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[Madame M]

Not taking a political stance infuriates me, has reggie considered how many people would be turned off because of his statements?

 

[HawthorneKitty]

Not taking a political stance infuriates me, has reggie considered how many people would be turned off because of his statements?

Have you considered how many people would be turned off for taking stances and what kind of lens you put yourself under?

 

[KtSlime]

Not taking a political stance infuriates me, has reggie considered how many people would be turned off because of his statements?

So what's your stance on the change in interpretation of article 9?

Spoiler

It's foolish to take stances on topics you are uninformed about.

 

[TheFierceGentleman]

I mean, politics are hard to avoid when making an interesting story or game.

Donkey Kong has themes of anti-imperialism

Pikmin, Kirby 64, Super Mario:Sunshine, and Wind Waker have environmentalist themes

Punch-Out shows off extreme cultural stereotypes
(The weak, cowardly french man, I wonder where they got from
https://youtu.be/V6De44WcBO8 )

Metroid has been championed as a feminist piece. It's strong with themes of motherhood, feminism, and government corruption.


Politics don't have to be shouted out in a game, but they're likely gonna exist in some form.

 

[NewGame]

Wii Fit is body shaming

 

[jdstorm]

the entire topic is about nintendo being unwilling to use their games to make political statements, so the author's will is exactly the point.
one can see twintelle and see a successfull "colored" woman that's empowering for both women and people of color...nintendo just thought that design was cool.

in this matter i'm pretty much on the author side..i want creatives to be able to make the stories they want to make without having to worry about what message people would try to get out of it..otherwise is just another form of censorhip

all white men cast? great
all female asians cast? great too
wanna make a story where the main character is a rapist? if you think you can get a good story out of it,go for it.
you think a given culture imagery is cool and wanna adapt it into your fictional world? be my guest

people can always try to find a message where there's one,but that's not the author's fault if that wasn't his/her objective in the first place.

Actually this topic is mostly about Reggie saying something dumb. Nintendo have a long history of making political statements in their games be it intentionally or otherwise. Most are well done and positive, because thats who Nintendo are as a company.

On your second point. I half agree with you. I agree that creative people should be empowered to tell the specific stories that they want to tell. Where i disagree is that creators should have no responsibility over what happens once their work is experienced by its intended audience.

Just as a carpenter would know everything about the wood they choose to work and the tools they choose to work with, creative people have a responsibility to understand the tools of their trade. If you are building a chair for an adult you would make sure it was reinforced to carry more weight then a chair built for a small child who is much lighter. Similarly if you are a designer you need to understand imagery and what it means to your intended audience. If you are a writer you need to understand how phrases and idioms vary between cultures.

For instance to an American a "Thong" is a type of skimpy underwear typically associated with women. To an Australian a "Thong" is a rubber shoe worn by all in summertime. If someone told an Australian and American they were just quickly putting their "Thongs" on before leaving the house, both would have very different reactions to that news.

If a creative work is transformed after the intended audience understands its original message, then thats not on the creator. However if the Audience missunderstands a creators intention because it was misscomunicated then it is the fault of the creator.

 

[Deimo5]

Not sure if I want to care what Reggie says about this kind of thing. I've rarely seen someone so consistently locked into marketing mode, it's hard to expect insightful commentary.

 

[Cuningas de Häme]

Pretty sure a good amount of Nintendo's games have an environmental message. The Pikmin series in general, some Mario games, some Pokemon games, Kirby 64, Animal Crossing, Splatoon (?), Mother 3, and so on. Which I feel would make sense considering Japan is an island nation vulnerable to floods, typhoons, and tsunamis, which will get worse due it climate change.

But yeah, some of those games have a political statement that says respect and protect nature.
.

That is not a political statement. That is only some common sense (that seems be lacking in some parts of the world).

Protecting nature is the one thing that should be uniting mankind. It is the most natural thing to do, make sure that the thing that grants you life is doing great so you can continue your pitiful, miserable life until you die alone in an old folks home.

