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The state of NeoGAF

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Buffalo

Banned
Pot, kettle. You're advocating for the disappearance of the only forum of its kind because you don't like it, even though there's plenty of other sites that cater to you.

no, I'm advocating for a return to roots. i.e, not being a hivemind. it was no different than /r/the_donald outside of being for the other side.

if you're alright with the purging of anyone that thinks differently from you, you're no better, regardless of how you feel about it.
 

Fercho

Member
I answered your question loud and clear. if it's too difficult for you to grasp, let alone argue against, then that's your problem, pal.

No you didn’t , it was a simple question. How you, will disagree with a person like me in this political climate? It’s simple.
 

jono51

Banned
For those that keep asking for Gaf Discord invites:

Only the mods in there can send them out and they are NOT currently sending out any more.

That's because they left the rest of the community to die on some hill. Not a good look for a place that wants to be "inclusive".

Evilore, its good to be back. 18 more years.
 

Coiote

Member
Errrr, victim blaming and mental issues allegations?

You better prove this, otherwise you just made your situation worse.
 
It's strange to see the end of the forum. The OT helped me grow into the person I am today and always inspired me to be the best person I could be. To see the entire OT community treated as a disease to be excised is extremely saddening. Everyday, I was excited to check this forum to see what people I felt held the same interests and values as me were up to. Sometimes it was crazy shit. Other times they were coming together to support each other. There's been ups and downs but to reject an entire section of the community in spite of the sheer magic they've brought to this place is further proof of a malicious shortsightedness. Thanks to all the people who've made me laugh, gasp, and cry in my time here and I wish you well wherever you may be.
 
Japan is dead. It's full of weebs anyway.

:O noooo. Haha.


Anyways. I want OT back. BOX office, travel, sports, toys. Random news.

I also thought the moderation wasn't that strict here either. I never felt I couldn't say what was on my mind. I discussed things like I would in an office setting. Never had any problems.
 

marc^o^

Nintendo's Pro Bono PR Firm
The only thing clear was that there was a group of users with mod assistance that liked to paint people who disagree with them as GG, racist, sexist, russian spies or whatever the current hated things was in games journalism. It was (and continues to be) pathetic when people appealed to mods to get rid of dissenters.
Evilore was kinda punished already, appearing naked and looking like a fool. Did he abuse her? Nope. She told him wtf, and he left. What is the story again?

And he was half right with the feeling he had that she would want it at that moment: she would later be excited enough to sleep with him, which makes this outrage an overreaction of epic proportions.

To add to this, this misconduct we are judging is absolutely nothing, and ridiculous, compared to the values and sanity neogaf has been protecting for years.

Based on both versions and these elements I have read, I’m staying.
 

Matty8787

Member
Ya know what? I am all for the OT to be canned... it was nothing but trouble anyway, any points made down there that you had a slight disagreement with meant you being hounded out or banned.

I am here for the games and if that's all GAF will be then I may hang around.
 
This entire thread just shows once again what is wrong with internet communities and social media nowadays: shitposting, accusations with no proof, assumptions, crucifying someone just for the heck of it. And let's not forget that fucking political correctness, so trendy right now.

There's a saying in my country: you see the needle in someone else's eye, but too blind to see the tree in your own.
 

Chariot

Member
There was a lot of good in Off-Topic, but getting rid of the toxic dogpiling PoliGAF that harassed everyone that didn't conform to their concensus is not the worst decision.

Still most of GAF finest seem to have declared for Reset.
 

Buffalo

Banned
No you didn't , it was a simple question. How you, will disagree with a person like me in this political climate? It's simple.

reading doesn't really seem to be your thing so I'll reiterate and make myself crystal clear:

we literally just disagreed about something political in nature (because of you), as you believe that anyone who thinks this is good = evil Nazi Trump supporter, and I disagree. if you want to have a political debate then you're in the wrong thread, and from what it seems now, the wrong forum.
 
no, I'm advocating for a return to roots. i.e, not being a hivemind. it was no different than /r/the_donald outside of being for the other side.

if you're alright with the purging of anyone that thinks differently from you, you're no better, regardless of how you feel about it.

