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[Relaxed Muscle]

The reaching thing is the way the game magnetizes you to a ledge. Again, even the split second where he starts to reach=no risk of failure. Here's another example of it. Most of the time the animation is good at hiding it, other times it's quite obvious what i'm talking about.

Jumping off early=any time his hand is not out, as in, when's he's not even remotely close.

Let face it, UC plataforming has been always a joke.

After several sections of climbings and jumps you can't fail, my mind always goes to the:"I wish someone would make a old Tomb Raider game with these graphics".

 

[Magic Mushroom]

I'm kind of surprised people haven't described the differences between TLOU gameplay and UC gameplay in more detail, because they have little in common. The following comparison is between the two games on hard difficulty.

Uncharted has regenrating health, TLOU does not. In Uncharted ammo is very rarely an issue, in TLOU you have to manage your ammo carefully and search areas and optional paths to find more. In Uncharted you generally get to use two weapons that enemies drop in any given area. In TLOU you keep any weapons you find and can use them all at any time. Uncharted does not have weapon upgrades, TLOU does. Uncharted does not have ability upgrades, TLOU does and you have to explore areas to get these upgrades.

TLOU has item crafting, Unchrated does not. TLOU enemy AI is better and more realistic than UC AI. The gunplay of TLOU is far more weighted an enemies go down and stagger in far less hits. The melee of TLOU is more important, and you have access to many different tools such as smoke bombs, mines and molotovs for which you get the resources by exploring and looting. Then there is the entire infected thing, they behave more predictably than humans but have abilities humans don't.

I could go on, but in summary gameplay wise Uncharted and TLOU have almost nothing in common expect that they loosely share the same genre, a 3rd person shooter.

Also, Uncharted is way more mobiliy based. Nate is a more nimble character than Joel, in combat you're moving at a much faster pace, making the most of the more vertical level design and using abilities like climbing, jumping, rolling, swinging, sliding, etc.

Gun blazing is also not fun at all plus some parts of the game are clearly balanced for stealth.

Guns blazing is awesome. One of the best things about this game - and why I consider it one of the best TPS - is that you can run, gun, slide, swing, roll, climb, jump, punch, sneak and switch effortlessly between all of these on the fly, Thanks to that and the open and vertical level design, each combat area is a mini sandbox, It's fantastic.

 

[GOOCHY]

I could go on, but in summary gameplay wise Uncharted and TLOU have almost nothing in common expect that they loosely share the same genre, a 3rd person shooter.

I think people make the comparison because there are a lot of "Here, help me lift this..." types of scenes where the two characters lift a door. The box "puzzles" also bear a resemblance to the crate/pallet puzzles that pop up repeatedly in TLOU. It's surface level, but they are similarities.

 

[Rudiano]

Wow all those bans on page 1 :-o

 

[Relaxed Muscle]

The structure of the game is very similar in TLOU and UC4: puzzles, battle areas, pacing, etc...

Hell, there's one chapter in UC4 that is almost like it was part of "Left Behind".

That's not to say there are not differences, but both games follow a very close pattern in how they were designed.

 

[boredandlazy]

The gunplay/combat is the weakest part of the series, almost seems like an after thought. You don't have to share that opinion though, I'm sure a lot of people haven't played games like Gears of war 3 and Vanquish, which both have a bigger focus on the combat.

Uncharted 4's gunplay is definitely not an afterthought. And that holds true regardless of whether you've played Gears or not.

 

[Magic Mushroom]

Uncharted 4's gunplay is definitely not an afterthought. And that holds true regardless of whether you've played Gears or not.

Yeah, I have played Gears (which is okay but very one-note) and Vanquish (which I love) but UC4 holds it own against these and is better in many ways. The level design is way more open and vertical for example and Drake has far more tools at his disposal than Marcus and Sam, which leads to very dynamic combat scenarios that are all mini sandboxes. Like I said earlier, for me it's Resi 4's village spread out over an entire game instead one of awesome combat bowl at the start that never really returns.

