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[Shifty1897]

Not for me. Besides the lag issue, which simply cannot be solved for 99% of potential customers, i'm not paying monthly in order to be able to play my games in what i could only describe as a subpar experience and i'm most certainly not giving any money to Google, arguably one of the most evil companies at the moment and well known for shutting down services at a whim. Plus, you have to over pay for the games compared to what you can get them for elsewhere

Google should have made it a netflix style subscription. Not that i would have bought into it then but i'm sure far more people would be willing to give it a try if they didn't have to pay for a controller, a subscription and each game

All that said, if it works for you i'm happy for you. I was just reacting to the blatant lie from the quoted post that input lag wasn't an issue. Even at the reveal event, there was input lag

So we're back to trusting games journalists when their findings affirm our own biases, huh?
Digital Foundry themselves found Red Dead Redemption had 70 Ms less input lag on Stadia than it did on Xbox One X, and 20 Ms above running it on a top of the line PC. Input lag exists for everything, but a proper connection makes it mostly unnoticeable unless you're looking for it.

 

[renzolama]

I’ll setup a recording and show my experience. I never experienced any of the input lag.

not sure why you don’t believe me.

oh well

Because you experiencing no input lag is literally impossible based on the laws of physics. These claims that the input lag is 'fine' are annoying to anyone with a basic understanding of physics and hardware/network limitations. If you can't detect the input latency because you're not sensitive enough to do so then fine, but saying it's not there is silly. We're witnessing the birth of the network version of 'There's no discernible difference in gameplay for over 30 fps'.

 

[Freedom Gate Co.]

How much did Kain pay you OP?

 

[-Arcadia-]

279ms is around 17 frame input lag. Why would anyone torture themselves with this kind of lag? I need to have snappy controls in my games.

I can even feel the difference when I play street fighter on my TV with 20ms input lag and on my monitor with 5ms input lag.

Exactly. I have a friend who plays fighting games at a semi pro level and he can even feel the difference between a TN panel (1ms lag) and IPS panel (5ms lag)

Just a mere 4 ms lag is enough to throw them off.

 

[renzolama]

So we're back to trusting games journalists when their findings affirm our own biases, huh?
Digital Foundry themselves found Red Dead Redemption had 70 Ms less input lag on Stadia than it did on Xbox One X, and 20 Ms above running it on a top of the line PC. Input lag exists for everything, but a proper connection makes it mostly unnoticeable unless you're looking for it.

You mean the Digital Foundry video where they measured animation speed rather than input latency?

 

[Spukc]

OP: i am having fun

THREAD: STOP HAVING FUN

OP: ​

 

[TylersProphecy4.0]

So, I actually purchased a Stadia founder edition and thought I’d post some thoughts regarding the whole thing.

Day 1 - setup

I was one of the lucky ones and received my code, all good. Setting up though was a nightmare! I couldn’t get the controller linked with the chromecast and no matter what I tried, I couldn’t get it working. I quit.

Day 2 - 2nd attempt

I got the controller linked and fired up Destiny and, I have to admit, I was impressed. I did a lot of ‘tests’ where I’d press a button and see how long it took to react and it was fine, no issues. I played for around 30 mins and after the first few minutes, I completely forgot I was playing in Stadia, it just felt like playing on a local console. It was that good.

Day 3

Fired up mortal kombat 11. Again, no problem at all. I had a blast and aside from one or two stutters, it was fine.

Day 4 - the ah-ha moment

I wanted to play some world of warships on my PC (yeah, yeah, sue me. I like it ) and hadn’t logged in for around 2 weeks. The first thing that greets me is a huge update which takes (in total) around 45 - 50 mins to download and update. Urgh.

Being a parent, I often only have a limited amount of time to game and I was somewhat peeved. However, that’s when I remembered I had Stadia and fired up Destiny. Sure enough, I was playing within moments and it was all good. I loved the fact I didn’t have to bother with downloads.

This one moment sold me. Sure, time will tell regarding the service but at that exact moment, I was more than happy with it.

Now, I do have a relatively fast connection (200 up and down on unlimited) but if someone had said to me 10 years ago that this would be possible, I’d have laughed at them. Hell, I remember playing unreal tournament on my 56k modem!

I know there are a lot of haters out there, but I thought I’d share this with you all.

I like this review.
I still think stadia isnt ready for prime time, but I'd be lying if your experience with it didnt make me want one just a TIIIIIIINY bit more than I had before I read about it.

Thanks for sharing.

 

[Katsura]

So we're back to trusting games journalists when their findings affirm our own biases, huh?
Digital Foundry themselves found Red Dead Redemption had 70 Ms less input lag on Stadia than it did on Xbox One X, and 20 Ms above running it on a top of the line PC. Input lag exists for everything, but a proper connection makes it mostly unnoticeable unless you're looking for it.

Nice straw man. Did Google manage to break the laws of physics? Because unless they did, there is input lag. More than on other setups. That's not debatable. I don't trust DF either btw

 

[ethomaz]

So we're back to trusting games journalists when their findings affirm our own biases, huh?
Digital Foundry themselves found Red Dead Redemption had 70 Ms less input lag on Stadia than it did on Xbox One X, and 20 Ms above running it on a top of the line PC. Input lag exists for everything, but a proper connection makes it mostly unnoticeable unless you're looking for it.

