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PoliGAF 2015-2016 |OT3| If someone named PhoenixDark leaves your party, call the cops

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benjipwns

Banned
Not exactly a fringe view when it's shared by almost the entire media and elected government.
I wasn't calling that a fringe view, and the fact that it's not is disappointing. Maybe the young adult website Vox can do an Explainer on what fascism and Nazism actually were. And the difference between racism and xenophobia. At least it'll include some interesting pictures of boats.
 

B-Dubs

No Scrubs
I wasn't calling that a fringe view, and the fact that it's not is disappointing. Maybe the young adult website Vox can do an Explainer on what fascism and Nazism actually were. And the difference between racism and xenophobia. At least it'll include some interesting pictures of boats.

I do like pictures of boats...
 

User1608

Banned
No, you should regret watching it after 2005. The first four seasons, and especially the first two were great. Though Martha Stewart's was better. Not even the Dawn of Ivanka could save Celebrity's descent into Donald's blatant favoritism, I was hoping The Donald would turn it over to her and his sons, since they were endlessly superior and actually interested in the process and tasks.

Alan Sugar's UK version of The Apprentice is/was far superior anyhow. Though just like the U.S. one, the finales are meaningless.
Hah hah. True, I just had nothing better to do! It was enough at the time.:p
 
I wasn't calling that a fringe view, and the fact that it's not is disappointing. Maybe the young adult website Vox can do an Explainer on what fascism and Nazism actually were. And the difference between racism and xenophobia. At least it'll include some interesting pictures of boats.

Sounds like the perfect opportunity for you to create a thread ... ohh ...
 
Was looking at huffpo polls and noticed that the share of undecided in the GOP primary has jumped almost 10% in the past two weeks. My interpretation is we're finally seeing a little more serious consideration from voters.

Also, praise jeebus, Cruz' numbers are already dropping. Maybe the evangelical vote is what's up for grabs.
 
As San Diego goes, so goes the nation:

-1x-1.jpg


http://www.bloomberg.com/politics/a...mberg-politics-poll-trump-muslim-ban-proposal
 

benjipwns

Banned
Sounds like the perfect opportunity for you to create a thread ... ohh ...
I already created the ultimate Trump thread, with the ultimate Trump title. It's the best, everybody says it's the best. It's not terrible, like how the Kurds have been treated, which is just horrible, they've gotten a terrible deal from us.
 

Makai

Member
Was looking at huffpo polls and noticed that the share of undecided in the GOP primary has jumped almost 10% in the past two weeks. My interpretation is we're finally seeing a little more serious consideration from voters.

Also, praise jeebus, Cruz' numbers are already dropping. Maybe the evangelical vote is what's up for grabs.
Yeah, wow. Undecided in second place

nq4mTUL.png
 
After being told about the idea, 37 percent of likely Republican primary voters say it makes them more likely to support the billionaire real estate mogul, while 16 percent say less and 46 percent say it has no impact.
Help.
 
T

thepotatoman

Unconfirmed Member
A.k.a. the Giuliani strategy, known for how well it worked.

It's not even that. Giuliani had a lead in the rest of the country, so he had a reason to believe that those two states aren't important, even though he underestimated the change in momentum those outcomes would bring. Rubio is going into those two primaries desperately needing momentum from somewhere.

The biggest reason early primary polls aren't great predictors is that these early hard fought states change the dynamics. If Cruz wins Iowa, and Trump wins NH, where does Rubio get his momentum? And winning your home state doesn't count because that's expected. If winning your home state gives you momentum, then Tom Harken would have won 1992 easily.
 

Makai

Member
Montel Williams thinks Trump is winning because he pioneered Reality Television. People have been trained for 15 years to value conflict and deception.
 

benjipwns

Banned
It's not even that. Giuliani had a lead in the rest of the country, so he had a reason to believe that those two states aren't important, even though he underestimated the change in momentum those outcomes would bring. Rubio is going into those two primaries desperately needing momentum from somewhere.

The biggest reason early primary polls aren't great predictors is that these early hard fought states change the dynamics. If Cruz wins Iowa, and Trump wins NH, where does Rubio get his momentum? And winning your home state doesn't count because that's expected. If winning your home state gives you momentum, then Tom Harken would have won 1992 easily.
Rudy started cratering at the start of December nationally.

On Dec 1, 2007:
29% Rudy - 14% Thompson - 13% McCain - 13% Romney - 9% Huckabee - 4% Paul

Jan 3, 2008 (IA):
20% Rudy - 17% McCain - 17% Huckabee - 15% Romney - 11% Thompson - 4% Paul

Jan 8, 2008 (NH):
21% Huckabee - 20% McCain - 18% Rudy - 13% Romney - 11% Thompson - 4% Paul

Jan 19, 2008 (SC):
29% McCain - 19% Huckabee - 15% Romney - 12% Rudy - 9% Thompson - 4% Paul

Jan 29, 2008 (FL):
27% McCain - 20% Romney - 19% Huckabee - 13% Rudy - 5% Paul

Feb 5, 2008 (ST):
43% McCain - 25% Romney - 18% Huckabee - 6% Paul

The target this time for everybody is Super Tuesday, especially anyone in the top tier. You need to come out of that with resources because then it becomes WTA.
 