One would think that for the_donald or whatever the "other side" is anyone not straight, white, and male would be enough to make someone take pause before throwing out such a false equivalency.
 

Fercho

Member
Nekketsu Kõha;252776583 said:
So now I voted for Trump?

Be difficult if you ask me since I live in Sweden and do not have American citizenship. I am also a moderate politically which means I believe in free healthcare and other "radical" ideas.

At least you answered my question which was to show how dumb you are and how stupid the extreme left political GAF was and how much damage you guys did when you dogpile and ban anyone you didn't like while throwing made yo allegations their way without a means for anyone to defend themselves.

Hope you get to enjoy your ResistEra soon enough.

And if resistEra (or GAF) continues with the same hardline in not tolerating little hateful toads like you who only felt enbolded to speak their minds among a caos that fits your shitty views, I will be there day one.
 

CrazyHal

Member
Count me as one of the folks who're happy that the site is back up.

The extreme political and correct side of the site was a part that I never cared for. I believe that no one is a saint, that everybody makes mistakes and that people can and should learn from those mistakes instead of condemning them for the rest of their lives. Throwing around insults when complaining about racism, facism, or a different topic never added much to the discussion.

Yeah i agreed with you here. I have been a neogaf member for 2 years and i have seen that attitude of immediately comdemning someone (sometimes without knowing all the facts) and talking about them like they should be damned for the rest of their lives, like there is no second chance, no chance at redemption for them, way to often.

It's completely unreasonable.

We humans are flawed in nature. We all make mistakes sometimes and we all had moments in our lives in which we acted like a shitty person. I feel like many of these members view the world in black and white instead of a shade of grey.

Honestly? I'm glad that many of them are going away.
 

mcfizzle4

Member
Errrr, victim blaming and mental issues allegations?

You better prove this, otherwise you just made your situation worse.
Exactly, everyone is too blame for this situation but the person responsible. The statement is not adequate or even appropriate and expressing that seems to end up in a ban.
 
EviLore/Mods saying there will be no more social/political discussion allowed on GAF while closing threads that are critical of NeoGAF's ongoing reputation (I'm not just talking about shitposts and account suicides either, of which there are a lot ATM) but keeping threads like the GAF will always support minorities/lgbt thread open are kind of emblematic that y'all didn't learn a damn thing about the criticisms about transparency, authoritarian and preferential modding, elastic policies, censorship against challenging opinions, and self-protective reflexes that have come to characterize modding on GAF in recent years.

And the firsts two posts in this thread reflect that. They fail to adequately acknowledge these characterizations that were anything but fringe opinions, fail to address them in favour of creating even less accountability for mods, and have the gall to even be condescending to the userbase and asking them to behave and respect the mod team after everything that has happened and users have endured over the past few years. Who would've thunk that a less accountable authority with unilateral power wouldn't inspire much confidence in the community it governs?

In the most dire of circumstances this forum has ever faced, you thought it was a good idea to do that, and expect people to believe that the welfare of the community is your top concern when you double down on, without question, some of the most frequent critiques people had of this site and EviLore? How do you expect anyone to respect an establishment that pre- and post-crisis stubbornly puts itself before the community it serves? WIth an owner that prides himself on it's autocracy?

These have been issues for years. You have have worked to silence these issues for years. You created an anonymous authority for mods to more easily be passive aggressive, subjective, and dismissive in their modding. A sexual misconduct allegation shatters the site and fragments users who, now no longer under threat of expressions of their concerns being cause for oppression towards them, cite these same issues over and over again during the recess. The site re-materializes and you fail to acknowledge these issues, because, oh man, it must just have been this last year that got us all fucked up.

I'm not upset EviLore took a couple days to make a statement, I just didn't expect that after all these losses the site has suffered for him (and the remaining/current mod team) to be so defensive, unsympathetic, placate responsibility, be condescending to the community, and make such a weak excuse for not releasing that statement to the community when there are clear obvious channels like Twitter to do so for times exactly like these.

