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Dark/mean moments in The Simpsons: Those that worked, those that didn't

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Kain

Member
There was one episode where Homer was trying to buy a cool coffin for his father when he died and he ended building a tennis court in his backyard. Then a lot of tennis celebrities appear at the end of the episode for some reason. This is the epitome of how shit the series has become, it hits all the wrong notes constantly. So, that part at the beginning when they are browsing stuff for the funeral and all felt very, very, very wrong. I love dark humor (like really love it when I find it funny) but that episode, and specially that part, was humorless, tasteless and completely boring. Ugh.

Skinner is the best.

Johnny, Johnny, JOHNNYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY

Making fun of war vets and it was funny as fuck without coming as offensive. That was good writing there. Those were the times
 

Krejlooc

Banned
okay, but homer isn't the same kind of character in that episode that he is in homer's enemy. he's more bitter and frustrated (and focused on the situation) than somewhat oblivious yet earnest. it wasn't a flip of the switch.

I know it wasn't a flip of a switch, I know it was a gradual change. He'd already started to show the signs that I disliked by about season 5. But by the time the frank grimes episode rolled around, those traits had become so prominent that it put me off the show entirely. By season 8, his "normal" was obnoxious enough. The grimes episode is him turned up to 11.
 

AniHawk

Member
There was one episode where Homer was trying to buy a cool coffin for his father when he died and he ended building a tennis court in his backyard. Then a lot of tennis celebrities appear at the end of the episode for some reason. This is the epitome of how shit the series has become, it hits all the wrong notes constantly. So, that part at the beginning when they are browsing stuff for the funeral and all felt very, very, very wrong. I love dark humor (like really love it when I find it funny) but that episode, and specially that part, was humorless, tasteless and completely boring. Ugh.

the only good joke in that episode:

353228.jpg

354479.jpg


but yeah the rest of the episode is shit. i guess i have a soft spot for when the writers indulge in a bit of self-deprecation.
 

munchie64

Member
I get all the meta implications. It just isn't funny or entertaining. I feel like people get so caught up on how self aware the episode is that they give it a pass on being a genuinely unfunny, obnoxious episode. I outright don't find it entertaining, nor do I find a deconstruction of an obnoxious character that boils down to "obnoxious Homer is obnoxious" to be all that deep.
But it is really funny though. The ending is amazing.
 

fisheyes

Member
Homer Simpson in Kidney Trouble is one of the worst of the near classic era for me. Homer leaving his father on his deathbed twice doesn't sit well with me. Most other dark moments of around that time I can deal with, but not that.
 

squall23

Member
Maude's death on the show was the fucking worst.

So mean spirited, and being that such an event was written during Mike Scully's tenure on the show, the tasteless "jokes" were in full blast.

The episode "Alone Again, Natura-Diddily" starts off with The Simpsons and The Flanders's in the bleachers at a racing event. Cheerleading mascots at the event try to give out free t-shirts via bazookas. Homer requests a t-shirt, but at the last moment, ducks down due to seeing a coin on the floor, and the bazooka-fired shirt hits Maude behind him, pushing her off the high bleachers, and to her death on the ground below. Yes, Homer is actually responsible for Maude's death.

And it only gets worse from there.

At the funeral, the cheerleaders from the racing event are present, shooting t-shirts of Maude into the air, in memoriam, with the same goddamn bazookas that killed her.

After the funeral, a few of the town's characters "try" to console Ned, with the highlight being Moe commenting that if Ned had died instead of Maude, he'd definitely make advances on the widow.

Needless to say, Homer is the biggest asshole in this episode. He never feels remorse for his place in Maude's death, constantly craps on Flanders, and even fucking comments that had he never parked in the ambulance zone at the hospital where Maude was to be brought in, she might have lived.

By far one of the worst episodes of The Simpsons I've ever seen. Such an emotional premise with the potential to be touching or gut wrenching, ruined by low brow jokes and a lack of believable or likeable responses from many of the characters. Absolute trash.
I believe I was in grade 10 when I first saw that episode. The next day in school, everybody was talking about it. The overall consensus was that it was super hilarious. Especially because someone turned that "no footlongs" quote into an innuendo.
 

