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Kojima: Overly sexualized women in DS will be given a deep background story"
- Thread starter Lime
- Start date
OverBlood 3
Banned
My man Kojima likes boobs and so do I. Don't like? Don't buy ¯_(ツ_/¯
What a pathetic post.
pretty much.
kojima undermines his character's backstories with their sexualisation. Its actively making his games worse.
Audioboxer
Member
He used to be "honest" enough about it. MGS has been littered with sexual innuendo since the first game. Quiet was just the turning point of trying to say it's something it is not, on top of her being the most blatant fan service in MGS so far.
His games have never been PG friendly, but just either stay quiet, no pun intended, or answer journalists honestly if they prompt you. That way you only anger the sex/nudity purity bunch, and have the rest just call Quiet a shit character, as she was shit by MGS standards. MGS5 is just a terrible MGS game, saved by its brilliant gameplay.
However, I will say as someone who doesn't get offended by sex or nudity in the slightest, even by MGS standards Quiet did have me rolling my eyes a bit. Not raging on Twitter @Kojima, but just wanting to expect better from a MGS game that has had some good female cast previously.
The statistics on rape, sexual harassment etc are unbelievably one sided against one gender, so I'm okay if this discussion remaining one sided too, since this point of attack always seems to derail the discussion overall.
flipswitch
Member
Isn't this a Japanese thing? I mean, you don't see it much in western games.
Pinko Marx
Banned
That arrow is photoshpped by the by.
My man Kojima likes boobs and so do I. Don't like? Don't buy ¯_(ツ
User123456
Member
Death Straddling
I forgot about this.
Bustanen
Member
Wat. Who said anything about torture? Did they torture Quiet in MGSV? I don't remember.
Baleoce
Member
This is honestly what's bugging me. And by sexualization, I mean his own implementation of it.
LordOcidax
Member
Kojima is Master Roshi of video games.
Wow... that sounds even worse than just admitting you like barely clothed hot ladies in your games. "They'll be hot and have huge tits, BUT it's ok, they have a backstory!".
Urgh, I'm really excited for Death Stranding, there's just no need to shove a sexy femme fatale into that game. Give us real female characters. Norman Reedus and certainly Guillermo Del Toro are hardly the most exquisite of men, but you just know every female character will be a size 6 with huge tits and look cute as fuck. I say no!
Urgh, I'm really excited for Death Stranding, there's just no need to shove a sexy femme fatale into that game. Give us real female characters. Norman Reedus and certainly Guillermo Del Toro are hardly the most exquisite of men, but you just know every female character will be a size 6 with huge tits and look cute as fuck. I say no!
Not this time, Kojima... just outright admit if you're gonna sexualise the characters... don't hide behind a shield of white armour.
yoooo that gif is amazing, for all the wrong reasons obviously. Ive only really seen the one she rolls around in the rain or whatever it was, I guess it gets worse? lol
Pinko Marx
Banned
Take notes for when the next Fire Emblem game drops. :3
J
JeremyEtcetera
Unconfirmed Member
Kojima has developed plots about mass murder, child soldiers/mass child murder, stuff relating to 9/11, forced abortion, slavery, and more. But the minute he brings out a sexualized character(possibly with a deep back story as to why) everyone-loses-their-minds-joker-image.jpg
Zvonimir Boban
Banned
Holy fucking shit at some of the Kojima defending in this thread. It's OK to perv over Quiet while she shoves her tits and ass into the camera as it races in for a closeup because look, the male characters are shirtless too!
It's not like women throughout history have been, and continue to be, exploited and treated as not much more than objects of sexual desire which makes Quiet's portrayal far worse than a hundred naked, cartwheeling Raidens. Although that would actually be pretty hilarious.
It's like a TV show where the only black guy happens to be a drug dealer, the Jewish guy has a giant nose and exclaims "oy vey!" every time he has to reach into his wallet but it's OK because everybody laughs at the rich, handsome white guy because he can't dance. There's no amount of bullshit reasoning that could stop that from being offensive.
