur talk.

 

[njean777]

I think I know a bit about how games are made and I can tell you that this post ignores concepts like occlussion, that you have a world full of dynamic objects doesn't mean that you are always rendering them or simulating them only the ones that the player can see. Any modern engine should also have batching (static and dynamic) so the draw calls are reduced. If Unity can pull it off then Bethesda should have an engine that can take advantage of that too.

Besides the problem is not the lack of lightmapping, the problems is that they are not even using modern shaders (PBR) so the models could look better with the illumination of the scene nor improved animations.

Do you know if they are using Unity? Or do you even know what engine they are using?

 

[Lautaro]

Do you know if they are using Unity? Or do you even know what engine they are using?

That's the point they have their own engine supposedly made to take advantage of next gen.

If Unity can have those features then Bethesda's engine should have them too.

 

[Chiggs]

To be fair it still looks great in the 1080p version as well.

No, not really.

 

[Trojita]

I'm glad that a dog is the main character of this one. Finally we are starting to get representation in games.

 

[zulfate]

lets be positive boys, i am sure its going to be glorious. i cant wait to play this game already, i am digging the architecture so far.

lets not worry over how good or not HD skid marks are gonna look like just yet.

 

[shinobi602]

 

[njean777]

That's the point they have their own engine supposedly made to take advantage of next gen.

If Unity can have those features then Bethesda's engine should have them too.

That is the keyword. We don't know their new engine, nor what it can do. Supposedly they have been working on this game for 4 years (don't know if that is entirely true). Until we get more info on the engine, then it is best to not talk about it.

 

[Lautaro]

That is the keyword. We don't know their new engine, nor what it can do. Supposedly they have been working on this game for 4 years (don't know if that is entirely true). Until we get more info on the engine, then it is best to not talk about it.

Why? they showed a trailer with in engine footage, am I not supposed to criticize what am I seeing?

There's a whole other thread to make speculations about the plot and gameplay, why can't there be also speculation about their technology too?

 

[Alebrije]

Just wandering how will be the collectors edition...!!

the game looks nice but not beyond the Withcher 3 (ps4) , also hope is not focused on megacities since I love just to walk in the open wild areas exploring and doing stuff.

 

[Apt101]

Fuck, that was quick.

 

[njean777]

Why? they showed a trailer with in engine footage, am I not supposed to criticize what am I seeing?

There's a whole other thread to make speculations about the plot and gameplay, why can't there be also speculation about their technology too?

Because you don't know the engine, you can criticize all day long for all I care. But it falls upon deaf ears (and is baseless) when you have no clue what they are using or how their engine works.

In other words, you are criticizing for the sake of criticizing before knowing anything. Which once again you can do, but unless you know how their engine works or what they are using, how can you properly criticize it? Their is a difference between criticizing intelligently and criticizing mindlessly.

 

[bananafactory]

Damn, it finally happened

$79.99 preorders

 

[DTKT]

What is Dark souls doing there? - NEVERMIND 5$ YO-

 

[Ghost Slayer]

why the hell DS goes to 4th place?
Does Amazon have PC sale right now?

 

[Lautaro]

Because you don't know the engine, you can criticize all day long for all I care. But it falls upon deaf ears (and is baseless) when you have no clue what they are using or how their engine works.

Then why people keep posting Croatoan's post? does he knows the engine?

Or technical speculation is only good when it supports positive opinions?

 

[Crimsonclaw111]

why the hell DS goes to 4th place?
Does Amazon have PC sale right now?

It's $5.

 

[MUnited83]

That is the keyword. We don't know their new engine, nor what it can do. Supposedly they have been working on this game for 4 years (don't know if that is entirely true). Until we get more info on the engine, then it is best to not talk about it.

We do. It's fucking Gamebryo/Creation Engine. They will probably give it a new name, but it's still fucking Gamebryo.

 

[SunBroDave]

It's $5.

And it's GOAT.

 

[K.Sabot]

We do. It's fucking Gamebryo/Creation Engine. They will probably give it a new name, but it's still fucking Gamebryo.

at least PS4 won't run into the save glitch

Spoiler

as fast

 

[njean777]

Then why people keep posting Croatoan's post? does he knows the engine?

Or technical speculation is only good when it supports positive opinions?

He gave a very educated reply and explained what may be happening. You haven't. Unless I missed it (which I may have). He at least tried to explain what may be happening and why it may look the way it does, you said "Unity does this so why doesn't bethesda". So who am I suppose to side with here? The one who actually took the time to write out what may be happening, or somebody that said: X company does this, why doesn't bethesda?

