That would require Nvidia working on an SoC that nobody knows about. I'd think that Nvidia would report that they're working on custom chips too. That said, a 16nmFF Nvidia SoC would explain the fabrication not being co-located. Does anyone want to chime in the odds that Nvidia could build an SoC using a desktop-class chip? It seems extremely unlikely to me. I also doubt that devs were reciting FLOP numbers to Emily.
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NX will launch in March 2017 globally, won't be at E3 (focusing on Zelda instead)
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That would require Nvidia working on an SoC that nobody knows about. I'd think that Nvidia would report that they're working on custom chips too. That said, a 16nmFF Nvidia SoC would explain the fabrication not being co-located. Does anyone want to chime in the odds that Nvidia could build an SoC using a desktop-class chip? It seems extremely unlikely to me. I also doubt that devs were reciting FLOP numbers to Emily.
Yes... which is what Storm's "jaw dropping" info was on.
And the source is actually potentially believable.
Eolz
Member
I'm a lot closer to 300-350 for console and 200-250 personally, despite the problems it might have (leaning towards the lower part of those).
James Scott
Banned
So is TEGRA on the next handheld good? Would that mean the console will use that too?
For a shared library to work well you don't need a ton of power for the console so a ~X1 seems fine for Nintendo.
Rumors spreading so early that it's so weak will probably do more harm than good with no price to counteract that. A $250 system with those specs would likely be well enough received like the Wii was, but without a price point given people will probably lose their minds
For a shared library to work well you don't need a ton of power for the console so a ~X1 seems fine for Nintendo.
Rumors spreading so early that it's so weak will probably do more harm than good with no price to counteract that. A $250 system with those specs would likely be well enough received like the Wii was, but without a price point given people will probably lose their minds
My guess is under the assumption that there wont be any expensive controllers jacking up the price.
Yes. No.
Not ~X1, read what was written again.
We have no information on how weak or strong it is, again, read what was actually written.
Eolz
Member
Ah, good point. Might be some unusual price (like not 250 or 300, but 280) instead?
Yeah, should be fine. For example, the Tegra X1 in Nvidia's reference platform consumed less power than Apple's A8X of 2014:
Why is that important? Well, Apple's GPUs (semi-custom PowerVR GPUs) don't throttle at all in operation, same with their CPU cores.
What I don't get is why the Shield console has to be actively cooled despite a supposedly lower power consumption? Would a Tegra part for the NX handheld be semi-custom? Just realised we haven't heard anything about a Pascal-based Tegra chip fabricated on 14nm yet...
Anyway, this is actually pretty exciting if true. Usually I'm not excited about Nvidia's SoCs because developers can't utilise their full potential with Android and OpenGL. But with (rumoured) Vulkan or a Nintendo graphics API and Nintendo OS we could be seeing something special.
That image is measuring power consumption purely of the GPU, when down clocked to match the A8X's performance (so likely down to around 500MHz or so). The base clock is 1GHz and there's also a CPU and more on there, so actual power consumption is a lot higher. Still, it shows that when clocked down it can be surprisingly efficient, which would be good news for an NX handheld based on it.
Yes and no. Nvidia's PC graphics cards do outperform AMD's "per Tflop", but some of this is going to be down to drivers, so it's hard to ascertain how much of an advantage they'd have when bypassing the drivers and optimising for each architecture.
Schnozberry
Member
Nvidia licenses out GPU tech similar to ARM and their CPU's. Nintendo could be licensing it, along with Nvidia's ARM cores, and building their own configuration similar to what Apple does with their A-series processors. 16nm FinFET would allow them to put a lot more pascal GPU cores on a die inside a Tegra design than Maxwell did with the Tegra X1 for a desktop class chip.
That's not to say it would have the same raw power as the other consoles on the market, just that it would likely be a very strong performer with Vulkan.
That's for the handheld..... Oh.
Tegra X1 in both. $200 console. Better cooling than Shield console. Still weaker than Xbone, but not the end of the world. Maybe even the Tegra X1's successor. Yeah, this would explain a lot. Still have no idea who could have AMD's ARM contract though.
Boy Wander
Member
This is what I was thinking. Why would Emily say "there is a good reason why talk of Polaris or Polaris like architecture is wacky"? Maybe it's wacky because they're not using AMD?
My opinion is that it can be a reverse Wii U in terms of reactions. If this is true, it will seem underpowered for a lot of people, but it will turn into a good surprise in terms of value for money in the end.
We can talk to her, no need for big interpretations.
James Scott
Banned
Yeah, but even if it's more powerful people will remain with that mindset for awhile. Just a guess, though.
?