So, Bernie was at the Freddie Gray Empowerment Center, talking about the very real challenges faced by African Americans, living in Freddie Gray's neighborhood of Sandtown, Baltimore, such as 50%+ unemployment and "it's very expensive to be poor", the neighborhood that Bernie had just walked with community leaders, and at the end of the press conference a reporter tried to derail the conversation - FAIL :) (I've skipped ahead to that point in the video, but I'd recommend seeing the whole video):

 
Montel Williams thinks Trump is winning because he pioneered Reality Television. People have been trained for 15 years to value conflict and deception.

Yeah, a show that debuted 11 years ago totally pioneered reality television, which has existed for decades.

Great theory, Montel.
 
It's not even that. Giuliani had a lead in the rest of the country, so he had a reason to believe that those two states aren't important, even though he underestimated the change in momentum those outcomes would bring. Rubio is going into those two primaries desperately needing momentum from somewhere.

The biggest reason early primary polls aren't great predictors is that these early hard fought states change the dynamics. If Cruz wins Iowa, and Trump wins NH, where does Rubio get his momentum? And winning your home state doesn't count because that's expected. If winning your home state gives you momentum, then Tom Harken would have won 1992 easily.

The first two contests matter for those that don't win, too.

Santorum wins Iowa but Mitt Romney overperforms is good press and ends up building a narrative up.

If Rubio underperforms either state, he's done. That's why it's important for him to get as many votes as possible.

Who comes in 2nd and 3rd and with what percentage can be just as or more important than who wins IA and NH.
 
Chuck Todd buys Crab's theory that an independent Trump run would be good for Republican Senate elections.

It actually is a solid theory, I said the same thing.

It would be amazing if this entire thing was some bizarre long con by the republicans to keep the Senate in 2016, but that level of political strategy is just inhuman
 

benjipwns

Banned
Donald Trump’s ban on Muslims echoes earliest days of Nazi propaganda: expert
Before we call him a neo-Nazi, though, let's look at the record.

...

Trump has not proposed any of these restrictions, although he did seem to support registration and a database for all Muslims or all refugees. However, by saying on Monday that all Muslims overseas, even U.S. citizens who are abroad for business or pleasure, will be refused re-entry to the United States, he would effectively deny them their citizenship rights. Like Jews in Germany, they would be rendered stateless.
546956751.jpg
917-05-012146b.jpg

Donald Trump's anti-Muslim plan has similarities to the push against Jews when the Nazis were in power.

King: Donald Trump has gone full blown Nazi on us
As Donald Trump's lead in the polls continues to grow, so does his bigotry, sexism, and xenophobia — so bad, in fact, that major media outlets have taken to comparing the billionaire blowhard to Adolf Hitler, another narcissist who managed to make millions of people feel increasingly unsafe.

Trump's bigotry has gotten so flagrant that today's cover of the Philadelphia Daily News openly compares him to Hitler. Because most of us were not alive during Hitler's reign, it's hard to swallow that the horror we're witnessing from the businessman is real.

...

He has already made fun of a disabled journalist, called a woman fat, inferred a woman was having menstrual issues, and more. That he has done all of this, and soared to his highest lead yet in the polls is a frightening reflection of the true American soul.

Any one of those issues should have disqualified Donald Trump as a candidate, but because his views on Mexican immigrants, women, African Americans, and the disabled don't actually bother tens of millions of Americans, he has been nearly impervious to real criticism of his horrendous views. Call him Teflon Don. It's not that nothing sticks, it's that a huge percentage of Americans actually agree with him.

Now though, Trump has gone full-blown Nazi on us.


At home, the condemnations were just as swift and nearly universal. The harshest came from Martin O’Malley, the former Maryland governor seeking the Democratic nomination, who tweeted Monday that Trump “removes all doubt he is running for president as a fascist demagogue.”

jesus christ, these people in the reality-based community are just coming completely unhinged and going insane
 

benjipwns

Banned
Saying that Republicans are literally Nazi's and fascists used to be something confined to the DU and the Daily Kos, not repeated by former Governors running for President or being pushed by people in the media. Dragging out local professors to write pieces about how Trump and Hitler both once mentioned religions illustrated with Trump giving the "nazi salute" is into some nutjob territory.

Even the Clinton campaign is doing it:
GEORGE STEPHANOPOULOS (HOST): Well, the question is how would they figure out what was going on and how would you know that people are Muslims that are coming into the country, and and that is, it's not on any passport in the world, and you said you have a lot of support, cover of the Philadelphia Daily News right now, I want to show this to our viewers right now. It shows "The New Furor Over Donald Trump," showing you raising your hand in a pretty demonstrative gesture, and we heard from the Ibrahim Hooper, Council on American-Islamic Relations, saying are we talking internment camps, are we talking the final solution to the Muslim question? I feel like I'm back in the '30s. You're increasingly being compared to Hitler. Does that give you any pause at all?
 