Of course UC adds other things on top, like better storytelling and acting, more gamepplay variety etc.

 

[nib95]

The gunplay/combat is the weakest part of the series, almost seems like an after thought. You don't have to share that opinion though, I'm sure a lot of people haven't played games like Gears of war 3 and Vanquish, which both have a bigger focus on the combat.

I can't speak for Vanquish as I've yet to play it in any lengthy capacity, but Uncharted 4 has far more competent combat and arena design compared to Gears 3. In terms of dynamism and diversity of approach and tactics, degree of mechanical complexity, number of pathways, amount of player freedom, quality of animations, hit reactions, AI etc.

 

[Zojirushi]

Um, no. Stupid article.

You see that first page and still post something like this?

 

[Emerson's Essentia]

Man, I gotta be honest: I don't know if I'll complete this game. Never thought I'd say or consider that at the outset.

I just don't like it. Even past Uncharted games, I liked, despite not being much of a fan of what they generally project as a franchise.

This game, far from being "bad", commits the unmitigated, oppressive sin of being plain boring. This game is studiously holding my interest to the fire like a Dhalsim flame carpet.

It's not like the 'TLoU approach' couldn't have worked for Uncharted at all, but it's not executed well enough here. These environments are not stimulating enough, and the dialogue/plot not multi-faceted enough.

And to be even more forthcoming - I don't think the combat is much better than previous games either. I think people are largely playing lip service to Naughty Dog's PR. Yeah, it's diversified via stealth, but the AI is so idiotic it doesn't matter much. I'm playing on Hard, and a Guard has to wait a full 1.5 seconds before coming to the stark realization that, yes, that is a fully grown man with an assault rifle charging you in an open field with the intentions of snapping your neck.

Aiming still feels off (though I don't usually complain about it too much for personal reasons I won't get into, here) and the bullet sponge enemies still aren't fun to fight.

Encounters aren't dynamic in any interesting way. All the talk about the physics engine don't really come into play. That's cool that fruit and chairs bounce around in an exaggerated fashion when I'm churning through a crowded street market (one of the few narrative setpieces I truly felt added to the atmosphere of the game), but Halo CE showed me the beauty of physics intwined with dynamic gameplay 15 years ago.

I really thought the grappling mechanic would have been used for more than traversal. I don't even get why Nate's abilities are so binary in the first place. Why can't I swing off an arbitrary tree branch in the environment and to take down a guard? Why can't I use my rope to lasso and pull someone in from a hiding position, or knock someone out, or swing from an errant tree branch > shenanigans?

The puzzles are so elementary that they fail to wake me from my coma. And that's actually a good thing, because my brain gets so lazy that anytime I actually encounter a puzzle that I get a sense of frustration - I don't see them as challenges I see them as stubborn tangents stopping from getting though a slog. Were they actually challenges I'd have likely dropped the game already.

I'm only on chapter 14/15 but I think I hate this game.

 

[daniels]

Kinda embarrassing that a well known and is some places even respected rag doesn't know what a walking simulator is.
Uncharted has exploration, climbing, light puzzles, shooting, jump and running, vehicle sections, underwater sections, melee combat, stealth and other stuff. Seriously EG?

 

[Dash Kappei]

Wow the first page is a graveyard, what happened?

 

[GeordieMark]

Wow the first page is a graveyard, what happened?

People rushing to comment without reading the article.

 

[Caayn]

Wow the first page is a graveyard, what happened?

Tons of people not reading the article or the OP. They read the title and go bananas. That's why.

 

[Audioboxer]

Wow the first page is a graveyard, what happened?

Calling EG clickbait probably. It's not, just an opinion with some substance even although I disagree with many remarks (interactivity and fail state comments).

 

[Straight Edge]

The story and production values are top notch. However the auto climbing sections are very boring imo. My GF calls UC4 "the game where you are always climbing".