And the worst part? Now that we can see this stubbornness/arrogance is still alive and well, all of this will probably continue to fall on deaf ears, and you have yet to give anyone confidence it won't. Hell, a post like this might have even gotten you a light ban (at the very least a certain lock) a week ago. Shit, it still might, even though I'm well within the ToS. I don't know what it will take if such a cataclysmic event for this site doesn't make you see what's been clear to and echoing throughout the entire community for years or reflect upon the decisions with the site you've made over the years. It's at that point where people begin to question whether you are fit to be a leader or decision maker, or you're incredibly out of touch with both what the community was and is relative to where you've been trying to steer it.

Without attacking or being inflammatory (because that's against the ToS, of course), what's it going to take to engender that much needed introspection, EviLore and co.? I'm not sure there will be anyone or anything left by the time what people are spelling out loud gets put on the page. Actually, that might be the saddest part. The damage to the communities is done. Maybe they were splintered by the events of the weekend, maybe they were sent to Community to die years ago, or maybe they were nuked in their entirety by the actions of a minority of users.

I've been on GAF for maybe 8 years and reading much longer, and have, like many others, built relationships and found a home in several communities; some of which you genuinely cannot find comparable others elsewhere online (e.g. FGC-GAF). Not that it matters, because it really doesn't, but I've got one of the higher post counts of any members I've seen, too. It's hard to go from that kind of investment in and daily ritual of GAF to having to suddenly disassociate from it, but honestly? I still had a bit of hope GAF would emerge from the ashes, confront those plain-as-day-issues at last, and pass the clearly tainted brand away from what has tainted it and some may argue slowly tainting it over the years as well. The OP pretty much dashed any last chances of that, and any confidence I once had in this site is now gone. Dunno how it's possible GAF will ever get me back but if it can, it definitely won't be like this, and probably not with EviLore at the helm.

Quoting this because it doesn't deserve to be at the bottom of a page. It's just so true.

Everyone needs to see this, not just the mods but also the people who made OT insufferable. I want to say they know who they are but I doubt that they are that self-aware. People who use their inclusive "beliefs" as a cudgel.
 

Lego Boss

Member
Sorry to say this, but OT became toxic only because anything outside of a narrow discourse was allowed. That’s not because of the topics, but because of the way in which people would latch onto a popular (read: highly politicised left wing) position and continue to dogpile in some sort of self-justified whirl of piousness. The mods were fully complicit in this, quelling debate and acting as quasi enforcers of what became an echo chamber.

After a ban l did return to GAF, but only in gaming and even then, only half-heartedly. Your admission that OT was toxic shows how self-cannabilising it all was. You have taken the action of removing debate entirely and that is sad, but also provides a wider context of the state of the Internet.

I hope GAF survives and that Evilore is at least offered the opportunity to defend himself, but there’s a lot wrong with this place and that is really at the door of those who ran the site and couldn’t stand any type of dissension or difference. Many people on here paint themselves as holier-than-thou, yet will rubbish people based on their looks or how they dress. This is OK because sex predators are always fat and slimy aren’t they? Well perhaps they’re not. Perhaps they’re just like you and me.

I hope you don’t ban me for articulating this as GAF has become a key part of my identity over the past few years. But l suppose l won’t be surprised if it happens.
 
I don't know, in recent years, and particularly this year, I've seen a malignant discontent that has fostered a caution in me that prevents me from posting in any kind of contentious topics. However, what worried me most was a thread relating to the recent Weinstein revelations, Evilore made a point and a debate ensued. What I saw was a guy who had clearly developed a seething contempt for his community, it became very passive-aggressive and the thread started to look like a graveyard. My takeaway from that was that it's in everyone's best interests to just not engage the guy, and for someone running a community, that's an inherently awful vibe to give off. The playful relationship between the mods and the users has been replaced with something that has built into a resentment that has driven out some of the best posters here.