Saying that Republicans are literally Nazi's and fascists used to be something confined to the DU and the Daily Kos, not repeated by former Governors running for President or being pushed by people in the media. Dragging out local professors to write pieces about how Trump and Hitler both once mentioned religions illustrated with Trump giving the "nazi salute" is into some nutjob territory.

Even the Clinton campaign is doing it:

Counterpoint, Neo-Nazi leaders agree with the comparisons.

The Republican presidential frontrunner has earned the praise of one of America’s leading neo-Nazi politicians. “Donald Trump is the real deal,” William Daniel Johnson, chairman of the white-supremacist American Freedom Party told teleSUR on Wednesday. “This is a unique phenomenon in modern politics. It is a throwback to a previous era,” he added. In the past, Johnson and his party have called for the stripping of citizenship for all but “non-Hispanic whites of the European race.”
 
They're not being insane if even the Neo-Nazis are saying Trump is basically fascist.

I'm sorry, I've always been one to defend against the whole Hitler stuff. Defending people calling GWB that online for years. I've had family members that have gone through that era. I know how insulting it is to the people that lived through it to compare people today to such times.

And I'm not saying Trump is Hitler or Mussolini or anything. But I think it's also not incorrect to point out the similarities between how Trump is running his campaign and how the NAZIs and Hitler originally ran their campaigns when trying to come to power. The language and earlier espoused ideas are very similar in numerous important ways.

edit: That said, the rhetoric about how we will become NAZI Germany is stupid.
 

SL128

Member
I've not liked the flippant comparisons of Republicans to Nazis, but Trump specifically is approaching that point more and more.
 

PBY

Banned
What political podcasts do ya'll listen to?

Only have the KCRW L, R and Center, and Slate's Political Gabfest, which I enjoy.
 
No, Hitler/Nazi comparisons are gross and will continue to be gross. They're not copying Nazi tactics they're copying normal political strategy that's been used long before the Nazis and long after; inflaming racial/ethnic tensions for electoral gain is not a Nazi exclusive tactic (see any political party in the world throughout history complaining about the 'other'). Did the Southern Strategy make Nixon a Nazi? FDR for internment camps? You cannot just casually compare racist discourse to the Nazis, it's disgusting. You can find plenty of other historical comparisons for this behavior without implicitly invoking the Holocaust.

The 'real' Nazis support him argument is asinine. Some KKK groups supported Obama, what should we draw from that?
 

pigeon

Banned
Saying that Republicans are literally Nazi's and fascists used to be something confined to the DU and the Daily Kos, not repeated by former Governors running for President or being pushed by people in the media.

But, like, so was saying we should ban all Muslim immigration and put current Muslims in camps. Prominent political figures didn't used to say that stuff, so other prominent political figures didn't call them fascists? Seems pretty reasonable to me?
 

benjipwns

Banned
They're not being insane if even the Neo-Nazis are saying Trump is basically fascist.
When Nazis say you're the real deal, you're bona-fide.
This is the worst appeal to authority ever.

But I think it's also not incorrect to point out the similarities between how Trump is running his campaign and how the NAZIs and Hitler originally ran their campaigns when trying to come to power. The language and earlier espoused ideas are very similar in numerous important ways.
The same could be said for Obama's campaigns, and most all others. The 2008 campaign with both major parties was tinged with fascist trappings. Especially in terms of suppress the individual for the goal of better serving the state.

I've not liked the flippant comparisons of Republicans to Nazis, but Trump specifically is approaching that point more and more.
No.
 
D

Deleted member 231381

Unconfirmed Member
Chuck Todd buys Crab's theory that an independent Trump run would be good for Republican Senate elections.

I think everyone should. Genuinely, as someone of the left, I am hoping very strongly Trump does not run Independent. In the long-run, it's more likely to be bad for the Democrats than good. It'd be nearly a generation before the Democrats would ever take the Senate again.
 

benjipwns

Banned
But, like, so was saying we should ban all Muslim immigration and put current Muslims in camps. Prominent political figures didn't used to say that stuff, so other prominent political figures didn't call them fascists? Seems pretty reasonable to me?
I don't remember Trump saying Muslims should be put in camps?

Banning immigration of any form is disgusting and anti-liberty, but targeted immigration bans have a long history throughout the "civilized" world. The United States banned all immigration from Iran during the hostage crisis. We still use restrictive quotas based on all sorts of seemingly irrelevant determinations on who is allowed in at what rates. We have entire lists of people placed on a whim, with no oversight and no real due process, who are restricted in their travel to and throughout the United States.

We celebrate FDR for the New Deal, but I do think we're too eager to brush over the fact that he was the closest thing America ever had to a dictator.
Wilson was closer.
 
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