 

[Audioboxer]

The story and production values are top notch. However the auto climbing sections are very boring imo. My GF calls UC4 "the game where you are always climbing".

They can be but I'm not sure what else the directors can do. Can't exactly put stairs and flat landscapes to all these supposedly well hidden "secret treasures". Sure they could make climbing harder and more fatal but then you'd piss off people with constant deaths.

Something like TLoU can have a lot more flat traversal. Maybe they could have tweaked the balance more but UC has always been about getting into the places no others treasure seekers have.

We wouldn't have all these beautiful mountain vistas and incredible views without climbing.

 

[nib95]

People rushing to comment without reading the article.

To be fair, the articles title is very sensationalist and doesn't even correlate with the actual content within. As I said earlier, the journalism equivalent of a 'gotcha' moment so to speak, which is poor form and inadvertently diminishes the credibility of the article. Granted those people should have read the article, but it doesn't change the fact that it's a horrible title.

 

[mrklaw]

Kinda embarrassing that a well known and is some places even respected rag doesn't know what a walking simulator is.
Uncharted has exploration, climbing, light puzzles, shooting, jump and running, vehicle sections, underwater sections, melee combat, stealth and other stuff. Seriously EG?

I'd argue the exploration and puzzles - even the climbing - could fit within the broad definition of a walking simulator.

But you're right, the combat immediately makes it not one. But the proportion of combat does seem noticably lower than UC1-3 so there is some argument that it is 'more' walking simulator than action game. Personally I don't think it is either - its an adventure/action adventure game and always has been.

 

[Widge]

Plus us - gamers - generally respond to criticism of gaming poorly. A statement of Walking Simulator is seen as a criticism, often bandied around with "not a game" claims. So lump that onto Uncharted and you get a bit of a NerdBomb situation.

 

[Widge]

Kinda embarrassing that a well known and is some places even respected rag doesn't know what a walking simulator is.
Uncharted has exploration, climbing, light puzzles, shooting, jump and running, vehicle sections, underwater sections, melee combat, stealth and other stuff. Seriously EG?

It's not saying "this game is 100% wall to wall walking simulator", it is exploring the passive motions it goes through that can be compared to said walking sims.

We all know what Uncharted as a series contains action wise, the piece calls for you to recognise that and then look at what exists aside from that, the techniques used for storytelling and counterbalancing third person shooty action.

 

[Theorymon]

The structure of the game is very similar in TLOU and UC4: puzzles, battle areas, pacing, etc...

Hell, there's one chapter in UC4 that is almost like it was part of "Left Behind".

That's not to say there are not differences, but both games follow a very close pattern in how they were designed.

I noticed that too, but I feel like this didn't quite fit Uncharted as well as The Last of Us.

In The Last of Us, I felt like its setting made great use of the "down time". Besides scavenging for materials, I felt like I was exploring a world I wanted to know more about, a place that could tell multiple stories about this post apocalyptic world.

With Uncharted 4, I didn't really feel much pushing me to explore. If I took an alternate path, I'd usually just find some useless trinket that got me a few points to unlock cheats (a lot of which aren't very interesting either). Occasionally you'd find these letters on stuff like skeletons or on tables: Now I thought THIS was cool! I feel like the game should have used a lot more of those, and a lot less of the boring treasures.

I feel like the only place that justified the downtime was (LATE GAME SPOILERS)

Spoiler

Libertalia. I feel it was at this point that the whole pirate mystery became a lot more interesting and less of a wild goose chase. I actually wanted to explore these segments because I was really curious about what happened! Even then though, a lot of the big discoveries were scripted, I think it would have been interesting if Libertalia was fleshed out a bit more via exploring and finding bits and pieces of the narrative to supplement the big reveals.

Don't get me wrong: I found Uncharted 4 to be quite enjoyable. However, the pacing really harms the game's repalyability for me compared to something like The Last of Us, Since the downtime is mostly braindead platforming, boring puzzles, or "find some useless trinket on the way".