Moderation isn't easy, it's a mostly thankless task, but it can be rewarding and fun. I don't get the impression that it's fun for mods on here any more. And it tends to show through the various discussions where they interact with the community. Anonymous modding isn't the answer, but engaging the user's questions, talking about bans, moderation decisions and discussions with the community is a more natural way of doing things, because people are inherently curious. They like to feel like mods are equals and are just doing a bit of sweeping up on the side, and that they need not tiptoe around them when they enter discussions. Bans with sardonic messages don't engage users, they put up barriers.


Anyway, PM some NeoGAF discords, I'm interesting in trying it out.
 

Popsickles

Member
Just glad that Gaf is back and I hope this whole thing can just blow over and we can get back to the business of gaming. There has been too much emphasis on other crap and political shit lately and it's been hard to bite my tongue on many occasions over some of the narrow minded shit.
Long live NeoGaf
 
What happened to innocent until proven guilty?
As far as I know, he hasn’t been charged of anything. Until that, it’s all just gossip and word against word.
 

Undead Unicorn

Neo Member
And if resistEra (or GAF) continues with the same hardline in not tolerating little hateful toads like you who only felt enbolded to speak their minds among a caos that fits your shitty views, I will be there day one.

The offsite spin offs of 4chan and Something Awful did very well I guess. I'm damn sure the insane cop killing wannabe of LF's site still exist. Likewise the white nationlists of Something Sensitive.

And all the chans,...
 

Link

The Autumn Wind
It's strange to see the end of the forum. The OT helped me grow into the person I am today and always inspired me to be the best person I could be. To see the entire OT community treated as a disease to be excised is extremely saddening. Everyday, I was excited to check this forum to see what people I felt held the same interests and values as me were up to. Sometimes it was crazy shit. Other times they were coming together to support each other. There's been ups and downs but to reject an entire section of the community in spite of the sheer magic they've brought to this place is further proof of a malicious shortsightedness. Thanks to all the people who've made me laugh, gasp, and cry in my time here and I wish you well wherever you may be.
Agreed to all this, not to mention I felt so damn uninformed this weekend without the OT forum. It really was a one-stop news aggregate. So many stories and incidents I would never know about otherwise, not to mention the quickness in which breaking news was posted.
 

Buffalo

Banned
One would think that for the_donald or whatever the "other side" is anyone not straight, white, and male would be enough to make someone take pause before throwing out such a false equivalency.

how is it a false equivalency? they're both hiveminds and they both silence those who go against the narrative, and they both have a tendency to be hateful/vitriolic.

whether or not you think you're on the "right side" doesn't change this.
 
And if resistEra (or GAF) continues with the same hardline in not tolerating little hateful toads like you who only felt enbolded to speak their minds among a caos that fits your shitty views, I will be there day one.

You label me a Trump supporter and now a hateful little toad without a single thing to back that up and me telling you I am not.

I am honestly tired of trying to act civil with you and your SJW kind and will simply end our conversation now by telling you to go fuck yourself and happy to see your dumbass gone.

Hopefully things will change for the better now. Time to talk games on NeoGAF the reason for why I signed up.
 

Undead Unicorn

Neo Member
EviLore/Mods saying there will be no more social/political discussion allowed on GAF while closing threads that are critical of NeoGAF's ongoing reputation (I'm not just talking about shitposts and account suicides either, of which there are a lot ATM) but keeping threads like the GAF will always support minorities/lgbt thread open are kind of emblematic that y'all didn't learn a damn thing about the criticisms about transparency, authoritarian and preferential modding, elastic policies, censorship against challenging opinions, and self-protective reflexes that have come to characterize modding on GAF in recent years.

And the firsts two posts in this thread reflect that. They fail to adequately acknowledge these characterizations that were anything but fringe opinions, fail to address them in favour of creating even less accountability for mods, and have the gall to even be condescending to the userbase and asking them to behave and respect the mod team after everything that has happened and users have endured over the past few years. Who would've thunk that a less accountable authority with unilateral power wouldn't inspire much confidence in the community it governs?