You don't kill your mom while she's breastfeeding you, right? The same applies here.

People confuse political with ethical and right and just. By that reasoning individuals religion is political. Hint, it's not unless people use it to further their political agenda, and at that point it's not about religion anymore, it is just abusing other people's faith.

 

[Forkball]

Not taking a political stance infuriates me, has reggie considered how many people would be turned off because of his statements?

Yeah I'm not sure why everyone is praising Super Mario Odyssey when it says NOTHING about raising the minimum wage or the Paris Agreement.

 

[T.O.P]

Not taking a political stance infuriates me, has reggie considered how many people would be turned off because of his statements?

Way less than you'd imagine

 

[Heyt]

Perfect answer, surprisingly. Most devs feel like this. They want to make stuff people can enjoy, not political statements. Politization of games both inside and outside of them through commentart tend to ruin them as most people use them to scape the discomfort of real life, and politics contribute to said discomfort.

 

[Ms.Galaxy]

That is not a political statement. That is only some common sense (that seems be lacking in some parts of the world).

Protecting nature is the one thing that should be uniting mankind. It is the most natural thing to do, make sure that the thing that grants you life is doing great so you can continue your pitiful, miserable life until you die alone in an old folks home.

You don't kill your mom while she's breastfeeding you, right? The same applies here.

People confuse political with ethical and right and just. By that reasoning individuals religion is political. Hint, it's not unless people use it to further their political agenda, and at that point it's not about religion anymore, it is just abusing other people's faith.

It is politics when there are political parties around the world who are completely denying its existence and actively push against any pro-environment movements and polices with polices that hurt and destroy the environment just to fill their pockets with money.

 

[KtSlime]

It is politics when there are political parties around the world who are completely denying its existence and actively push against any pro-environment movements and polices with polices that hurt and destroy the environment just to fill their pockets with money.

What is and is not politics is determined by the political environment, what might be a political issue for you or your country might not be a political issue for someone else in their country.

 

[peanutbutterlatte]

Games are escapism. I don't want to be reminded of the harshness of the modern world whilst I'm trying to explore Hyrule.

 

[BADMAN]

Games are escapism. I don't want to be reminded of the harshness of the modern world whilst I'm trying to explore Hyrule.

Video games are whatever the hell you want them to be. Thats the beauty of the medium. You can play gta for the sole porpouse of having a shoot out with the cops or you can walk around and appreciate the satire of modern LA society from the pedestrian voice clips or the rediculous billboards. You can dump hours into a mindless rouge like or get wrapped up in the narrative of The Beginners Guide. Video games are pretty great.

 

[TheFierceGentleman]

What is and is not politics is determined by the political environment, what might be a political issue for you or your country might not be a political issue for someone else in their country.

Any issue tackled by the government is political, simply because the party/people in power support it or oppose it.

Just because a political issue isn't talked about or is just accepted as being one way doesn't mean some parties won't oppose it either.
Another side of the spectrum is the idea that it may become a political issue later down the line in their own country.

 

[isaacnukem]

I kinda agree with Nintendo. Not everyone or everything needs to be political.

 

[Haganeren]

Why should that be? Sexual orientation isn't political

... Of course it is. It sends a message that "gay people are ok", and that's quite political. The single virtue to be tolerent IS political.
Everything is political to me. Every interaction between characters. It can be subtle but there is always something, it's nearly impossible to make game with character without being political imo. It always try to be "familiar" to the player and so, presesnt a certain situation as "normal"... Which is political.

Video games are whatever the hell you want them to be. Thats the beauty of the medium. You can play gta for the sole porpouse of having a shoot out with the cops or you can walk around and appreciate the satire of modern LA society from the pedestrian voice clips or the rediculous billboards. You can dump hours into a mindless rouge like or get wrapped up in the narrative of The Beginners Guide. Video games are pretty great.

