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[Ape Gone Insane]

I was watching the Gatlin vs Bolt battle for the 'soul of the sport' as it has been billed and was pleased to see Gatlin lose. But it does make me wonder how likely it is that a guy who runs so much faster than even dopers is completely clean. Especially given the high levels of positive doping that have been found around his Jamaican teammates and sprinters such as Asafa Powell and Yohan Blake and in general there's been an unusually high level of success coming out of Jamaica. You also have to consider the nature of doping techniques that always mean individuals are steps ahead of anti-doping tests and authorities. There are clearly fundamental problems with these tests that allow dopers to mask their true results. Bolt's also had a very rapid progress, jumping from a PB of 10.03 to 9.76 and then breaking the WR at 9.72 and 9.69 in the span of a year. Before that, his times were at a very consistent level for years.

And there's Angel Heredia who was on the payroll of at least 12 Olympic athletes (and rumoured to have worked with Bolt). He built up a valuable knowledge of doping and PEDs and basically became a chemist and worked with athletes on creating do substances and cheating tests. From an interview:

PIEGEL: Mr. Heredia, will you watch the 100 meter final in Beijing?
Heredia: Of course. But the winner will not be clean. Not even any of the contestants will be clean.
SPIEGEL: Of eight runners ...
Heredia: ... eight will be doped.
SPIEGEL: There is no way to prove that.
Heredia: There is no doubt about it. The difference between 10.0 and 9.7 seconds is the drugs.
......
SPIEGEL: Is there doping at every level of athletics?
Heredia: Yes, the only difference is the quality of the doping. Athletes with little money use simple steroids and hope they don’t get tested. The stars earn 50,000 dollars a month, not including starting bonuses and shoe sponsorship contracts. The very best invest 100,000 dollars – I’ll then build you a designer drug that can’t be detected.
SPIEGEL: Explain how this works.
Heredia: Designer drugs are composed of several different chemicals that trigger the desired reaction. At the end of the chain I change one or two molecules in such a way that the entire structure is undetectable for the doping testers.
...............
SPIEGEL: Did you live in the shadows of the sports world, where no one was allowed to see you?
Heredia: No. I rarely traveled to the big events, but that was because of jealousy: the Americans didn’t want me to work with the Jamaicans and vice versa. But shadows? No. It was one big chain, from athletes to agents to sponsors, and I was part of it. But everyone knew how the game worked. Everyone wanted it to be this way, because everyone got rich off it.

Maybe I'm too cynical in light of repeated doping scandals and Bolt really is a genetic outlier.

It makes me wonder how widespread and cleverly buried it really is - is it likely top UFC fighters like Rousey and McGregor are also using big bucks for designer drugs?

 

[entremet]

If you don't think that most top athletes are doping, they're doing a great job fooling the general public.

Just accept that most are doping.

The drugs are so advanced these days that most clear your system in 24 hours or less.

 

[air jordans for dogs]

He's on a hilarious amount of drugs, same with all top athletes. Would be ignorant to deny that.

 

[John Dunbar]

he's as clean as lance armstrong was.

when you dominate a field of dopers in a sport of endurance or strength, you're a doper.

 

[ldcommando]

Yes,but the dude is a freak anyway

 

[Joey Fox]

Is it likely that any elite level athlete is using Performance Enhancing Drugs? It depends on the sport, certainly, but it seems more likely when we're talking the limits of human performance. Usain Bolt could be an extreme outlier, and it would be cool to know for sure he doesn't use, but I will always have doubts on Olympic athletes.

 

[Ninja Scooter]

A handy dandy guide to to determining if someone is doping:

Is he/she a wildly successful athlete? If yes, they are doping.

 

[Skellig Gra]

Yes, it's almost certain he is. Along with everyone else.

 

[cluxdeluxe]

yes

 

[entremet]

Is it likely that any elite level athlete is using Performance Enhancing Drugs? It depends on the sport, certainly, but it seems more likely when we're talking the limits of human performance. Usain Bolt could be an extreme outlier, and it would be cool to know for sure he doesn't use, but I will always have doubts on Olympic athletes.

Olympic testing is also pretty terrible. In the cat and mouse game of testing versus PEDs. PEDs won a long time ago.

Almost every high profile doping athletes that has been caught, has been caught due to eye witness testimony or personal records (a la Biogenesis) not test results.

The ones that are caught by test, are stupid and messed up their drug taking schedules.

 

[CDX]

I just assume ALL top level successful athletes are on stuff. With a few exceptions for certain sports.

That's just how it is today.

The wealthier the athlete the better private chemist they can afford. IMO.

Who knows. Maybe a few are pure, but I doubt it.

 

[Deleted member 284]

Call me silly, but until I see smoke, I can't assume fire.

 

[John Dunbar]

Call me silly, but until I see smoke, I can't assume fire.

running 100 metres in under 9.6 seconds is a goddamn wildfire.

 

[lastrealgameralive]

No.

 

[Violater]

Yam and banana power haters

 

[ajim]

Let's just allow doping and see how far the human body can be pushed and see some crazy ass results!

 

[NHarmonic.]

If you don't think that most top athletes are doping, they're doing a great job fooling the general public.

Just accept that most are doping.

The drugs are so advanced these days that most clear your system in 24 hours or less.

That's for competition right? Because on a normal routine of training i guess they use other shit too...

 

[Prez]

Let's just allow doping and see how far the human body can be pushed and see some crazy ass results!

That's already going on.

 

[PreFire]

Call me silly, but until I see smoke, I can't assume fire.

Same here. I've never heard any rumors about him doping

 

[Thug Waffle]

whether they're doping or not, they still fast as fuhhh

 

[Epsilon-delta]

Call me silly, but until I see smoke, I can't assume fire.