 

[Violet_0]

I like to swim in a sea of grey names

the so-called "walking simulator" has become one of my favorite genres in recent years, and really, it's just a subtype of the adventure genre that focuses on character interaction or exploration instead of puzzles. I still don't understand why the term is preceived so negatively by a lot of people

 

[Straight Edge]

They can be but I'm not sure what else the directors can do. Can't exactly put stairs and flat landscapes to all these supposedly well hidden "secret treasures". Sure they could make climbing harder and more fatal but then you'd piss off people with constant deaths.

Something like TLoU can have a lot more flat traversal. Maybe they could have tweaked the balance more but UC has always been about getting into the places no others treasure seekers have.

We wouldn't have all these beautiful mountain vistas and incredible views without climbing.

For one they could make the climbing not automatic then I wouldn't be bored during these sections.

 

[astroturfing]

Let face it, UC plataforming has been always a joke.

After several sections of climbings and jumps you can't fail, my mind always goes to the:"I wish someone would make a old Tomb Raider game with these graphics".

is it still a joke? i thought they reworked it :/

what about the puzzles..? any challenge there?

don't like the combat in these games so if the platforming and puzzles still suck i dont know why exactly i should play the game.

 

[Audioboxer]

For one they could make the climbing not automatic then I wouldn't be bored during these sections.

With the amount of climbing you do though full manual would lead to so many deaths. Just in the same way as it would in AC. They've improved it a little allowing the analogue stick to be used to direct Nate's hands and not require the jump button. Somewhat simulating hand movement/natural directional movement.

Most people want to feel like a bad ass and progress, not die 100 times to a realistic rock climbing simulator. I get what you are saying about it being boring, but the alternative would tank even more.

 

[Mihael Mello Keehl]

Life Is Strange is an adventure game. Walking simulator would be something more limited where you're mostly walking and looking at objects with no failure state nor many more gameplay verbs (choices, puzzles).

Heh.. what game is a walking simulator then? I never played one. And dont say uncharted for the jokes lol.

 

[Audioboxer]

Heh.. what game is a walking simulator then? I never played one. And dont say uncharted for the jokes lol.

Journey I guess? It's a term coined which primarily describes adventure games, all with varying degrees of exploration and interaction.

Nothing wrong with the term itself but it's often used unscrupulously to dismiss a game as being a game which riles some up. Strange after how the indie scene starting to come to consoles on the PS3/360 had most praising diversity in games, and now some of said people go off on tangents if something isn't a 1990s FPS.

 

[Jeffrey]

3/4 the way in, not really seeing whats wrong with the article, especially for 4, which is fairly low key on the bombastic.

Really do wish there was more to do in the exploration though. The collectibles could use some flavor text like in the recent Tomb Raider games.

 

[ElyrionX]

This is what I have been saying since UC1 and UC2. Playing these games is like watching a mediocre action movie. It's made worse by the fact that the combat mechanics are shallow and unsatisfying. I have never understood why the UC games command such high praise.

 

[ElyrionX]

With the amount of climbing you do though full manual would lead to so many deaths. Just in the same way as it would in AC. They've improved it a little allowing the analogue stick to be used to direct Nate's hands and not require the jump button. Somewhat simulating hand movement/natural directional movement.

Most people want to feel like a bad ass and progress, not die 100 times to a realistic rock climbing simulator. I get what you are saying about it being boring, but the alternative would tank even more.

AC implements its climbing engine a lot better than UC. It's not nearly as automatic and sloppy as UC and it is far more consistent in terms of defining what you can climb and presenting that in a visually-logical manner to the player.

In AC, if you see something you think you can climb, 95% of the time you will be able to. In UC, it's all extremely arbitrary. Nate can't climb things like short vines and wire fences so sometimes you just go button mashing around the envirinment to figure out where the devs want you to go next. That is just awful game design.