Well, i know i said that everything is political before but... Shooting a cops which control the liberty of the player is VERY political... Even that. (And i think in GTA you even play at some not-so-virtuous people which make the message even more clear)

 

[kerr]

OP: Making grammatically correct titles is for other people. I just want to have fun

LOL

 

[BBboy20]

Well, Treehouse is liberal as fuck, at least.

 

[Funyarinpa]

Honestly, so long as you aren't telling a story, I can understand that. That's fine, the way I don't expect politics out of Hexcells.

But you have to ensure that you don't alienate people if you "just want people to have fun", and that's where politics inevitably comes in.

 

[BADMAN]

... Of course it is. It sends a message that "gay people are ok", and that's quite political. The single virtue to be tolerent IS political.
Everything is political to me. Every interaction between characters. It can be subtle but there is always something, it's nearly impossible to make game with character without being political imo. It always try to be "familiar" to the player and so, presesnt a certain situation as "normal"... Which is political.



Well, i know i said that everything is political before but... Shooting a cops which control the liberty of the player is VERY political... Even that. (And i think in GTA you even play at some not-so-virtuous people which make the message even more clear)

It's up to the interpretation of the player. I would never debate that shooting cops in video games isn't political but the player can choose to ignore the political dilemma and see it as a form of release. The same could be said of just about any game where you kill for fun. Call of Duty is a good example of fans not really thinking about the political aspects of the story and focusing on the pleasure dirived from gunning down a bunch of bots.

 

[The perfect Dark]

Ugh, terrible answer.

No, perfect answer.

 

[iMerc]

nintendo have many political statements in many of their games.
they just don't try to shove them down your throats to get brownie points with 'gamers' so everyone can see how 'progressive' they are.

once again a bunch of armchair activists making a mountain out of something smaller than a molehill, and trying to create an "issue' out of something that is devoid of one.

 

[Audioboxer]

I completely agree with Reggie/ Nintendo. Don't say anything that would have someone associate your comment with your company or your company's product.

Far Cry 5 has nothing to do with Nintendo, and it's never coming out on a Nintendo system, they just wanted a juicy headline.

I do think more people would benefit from watching the video clip, it's like 4 minutes long, in which Reggie has 10 seconds.

The whole thing is largely about politics in games in the sense of killing nazis (Wolfenstein), killing Christian supremacists (or fundamentalists) (Far Cry 5), killing KKK (Mafia 3) and a small cameo of killing/attacking Trump in some indie game. None of that Nintendo would ever create in-house. It's not just the political themes, it's the extent of the visceral violence. They then bring out some guy who appears to either be a reviewer or writer for a "family ratings company" of some sorts. Basically some sort of commentator on what is suitable for kids. Who has the statement politics can divide people/families, therefore, some care is needed. Then they chuck on Reggie for 10 seconds after all of this and people are surprised at the vanilla PR answer following the content in the video?

As I said in my other post, the framing of this small clip coupled with the content should have hardly anyone surprised at Reggie's remark, so I really am guessing hardly anyone is watching the video and just reading the OP/title. I get the branching out discussion about all Nintendo games and politics to a degree but be honest about the place he was put into in the video the news station produced. It was not 60 minutes/an evening with Reggie. The guy got 2 sentences on the news stations 4-minute piece on violence/politics in games when it's skewing to the most extreme examples (killing/shooting/attacking extremists). For anyone bringing up Mother/Zelda/Kirby or anything else, watch the video. The framing was around some of the most visceral examples of politics in the industry from games like Far Cry/Mafia/Wolfenstein. Nintendo do not make games like that. They make Splatoon and Mario on a normal day, something "edgy" like Pikmin at the weekend. Jokes aside, yes, games that can still have political themes, but not on the scale of some of the examples in the video.

 

[feelingkettle]

There's nothing wrong with games making political statements. There's also nothing wrong with people wanting games to be a form of escapism. There's both out there.

There's also people who look for validation for their own political beliefs in places where those things or companies are not trying to make political statements. However, people do see meanings in things differently, which is fine, too

But if you look to Nintendo to make political statements on things, you probably need to reevaluate how you go about being involved in political discussion.

