Support NeoGAF

[MiamiWesker]

This is only true if you consider Uncharted to be a third person shooter, whereby the medium of the game is shooting and variety is expressed through the medium of combat.

Uncharted is action/adventure and it uses more tools at its disposal to express that variety. Whether you like it or not is up to your tastes.

This comes up so many times. Yes it's an action adventure game where the adventure aspect is extremely limited and not that great. Zelda games have an incredible adventure component. Games like Arkham, metroid, any games of that ilk have the correct balance in action and adventure. I never felt Uncharted did the adventure side well. But it does action and variety in setpieces better than ANYONE. That's what uncharted is known for.

 

[Jawmuncher]

This comes up so many times. Yes it's an action adventure game where the adventure aspect is extremely limited and not that great. Zelda games have an incredible adventure component. Games like Arkham, metroid stuff like that have the correct balance in action and adventure. I never felt Uncharted did the adventure side well. But it does action and variety in setpieces better than ANYONE. That's what uncharted is known for.

Uncharted to me was always a TPS with some exploring over anything else. I never played UC1-3 to explore and do puzzles. I played for the set pieces and action.

 

[Scientist Supreme!]

Don't say anything negative about Eurogamer™, our moderator overlords are looking to ban any citizen not obeying their employers. Can't criticize the article and their intentions either.

You'll probably have to read the article in question to properly criticize it. Which is not what happened but continue to be foolish.

 

[Curufinwe]

It caught on because it's intentionally dismissive. Like Murder Simulator. Now the Uncharted series has the lucky distinction of being accused of being both.

Walkder Simulator?

 

[scitek]

Post like yours do make me reconsider calling myself a gamer but not for the reasons you think.

Lol, c'mon, he's clearly just a kid.

 

[Neiteio]

When will Naughty Dog make a Walken simulator

 

[Ferr986]

If you don't have the same excitement that I have playing a game and enjoying the experience, maybe you should reconsider calling youself a gamer.

Maybe could be Uncharted, but every game has something to experience, and if you can't find joy doing that.... it's time to stop playing games and saying shit about games.

You forgot the /s, bruh.

 

[NullPointer]

This is only true if you consider Uncharted to be a third person shooter, whereby the medium of the game is shooting and variety is expressed through the medium of combat.

Uncharted is action/adventure and it uses more tools at its disposal to express that variety. Whether you like it or not is up to your tastes.

I never thought it would be controversial to describe Uncharted as a third person shooter until now. Its always been very heavy on the combat (and waves and waves of enemies), with light traversal and puzzle elements in between. I'd put the mix at maybe 70% combat to 30% everything else, maybe 60/40 at best.

UC4 flips that on its head. While there are some incredible action scenes, combat feels rare, mostly stealth oriented and often avoidable, at least in terms of not having to clear the whole area of enemies.

Now maybe the last third of the game is crazy combat and I'll get a different sense of things, but so far it absolutely feels like they purposefully switched the formula up to put combat in the background (often literally).

 

[tuxfool]

I never felt Uncharted did the adventure side well. But it does action and variety in setpieces better than ANYONE. That's what uncharted is known for.

The setpieces in the UC3 were more frequent, bombastic and varied than any other game in the series. That game is the most disliked and many feel like it was a step down. That game was nothing more than pieces with some connective tissue in between.

UC4 doesn't actually do that, and the downtime seems like it has its own purpose other than ferrying you between setpieces.

However saying that, I would also appreciate a lot less (auto) traversal in climbing sections. It is one of the things that annoys me about TR, whereby they dropped what made that series different from Uncharted.

I never thought it would be controversial to describe Uncharted as a third person shooter until now.

I don't think it is controversial, especially as applied to the previous entries, but one can see there is a deliberate attempt by the designers to make it less "third person shooter".

 

[Nibel]

I just wrote yesterday on Twitter that 7 chapters in this is the best looking walking simulator of all time. I'm in chapter 8 right now and it now feels like an actual third-person action adventure that requires you to do more than walking through broadened corridors.

People been telling me it will pick up and I still think this is a solid product that I of course will finish, but you can feel the TLOU impact almost in every aspect and I'm not quite sure if it works here.

 

[Air Zombie Meat]

Lol, c'mon, he's clearly just a kid.

In that case, WELCOME TO THE REAL WORLD SON!

 

[nib95]

This is the most backward opinion I have ever read. If you are a gamer and love PLAYING games because of their mechanics and the joy you have of being engaged from a gameplay perspective then huge segments where all you do is walk around and press x on predetermined highlighted objects is not engaging.