 

[Ratrat]

is it still a joke? i thought they reworked it :/

what about the puzzles..? any challenge there?

don't like the combat in these games so if the platforming and puzzles still suck i dont know why exactly i should play the game.

I feel like the puzzles are slightly better, which is not saying much. It still takes time slowly moving incredibly elaborate machines to solve puzzles that take two seconds of thought. There is more to the platforming this round because they added gimmicks like the rope, lubricated slides and a pick.

 

[Audioboxer]

AC implements its climbing engine a lot better than UC. It's not nearly as automatic and sloppy as UC and it is far more consistent in terms of defining what you can climb and presenting that in a visually-logical manner to the player.

In AC, if you see something you think you can climb, 95% of the time you will be able to. In UC, it's all extremely arbitrary. Nate can't climb things like short vines and wire fences so sometimes you just go button mashing around the envirinment to figure out where the devs want you to go next. That is just awful game design.

Well to be fair UC isn't an open world game/open sandbox. If ND had to prepare for that they'd probably have to change their linear narrative/spend more time on maps. As you know open world and gamer = dicking around and trying to go everywhere and wanting to do quests at their own pace/own order.

They built in some more open elements in UC4 but it's as the other titles are, a linear story driven game. Not really a make your own avatar decisions game. You're following a strictly told story.

Not saying they couldn't learn some stuff from AC, but they spent their time and resources elsewhere rather than focusing heavily on climbing (motion capture/graphics/voice acting/plot/etc). AC has all of that, but not on the same level as UC4. By level I don't mean an opinion on what is best, but on what probably took more resources/time.

 

[Relaxed Muscle]

is it still a joke? i thought they reworked it :/

what about the puzzles..? any challenge there?

don't like the combat in these games so if the platforming and puzzles still suck i dont know why exactly i should play the game.

Is slightly less of a joke, but still a joke. The additions make for a paltry superficial upgrade over we had before.

Puzzles saw more of an improvement but not enough to make them really interesting or actually fun. They are more or less a distraction to mix things up, which is basically their function on past games.

 

[Audioboxer]

Is slightly less of a joke, but still a joke. The additions make for a paltry superficial upgrade over we had before.

Puzzles saw more of an improvement but not enough to make them really interesting or actually fun. They are more or less a distraction to mix things up, which is basically their function on past games.

Yeah I found the puzzles incredibly easy. I liked the thought behind a few but they certainly weren't challenging at all.

 

[mrklaw]

With the amount of climbing you do though full manual would lead to so many deaths. Just in the same way as it would in AC. They've improved it a little allowing the analogue stick to be used to direct Nate's hands and not require the jump button. Somewhat simulating hand movement/natural directional movement.

Most people want to feel like a bad ass and progress, not die 100 times to a realistic rock climbing simulator. I get what you are saying about it being boring, but the alternative would tank even more.

yeah I enjoyed trying to do as many climbs as possible without Nate's grunt-jump while climbing, using the analogue sticks to try and find him handholds. Was a nice step up from previous games. Still pretty much a no-lose mechanic other than occasional jumps

 

[Magic Mushroom]

This is what I have been saying since UC1 and UC2. Playing these games is like watching a mediocre action movie. It's made worse by the fact that the combat mechanics are shallow and unsatisfying. I have never understood why the UC games command such high praise.

Have you even played the game?

The combat is excellent.

 

[Relaxed Muscle]

Have you even played the game?

The combat is excellent.

For me is serviciable at best.

Which is not to say is bad, or it wasn't improved in UC4.

 

[gamerMan]

First off, there is a lot to love about Uncharted 4. Just because you love something doesn't mean that you can't criticize it. This is easily the best playing Uncharted game. The combat has never been better so much so that I wanted more of it. Yet, this is Naughty Dog's worst game in recent memory and easily the worst Uncharted game. There is too much Last of Us in this game without the parts that made Last Of Us wonderful.

