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The Last of Us 2 needs to transition to full RPG gameplay

Keihart

Keihart

Member
Combat in the game was exactly in the direction it needed to be, the improvements gameplay wise should be in the same direction they were going already.

If anything, making it open world-ish might be the best change they could bring but it would also be hard to balance with story telling.

I think ND will focus on making better partner AI and dynamics since they've been building on it since uncharted 2 and making the game more open, how open no idea.

Giving stats and numbers or some kind of agency to the player regarding the outcome of it's story is not really necesary i think, but who knows, uncharted 4 had dialogue trees.
 
B

badcrumble

Member
TLoU's gameplay formula is already really excellent.

I wouldn't mind giving the game one or two scenarios you can talk your way out of in addition to sneaking/fighting/bypassing, I suppose. But that's about it, and could be pretty well accomplished by having hostage-taking (the human shield grab move) in some specific situations result in a stand-down after a few seconds and people letting you pass *if* you hadn't killed anyone, rather than requiring dialogue trees.
 
C

Callibretto

Member
TLoU gameplay is already great, what I want is general improvement in AI and deeper stealth mechanic, like ability to drag bodies. more crafting item would also be welcome like making traps etc.
 
chozen

chozen

Member
For everyone already saying its a bad idea, for all you know Last of Us 2 may already incorporate RPG aspects.

Watch you all turn around and say its a 10/10 all over again.

I seriously think you all saying "no" should be a bit more open minded to the idea.
 
S

SoilBreak

Banned
LBXQSwY.gif
 
B

badcrumble

Member
xxracerxx said:
I still just dislike this critique of the game, it would be downright infuriating if she was visible to enemies. Better AI would not help.
Click to expand...
It'd really suck if she were visible to enemies and would have ruined many stealth sections, but the game should have done a better job at maintaining the *illusion* that Ellie's cover/concealment mattered, to prevent the scenario where she's darting around the enemy's kneecaps undetected.

Basically it's a presentation problem, not a gameplay problem.
 
H

HussiZooT

Member
As much as I like RPG games where you can interact with NPC's, have dialogue choices and rich lore to uncover, the reason Last of Us worked was because we played a Naughty Dog narrative.

I didn't want to kill the surgeon at the end. But this was ND's story. And in that, Joel selfishly kills the surgeon. Would I have liked to have a choice? Sure. But then it wouldn't be ND's story now would it?

Let ND direct TLoU2 as they see fit. Give us sandbox arenas like Uncharted 4 for variable combat options. But that's it.
 
K

KirbKirb30

Member
Vehemently disagree here. TLOU was perfect as it is. Rarely have I ever felt that gameplay and story have worked in tandem quite as well as it did in that game.
 
V

valkyre

Member
Last of Us now has a MASSIVE disconnect eh?

Riiiight... oh Gaf...

People need to learn to present their opinion as just that, an opinion. Not as if it constitutes a universal truth / fact or something...

The only fact around here is that TLOU was a pretty awesome game in all regards and it doesnt have to be anything other than what it is.
 
H

Heckler456

Banned
They said that their new expansion Lost Legacy has the biggest map in any of their games yet. My guess would be that depending on their audience's reaction to that stuff (just like the reaction to the QTE-like storytelling mechanics in Left Behind), they will either steer TLOU2 towards or away from even more open and sprawling maps.
 
D

DrunkShogun

Member
Disagree. Like most games which end up being open world when they don't have to be, the last of us doesn't need to go down the rpg path to be a better game. The combat, crafting and story were the selling points so improvement on them should be the focus. We are watching the story of the characters rather than deciding the story so that's why rpg doesn't seem to be a natural fit. A spinoff rpg game with new characters in their own separate world would be fine.
 
H

hbkdx12

Member
It's kind of annoying when people are in that honeymoon period with a good game (in this case it seems to be either Horizon or Zelda) and then want to act like every other game/franchise that they like should be more like the game they just enjoyed.

Everything doesn't need to be the same
 
E

Elios83

Member
No we don't need every game to be an open world rpg.
Also we don't know what Naughty Dog is doing.
Assuming it will be the same as the original is a mistake.
I totally trust ND to be able to make the game they want to make.
 
H

HeelPower

Member
Net_Wrecker said:
If that's what you were aiming for, saying "The Witcher 3" and "Horizon," just throws your point into a completely different realm, as evidenced by the reactions in the thread. People see "RPG" and hear stats, bars, open world, conversation systems, etc. What I'm talking about is an extension of the foundation TLOU is built on. I don't need branching story arcs or stats. Just a way to spice up the moment-to-moment gameplay dynamics between the player and the humans that populate the game world between the big scripted scenarios.

This is pretty much the reason I'm excited for Rain World. That ecosystem of independent AI to move around and, potentially, manipulate.



TLOU doesn't need any more down time. It had plenty of that. What it needs is to evolve the human interactions to be MORE intense and/or meaningful. You don't have to slow down to do that. AI, AI, AI. It's all about AI.
Click to expand...

The way I see it,TLoU's complex plot and writing could be better served by multi-ended gameplay.Its current gameplay template falls short of portraying the world in its full complexity the same way the story managed to.

You suggest that AI advancement is the key to it.I actually like that idea ,but there are multiple ways to fulfill the end goal of more open ended gameplay.