Dryk

Member
Some of those aren't really that bad, like the first clip from Lisa's First Word. Homer is just acknowledging his cousin, there's no real malice in it.
The entire joke is "Won't that fuck up Bart?", "Nah my cousin did it and turned out fine. BTW she's transgender and a cult leader"
 
Homer's Enemy is one in which it worked because life is unfair sometimes.
Boys of Bummer I feel tried to be say something, but it was just really mean spirited.
 
To put it mildly, I think quite a large percentage of Simpsons fans would argue this moment didn't really work..:

screen-shot-2012-06-01-at-3-14-41-pm.png


cqFEznp.png

Yeah it didn't work for me at all. Felt very forced the whole joke (no pun intended). That episode was just awful.

One that stands out for me was an early one where Homer and Ned pulls the wish bone and homer wishes Flanders Leftorium would fail. Very evil of him and very dark the whole episode, but it had a great ending and showed that deep down Homer does like his neighbour.
 

BatDan

Bane? Get them on board, I'll call it in.
Boys of Bummer is by the meanest, most unpleasant episode. It's like it belonged to one of those really awful Fox shows that only lasted a season and not The Simpsons.
 
The year was 1968. We were on recon in a steaming Mekong delta. An overheated private removed his flack jacket, revealing a T-shirt with an ironed-on sporting the MAD slogan "Up with Mini-skirts!". Well, we all had a good laugh, even though I didn't quite understand it. But our momentary lapse of concentration allowed "Charlie" to get the drop on us. I spent the next three years in a POW camp, forced to subsist on a thin stew made of fish, vegetables, prawns, coconut milk, and four kinds of rice. I came close to madness trying to find it here in the States, but they just can't get the spices right!
 

Kinyou

Member
Homer Simpson in Kidney Trouble is one of the worst of the near classic era for me. Homer leaving his father on his deathbed twice doesn't sit well with me. Most other dark moments of around that time I can deal with, but not that.

And then they just take his kidney while he's passed out
 

Blues1990

Member
It's this sequence from "Homer' Odyssey."

Homer's attempt to commit suicide had made me uncomfortable, given similar circumstances had happened to me. (Depression and unable to find a new job.)
 
You wanna talk bad, well how about "Principal Tamzaria."

What a terrible premise and execution of an episode. Completely retcon an otherwise classic character (Principal Skinner) by making him a fake while showing a complete nobody (the Real Skinner) and make him believe he's the one we should root for. Only to throw him away at the last minute.

I simply do no get how this got through and what the producers were thinking, I'm glad I never see this on reruns and it's still regarded as one of the worst.
 

MC Safety

Member
You wanna talk bad, well how about "Principal Tamzaria."

What a terrible premise and execution of an episode. Completely retcon an otherwise classic character (Principal Skinner) by making him a fake and while showing a complete nobody (the Real Skinner) and make him believe he's the one we should root for. Only to throw him away at the last minute.

I simply do no get how this got through and what the producers were thinking, I'm glad I never see this on reruns and it's still regarded as one of the worst.

That was an awful episode all around. Even classic Simpsons wasn't immune from the occasional stinker.
 

HStallion

Now what's the next step in your master plan?
The show got really mean as it went on and it can be seen mostly through Homer though it affects all the characters. He went from a good natured idiot with a short temper to an aggressively stupid character, to a down right asshole that cracks a joke after doing something terrible as if that somehow makes up for it. It started around the middle of the classic seasons and then got more noticeable around the Homer's Enemy episode and then things seemed to escalate.