 

[jipewithin]

Really depends what he means and understands is being "political". In a sense everything is political some way or another. I don't play Nintendo games expecting to see social issues being addressed and I dare to say vast majority won't care about that when playing Super Mario or Zelda.

 

[Tyraniboah]

But they do.

Put in a character that, if another dev had made the game, would have made a big deal out of how inclusive they were. Instead Nintendo treats him literally the same as any other character in the game

Include an all female society with a variety of skin tones, body types and personalities. Again, they make no "comment" on it or how progressive they are. They're simply treated like any other race in the game

I'll be honest. I felt no different about these characters because they were treated as regular people, as you said. I liked that. Made the world feel more varied and alive to me

 

[protomouse]

It feels a bit disingenuous of Reggie to put all of Nintendo's developers under the same banner. There isn't, and shouldn't be, a singular vision for all of Nintendo's games. That said, I do respect the philosophy of individual developers avoiding to make their games be about politics. We will always need games that are completely disconnected from reality. The AAA space shies away from the notion of pure, meaningless fun. So Nintendo's contributions are a balancer.

 

[D_prOdigy]

Rubbish response.

I have a better, safe, Reggie-style non-answer that he can use for free if he happens upon a time machine.

We at Nintendo have always believed, first and foremost, that our duty is to provide content that can be enjoyed by absolutely anybody; regardless of gender, colour, race, or age. We believe that nobody deserves to be excluded from the joy of games and the feeling of inclusion and representation that games can provide. If that's a political statement, then absolutely it's the one we want to make.

 

[xrnzaaas]

Geez people, he's been asked to give an answer, he didn't force people to hear what's his opinion about it. And he gave an answer that all execs at Nintendo would expect him to give.

 

[mark-san]

Gotta love capitalism and its innate spinelessness as well as lack of moral <3

Lol

Gotta love socialism/progressivism and its constant cynical look on everything, finding something wrong even on pure joyful games as Mario.

 

[Bobo Dakes]

I'll start by saying I wish there was more context to this, I don't like jumping on people for a soundbites.

Most of you are right by saying we don't look to Nintendo for "political" (a word that could be mean anything to anyone at this point) statements, but Reggie's complacency in that statement is what's off putting. And whether they realize it or not, Nintendo games have touched on certain issues. I wasn't smiling when I was playing Advance Wars Days of Ruin, war is bad and the game touched on it appropriately (for the most part).

And some of you are being so hyperbolic with your comparisons, no I'm not looking for Mario's stance on fascism or for Nintendo to "pick a side", but there's nothing wrong drawing a line from a game's story to real world issues, gives it a sense of purpose. Imagine Peach at the end of Odyssey simply saying no at the wedding and rescuing herself, not a political statement, but it would be nice to see Nintendo update that damsel in distress trope (especially when she's fighting for herself in the Ubisoft game). Is that asking for a lot? Is that beating anyone over the head with the feminist agenda?

But the "yeah, we don't want to worry about that stuff" mentality is just annoying. You're acting superior in your complacency, something a lot of people can't afford to do.

Some of you are pissing me off for acting like the mere mention of the political climate around the world in the video game is something being "forced" on you. "I'm tired of x", so the fuck what? Don't play it, change the channel, click off the article. Shit is happening to different people and don't be all "poor me" just because you have to hear about it.

I felt that way when they revealed BG&E2. As if i couldnt figure out that the trailer promoted how diverse the races are in that footage. They even put in the credits of Assassins Creed that many types of people helped developed the game as if they deserve an award for it when it should just be common knowledge?

This is probably the worst thing said in this thread.

 

[Forkball]

Lol

Gotta love socialism/progressivism and its constant cynical look on everything, finding something wrong even on pure joyful games as Mario.

Mario supports a feudalistic system that inheriently suppresses the citizens of the land.