You clearly enjoy boring gameplay, that's nice. Some of us want more than the illusion of exploration. Uncharted 4 does a great job of making the simple downtime sections be interesting through its unparalleled presentation, still I much rather be playing the parts with interesting gameplay, the combat.

Uncharted 4 does offer more than an illusion of exploration though, by actually offering beautiful, often large areas, with massive attention to detail, as well as treasures, journals, new dialogue options etc that incentivise the exploration. Then there's the puzzles that are thrown in the mix, as well as other new gameplay mechanics that do actually require some form of skill, timing, control and/or momentum, eg the mudslides, ropeswing, rockpick, vehicles etc.You yourself might not have found these things engaging, but many people did and do.

 

[gamerMan]

Technically most games are walking and running simulators but Eurogamer had to go with that baity headline for the clicks. Going by the same metric, Batman was a driving simulator.

As stated by many the change in the series is a very welcome change and pointed out as a good change by most reviewers. I think ND brought the TLOU pace to UC4 and not surprisingly it works very well here too. I would be very happy if more devs took this approach then not.

I wouldn't call it a walking simulator, but Naughty Dog has created a whole new genre called which I would call "interactive movie." Uncharted isn't designed like other games. It is designed very much like a computer animation movie. The story is created along with all the scenes being storyboarded. Then the gameplay is shoehorned to fit into the story. Why am I jumping across the roof? To meet Sam.

Every other game does it the opposite way. The gameplay is created and then the story is built around the gameplay.

As a result, in Uncharted you are being tunneled through the story. Can't make it across the ledge, well your rope just happens to be 1 foot away. Need to shoot bad guys, someone will throw you a gun. Need to climb up higher, a crate just happens to be just a few feet away. Need to solve a puzzle, the answer is in your notebook. Need to hide from enemies, there is tall grass waiting for you. While there is faux sense of exploration, there is really no challenge in figuring out where you have to go or with the mechanics. It leads you by your hand through the story.

Unlike traditional games, you never really have to think about what you have to do. It's just automatic and done in an effort to build the story. The reason the game is loved is because nobody else builds games the same way Naughty Dog does --around the story.

The only real gameplay is found during shootouts which are really spaced out through the story. The rest of the gameplay is just there to build the story with highly scripted segments. When the gameplay opens up with very little story elements, it becomes boring like roaming on a jeep. The game feel the bests when it is tunneled through the story segments and the scripted moments, which are automatic.

The only reason that the original 8 chapters are in Uncharted 4 is to build the story, but it is not boring because the story is interesting. They are completely unnecessary from a game play perspective because you are really not doing much. If this game was built around game play, then a game designer would cut all that out. A movie director would not as it is essential to tell the story.

 

[potatohead]

I just wrote yesterday on Twitter that 7 chapters in this is the best looking walking simulator of all time. I'm in chapter 8 right now and it now feels like an actual third-person action adventure that requires you to do more than walking through broadened corridors.

People been telling me it will pick up and I still think this is a solid product that I of course will finish, but you can feel the TLOU impact almost in every aspect and I'm not quite sure if it works here.

The first 7 chapters are almost like a prologue, even though it only calls one part the prologue. The introduction is very, very long. But enjoyable.

The rest of the game is more traditional. It will pick up.

I wouldn't call it a walking simulator, but Naughty Dog has created a whole new genre called which I would call "interactive movie." Uncharted isn't designed like other games. It is designed very much like a computer animation movie. The story is created along with all the scenes being storyboarded. Then the gameplay is shoehorned to fit into the story.

This is so absurdly reductive. Very absurd.

This paragraph makes sense about Heavy Rain or other Quantic Dream games. But it's pretty much delusional to say that the gameplay is "shoehorned" into Uncharted.

Highly disingenuous.

As a result, in Uncharted you are being tunneled through the story. Can't make it across the ledge, well your rope just happens to be 1 foot away. Need to shoot bad guys, someone will throw you a gun. Need to climb up higher, a crate just happens to be just a few feet away. Need to solve a puzzle, the answer is in your notebook. There is really no challenge in figuring where you have to go or with the mechanics.

I'm sorry I'm done. Lol. Too much for me.

Jesus Christ it's like no one has ever played another action-adventure game ever. "They put the answer in your notebook." Omg... Lol. I'm done.

 

[MiamiWesker]

The setpieces in the UC3 were more frequent, bombastic and varied than any other game in the series. That game is the most disliked and many feel like it was a step down. That game was nothing more than pieces with some connective tissue in between.

UC4 doesn't actually do that, and the downtime seems like it has its own purpose other than ferrying you between setpieces.