Do you mean backwards compatibility? The handheld would benefit from having the console out so Nintendo can release a lot of game alongside it. Get a port of the latest pokemon (which looks pretty good) if there is no BC, but if they can get BC without many drawbacks to the hardware then yeah, it would be a plus
Hm... In that case we'd be looking at something along the lines of a 750 Ti.
No, she's saying it's wacky due to performance.
Mihael Mello Keehl
Banned
What's going on? Somebody lying in here with fake stuff? 👀
Vulkan isn't a rumor. That's maybe the only thing we know about NX specs atm.
They are registered contributors (or something like that), they are working on it.
If its no longer on AMDs GCN then the "raw power" comparison, ie what I can write down on a piece of paper to explain performance, goes out of the window.
Doubly so with a change in CPU architecture.
Throw in Vulkan and this whole discussion on "power" is fucked until we get an actual teardown on the hardware.
Not today? But when?
Nintendo cannot charge $300 for a handheld. Hell, I think $200 is too expensive.
I'm still in the dark about what it'd mean for their cross-compatible games and whatnot that Iwata talked about.
An Nvidia partnership does seem like a good move on Nintendo's part, at least. A lot of devs work with Nvidia.
I'm still in the dark about what it'd mean for their cross-compatible games and whatnot that Iwata talked about.
An Nvidia partnership does seem like a good move on Nintendo's part, at least. A lot of devs work with Nvidia.
Mihael Mello Keehl
Banned
So now the NX went from being the PS4K to the Kindle Fire HDX
what is life
what is life
Crazy idea: Sony portable aimed at streaming?
FTFY, especially given how the launch of the OG 3DS panned out.
A Tegra handheld can make it under $200 easily.
I dunno. I wasn't expecting it at all really.
Eolz
Member
They easily can ask 200$ with no competition on the dedicated handheld market, and it allows some quick pricecut margin if it's not selling as expected at first.
People mentioned $300, that's why I said it.
They're at $200 now with no competition and it's not working all that well.
Dark Cloud
Member
So to conclude we don't know the power of the NX going by what Emily said until it's teared down, but the NX handheld could be more powerful than we thought?
Eolz
Member
It didn't though, since nobody ever realistically compared it to the PS4K, and since we're talking about the handheld for Tegra.
NX console is still somewhere around PS4.
@Dark Cloud: yes.
edit:
It's working well for a saturated market competing with smartphones. Japan is a good example of that.
James Scott
Banned
$200 is fine for a new portable. The sweet spot between the original 3DS price and its first price drop.
You would get a totally different value for the same $200.
Theanine3D
Member
These prices seem the most reasonable to me and are what I hope for.
I can also see them pricing the home console at $300 by itself, or with a discount that drops it to $250 if you buy both the handheld and the console together.
I expect Nintendo to incentivize owning both SKUs in a big way.
$199 Handheld
540p top screen, small bottom low res Touchscreen
Slightly weaker than Wii U
$250 Console
controller with small low res Touchscreen
Slightly more powerful than Wii U
Full 3DS Backwards Compatible
Cross Buy Cartridges work on both Handheld and Console
Zelda graphics comparison
NX Console (High) - Wii U (Med) - NX Handheld (Low)
And if Zelda were to come out on PS4 it would be Ultra
540p top screen, small bottom low res Touchscreen
Slightly weaker than Wii U
$250 Console
controller with small low res Touchscreen
Slightly more powerful than Wii U
Full 3DS Backwards Compatible
Cross Buy Cartridges work on both Handheld and Console
Zelda graphics comparison
NX Console (High) - Wii U (Med) - NX Handheld (Low)
And if Zelda were to come out on PS4 it would be Ultra
Schnozberry
Member
Übermatik;203555442 said:
Maybe a 1050ish.
Plinko
Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
1) Emily's post goes right in line with the rumor last year that Nintendo is going for a cheap home console with a shared handheld library. A $249 console could be a great impulse buy. I honestly think they're going back to an advanced Wiimote, which I would love.
2) Tegra for the handheld is fantastic news.
2) Tegra for the handheld is fantastic news.
Eolz
Member
Yeah, more worried about the screen quality than the rest (possibly the speakers too?).
Nintendo isn't dumb for memory cards tbh.
Wonder what will happen for BC, and really hoping that dual screen is still there (even if it's one long screen instead).
It is, but n3DS was just there to try to hold 3DS sales until the replacement was coming, like other handhelds revisions before it.
edit:
Übermatik;203555442 said:
1080 sequel on NX confirmed.
James Scott
Banned
I see so we still know nothing, lol
That is really the best takeaway. NX handheld if it is tegra based is likely going to be pretty decent. Console until we know whats actually in it we cant really say much
It wouldn't be able to run. Wrong architecture. ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
We seemingly know the architecture of the CPU, and the provider of at least the handheld SoC.
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