I guess the lack of social and financial mobility for its people that is the core of the Mushroom Kingdom is "joyful" for you.

 

[nicoga3000]

I shouldn't be so surprised with GAF's reaction to this, but I am. He's totally justified with his answer. Why should any game developer or company be required to tackle sensitive social and/or political issues in their games? It's fine that some devs do exactly that, and kudos to them. But not everyone needs to, Nintendo included.

 

[Makai]

Gotta love capitalism and its innate spinelessness as well as lack of moral <3

What does this even mean? Is the ideal world where Nintendo doesn't exist and games are made by state-run media?

 

[Blindy]

Good for Nintendo to just stick to senseless fun games. Not all games need to have some sort of deep meaning. People have to stop with cramming what they want in a game towards all of these game developers, let them breathe and put out what they want to put out.

The more Splatoon 2 and ARMS, the better. Keep shit like the article that ragged Splatoon 1 since it had you on a male character for it's customization off your games and I will be a happy camper.

Video games should be meant for an outlet and way to temporarily escape the horrors and complexity of this world, last thing you want to do is demand games that incorporate propaganda or a touchy subject into said outlet. I don't come into all games looking to be preached about what is right and what is wrong, I want to lay back and burn a couple of hours having fun.

 

[WrenchNinja]

ORAS was a remake though. They basically said "R/S didn't have customization so this won't", despite it including all the other modern updates, so I'm not sure I'd count that. The fact that it was brought back in S/M kind of makes it not arbitrary

And Splatoon 2 is weird, because the female squidling on the box is much lighter than she appears to be in any other version of her, including the amiibo and in the Salmon Run art

ORAS had more than just modern game play updates, they changed environmental design, available pokemon, introduced new characters, it being a remake was not really a good excuse to not include customisation when they went out of their way to change everything else. I would not hold my breath with Game Freak with potentially dropping important features in the future (and giving out stupid excuses like Kalos is for dressing up) even if they made a come back with the latest games.

Okay, that Splatoon 2 thing is crazy. Either they made a mistake or it's a lot worse than I thought. The fact the amiibo and official art has darker skin makes me think they made a mistake, but the game is out in a month, I would hope they fix it by the time it hits shelves

 

[UnemployedVillain]

The box was the first thing shown off IIRC, so it seems like it's either a mistake or they've actually made her darker since they first showed the character. Hopefully it'll be updated

 

[GiantBreadbug]

However if the Audience missunderstands a creators intention because it was misscomunicated then it is the fault of the creator.

I'm not addressing the rest of the post here, and this is probably gonna get a little esoteric, but I really disagree with this view of art in general. Creators don't have any responsibility to their audience. Likewise, the audience doesn't have a responsibility to "correctly" interpret the intent.

Artists are just sharing something they want to share, and people who give audience to that art do so with the understanding that 1) they will interperet the art through their own lense, and 2) their interpretation of that art belongs to them and them alone. Audiences come to art on their own and take as much or as little from it as they can, and that's it.

Art is just art, man. You don't get points for correctly guessing or interpreting intent, and the creator doesn't owe the audience anything. Art that's made for its own sake, because the artist just wanted to express something, is great. It doesn't require people to understand or click with it, and it doesn't involve any "responsibility."

Anyways this is a little OT so I'll stop here and apologize for that.

 

[Parapraxis]

Yeah I'm not sure why everyone is praising Super Mario Odyssey when it says NOTHING about raising the minimum wage or the Paris Agreement.

Real talk though, I feel the Mexican level in Odyssey a bit off putting, I find the accusations of cultural appropriation very often poorly supported and silly, but in this instance I really doubt that Nintendo actually worked with many (any?) Latino's in ensuring that the representation is respectable and not just stereotypes and tropes.

IMO they are treading on some highly charged political lines and they should be prepared to explain themselves.

I hope Nintendo has their best PR at hand when they get asked about the levels conception creation and curation.

 

[Agent Matt]

A lot of so called "non-political" games are political, you just don't see it as that because it upholds and supports parts of your world that you view to be normal.