However saying that, I would also appreciate a lot less (auto) traversal in climbing sections. It is one of the things that annoys me about TR, whereby they dropped what made that series different from Uncharted.

Yes U3 has issues with pacing as well. It too had these odd just walk forward segments scattered around. And it's action pieces didn't flow well. So it was a two fold problem. Plus it didn't really improve much from U2 so it felt like a safe sequel.

U4 has significant gameplay improvements, new hardware that takes the presentation to levels never seen before, a better story but what I would say is terrible pacing. And that matters a lot in what is mostly an action game.

All these discussions on the what the right balance should be would make sense if U2 didn't exist but it does. U2 is the exact balance, it's right there, we all played it. It is considered to be a masterpiece for a reason. That's the template, follow that! What's so hard about that.

 

[MegaSackman]

I just wrote yesterday on Twitter that 7 chapters in this is the best looking walking simulator of all time. I'm in chapter 8 right now and it now feels like an actual third-person action adventure that requires you to do more than walking through broadened corridors.

People been telling me it will pick up and I still think this is a solid product that I of course will finish, but you can feel the TLOU impact almost in every aspect and I'm not quite sure if it works here.

I think you are generalizing but you get to "action play" in chapters 1

Spoiler

(boat scene)

, 2

Spoiler

(prison escape)

, 5

Spoiler

(another prison escape)

, 7

Spoiler

(auction house escape)

. Those are all action oriented scenes where chapter 6 is a build up for 7. It's true that those chapters are in narrow places but this exist through all the franchise.

 

[Neiteio]

Uncharted 4 does offer more than an illusion of exploration though, by actually offering beautiful, often large areas, with massive attention to detail, as well as treasures, journals, new dialogue options etc that incentivise the exploration. Then there's the puzzles that are thrown in the mix, as well as other new gameplay mechanics that do actually require some form of skill, timing, control and/or momentum, eg the mudslides, ropeswing, rockpick, vehicles etc.You yourself might not have found these things engaging, but many people did and do.

Miami is saying the game is pretty light from a mechanical standpoint. And I'm inclined to agree, although I haven't finished yet.

Many stretches have you panning the camera until you see the only way forward: Usually a set of handholds where you push forward and tap X to jump and grab without fail, or a slope leading to a distant set of handholds. Sometimes they mix it up and you have to drop to a lower ledge by tapping Circle — again, there's only one way forward, so no thinking required. Other times you're jumping across monkey bars at the apex of your swing, or using the rope to swing to handholds, or climb/lower to handholds — again, very linear, and very light in terms of actual interaction. Beyond that, you just have treasures and optional conversations that incentivize exploration for the one time you find them.

Bear in mind I'm not saying this critically — it's just the way things are. UC4 isn't very involving, but that's OK. Gamers who want more engagement should seek out mechanically rich/rigorously designed games like the kind made by Nintendo, From Software and Platinum. But the games made by Naughty Dog are still richly rewarding in their own way. You just have to go in with the expectation that your actual interactions will be a bit linear, limited, and light from an interactive standpoint.

 

[tuxfool]

All these discussions on the what the right balance should be would make sense if U2 didn't exist but it does. U2 is the exact balance, it's right there, we all played it. It is considered to be a masterpiece for a reason. That's the template, follow that! What's so hard about that.

For you maybe. I like 4 better. I've grown past 2.

Therein lies the rub. They can't follow a template on something that is a question of preference. I don't demand mechanical purity.

 

[Curufinwe]

Yes U3 has issues with pacing as well. It too had these odd just walk forward segments scattered around. And it's action pieces didn't flow well. So it was a two fold problem. Plus it didn't really improve much from U2 so it felt like a safe sequel.

U4 has significant gameplay improvements, new hardware that takes the presentation to levels never seen before, a better story but what I would say is terrible pacing. And that matters a lot in what is mostly an action game.

All these discussions on the what the right balance should be would make sense if U2 didn't exist but it does. U2 is the exact balance, it's right there, we all played it. It is considered to be a masterpiece for a reason. That's the template, follow that! What's so hard about that.

U2's balance did not seem perfect to me when playing it last year after playing TLOUR. Times change.

 

[papo]

What is he talking about? You can't randomly mash buttons and climb up shit in Uncharted.. especially previous entries. You actually do need to hold the direction you'd like the character to go. In that particular box car sequence you use all of the traversal mechanics in the game to get out of it.

I love the game, but oh yes you can. Unless it is one of those jump that is at an angle you can basically button mash Drake to completion. And yes it still needs you to tap the directional button in a couple of jumps or run into them, but it's not even an issue most of the time.