It's not like women throughout history have been, and continue to be, exploited and treated as not much more than objects of sexual desire which makes Quiet's portrayal far worse than a hundred naked, cartwheeling Raidens. Although that would actually be pretty hilarious.
It's like a TV show where the only black guy happens to be a drug dealer, the Jewish guy has a giant nose and exclaims "oy vey!" every time he has to reach into his wallet but it's OK because everybody laughs at the rich, handsome white guy because he can't dance. There's no amount of bullshit reasoning that could stop that from being offensive.
Crossing Eden
Hello, my name is Yves Guillemot, Vivendi S.A.'s Employee of the Month!
Yes they tortured Quiet in MGSV, via throwing water on her, that makes her emit steam but not enough steam that you aren't distracted by the camera focusing on her wet breasts.
You already know the answer to this.
SolidSnakex
Member
Based on his Twitter I imagine that he's going to go pretty anti-Trump with DS. So, you'll be able to add that to issues he's tackled.
Angry Fork
Member
Because it's likely that a low percentage of women play the games, or at least Kojima believes this is the case. If that's true then it's normal for Kojima to mainly cater to straight men.
You have it backwards. The people in this thread raging at Kojima are the only ones interested in censoring.
Wonder who the heroine in D.S will be. I looks like Stefanie Joosten might be back as a supporting character, and she was totally fine with Quiet back in MGSV.
I dunno, maybe now that Kojima isn't limited to the MGS universe anymore he can iron out better characters in a new universe.
I dunno, maybe now that Kojima isn't limited to the MGS universe anymore he can iron out better characters in a new universe.
Why...does he think a deeper backstory will make a difference?
It is perfectly fine if you have a female character that has an athletic build and/or larger breasts...just don't barely cover them up with a tiny tied up shirt, dangle them right in front of the player camera, then have the character turn around to arch up her ass...and make up a justification that it's special skin cells.
It's far creepier to have that weird attempt at deeper meaning, than just saying it's because of pandering or you the designer like hot women dressed in barely anything.
It is perfectly fine if you have a female character that has an athletic build and/or larger breasts...just don't barely cover them up with a tiny tied up shirt, dangle them right in front of the player camera, then have the character turn around to arch up her ass...and make up a justification that it's special skin cells.
It's far creepier to have that weird attempt at deeper meaning, than just saying it's because of pandering or you the designer like hot women dressed in barely anything.
Dragon1893
Member
Let's work extra hard on the excuses to show women as sex objects in our games instead of avoiding sexualizing them in the first place. What kind of backwards mentality is this?
Crossing Eden
Hello, my name is Yves Guillemot, Vivendi S.A.'s Employee of the Month!
Half the people who play games are women. Gaming isn't a boys club. And no, it's not ok to pander solely to a perceived white male audience via objectifying women.
Obliterator
Member
I won't deny that men are much more likely to commit sexual crimes than women. That is likely a hormonal / biological issue more than seeing a scantily clad video game character though.
It's more of a vocal discussion point than anything though. Same with say GTA. When the games come out there is huge controversy but it doesn't affect sales numbers. Same for say Quiet in MGSV. There is no evidence her inclusion had any sort of negative detriment to sales numbers.
UtterlyPerplexed
Member
What is it with these dismissively lazy posts along the lines of "I like tits! Don't like it, don't buy it"? Good for you? I'm glad you like what Kojima has to say, and I'm happy that you're going to get the titillation you so crave. I mean, I dunno why you need it in a video game, but hey, it's your thing. Does that somehow negate the ability of other people who perhaps aren't as keen to see the still-rampant objectification of female characters sully an otherwise very decent and competently produced game to criticise and let their ire be known? God forbid people engage in these sort of discussions instead of unquestionably submitting to a creative individual with some very dubious ideas and notions of what an ideal woman in a work of fiction that we're supposed to take seriously.