Its funny watching some of the current episodes it seems the series has done a bit of a 180 and has gone back to a dumber happier Homer who isn't try scheme every episode and a lot of the story lines seem to focus more on the family and their issues than what zany celebrity is going to show up or crazy event is going to happen. Its kind of weird lol
 

blakep267

Member
Maybe not mean, but as a kid I always found the Treehouse of horror ep where homer gets trapped in the dimension behind the book case to be dark and unsettling. Mainly the ending. He gets transported to a different world and that's it. Maybe I found it unsettling because I felt that I wanted closure to it as a kid
 
Re-posting from the main Simpsons thread:

So my parents were watching S26E16 "Sky Police" wherein Chief Wiggum gets a jetpack, which is huge and is essentially two jet turbines strapped together. During a musical number where he enjoys the jetpack, he lands on two graffiti artists, shredding them up in the turbines. You can see the blood on the sidewalk.
 

Jackpot

Banned
Pretty much any moment that pushed Bart from "loveable scamp" to juvenile criminal did not work. Stealing cars, breaking into Flander's house and trashing it, going to juvie, etc.

Twice they've done stories on teachers bullying and abusing Bart and Lisa respectively. Not many jokes there.

And one moment that stuck in my mind was Homer waiting until the middle of the night to strangle Bart in his bed. Takes away the heat-of-the-moment anger and made it creepily premeditated.

And there was the episode were Bart and Lisa literally murdered Martin and tried to cover it up, and then some stupid mumbo-jumbo at the end to make it so he hadn't died after all.

edit:

+1 to Bart's actions towards Lisa's babysitting and Summer makeover as just wrong.
 

munchie64

Member
You wanna talk bad, well how about "Principal Tamzaria."

What a terrible premise and execution of an episode. Completely retcon an otherwise classic character (Principal Skinner) by making him a fake while showing a complete nobody (the Real Skinner) and make him believe he's the one we should root for. Only to throw him away at the last minute.

I simply do no get how this got through and what the producers were thinking, I'm glad I never see this on reruns and it's still regarded as one of the worst.
I listened to the commentary for it with the writer, and I think the idea was that the episode was meant to be about the people that ended up complaining about it.
 

BatDan

Bane? Get them on board, I'll call it in.
There's also "Love is a Many Strangled Thing". To get Homer to stop choking Bart, a therapist hires Kareem Abdul-Jabaar to constantly strangle Homer. It's not as funny as it sounds.
 

DrFunk

not licensed in your state
Johnny, Johnny, JOHNNYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY

Making fun of war vets and it was funny as fuck without coming as offensive. That was good writing there. Those were the times

302918.jpg


holy hell the simpsons could be dark
 
I know that didn't work at all. In Homer vs. Dignity, Mr. Burns hires a cash-strapped Homer to be his "prank monkey" while Smithers is away. Essentially this means paying him to troll society and humiliate himself in public.

In one scene Homer puts on a Panda costume, and they pretend he's a new donated panda to Springfield Zoo. He does some zany antics until the Zoo announces that they also have a male panda in the same enclosure. This panda then proceeds to rape Homer, still in his suit. Before this horrible scene ends, Moe cuts in to make a quick remark how this supposed female panda can't escape the assault.

Here's the transcript of the whole ordeal:
Zookeeper: Hey, there's our resident bull panda, Ping-Ping. With any luck, folks, these two will become very, very close, if you know what I mean.

[Ping-Ping sniffs, and approaches Homer]

Homer: Huh? Help! Mr. Burns!

[Burns laughs]

[Homer gets up and tries to run away, but he trips and lands on a boulder, with his butt sticking up in the air]

Zookeeper: Ooh, look -- she's presenting! We thought this would take years to happen.

[Ping-Ping grabs Homer and drags him closer. A curtain descends on the bizarre tableau]

Zookeeper: Ping-Ping just asked Sim-Sim to marry him, and I think she just said yes.

Audience: Aw. [claps]

[sounds of a struggle come from behind the curtain. Homer tries to crawl out, but only gets halfway before Ping-Ping drags him back inside]

Moe: Ha! You ain't going nowhere, cutie.
I stopped watching Simpsons for years after that episode.
 