Stealth shooter isn't the absolute finite possibility that the story tellers at ND need to be stuck with.
 
S

SxP

Member
HeelPower said:
The Last of Us has the potential to be amazing
Click to expand...

This sums it all up right here. There are A LOT of people who consider TLOU amazing, if not one of the best games of all time. Yet, you don't and therefore the game needs to change to what you like. Well, sorry if it sounds harsh, but why don't you try playing something else.

There are so many games released every month and the variety in genres and styles seems greater than ever. So I don't understand why some people constantly feel the need to express how every game should cater to their tastes or should follow the same mould. And this seems especially prevalent in threads about Naughty Dog games.
 
xviper

xviper

Member
this generation has a disease with open world games

it's like the FPS genre of this generation '

not all games have to be open world to be good

leave The last of us the way it is
 
R

redcrayon

Member
SxP said:
This sums it all up right here. There are A LOT of people who consider TLOU amazing, if not one of the best games of all time. Yet, you don't and therefore the game needs to change to what you like. Well, sorry if it sounds harsh, but why don't you try playing something else.

There are so many games released every month and the variety in genres and styles seems greater than ever. So I don't understand why some people constantly feel the need to express how every game should cater to their tastes or should follow the same mould. And this seems especially prevalent in threads about Naughty Dog games.
Click to expand...
I kinda reach the same conclusion from the opposite direction. I'm lukewarm on Naughty Dog games but there are enough games trying to be an open world, rpg-lite with crafting, XP bars, skill bars etc. ND clearly have a vision for what they want to make at the moment, they've made a run of highly acclaimed games in a row, let them do their thing. Not everything needs to follow the same template, I wouldn't expect other shooters/action games to start becoming RPGs either as that slow progression doesn't work for everything, sometimes people just want arena gunfights and zombies.

I remember when OOT and Tomb Raider came out and suddenly 2D action games like Castlevania and Megaman wanted to be 3D games with more movement and less immediacy in the combat. Not everything needs to follow a trend when it's already good at what it does. I do think ND could do some things a bit better- if they are going to put puzzles in their games they could be more complex and less repetitive, otherwise they come across as just busywork to break up the gunfights. However, what they are good at is storytelling and drama, and rpg elements have a habit of slowing things down. ND games are the equivalent of an action thriller film compared to RPG sidequests and XP bar filling being the filler episodes of an epic fantasy tv series.
 
B

Bunga

Member
Uhm, nope. Not everything needs to be an RPG.

TLOU's gameplay was (and remains) spot on, just needs refining, things like improvements to stealth gameplay, being able to drag bodies etc.
 
P

Phreakuency

Banned
No.

But I do think the new Tomb Raider series should (and said so numerous times last year) move to an open world, semi rpg like Horizon.
 
A

Ansatz

Member
HardRojo said:
I'm trying to make sense of this, unless the joke flew right over my head.
Click to expand...

If you take away all the audiovisual presentation elements (voice acting, textures, backgrounds), remove all story and writing, replace the characters with generic human models; basically remove any aspect of the game people may have an emotional attachment to and turn it into a mechanical playground...

X6pT06y.jpg
Click to expand...

...thus forcing TLoU to be judged purely based on its mechanics, level design layouts, object/enemy placement etc; then you'll find a mechanical core that's not too much above average to be honest. It's not terrible or anything, but certainly nothing special either. To give concrete examples, Vanquish and Bayonetta remain excellent games even if you'd give them the above treatment.
 
B

Bjoern the Smexy

Member
I'd be very glad if TLoU2 is just the same as the first one.
I don't need RPG elements in it. It doesn't even make sense to suddenly make it an RPG.
It doesn't need an open world either.
It's a story-driven game first and foremost. The gameplay, while very good, is secondary.

So fuck no, The Last of Us 2 should stay away as much as possible from being an RPG.
 
P

Purple_Orchid

Member
This is a perfect example of ''leave the game developing to the game developer and just play the damn thing.''

No one wants an open world TLoU or an RPG-heavy TLoU.
 
T

Trojan

Member
Can't say I'd be happy if Ghost Joel was a quest giver.

I get what you're saying OP but I think they can just open up gameplay more and give it additional variety rather than go full RPG.
 
Z

ZettaiSeigi

Member
HardRojo said:
I'm trying to make sense of this, unless the joke flew right over my head.
Click to expand...

Couldn't tell whether it was sarcasm or something serious either. Either way, that seems to be the go-to accusation of Nintendo fanboys (just the rabid ones) against anything from Sony that comes close to being cinematic or having a heavy narrative.

Anyway, not everything needs to be a copy of another game, especially when the game is already successful as it already is. I loved my time in HZD and I want more of that game. But I don't want TLOU Part 2 to be anything like Horizon. They're two different games that tell their stories through different gameplay mechanics. They should improve on what sets them apart, not be like other games. TLOU shone because of its story and the gameplay (including the lack of dialogue choices) actually complemented that.

Sorry OP, I get it that you tried so hard to like the game, but it's safe to assume that you're in the minority here. The game shouldn't change to appeal to you at the expense of alienating the others that already loved it for what it is.
 
T

Triggerhappytel

Member
"I'll tell you where the Firefly enclave is Ellie, but first I need you to gather 9 eucalyptus plants and 6 bandages for me so I can restock our medicine supplies."
 
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