Anita Sarkeesian said something along the same lines in one of her videos, "We must remember that games don’t just entertain. Intentional or not, they always express a set of values and present us with concepts of normalcy."

 

[Xiao Hu]

Lol

Gotta love socialism/progressivism and its constant cynical look on everything, finding something wrong even on pure joyful games as Mario.

What does this even mean? Is the ideal world where Nintendo doesn't exist and games are made by state-run media?

You don't think that Nintendo avoids any political statements because they're too afraid potentially 'tarnishing' their image which might lead to minimized profits because certain asshats might feel offended? I remind you that they kicked out that gal from Treehouse after some neckbeard gamer gators started a massive shit storm circling around her lewd photo sidejob and controversial college thesis, but hey we really need that family friendly money don't we

 

[NHarmonic.]

"This coming from the company that removed crosses, smoking, alcohol, and gay marriage from its games.

Sounds pretty political to me, you brogressives you."

Crosses were generally removed for trademark reasons(red cross logos) or because the Japanese, when looking up what knights would carry into battle for Zelda, saw that every single shield in the history books had crosses on them. They didn't make the connection that crosses = religion. Japan's christian population is less than 5% of the population and Christianity(and most religions) are dumped on very frequently in Japanese popular culture. Removing those was a business, not a political decision.

Smoking and Drinking, this is the same thing. It's just washing that stuff away, Putting smoking and crude sex jokes and such is pretty common in Japan but that shit won't fly here, lots of stuff won't air, or it'll bump the rating up and alienate parents looking to get trustworthy family friendly games for their spawn.

And if you're seriously going to bring up the gay marriage, which was a glitch, not a feature, then I don't know if this post was worth typing up. that level of dishonestly is IMPRESSIVE, my man!

Well, gay marriage being "a glitch" and then removing it is quite the political statement. That's the point.

 

[jdstorm]

snip.

I seem to have gotten a bit distracted and went a bit off topic. Sorry about that. I appreciate you taking the time to respond. Although i completely disagree with your oppinion.

The quick version.

Spoiler

Creating Art is inherently about sharing with others. Its impossible to share with someone if the person you are trying to share/communicate with doesn't understand what you are trying to do/say.

A final question. If Art isn't about being understood by its audience then why do we translate films/games into foreign languages with subtitles and dubs?

 

[Breakage]

I'm ok with this.

 

[ThanksVision]

Mario fighting Bowser at the top of New Donk City's empire state building is a metaphor for the common people taking on Trump. I couldn't imagine actually getting riled over Reggie's statement. All art is political. Donkey Kong jumping over a barrel can mean anything to anyone.

The worst kind of political art is the shit that is constantly making a point of HOW political it is. Nintendo doesn't have to make a comment. This thread reminds me of the famous dril tweet https://twitter.com/dril/status/107911000199671808

just play the games and take what you want from them, I don't need the fucking president of Nintendo to validate my political insecurities. Living in America does that every day

 

[zelas]

The big 3 pissing of everyone all week is hilarious. This E3 has been great.

 

[shark sandwich]

Mario fighting Bowser at the top of New Donk City's empire state building is a metaphor for the common people taking on Trump. I couldn't imagine actually getting riled over Reggie's statement. All art is political. Donkey Kong jumping over a barrel can mean anything to anyone.

The worst kind of political art is the shit that is constantly making a point of HOW political it is. Nintendo doesn't have to make a comment. This thread reminds me of the famous dril tweet https://twitter.com/dril/status/107911000199671808

just play the games and take what you want from them, I don't need the fucking president of Nintendo to validate my political insecurities. Living in America does that every day

Mario and Bowser battling for supremacy on top of a giant penis-shaped building, looking down at all the poor women and minorities below. Clearly this is meant to reinforce the white patriarchy.

 

[Qassim]

Nintendo should be free to avoid politics in their own games, just as long as they don't unreasonably stop others from making political games.