 

[Colonel Nasty]

As someone who hates the shooting in uncharted this game has been great so far. There was a lot less of forced combat in TR as well.

 

[Mihael Mello Keehl]

Maybe he should have used cinematic, something life is strange is a walking simulator. And its a damn good one

 

[MiamiWesker]

U2's balance did not seem perfect to me when playing it last year after playing TLOUR. Times change.

For you. I replayed U2 recently, still perfect. And I like it more than TLOU.

 

[pablito]

I hate this term, but I kinda feel like we earned it. People that like linear games had to hear the complaints of people that didn't, especially with games like FFXIII. Being linear became a negative, and it seems like that was taken seriously and now there are open world games a plenty. Games like TW3 and MGS5 are open world and came from non open world series.

However I don't like my love for exploration, seeing beautiful and cool locations, and the excitement of possibly stumbling upon cool hidden items or enemies reduced to "walking." Sounds like I could be playing a game of walking on a treadmill and get the same satisfaction. Nope.

 

[Punished_Snake]

I agree with this article. Many chapters are not repayable becuase of this.

 

[nib95]

Miami is saying the game is pretty light from a mechanical standpoint. And I'm inclined to agree, although I haven't finished yet.

Many stretches have you panning the camera until you see the only way forward: Usually a set of handholds where you push forward and tap X to jump and grab without fail, or a slope leading to a distant set of handholds. Sometimes they mix it up and you have to drop to a lower ledge by tapping Circle — again, there's only one way forward, so no thinking required. Other times you're jumping across monkey bars at the apex of your swing, or using the rope to swing to handholds, or climb/lower to handholds — again, very linear, and very light in terms of actual interaction. Beyond that, you just have treasures and optional conversations that incentivize exploration for the one time you find them.

Bear in mind I'm not saying this critically — it's just the way things are. UC4 isn't very involving, but that's OK. Gamers who want more engagement should seek out mechanically rich/rigorously designed games like the kind made by Nintendo, From Software and Platinum. But the games made by Naughty Dog are still richly rewarding in their own way. You just have to go in with the expectation that your actual interactions will be a bit linear, limited, and light from an interactive standpoint.

What determines light from a mechanical standpoint? Difficulty alone? What about the element of discovery, or how about fun factor, animation quality, controls, fluidity, how they blend together with other mechanics etc? I do agree that most of these explorative mechanics in UC4 definitely don't require much skill, though some definitely require a little. As mentioned before, I actually died more on the platforming than any of the gunfights, mostly because I barely died from the combat, but also because contrary to belief, you can actually miss time some of the jumps, swings, slides etc, and often you can also misjudge the distance of a particular gap, and other times whether something is or isn't scale-able, especially if you're impatient like me, as often times it takes a little while for the hand reach animation to actually kick in. That and trying to scour every nook and cranny for treasures.

But when we talk about gameplay 'engagement', we should be careful not to confuse what we mean with gameplay 'difficulty', the two are not necessarily the same. I personally find swinging about like Tarzan with beautiful backdrops engaging and more importantly, really fun, as I do figuring out traversal options or pathways etc. Different strokes for different folks as they say. Mind you, I still think UC4 should have had a greater balance of gunfights, because I enjoy them most of all, though I appreciate many don't.

 

[Neiteio]

I hate this term, but I kinda feel like we earned it. People that like linear games had to hear the complaints of people that didn't, especially with games like FFXIII. Being linear became a negative, and it seems like that was taken seriously and now there are open world games a plenty. Games like TW3 and MGS5 are open world and came from non open world series.

However I don't like my love for exploration, seeing beautiful and cool locations, and the excitement of possibly stumbling upon cool hidden items or enemies reduced to "walking." Sounds like I could be playing a game of walking on a treadmill and get the same satisfaction. Nope.

I think it's pretty implicit that "walking simulator" really means "walking and sightseeing simulator." Like going for a walk. Taking a hike. Which admittedly is a big part of the appeal of the Uncharted games. They build each level around an amazing view for a reason.

 

[SomTervo]

When will Naughty Dog make a Walken simulator

that would be tits

 

[gamerMan]

The first 7 chapters are almost like a prologue, even though it only calls one part the prologue. The introduction is very, very long. But enjoyable.
.

Prologue to what though? The game or the story? With Uncharted you can't really separate the two. Because the story is the game.

 

[IronicSonic]

I just wrote yesterday on Twitter that 7 chapters in this is the best looking walking simulator of all time. I'm in chapter 8 right now and it now feels like an actual third-person action adventure that requires you to do more than walking through broadened corridors.

