Rentahamster
Rodent Whores
Fighting for a good cause matters.
There's not a direct cause and effect consequence between those two events.
That's not a rebuttal to what I said.
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Bernie Sanders To Announce Single-Payer Healthcare Medicare For All Legislation
- Thread starter flkraven
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shinra-bansho
Member
No. Because support for it plummets if and when people find out they (1) may have to pay more taxes for it, and (2) can't keep their current plans.
But I think it's fine for those that have the electoral luxury to do so, to keep it in the public eye.
Ziltoidia 9
Member
If enough people hear about it, learn what this would mean for them, and contact their congress/senators, then it will just help the future when we CAN do it.
Carpe Libertatem
Member
Okay, I'll bite. Who?
kame-sennin
Member
This is the most important point in this discussion. Through some bizarre twist of fate, the election of Trump and the Republican dominance over Congress has lead to a greater chance of single payer succeeding than before. It's a window of opportunity that should not be missed.
I don't see how when only 16% of Republicans favor keeping the ACA, while 41% favor medicare for all.
25% of Democrats in favor of repealing the ACA.
79% of Democrats in favor of keeping the ACA.
25 + 79 = 104.
At least 4% of the Democrats polled wanted to both keep and repeal the ACA.
Sho_Nuff82
Member
The ACA and the Republican option could not have lower credibility than they do now. It's the perfect time, while the exact details of coverage for both plans are fresh in everyone's minds, to introduce option C.
That's not how that works.
Hmm? Those are separate questions.
Bonen no Max'd
Banned
edit: nvm I'm bad at reading, but difference is that people who want to expand the ACA (more subsidies, public option) probably answered different in some accounts.
jimmypython
Member
i also agree to start on a by-state-basis. LA and NY should push this just to show it can be done.
The timing is always off, the goal here is to keep talking about it, especially with everyone's minds focused on the boondoggle that occurred last week. The next step is hosting these discussions over a larger swath of the public, but you don't get there without bringing it up until enough people are aware.
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
I appreciate the effort.
I'm torn on how much effort I want put into actually writing this. On the one hand, there's not much point in putting a ton of development work into something that's never going to pass. On the other hand this is Bernie's chance to show me that there's literally anything of substance inside him
I'm torn on how much effort I want put into actually writing this. On the one hand, there's not much point in putting a ton of development work into something that's never going to pass. On the other hand this is Bernie's chance to show me that there's literally anything of substance inside him
OfficerRaichu15
Member
Bernie you get people together and go show those heartless GOP fuckers to go fuck themselves and give healthcare like this.
Sho_Nuff82
Member
He probably wrote this two years ago when he was getting serious about his presidential run.
makingmusic476
Member
It's so awesome seeing serious momentum behind this.
I remember a decade ago when John Conyers would submit a Medicare for All bill in the House every year, and not a single other member of Congress would support it. Times are changing.
I remember a decade ago when John Conyers would submit a Medicare for All bill in the House every year, and not a single other member of Congress would support it. Times are changing.
Rentahamster
Rodent Whores
Advancing the narrative and swaying the electorate has a point.
The other things he's done in the past showed you nothing?
Ether_Snake
å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®
People saying it can't pass: The Republicans had started to make it sound reasonable that Obamacare should be repealed, which shifted the narrative to the right. They fucked up, so proposing Single-Payer now is a great opportunity. Will it pass? Probably not, will it shift the narrative leftward, effectively opening a breach to progress on healthcare instead of regressing? Yes.
Why would someone be in favor of both questions?
makingmusic476
Member
This moment pissed me off so much when it happened.
Saying it's unlikely? It'd be a challenge? Sure. That's reality. Closing the door on it entirely for political bullshit? Fuck you.
People misinterpret the question or just are marking boxes. Different wordings produce different results
RPGCrazied
Member
That would be hilarious if Trump signed it just to piss off the people that failed his healthcare plan. Oh the salt.
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
In the 90s Clinton was a wide eyed optimist who believed that single payer was inevitable
I wonder what could possibly have happened to that person in the 20 years since to convince them that America rejects single payer...