A PB of 10.03 to an unbelievable 9.69 WR in a year is a lot of smoke.

 

[entremet]

Let's just allow doping and see how far the human body can be pushed and see some crazy ass results!

It's already happening on the DL anyway.

The testing is just a PR tactic. The testing is way too far behind. If you wanted accurate testing you'd need to basically violate the privacy of these athletes and be around them 24/7.

Not happening due to privacy laws and also resources.

 

[Velcro Fly]

i don't care if one doper is doing it better than the others.

it's why i never gave a shit about lance armstrong getting caught. he's done a lot more good as a doper than he would have been as someone who never won the tour

 

[ILoveBish]

Anyone who uses their body for advancement in anyway is likely to be on something. Just don't make the mistake of comparing yourself to them. Be the best you that you can be, don't try to make yourself someone else.

 

[John Kowalski]

I like to think not.

 

[Caboose]

Duh.

 

[Archer]

Wheaties = the original doping

 

[M.W.]

Of course. See all pro athletes.

 

[Slaythe]

He has been EXTREMELY monitored. And tested.

Especially after his teammates got caught.

He is obviously having specific diets and vitamins bla bla. But he isn't cheating like Gatlin was.

Also you say he is consistent but his WR was way faster than he currently is.

 

[Dr Bass]

Victor Conte had an interesting explanation of this, that the difference between a 10 second 100m and a 9.7 (or thereabouts), isn't just .3 seconds. It's around 5 meters, which is a huge amount of distance to be able to cover in terms of "improving." His bottom line was that 5 meters is the difference between doping and not doping.

So yeah, I think Bolt is obviously doing it, especially if he made such a huge improvement in his time like that.

 

[trixx]

No.

yams all day

 

[ReturnOfTheRAT]

There was a Joe Rogan podcast warning yesterday.

 

[Wyndstryker]

Just assume every athlete who's successful at this time are those who are ahead of the doping detection methods.

 

[JimmyRustler]

When the 2nd and 3rd are positively tested, you can positively assume that the 1st is doped as well.

 

[ChouGoku]

Why is doping considered bad? Doping doesnt turn regular guys into Usain bolt, you still have to be good to perform at this high level. I say doping be allowed in all sports so they will be more fun to watch

/s

Spoiler

kind of

 

[gogosox82]

Probably but that goes for most athletes. I think this need for athletes to be "clean" is silly. Just let them do what they want so we can all be entertained.

 

[clemenx]

With Bolt in particular im more inclined to believe that he's just a freak of nature.

But yeah. if he's doping he's beating other 7 doped dudes so who cares. It's the same in every sport.

 

[HeySeuss]

Eh, someone has to be the fastest man on the planet. I'm just going to enjoy the show while it lasts. Even if he is doping, testing the limits of the human capabilities is pretty cool to watch. What a time to be alive.

 

[DeaconKnowledge]

If they're all doping and he's the best of them then it's an even playing field. Who cares.

 

[Laz-E-Boy]

Yeah he's doping, so is every other Olympic athlete.

and I don't care one bit.

 

[DominoKid]

yes. but hes also just better.

 

[Seesaw15]

Nope just fast twitch muscles

Spoiler

/s

 

[The Maverick]

Assume any elite athlete is on something. It's either you join in or fall behind the competition.

 

[Syntsui]

He is the biggest target out there and they still couldn't catch anything on him. Whatever he is taking, it's good.

 

[JimmyRustler]

If they're all doping and he's the best of them then it's an even playing field. Who cares.

There's prolly a difference if you dope for say 10.000 $ or 100 $....

 

[Prinz Eugn]

He has been EXTREMELY monitored. And tested.

Especially after his teammates got caught.

He is obviously having specific diets and vitamins bla bla. But he isn't cheating like Gatlin was.

Also you say he is consistent but his WR was way faster than he currently is.

I remember saying almost the exact same thing about Lance Armstrong, when I was 12.

 

[Lactose_Intolerant]

chicken nuggets are the only drugs he's on

 

[Ninja Scooter]

He has been EXTREMELY monitored. And tested.

.

So were Marion Jones and Lance Armstrong.

Sports are a billion dollar industry, even something like track and field. Usain Bolt is no longer a person, he is a brand that is worth tens of millions of dollars to himself, and hundreds of millions of dollars to his sponsors and people with money invested in him. If he needed the resources necessary to beat a drug test, he could get it in 2 seconds.

 

[Allonym]

When I ran track in high school, I managed to drop my pb from 12.49 my freshman year to 10.3 my senior year, hand timed. My second year of doing track, I consistently posted low to mid 11 sec times and as the season winded down and I peaked I broke 10 seconds. So considering that Usain Bolt was always a talent in the sport and coupled with professional training, I don't see why all his success can be attributed to doping or the suspicion thereof. Usain Bolt rarely ran the 100m and was a standout in the 200m, setting g the junior record.

In my mind, if he were to dedicate himself to the 100m it doesn't seem unrealistic that he would find the same success he had with the 200m. The 100m is about who slows down the least and because of his stamina, absurd stride and the fact that he doesn't really get going until about 40m-55m into the race that he's slowing down the least unless he's up against dudes with crazy top end speed like Tyson Gay. I remember as a kid I championed Justin Gatlin and Tyson Gay in high school and attempted to mirror their styles of sprinting so I was disappointed when they were revealed to be doers and the domination of sprints returned to Jamaica but at this moment in time Usain Bolt is the man in track until his body gives out but his records will never be touched. I always believed that a prime Tyson Gay with a perfect race and race conditions could have broken his record but alas that was not meant to be.

Tldr; I don't think he's doping and if you believe not only believe not only winners but everyone else is doping, why are you even watching the sport?

 

[Dennis]

Yes. But he is the fastest in a field of dopers so there is that.