People been telling me it will pick up and I still think this is a solid product that I of course will finish, but you can feel the TLOU impact almost in every aspect and I'm not quite sure if it works here.

My thoughts exactly. Specially the bold sentence

 

[Wowfunhappy]

The reaction to this article is why we really need a better term than "Walking Simulator".

 

[Lonely1]

First, I must say that 'walking simulator' shouldn't be a derogatory term. Some of my favourite games can be classified as such (Amnesia: aMfP and even Amnesia and Soma).

That being said, I must agree to a degree with this article. I always cringe a bit when people discuss which Uncharted has the better plataforming or shooting mechanics. Imo, all the four first Uncharted's (I have yet to play UC4) are weak on those aspects. Their strong points have always been their presentation. So, perhaps interacting movies is better term? It has been used before to describe the franchise.

Those that mean that I think the series are a lesser kind of game? No! I'm glad that they exist as it is. I love the spectacle and I like the format better than the sandbox one, even when the second has more game play. Give me a tight linear game over a colectatton any time!

 

[N.Domixis]

Got Dayum at the amount of people banned lol.

 

[cartographer]

First, I must say that 'walking simulator' shouldn't be a derogatory term. Some of my favourite games can be classified as such (Amnesia: aMfP and even Amnesia and Soma).

That being said, I must agree to a degree with this article. I always cringe a bit when people discuss which Uncharted has the better plataforming or shooting mechanics. Imo, all the four first Uncharted's (I have yet to play UC4) are weak on those aspects. Their strong points have always been their presentation. So, perhaps interacting movies is better term? It has been used before to describe the franchise.

Those that mean that I think the series are a lesser kind of game? No! I'm glad that they exist as it is. I love the spectacle and I like the format better than the sandbox one, even when the second has more game play. Give me a tight linear game over a colectatton any time!

I can only see that term increasing the number of drive-by shit posts from commenters that didn't bother to read the article. People seem to have an issue with terms like that, as well. They wouldn't take well to having their game referred to as a movie, if past discussions with similar groups is anything to go on.

I really don't think there's much wrong with "walking simulator," especially since it's pretty much been successfully reclaimed to no longer have a purely negative connotation. People just need to read instead of reacting.

 

[Neiteio]

What determines light from a mechanical standpoint? Difficulty alone? What about the element of discovery, or how about fun factor, animation quality, controls, fluidity, how they blend together with other mechanics etc? I do agree that most of these explorative mechanics in UC4 definitely don't require much skill, though some definitely require a little. As mentioned before, I actually died more on the platforming than any of the gunfights, because contrary to belief, you can actually miss time some of the jumps, swings, slides etc, and often you can also misjudge the distance of a particular gap, and other times whether something is or isn't scale-able, especially if you're impatient like me, as often times it takes a little while for the hand reach animation to actually kick in.

"Mechanically light" means light in terms of mechanics. Mechanics being forms of interaction in a videogame. Not animation or fluidity of control or witty banter or whatever.

To be satisfying, mechanics don't have to be hard, and they don't have to involve much in terms of inputs. They just have to be involving in terms of interactions. The best mechanics are simple but layered.

For example, in a Mario game, you jump, and in an Uncharted game, you jump. But in a Mario game, you can jump in a variety of ways, adjusting the height and distance and even retracing your trajectory with a fine degree of air control. This is accomplished with a sustained press vs. a short press, in tandem with directional inputs extending or counteracting your jump distance and height. And the platform layouts test this simple but layered mechanic with increasingly complex layouts. The courses may be linear, but the way you approach/land each jump is not, with abundant room for minute adjustments that make the mechanics "elastic" rather than "rigid."

Now to be clear, I'm not saying Uncharted should try to be a Mario game. Of course not. But I am noting the difference in terms of how layered any one mechanic is. The "platforming" in Uncharted is tantamount to 1) pan camera to spot ledge, 2) walk up to edge, 3) push forward and jump. Everything else is automatic: Nate grabbing onto the ledge, at which point you just push in the next direction and tap X again once he reaches out with his hand (indicating that, yes, you will make the jump).

Failure is nearly impossible when it comes to traversal in these games. You have to either jump too early (which you can handily avoid by making sure you jump from the edge, or that you jump at the apex of a swing). The timing element is minimal. The input is flat. You're more or less "hitting your marks." There's very little give and take beyond that — very little elasticity or meat to the mechanics.

Again, this is referring to the exploration that comprises the bulk of the experience. The combat is much more nuanced and interesting.

Also, just to be clear, I'm loving this game. But primarily as an experience. It's merely serviceable as an actual game.