TurnipFritters
Member
You missed the step where Bernie goes back to being a Representative rather than a Senator.
I mean, in the sense that the image his supporters put forth is frequently at odds with his actual record as a legislator.
He wants to keep people motivated and engaged. As director of outreach for the Democratic party and also a person who wants to hold off the Apocalypse, he wants to keep The Youth tuned into political happenings so they'll actually show up to vote in the midterms.
To be frank, I don't see the far left having won anything for decades either.
Byakuya769
Member
The fact that this isn't internally consistent with the facts of it's preceding story (Sanders is a senator), makes this excellent fan fiction.
He can still be speaker! You don't need to be a rep to be speaker of the house.
The speaker doesn't have to a member of the majority party. Doesn't even have to be a member of congress.
Adam_Vania
Banned
im all for politicians announcing plans to help a lot of people. we need more of this.
if you don't like it, top it.
if you don't like it, top it.
A Human Becoming
More than a Member
CBO score could make this possible to sell after the disastrous Ryancare bill. It's still a longshot but if Trump really wants to be a different Republican he would at least listen.
GoldenEye 007
Member
Well I addressed the "Bernie is the only person pushing liberal liberal legislation" line. ACA was subject to a long-term sustained negative marketing campaign which made it toxic. It was a major item which allowed the GOP to make so many gains in 2010 - an item so much on the forefront that it was attempted to be repealed over 60 times and was a constant item in campaign attack ads against Democrats. President Obama, as it was being debated, admitted that there would likely be many political causalities for passing this. And there was. Obamacare wasn't exactly supposed to be and isn't an endearing name for the legislation.
So I do think that is a major reason that once it passed, you didn't hear lot from Democrats on further improvements - hell, it wasn't even fully rolled out at that point. My point was Dems pulled off a monumental feat even getting it passed. And just now in this particular window, can there be a larger push for more liberal policies. It's great Bernie introduced something - even if he historically was not a Democrat. I just don't see the point in calling out Democrats because he was the first this time.
The other reality is that this country is largely center to center right. Liberal policies overall seem to do poorly across the country. So of course, Democrats understanding their base, may not champion liberal policies because the fact is they'd stand a good chance of getting destroyed over it.
The Democratic party isn't a pure progressive party. It can't be if it wants to remain viable in the US.
Hillary is the president America needed, but not the one it deserved.
Republicans will stamp their feet and scream socialism regardless of the fact that SP is the most fiscally conservative option.
A Human Becoming
More than a Member
Of course, but Trump wants to be a hero and is transforming the Republican Party. Stroke his ego and sell it to moderate Republicans.
Even though it's a pipedream, a CBO score showing millions more getting insurance and it reduces the deficit would at least make the Republicans look very bad. More people nowadays think healthcare should be a right.
Byakuya769
Member
Wow, that is pretty interesting. Had no idea.
I take it back.. no longer fan fiction, closer to a "what if" story.
shinra-bansho
Member
I highly doubt that's happening.
I could be wrong, but I don't think they analyse every piece of legislation proposed. And I doubt that Sanders wants this scrutinized under an economic lens anyway, since it's just symbolic.
FTFY
kame-sennin
Member
But in that quote, she's using the threat of single-payer (way off in the yeeeaar two thooousaaaand) to convince republicans to vote for her private insurance plan.
That sounds like the exact same asshole who ran in 2016.
What's required to obtain a CBO score?
It would be an amazing political move if the dems could actually push forward an alternative legislation, even one that is destined to fail to pass, but garner enough attention around such a vote to show that they did try to pass sensible legislation with the polar opposite national reception compared to the AHCA. TBH though, I don't think the dems are capable of that kind of unity either.
No, competence matters
Right, I agree.
Wafflecakes
Member
Even if it came to a vote, you wouldn't get all Democrats to vote for it... let alone moderate Republicans.
elrechazado
Banned
Got any data that's not a 20 year old poll?
bangbang i'm a timpani
Banned
link to the bill anywhere?
shinra-bansho
Member
I'm not sure.
But it's never going to come to a vote at all anyway.
Unity is irrelevant. They're the minority.
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