Parallax

best seen in the classic "Shadow of the Beast"
On a clear day i can't see my sister is the episode that made me give up on watching the Simpsons regularly. Such a mess of an episode. Then theres the one where Bart learns top play the drums that ends with him unable to play the drums again.
 
I listened to the commentary for it with the writer, and I think the idea was that the episode was meant to be about the people that ended up complaining about it.

I guess but they did a better job with another similar episode "the Itchy and Scratchy and Poochie Show." This time it's at the cost of an existing character's canon. Sure everyone can brush off the Tamzaria part but it's such a throwaway episode that's still canon.
 
I believe I was in grade 10 when I first saw that episode. The next day in school, everybody was talking about it. The overall consensus was that it was super hilarious. Especially because someone turned that "no footlongs" quote into an innuendo.

Back when I was a kid, I never hated that episode, but even then, I felt something was off.

Hell, that's how I felt about most of Scully's works. As an adult, I can now see that while his episodes still had funny moments, the plots were usually shit.
 
One that didn't work for me:

Don't remember what episode it is, but it opens with homer having a dream in which after an accident he Kills Euthanizes grandpa Abe for selfish reasons and wakes up saying he had a wonderful dream. It's mean spirited and horrible and devoid of humor.

Later i was told the scene was meant to parody one from The Soprano or some shit, but i fail to see how that makes it funny with no context or set up.

wait, they killed grandpa?

S19E16 Papa Don't Leech. Lurleen Lumpkin is back, and they eventually find her deadbeat dad, and after they reunite, he abandons her again. This also makes Homer wonder how he can abandon his own family, and the dream sequence about him smothering Grampa is supposedly a reflection of how he doesn't want to be a burden to his family in old age.

As for the thread:

tumblr_mi2lfpxPIO1r72ht7o1_500.gif


This scene always hits close to home for me. I wasn't very popular as a kid and Valentine's day was always a big reminder of that fact.

This was me too back then. ='(

In my school, you were required to give Valentine's cards to everyone, and everyone gave them to you, so while this sort of thing was averted, it comes off as disingenuous.
 

Akuun

Looking for meaning in GAF
I had never heard of that Ricardo thing because I had stopped watching the show by that point. Damn, that is a huge, HUGE dick move if she didn't know about it beforehand. That's a huge middle finger to fans, not a thank you.

The mean moments from older episodes worked better. I agree that Grimes was a perfect example of what a "normal" hardworking person would be like if he lived in the Simpsons world, and it works despite being incredibly mean to Grimes himself. The followup Grimes episodes were garbage, though. Older episodes where family members were mean to each other were usually smoothed over with them making up in the end, which was an incredibly important element that was often omitted in the newer episodes.
 

BowieZ

Banned
You wanna talk bad, well how about "Principal Tamzaria."

What a terrible premise and execution of an episode. Completely retcon an otherwise classic character (Principal Skinner) by making him a fake while showing a complete nobody (the Real Skinner) and make him believe he's the one we should root for. Only to throw him away at the last minute.

I simply do no get how this got through and what the producers were thinking, I'm glad I never see this on reruns and it's still regarded as one of the worst.
Love that episode.

"And I further decree that everything will be just as it was... before all this happened! And nobody will ever mention it again, under punishment of TORTURE!" *Yeahhh!*