 

[skelekey]

I don't think the writer of this article understands what "walking simulator" implies. The Uncharted series is not even close. It's not even adventure for the most part until 4. It's feet are planted firmly in the action adventure space.

 

[The Flash]

There's definitely a lot of walking that's for sure.

Personally I enjoyed the slower pace for this particular entry but it definitely isn't anywhere near as action packed as the other games.

Spoiler

Didn't have the "supernatural" elements of the others as well which is a shame. I was hoping that there was going to be a "pirate's curse" or something.

Good game regardless.

 

[freethoughtbubble]

The reaction to this article is why we really need a better term than "Walking Simulator".

Term backfire. For what it's worth, I agree with the article. I'd be more inclined to play the Uncharteds and Assassin's Creeds of the world if they just dropped the pretense and leaned into their true appeal: intricate and immersive worlds and compelling storytelling.

 

[nib95]

"Mechanically light" means light in terms of mechanics. Mechanics being forms of interaction in a videogame. Not animation or fluidity of control or witty banter or whatever.

To be satisfying, mechanics don't have to be hard, and they don't have to involve much in terms of inputs. They just have to be involving in terms of interactions. The best mechanics are simple but layered.

For example, in a Mario game, you jump, and in an Uncharted game, you jump. But in a Mario game, you can jump in a variety of ways, adjusting the height and distance and even retracing your trajectory with a fine degree of air control. This is accomplished with a sustained press vs. a short press, in tandem with directional inputs extending or counteracting your jump distance and height. And the platform layouts test this simple but layered mechanic with increasingly complex layouts.

Now to be clear, I'm not saying Uncharted should try to be a Mario game. Of course not. But I am noting the difference in terms of how layered any one mechanic is. The "platforming" in Uncharted is tantamount to 1) pan camera to spot ledge, 2) walk up to edge, 3) push forward and jump. Everything else is automatic: Nate grabbing onto the ledge, at which point you just push in the next direction and tap X again once he reaches out with his hand (indicating that, yes, you will make the jump).

Failure is nearly impossible when it comes to traversal in these games. You have to either jump too early (which you can handily avoid by making sure you jump from the edge, or that jump at the apex of a swing). The timing element is minimal. The input is flat. You're more or less "hitting your marks." There's very little give and take beyond that, very little elasticity or meat to the mechanics.

Again, this is referring to the exploration that comprises the bulk of the experience. The combat is much more nuanced and interesting.

You're sort of ignoring the other mechnaics within the game. Don't you think the ropeswing, rockpick, mudslides and vehicles add more of what you're referring to? In both the sense that they're a little more mechanically complex, and require a bit more skill, player control, movement, timing etc. Granted, still not nearly to the level of an actual platformer, but that's where I think Uncharted's platforming serves the purpose of being more of an additive gameplay function only, whereas with Mario it is essentially the core component. I think because UC4 mixes different mechanics up more than any of the other games, the exploration is a little less automated or less mundane, but at the same time, maybe in trying to fit them all in, inandvertently less time was given to the actual combat and gunplay.

 

[Curufinwe]

I replayed U2 recently, still perfect. And I like it more than TLOU.

Perfect for you. Not for everyone. TLOU is more of a masterpiece template now than U2.

 

[Deleted member 125677]

Wait, people are getting banned because they disagreed with the article? This isn't real life is it?? My goodness. This isn't a good look, at all.

No one is getting banned for disagreeing with an article, and anyone should feel free to provide counter arguments or refute arguments in the article under discussion. A lot of posters have done so, and we value their contributions.

As always however, we don't value thoughtless drive-by posts, zero content "lol eurogamer", "what a piece of shit click-bait trash turd", "looking for dem clicks" trash. These posts add absolutely nothing of value, and it's quite frankly emberassing to see people going all in "never giving them a click again because I don't like title of an article I wouldn't read if you tortured me with glowing pliers", just because their gut reaction is to take offense to a well written and formulated opinion that differs from their own on a fucking video game they're enjoying.

We are absolutely fed up with this kind of childish behavior from our posters, and this thread, the review thread that went out in flames, and the fake apology thread, have all gotten a fair share of casualties because of it.

That being said, feel free to discuss all content posted on the forum, critize and slaughter it as much as you like, but stay on topic, provide your own arguments, point out weaknesses in the article's arguments, and in general try to act like a grown up.

If anyone else have further questions about moderation in this thread or in general, pm me or another moderator and we will be happy to reply as long as you're not being rude. Let's try to focus on why or why not the article's viewpoints are reasonable for the remainder of this thread, shall we?