In the most dire of circumstances this forum has ever faced, you thought it was a good idea to do that, and expect people to believe that the welfare of the community is your top concern when you double down on, without question, some of the most frequent critiques people had of this site and EviLore? How do you expect anyone to respect an establishment that pre- and post-crisis stubbornly puts itself before the community it serves? WIth an owner that prides himself on it's autocracy?

These have been issues for years. You have have worked to silence these issues for years. You created an anonymous authority for mods to more easily be passive aggressive, subjective, and dismissive in their modding. A sexual misconduct allegation shatters the site and fragments users who, now no longer under threat of expressions of their concerns being cause for oppression towards them, cite these same issues over and over again during the recess. The site re-materializes and you fail to acknowledge these issues, because, oh man, it must just have been this last year that got us all fucked up.

I'm not upset EviLore took a couple days to make a statement, I just didn't expect that after all these losses the site has suffered for him (and the remaining/current mod team) to be so defensive, unsympathetic, placate responsibility, be condescending to the community, and make such a weak excuse for not releasing that statement to the community when there are clear obvious channels like Twitter to do so for times exactly like these.

And the worst part? Now that we can see this stubbornness/arrogance is still alive and well, all of this will probably continue to fall on deaf ears, and you have yet to give anyone confidence it won't. Hell, a post like this might have even gotten you a light ban (at the very least a certain lock) a week ago. Shit, it still might, even though I'm well within the ToS. I don't know what it will take if such a cataclysmic event for this site doesn't make you see what's been clear to and echoing throughout the entire community for years or reflect upon the decisions with the site you've made over the years. It's at that point where people begin to question whether you are fit to be a leader or decision maker, or you're incredibly out of touch with both what the community was and is relative to where you've been trying to steer it.

Without attacking or being inflammatory (because that's against the ToS, of course), what's it going to take to engender that much needed introspection, EviLore and co.? I'm not sure there will be anyone or anything left by the time what people are spelling out loud gets put on the page. Actually, that might be the saddest part. The damage to the communities is done. Maybe they were splintered by the events of the weekend, maybe they were sent to Community to die years ago, or maybe they were nuked in their entirety by the actions of a minority of users.

I've been on GAF for maybe 8 years and reading much longer, and have, like many others, built relationships and found a home in several communities; some of which you genuinely cannot find comparable others elsewhere online (e.g. FGC-GAF). Not that it matters, because it really doesn't, but I've got one of the higher post counts of any members I've seen, too. It's hard to go from that kind of investment in and daily ritual of GAF to having to suddenly disassociate from it, but honestly? I still had a bit of hope GAF would emerge from the ashes, confront those plain-as-day-issues at last, and pass the clearly tainted brand away from what has tainted it and some may argue slowly tainting it over the years as well. The OP pretty much dashed any last chances of that, and any confidence I once had in this site is now gone. Dunno how it's possible GAF will ever get me back but if it can, it definitely won't be like this, and probably not with EviLore at the helm.

Amazing post
 

Lego Boss

Member
Quoting this because it doesn't deserve to be at the bottom of a page. It's just so true.

Everyone needs to see this, not just the mods but also the people who made OT insufferable. I want to say they know who they are but I doubt that they are that self-aware. People who use their inclusive "beliefs" as a cudgel.

Amen and we’ll said.
 

JJD

Member
What is happening to GAF is a fucking tragedy. Despite all the issues our community have ( and there are a lot of issues) this site was still a special place for most of us.

Is there any place were I can check the reasons some mods left? I would like to know if and why Stump and Nirolak left. They were some of the best posters on GAF.

I will keep visiting the site and I hope it can bounce back from all this.
 

remist

Member
EviLore/Mods saying there will be no more social/political discussion allowed on GAF while closing threads that are critical of NeoGAF's ongoing reputation (I'm not just talking about shitposts and account suicides either, of which there are a lot ATM) but keeping threads like the GAF will always support minorities/lgbt thread open are kind of emblematic that y'all didn't learn a damn thing about the criticisms about transparency, authoritarian and preferential modding, elastic policies, censorship against challenging opinions, and self-protective reflexes that have come to characterize modding on GAF in recent years.