Over 50% of this game is spent during downtime where you are just walking through the game's gorgeous environment. Downtime is not a bad thing provided that you are actually doing something related to the gameplay. In Uncharted 4, it's a very passive experience so much so that this is the "new cutscene." Instead of putting down the controller and watching the story unfold, you are walking through the story. It ends up being a very passive cinematic experience with very little player involvement.

Unlike Last Of Us, none of these portions are designed around the gameplay. Like others were saying, in Last Of Us, these segments worked because you had to explore the environments looking for resources. In Uncharted 4, the only reason they exist is for the story so much so that I wish there was an option that said "skip walking scene."

 

[Trigonometrize.]

Unlike Last Of Us, none of these portions are designed around the gameplay. Like others were saying, in Last Of Us, these segments worked because you had to explore the environments looking for resources. In Uncharted 4, the only reason they exist is for the story so much so that I wish there was an option that said "skip walking scene."

Personally, I'd rather explore stunning and exotic environments with nothing in them then explore the relatively boring environments because I feel like I have to to upgrade by guns because otherwise I'll fall behind. Chapter 12 in U4 was more fun for me then rummaging through the same looking desks in drawers in TLOU, even if I was only finding a treasure or two.

In the Last of Us, let's say at various points in the game exploration led to just parts, but also sometimes led to encounters with hunters or infected that you'do have to waste ammo on. It would not only make the world feel much more dangerous, but also give exploration the feel of a double edged sword where you might luck out and get a healthy share of parts but you might also end up finding yourself trapped and only efficient use of your stealth and guns will reward you. As it stands, exploration is something the just feels like a chore because it's both unexciting and tied to your overall progression in the game.

 

[Kaako]

It is definitely more of a wanking simulator than a walking simulator. Cause them graphics are straight up sex and every environment oozes with them little detail sex juices.

 

[Mr. Giggles]

With the amount of climbing you do though full manual would lead to so many deaths. Just in the same way as it would in AC. They've improved it a little allowing the analogue stick to be used to direct Nate's hands and not require the jump button. Somewhat simulating hand movement/natural directional movement.

Most people want to feel like a bad ass and progress, not die 100 times to a realistic rock climbing simulator. I get what you are saying about it being boring, but the alternative would tank even more.

.

 

[jhmtehgamr20xx]

I mean, this was pretty clear from the very first game. I don't know why you would expect anything else from the series at this point.

2007 was kind of a watershed year for me with regards to both Uncharted 1 and Modern Warfare popularizing a direction for video games which I have absolutely zero interest in. Both of these games came to to represent archetypes in how much they revel in watering down or removing agency from the player, and it was particularly alienating for me to see just how much the gaming audience celebrated this shift.

I can agree with this opinion to a degree, but tbh that shift was happening at a slower, more gradual shift since the late PS1 years tbh. RE2, MGS, FFVII...these were the games that really helped usher in the "cinematic" gaming idea and accelerated the shift of home consoles from more arcade-style games as their main focus.

Of course, there were both intentional and technical factors at play which resulted in them being the games they became, but the same complaint you have about Uncharted and MW, there were people back then saying the same about MGS and FFVII or the such.

That being said, the likes of RE2, MGS etc. involve a lot more direct player feedback and agency (and offer more openness in application of their mechanics) than something like Uncharted or MW's single player campaigns. The reasons for that tho are far and wide and too much to go into depth on in this thread.

 

[mckmas8808]

I don't get why this article is making people angry.

Ofc Uncharted (and TLOU) have elements that are walking simulator esque; this is by no means a negative. It is one of the only big AAA franchises that can pull it off. In fact, the article was very positive about this fact.

What does "walking simulator" even mean? And are Mario walking simulators?

 

[zoukka]

What does "walking simulator" even mean? And are Mario walking simulators?

I think it refers to a game that has no reactionary gameplay elements and has a heavy emphasis in story exposition. If you would eliminate shooting from UC4 it would be pretty accurate to call it a walking simulator. Obviously the shooting sections make the game something else.