 

[Basketball]

I for one am appalled

 

[potatohead]

Prologue to what though? The game or the story? With Uncharted you can't really separate the two. Because the story is the game.

Uh huh. Keep telling yourself that.

 

[Timeaisis]

Uncharted to me was always a TPS with some exploring over anything else. I never played UC1-3 to explore and do puzzles. I played for the set pieces and action.

Here, here. If I want discovery and exploration I play something else that is less linear and on rails. Uncharted for me, has always been about action-adventure (more along the lines of a swashbuckling adventure, less of exploring new worlds adventure). Pulp fiction, if you will. Feels like 4 is going in a different direction (I'm only halfway through, though). Which is kind of weird. I feel it's distinctly lacking those "oh shit, how am I gonna get out of this" moments that really made me love the previous games, while drumming up the exploration, which, while fun, pales in comparison to other games.

 

[joms5]

I'm surprised many disagree.

So far i'm at Chapter 9 in the game (i think) and I find it more boring than exciting. Maybe it hasn't picked up yet but the game just seems messy to me. It's extremely linear (which i know the other games were too) but in this game it seems to stand out more. They give you these open areas to simulate more open ended gameplay but it's all a facade because you're driven right down into the next corridor to continue on the main path.

Again perhaps it gets better but so far I can never see myself playing through this game a second time. It's just slow as all hell. There's no reason in this game to explore like there was in The Last Of Us. TLOU had to scavenging for supplies which made sense to look in every nook and cranny. Also the world of TLOU was interesting to explore because there was a story told but what you saw. In Uncharted 4 it's just scenery and caves.

I hope i'm wrong and things get better, but so far i'm not impressed.

 

[MiamiWesker]

Perfect for you. Not for everyone. TLOU is more of a masterpiece template now than U2.

Right, we can do this forever and never agree. I understand TLOU is now the ND golden child but there is a big distinction between the two franchises. TLOU being horror themed lends itself a hell of a lot more to slow parts being better for pacing than a series that is a pulpy action series. Trying to take the pacing of TLOU and putting it into Uncharted doesn't work that well.

 

[TissueBox]

It's called not being another shooting gallery murder simulator that really makes being a sympathetic everyday hero hard to do -- especially in a story about treasure hunting and scavenging uncharted lands, not mowing down an army of tobacco-spitting expendable men.

It's also, on the other hand, called a very automated game experience. The moment-to-moment thrill and tension don't translate to gameplay quite as well as it could because of the heavy focus on a story built on beats and restraint that only feel like a limitation on the gameplay, rather than cohesively focusing it.

I know some consider the pacing suffers as a result, and others consider it better for it -- I lean towards the former camp, but there's a lot more going on here than it looks on first glance; UC4 is a conglomeration of many unique elements that are tricky to take in. If you're sure about how you feel about it, then you either got what you wanted or got what you expected. If you're confused, then you feel the uncanniness brewing inside; a game that's great and distant in the same time. But I'm still setting up that OT post...

(Also, the talk by Richard Lemarchand that the article linked to is great, you should watch it. The man is hella smart and interesting to listen to just talk about the artistic potential and philosophy of game design -- even if you disagree with the particulars.)

 

[Jakartalado]

If I'm trying to have fun with a video game and there is something that is actively impeding my ability to have fun with said video game despite other fun elements being involved, I am sure as hell am going to continue saying shit about video games.

"Maybe this video game isn't for you" only goes so far as an answer, because the very idea of games evolving requires input from both people who are blind fans and those who aren't.

There could be a good idea for a change that no one in the "blind fan" category would've expected or come up with themselves, because they're so used to liking what they already have that they don't "need" that change, even if it ends up better for everyone.

No game is a literal 10/10. No game has literally perfected the medium. There is no "perfect video game". Because there is always something that could be improved. And sometimes fans of the series aren't the ones who are going to come up with that improvement, because from their perspective, there is nowhere else to go.

I think Uncharted could still be the magnificent cinematic production that it is, but with a hint more actual "gameplay" thrown in the mix. A bit more opportunity for the player to make a direct impact to the world around them, rather than being pushed down a hallway and expected to marvel at the sights around them. I don't think these two things are mutually exclusive, and I don't understand why some people (including in this very thread) are adamant that they couldn't be done in any other way.

I agree with you, but it is useless to keep saying it's shit because someone don't like it, just like my father was doing yesterday. There are the blind fans, but a person like my father is the oposite of that, it's the blind ignorance. He just don't want to see what is happening on screen since I'm always walking. He simply starts to say shit without even see what is going on.