EDIT: Extra jokes as I'm watching the episode right now!
"Superintendant Chalmers, would you like a cup of coffee-flavored Beverine?" "Uh, yes, I'll take it grey, with creamium."
"Miss Hoover, which one is 'one'?"
"My theory is... Skinner likes dog food." "Ooh! A fresh batch of America balls!!"
"Principal Skinner is an old man who lives at the school!"
"Keep looking shocked... and move slowly towards the cake..."
"You can have some lima beans as soon as you've cleaned your room! GO! (Upstairs... third door on the left...)"
"I'm calling this assembly to announce my retirement... effective as of the end of this sentence... this sentence I'm speaking... right now. Period." "OH!!!" *shocked whispers*
"Armin Tamzarian's reign of terror is over! Now let's welcome our new Principal Skinner... Principal Seymour Skinner! Uh, him."
"It's your life; I've just kept it warm for you."
"Up yours, children!"
"And now to recap our top story in its entirety!"
"I must say, in many ways, Springfield beats the old slave labor camp."
"His name doesn't matter: a rose by any other name would smell as sweet." "Not if you called them stench-blossoms." "Or crap-weeds." "I'm not sure I'd like to get a bunch of crap-weeds for Valentine's Day. I'd much rather candy." "Not if you called them scum-drops."
"Hey America, you're so fine. You're so fine, you blow my mind. America." *fart noise* *laughs*
"Okay, once more, where are we going?" "To Capital City." "And why are you and the lady in the car?" "We're going to talk Armin Tamzarian into coming back." "Well why is Marge here?" "I came up with the idea." "And why am I here?" "Because the streets of Capital City are no place for three unescorted ladies." "And why are the kids here?" "Because we couldn't find Grampa to sit for him." "Well why is Grampa here?" "Because Jasper didn't want to come by himself!" "Huh. Fair enough."
"Hello, beautiful!" "In your dreams!" "We'll see about that!" *snores immediately* "... hello beautiful..."
"Well from now on, you're going to see a new Seymour Skinner...!" "Oh no, we won't!" "Yes, mother."

I feel like some people just hate when Simpsons goes meta. I mean, meta can be done crappy (many subsequent Simpsons episodes), but Principal and the Pauper and Homer's Enemy are generally hilarious episodes from start to finish. Honestly, I feel like the internet propagated the hive mentality that Principal and the Pauper "jumped the shark," when at the heart it's just classic Simpsons with classic humour and a meta premise.

Jumping the shark definitely began with Saddlesore Galactica halfway through Season 11. Ian Maxtone-Graham's name flashing on the screen, the stupid anthropomorphic horse, the murderous jockey trolls, Lisa writing a letter to President Clinton about a band competition? The fuck... The jokes are the meta-references (very Family Guy) rather than the premise just so happening to be meta.

As per wikipedia:

The episode is heavily self-referential and contains a number of meta-references.[9][10][11] When the Simpsons take Duncan home from the fair, Comic Book Guy points out to the Simpsons that they have already taken in a horse as a pet (as seen in "Lisa's Pony"), and that "the expense forced Homer to work at the Kwik-E-Mart, with hilarious consequences."[9][12] In another scene later in the episode, when Lisa points out to Marge that Marge is showing signs of gambling problems, Comic Book Guy shows up again wearing a T-shirt that says "Worst Episode Ever" and tells Lisa: "Hey, I'm watching you!" This refers to the fact that Marge's gambling problems have already been explored in the episode "$pringfield".[3][9][10]

Jonathan Gray analyzed the self-referentiality in The Simpsons in his 2006 book Watching with The Simpsons: Television, Parody, and Intertextuality, writing that "Sitcoms constantly 'reset' themselves, living in [...] an 'existential circle' in which nothing really changes, and every episode starts more or less where the last one started; and The Simpsons frequently plays with this sitcom clock, and with the amnesia of sitcom memory. The family members often forget important events in their 'history' [...]".[9] Gray noted that in "Saddlesore Galactica", "the action continues as normal, as sitcom memory (or lack thereof) is pointed out but comically not acted upon. Thus, where David Grote [author of The End of Comedy: The Sit-Com and the Comedic Tradition] (1983: 67) notes that sitcom episodes 'live in a kind of time-warp without any reference to the other episodes,' producing a situation whereby everything 'remains inviolate and undisturbed, no matter what transitory events may occur' (1983: 59), The Simpsons comically reflects upon this."[9]
 

Krejlooc

Banned
I had never heard of that Ricardo thing because I had stopped watching the show by that point. Damn, that is a huge, HUGE dick move if she didn't know about it beforehand. That's a huge middle finger to fans, not a thank you.