We do. It's fucking Gamebryo/Creation Engine. They will probably give it a new name, but it's still fucking Gamebryo.

Was this specifically said? Or are you basing this off rumors?

 

[mgs2master2]

People tend to not educate themselves before they speak. It is the internet thing to do. Complain first until somebody calls you out and explains to you why you are wrong. Its tiresome, but unfortunately people are lazy and will not research themselves.

indeed. which is why i quoted that post.

I think I know a bit about how games are made and I can tell you that this post ignores concepts like occlussion, that you have a world full of dynamic objects doesn't mean that you are always rendering them or simulating them only the ones that the player can see. Any modern engine should also have batching (static and dynamic) so the draw calls are reduced. If Unity can pull it off then Bethesda should have an engine that can take advantage of that too.

Besides the problem is not the lack of lightmapping, the problems is that they are not even using modern shaders (PBR) so the models could look better with the illumination of the scene nor improved animations.

But of course, unless any of us have insider information this is only amateur talk.

this post only furthers that quote.

 

[Lulubop]

indeed. which is why i quoted that post.



this post only furthers that quote.

I like Durantes post in regard to that one better.

 

[Ghost Slayer]

It's $5.

Steam? Can i get free-DRM version since i haven't bought PC games on Amazon before

 

[hammertomb]

Damn, it finally happened

$79.99 preorders

I hope they have e3 sales again.

 

[texhnolyze]

Speaking of gamebryo engine, has the PS3 version of Skyrim been fixed yet?

Nvm found my answer.

 

[Lautaro]

He gave a very educated reply and explained what may be happening. You haven't. Unless I missed it (which I may have). He at least tried to explain what may be happening and why it may look the way it does, you said "Unity does this so why doesn't bethesda". So who am I suppose to side with here? The one who actually took the time to write out what may be happening, or somebody that said: X company does this, why doesn't bethesda?

I gave my reasons: occlussion, batching, PBR and good animations. If you choose to not hear me because you don't like my opinion, fine but don't tell what I can't post or not.

There's no sides too. Stop feeling threatened by different opinions, people, we are all fans.

 

[MUnited83]

He gave a very educated reply and explained what may be happening. You haven't. Unless I missed it (which I may have). He at least tried to explain what may be happening and why it may look the way it does, you said "Unity does this so why doesn't bethesda". So who am I suppose to side with here? The one who actually took the time to write out what may be happening, or somebody that said: X company does this, why doesn't bethesda?



Was this specifically said? Or are you basing this off rumors?

It wasn't specifically said, and it doesn't need to be. If those screens screamed Gamebryo anymore than they already do i'd be deaf. It's Gamebryo.

 

[njean777]

It wasn't specifically said, and it doesn't need to be. If those screens screamed Gamebryo anymore than they already do i'd be deaf. It's Gamebryo.

Oh, ok, I 100% believe you. You said it, so it must be true.

I gave my reasons: occlussion, batching, PBR and good animations. If you choose to not hear me because you don't like my opinion, fine but don't tell what I can't post or not.

There's no sides too. Stop feeling threatened by different opinions, people, we are all fans.

You also are basing that off newer engines. We don't know how old this engine they are using is. Once again until we know specifics about the engine trying to say "well this engine uses all these, so they should to" is what you are really saying. Which I already said isn't wrong, but don't be mad when somebody tells you that its annoying. The road goes both ways, if you want to criticize then you should be able to accept all criticism back. I, along with others, find it annoying that people complain/criticize before they know specifics about things. If you cannot accept that, then you should not criticize in the first place.

 

[Protomanx13]

If Bethesda Game Studio has a team that dedicate only on game engine, then I can understand questioning of not having a graphic leap, but they don't as far as I know

Look at Id Tech 5 or Unreal Engine 4. Unreal 4 took 12 years to develop and Id Tech 5 took like 7 years since Doom 3 came out. This game probably has been in development for 7 years at most assuming some developers started working on this after Fallout 3. Considering the scale of this game, I highly doubt they have that much time to put into improving the engine much

 

[Look_insid3]

The game seems to be much more colorful than the previous ones. Perhaps a little bit too colorful, in my opinion. Dirty green and brown tints can be pretty depressing to look at but isn't it how the nuclear wasteland supposed to be?
Oh well, still super excited for the game.

 

[Leithkorias]

I'm hyped and I'm sure ill love the game, but if that's a new engine, its not impressing me...