"What a boring thing, someone is talking on TV"

"What a boring thing, he's always walking"

"So boring, he climbs to get nowhere"

It kind pisses me off, since I'm having a great time with the game and he enters and start saying it's boring.

If someone it's playing video games with the same mind of my father, please, save your money and just stop.

I played Doom (2016) right in front of him last week, he hated the game and loved the soundtrack, and he said what a waste to use such a good music in something boring, you just run and kill monsters.

 

[Neiteio]

You're sort of ignoring the other mechnaics within the game. Don't you think the ropeswing, rockpick, mudslides and vehicles add more of what you're referring to? In both the sense that they're a little more mechanically complex, and require a bit more skill, player control, movement, timing etc. Granted, still not nearly to the level of an actual platformer, but that's where I think Uncharted's platforming serves the purpose of being more of an additive gameplay function only, whereas with Mario it is essentially the core component. I think because UC4 mixes different mechanics up more than any of the other games, the exploration is a little less automated or less mundane, but at the same time, maybe in trying to fit them all in, inandvertently less time was given to the actual combat and gunplay.

To be clear, I'm enjoying the game. I'm just saying it's mechanically light, because each mechanic (in terms of traversal) is more or less tapping X at the right time.

Stand at the edge of a platform, and tap X to automatically make jump. Reach out to outcropping, and tap X to make the jump. Stand over ledge, and tap Circle to drop to ledge. Slide to end of slope, and tap X to make the jump. Swing on rope, and when rope is near the edge, tap X to make the jump. Etc.

There's no modifying said jump — no deciding where it goes or how it sticks the landing; no increasing or decreasing its distance or height or angle or speed; no air control over trajectory, etc. It's just... wait until you reach the edge, then tap X. A minimal timing element, and a flat input, and a strictly linear path, including where you land and how.

But again, that's OK. It doesn't make for much of a game, but the way I see it, it's in service of an experience akin to a Disneyland ride, and that's perfectly valid in its own right.

I'm still thoroughly enjoying my time with UC4, all things considered.

 

[EviLore]

Some of the mod team mentioned they'd be making a statement, but I'll also step in directly here regarding why so many people have been banned in this thread, since the mod team acts based on the core philosophies of the site, which I can help provide some perspective on.

The intent when providing someone with a NeoGAF account is for the person to contribute positively to discourse here. Almost all traffic to the site is based upon reading the news and discussions, not participation in them. When you, as one of the carefully curated participants that comprise less than 1% of NeoGAF's total traffic, can't be assed to read the thing you're reacting to with your one-line drive-by disdain based on, in many cases, a single phrase you noted in the thread title, you're not contributing positively to the discourse here in any way.

Our members post new threads about items of interest in the video game sector, and the moderators keep tabs on these and lock any threads that don't meet our criteria for relevance or quality. If a thread is open for discussion -- and in this case a pretty even-handed editorial piece from a major video game publication is being discussed -- as a participant in the thread you are more than welcome to discuss the editorial, agree with it, disagree with it, provide counter-points, etc. All of that adds value to the discussion and hopefully contributes to a quality atmosphere overall. What makes NeoGAF worse, by contrast? Visceral reactions to a phrase like "walking simulator" attached to a game you really like, by making drive-by comments about "clickbait" and how no one should provide the publication with any clicks in order to spite them and/or hopefully result in their eventual insolvency or whatever bullshit you've devised in your head to that effect.

If you have nothing to say, don't say it. If you think an article like this is not worthy of discussion, well, you're being counter-productive by replying to the thread about it, not even considering how you're explicitly breaking the rules by drive-by shitposting, since you're bumping the thing to the top of the NeoGAF thread list by making that comment, drawing more attention to it by the thousands of views each time.

No one is being banned for disagreeing with the conclusions of the editorial. The moderation team actively handling this thread is not emotionally invested in Uncharted or its perception one way or another. Anyone who might happen to be really into Uncharted 4 right now, or despise the series for whatever reason instead, would default to just staying away from the thread, or otherwise at absolute bare minimum regardless of any biases they might have consciously or subconsciously they would still vet their preliminary decisions with the entire mod team online at that moment to make sure they're not being undermined by their personal opinions when deciding how to evaluate what's taking place in here.

Understand how NeoGAF operates. Everyone on the staff takes the site's neutrality very seriously, since we intentionally integrate all platforms and games and their rabid fans in one open forum, rather than creating easy, pointless, insular comfort bubbles for everything by default.

You're not being oppressed. Uncharted is not being oppressed (the editorial isn't even anti-Uncharted, as many have pointed out). Carry on.