And the firsts two posts in this thread reflect that. They fail to adequately acknowledge these characterizations that were anything but fringe opinions, fail to address them in favour of creating even less accountability for mods, and have the gall to even be condescending to the userbase and asking them to behave and respect the mod team after everything that has happened and users have endured over the past few years. Who would've thunk that a less accountable authority with unilateral power wouldn't inspire much confidence in the community it governs?

In the most dire of circumstances this forum has ever faced, you thought it was a good idea to do that, and expect people to believe that the welfare of the community is your top concern when you double down on, without question, some of the most frequent critiques people had of this site and EviLore? How do you expect anyone to respect an establishment that pre- and post-crisis stubbornly puts itself before the community it serves? WIth an owner that prides himself on it's autocracy?

These have been issues for years. You have have worked to silence these issues for years. You created an anonymous authority for mods to more easily be passive aggressive, subjective, and dismissive in their modding. A sexual misconduct allegation shatters the site and fragments users who, now no longer under threat of expressions of their concerns being cause for oppression towards them, cite these same issues over and over again during the recess. The site re-materializes and you fail to acknowledge these issues, because, oh man, it must just have been this last year that got us all fucked up.

I'm not upset EviLore took a couple days to make a statement, I just didn't expect that after all these losses the site has suffered for him (and the remaining/current mod team) to be so defensive, unsympathetic, placate responsibility, be condescending to the community, and make such a weak excuse for not releasing that statement to the community when there are clear obvious channels like Twitter to do so for times exactly like these.

And the worst part? Now that we can see this stubbornness/arrogance is still alive and well, all of this will probably continue to fall on deaf ears, and you have yet to give anyone confidence it won't. Hell, a post like this might have even gotten you a light ban (at the very least a certain lock) a week ago. Shit, it still might, even though I'm well within the ToS. I don't know what it will take if such a cataclysmic event for this site doesn't make you see what's been clear to and echoing throughout the entire community for years or reflect upon the decisions with the site you've made over the years. It's at that point where people begin to question whether you are fit to be a leader or decision maker, or you're incredibly out of touch with both what the community was and is relative to where you've been trying to steer it.

Without attacking or being inflammatory (because that's against the ToS, of course), what's it going to take to engender that much needed introspection, EviLore and co.? I'm not sure there will be anyone or anything left by the time what people are spelling out loud gets put on the page. Actually, that might be the saddest part. The damage to the communities is done. Maybe they were splintered by the events of the weekend, maybe they were sent to Community to die years ago, or maybe they were nuked in their entirety by the actions of a minority of users.

I've been on GAF for maybe 8 years and reading much longer, and have, like many others, built relationships and found a home in several communities; some of which you genuinely cannot find comparable others elsewhere online (e.g. FGC-GAF). Not that it matters, because it really doesn't, but I've got one of the higher post counts of any members I've seen, too. It's hard to go from that kind of investment in and daily ritual of GAF to having to suddenly disassociate from it, but honestly? I still had a bit of hope GAF would emerge from the ashes, confront those plain-as-day-issues at last, and pass the clearly tainted brand away from what has tainted it and some may argue slowly tainting it over the years as well. The OP pretty much dashed any last chances of that, and any confidence I once had in this site is now gone. Dunno how it's possible GAF will ever get me back but if it can, it definitely won't be like this, and probably not with EviLore at the helm.
It's fuckin sad, but well put.
 

Matty8787

Member
What happened to innocent until proven guilty?
As far as I know, he hasn’t been charged of anything. Until that, it’s all just gossip and word against word.

Bingo. Surely the onus is on her to prove these allegations?

Either way as I said earlier, I am here for the games and politics etc can take a nosedive.
 

Chariot

Member
Agreed to all this, not to mention I felt so damn uninformed this weekend without the OT forum. It really was a one-stop news aggregate. So many stories and incidents I would never know about otherwise, not to mention the quickness in which breaking news was posted.
I mean, there is Reddit. Find a sub or a few that suit you and you'll have a quick variety of news just like GAF.
 
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