The mean moments from older episodes worked better. I agree that Grimes was a perfect example of what a "normal" hardworking person would be like if he lived in the Simpsons world, and it works despite being incredibly mean to Grimes himself. The followup Grimes episodes were garbage, though. Older episodes where family members were mean to each other were usually smoothed over with them making up in the end, which was an incredibly important element that was often omitted in the newer episodes.

there are follow up grimes episodes?? But he died at the end.
 

akira28

Member
The animation definitely adds to that tension. It's so creepily fluid in comparison to other episodes at the time.

thosesimpsons.gif

yeah...wow. she completely conveys that unpredictable feeling of a crazy lady that could pull a knife on you at any second. the animation seems different, more exaggerated, or maybe its just a hallmark of earlier Simpsons animations.
 

Trojita

Rapid Response Threadmaker
It's not really "dark/mean" but I always felt bad for the family when they buy Itchy and Scratchy Money and then find out that it is worthless.

CUR4DvsUEAA8XqH.jpg
 
I hate the frank grimes episode of the simpsons, I don't see what people see in it. It's one of the first episodes that really painted Homer as a malicious blithering idiot, rather than a well-meaning (albeit lazy) bumbling fool like he was earlier in the series.

Homer doesn't do anything malicious in the episode though, aside from eating Grimey's lunch. He also spends Acts 2 and 3 trying to be his friend while Grimey acts like a jackass towards him because of his jealousy.
 
pJ8AlHr.gif


Went from I choo, choo, choose you, to this. They really did a number on Ralph in that episode.

Also, the episode where no one celebrated Lisa's birthday until the very end with Bart and a mental patient singing to her.

tumblr_mk2pgk5Qix1qg0rnuo1_500.jpg


And have they stopped trying to find different ways for Moe to kill himself yet? It was never funny.
 
D

Deleted member 13876

Unconfirmed Member
The animation definitely adds to that tension. It's so creepily fluid in comparison to other episodes at the time.

thosesimpsons.gif

Different animation studio. It was also the first episode they produced.

The episode was first directed by Kent Butterworth. Klasky-Csupo, the animation studio that produced the earlier Simpsons shorts, was in charge of the animation, with one exception. During the years of producing the shorts, everything was created in-house. As a budgetary consideration production was subcontracted to South Korean animation studio AKOM.[5] While character and background layout was done in Los Angeles, inbetweening, coloring and filming is done by the overseas studio.[5] A debacle erupted when this episode, the first to return from Korea, was screened in front of the production staff at the Gracie Films bungalow.[4] Brooks' initial reaction to the animation was "This is shit."[4] Afterwards the room almost cleared.[4] A heated argument ensued between Brooks and Klasky-Csupo animation studio head Gabor Csupo, who denied that there was anything wrong with the animation and suggested that the real problem was the quality of the show's writing.[6]

The producers felt the animation did not exhibit a distinct style envisioned for the show. At the time there were only a few choices for animation style. Usually, they would follow the style of either Disney, Warner Bros., or Hanna-Barbera. Disney and Warner Bros. cartoons had a universe that was bendy and the characters seemed to be made of rubber.[4] The producers wanted a realistic environment in which the characters and objects could not do anything that was not possible in the real world. One example with the early animation being cartoonish was that the doors behaved liked rubber when slammed. The style of Hanna-Barbera featured the use of cartoon sounds, which they did not want either.[4]
 

Akuun

Looking for meaning in GAF
there are follow up grimes episodes?? But he died at the end.
Yeah, there was one episode (after the series started to go to shit) where Homer was getting harassed by random hateful messages or some such, and it turns out that at the end it was Grimes' relatives trying to get revenge on him.

The episode was really really bad.
 

Parallax

best seen in the classic "Shadow of the Beast"
Yeah, there was one episode (after the series started to go to shit) where Homer was getting harassed by random hateful messages or some such, and it turns out that at the end it was Grimes' relatives trying to get revenge on him.

The episode was really really bad.

That makes as much sense as his son
 
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