Is sexualisation too ubiquitous? Yes. Is it inherently evil per se and should be avoided at all costs? Maybe not. But moderation is key and taking in critical factors such as tone and how you've built your character first and foremost can't be understated. The result of visually designing your character to fit around the person whose personality, backstory and place in the context of their fictional world is going to be very different to a character who was sketched first to resemble some kind of sex android and THEN given an actual backstory and characterisation later to fit around what you've just drawn up. Quiet smacks of an egregious example of the latter, whose story and canonical reason for her appearance coupled with a voyeuristic camera and her base design all come together to make this out-of-place, utterly incongruent presence in a game that we're supposed to fully take seriously. It's perfectly fine for one to admit that they enjoy MGSV and think it's a decent game, made by a competent visionary in spite of Konami's fuckery, AND also condemn this particular limb of the game as well as point out Kojima's troubling trends as of late.
Is sexualisation too ubiquitous? Yes. Is it inherently evil per se and should be avoided at all costs? Maybe not. But moderation is key and taking in critical factors such as tone and how you've built your character first and foremost can't be understated. The result of visually designing your character to fit around the person whose personality, backstory and place in the context of their fictional world is going to be very different to a character who was sketched first to resemble some kind of sex android and THEN given an actual backstory and characterisation later to fit around what you've just drawn up. Quiet smacks of an egregious example of the latter, whose story and canonical reason for her appearance coupled with a voyeuristic camera and her base design all come together to make this out-of-place, utterly incongruent presence in a game that we're supposed to fully take seriously. It's perfectly fine for one to admit that they enjoy MGSV and think it's a decent game, made by a competent visionary in spite of Konami's fuckery, AND also condemn this particular limb of the game as well as point out Kojima's troubling trends as of late.
Angry Fork
Member
"Play games" is different than "play mgs games". It's ok for men and women to write whatever they want towards whatever audience they want.
OverBlood 3
Banned
He can do as he pleases and we'll continue to call him out for objectifying women. If he's okay having cringeworthy and embarrassing moments that weaken the experience in his games then fine.
Obliterator
Member
What on earth? How in the hell did this now become about race? "White male audience?"
Are you actually trying to imply black / Asian / any ethnicity men are above liking sexualization in media?
Crossing Eden
Hello, my name is Yves Guillemot, Vivendi S.A.'s Employee of the Month!
You think a downward spiral into misogynistic depictions of women is a-ok?
You realize the main audience that people are thinking of when they present such excuses as "sex sells" or "thats the audience" is straight white 18-35 year old men? Surely that point hasn't flown over your head. The protagonist of remember me couldn't even have a love interest onscreen because the higher ups assumed that would turn off male gamers.
Pretty much this.
Not this time, Kojima... just outright admit if you're gonna sexualise the characters... don't hide behind a shield of white armour.
Every time I see that gif all I can think of is this:
You will be ashamed of your words and deeds.
J
JeremyEtcetera
Unconfirmed Member
There is a lot wrong with that poster's statement, especially how the person did not look at the second half of the statistic which states what percentage of those women play what genre. Spoiler: MGS genre isn't above double digits in percentage.
Why did you turned this to a "race thing"?
Who said any words even resembling to races up to your post
Crossing Eden
Hello, my name is Yves Guillemot, Vivendi S.A.'s Employee of the Month!
Pointing out the perceived largest section of the gaming audience isn't turning this into a race thing.
All I can think of is the people that said that you aren't forced to look at her. Or that she was just anxious, not trying to pose for the player. Lol
My man Kojima likes boobs and so do I. Don't like? Don't buy ¯\_(ツ
Cool and deep arguments from Kojima's defense force. But honestly I rather that Kojima said something like "I like boobs" instead of that dumb rhetoric full of sophistry. At least he is being honest.
John Kowalski
Banned
Of course they do, because sexual objectification is consistently the one thing Kojima's games represent as a positive thing, which it isn't. Kojima is perfectly ok with sexual objectification and practices it frequently in his games. Does Kojima show slavery in a positive light? Or nuclear proliferation? Or putting bombs inside women? No, he doesn't, and whether he handles those subjects deftly or not, they are always shown under some degree of abjectness. Sexual objectification though? It's invariably present, unapologetically flaunted and always under a positive light.