DF said X at 30fps have 50ms more animation lag than Stadia at 60fps in RDR2. At same framerate (60fps) Stadia add 29ms animation lag over PC.

So no... no connection can make input lag unnoticeable... it add more input lag over what already exists in the game running locally.

And the fact that in 30fps has only 50ms more animation lag than 60fps shows X has the advantage over Stradia.

Nice straw man. Did Google manage to break the laws of physics? Because unless they did, there is input lag. More than on other setups. That's not debatable. I don't trust DF either btw

He just misunderstood what DF said (or maybe are try to spin what they said).

DF compared overall animation lag between PC 60fps, Stradia 60fps and X 30fps... it was clear Stradia added addiction input lag over local.

 

[Three]

Nice straw man. Did Google manage to break the laws of physics? Because unless they did, there is input lag. More than on other setups. That's not debatable. I don't trust DF either btw

This isn't about the laws of physics. Yes there is more input lag depending on circumstances but it's not out of the question that you can have the same or better on stadia in other instances. As an example did you know that a wireless DS4 has less input lag than a wired Xbox one controller? It may seem strange or debatable but things aren't as simple as they seem. DF are probably not lying at all.

 

[Psykodad]

So, what if internet goes down? Does Stadia show improvement over local gaming?

Honestly curious.

 

[ethomaz]

So, what if internet goes down? Does Stadia show improvement over local gaming?

Honestly curious.

Nope. It offer less quality (streaming quality added to not delivering promised targets) plus added input lag over local.

This isn't about the laws of physics. Yes there is more input lag depending on circumstances but it's not out of the question that you can have the same or better on stadia in other instances. As an example did you know that a wireless DS4 has less input lag than a wired Xbox one controller? It may seem strange or debatable but things aren't as simple as they seem. DF are probably not lying at all.

DF clearly showed advantage of local over Stradia in terms of input lag in RDR2... the animation lag was 29ms bigger on Stradia.

X at 30fps has only 50ms animation lag over Stradia at 60fps that should put X at better position if it could run at 60fps.

 

[nikolino840]

Mmmh... someone with a not fast internet have tried stadia? Of course works well...but someone with a low internet Speed Is important to know if he was thinking to not spend Money on a new hardware

 

[nkarafo]

OP: i am having fun

THREAD: STOP HAVING FUN

OP: ​

Having high standards and being sensitive to frame rates, input lag, etc, can be a curse. So i envy the OP in that sense. But the more people tolerating low standards, they lower they get and that affects everyone.

So yeah, OP, stop having fun with that shit and help us make gaming better.

 

[Gavin Stevens]

Some people just don’t notice the input lag, and to them, I’m jealous.

To me? Even local games with it are unplayable. Couldn’t finish killzone shadow fall because of it.

 

[plushyp]

Showing your age there lol

 

[-Arcadia-]

Showing your age there lol

Somewhat. I was young when I watched it.

 

[TLZ]

I'm completely ok if this was a rental service.

Regarding not waiting for updates and patches, it's basically the same thing as keeping your console in rest mode and it does all that while you're away. This still has the advantage of playing straight away the first time though. But again can't digest paying the full $60 per game for only streaming it.

 

[nkarafo]

To me? Even local games with it are unplayable. Couldn’t finish killzone shadow fall because of it.

Local gaming was hit hard when CRT technology completely died. Gaming become laggier across the board, with every system and every game being affected ever since. Not to mention other regressions like motion blur and fixed resolutions/bad scaling. I don't think better static image quality and bigger size/smaller weight were worth the sacrifices. But people got used to it and now i see that it can get even worse with additional lag on top of the existing, already high, lag and people can still tolerate it.

The funniest thing i saw all month was the game Thumper being one of the Stadia games. I don't see how that can work, this game requires very good response/accuracy. Even locally it's hard to play well on an average LCD panel. When the game was released i still had my CRT PC monitor and only when i tried it there the game became natural and easy enough, without me having to rewire my brain thinking i have to press the buttons early all the time. On the CRT the game became a second nature to me. I suspect the time window tolerance wil be much higher on Stadia to compensate, but that will probably take the challenge away completely, especially if you play it on a fast TN panel or something.

 

[kraspkibble]

how dare you have a positive experience!

/s

i'm excited for streaming. Stadia has a lot of flaws and I do hope it improves. Of course people on here like games more than most people. We take games serious and some people take it extremely serious. A lot of people just want to quickly play a game without the hassle/cost of buying and setting up a console/PC. they don't care about input lag/latency/resolution/framerate. this is who streaming is mainly aimed at. i take my gaming seriously and have spend thousands on hardware to get the best out of games but even i am still excited for streaming. even for enthusiasts it can be exciting. we love games and the more people playing games helps this industry/community we are part of.

i haven't tried Stadia. when i can play it on my PC with my XB1X controller (wirelessly) then i'll try it out. if that is never possible then i probably won't bother with it. but if it does become possible i can see myself buying some games from Stadia.

we'll see.

 

[phil_t98]

Lol

You should check it out for yourself.

actually, would it work with any chromecast?

so are you happy that you are paying for a service where the currant console Xbox X out performs what you have. Red Dead 2 is far better on X thanStadia and next gen around the corner there gap may get wider. I know they are streamed off different tech than the stadia device itself but having the next gen hardware in your living room will always be better than stream in my opinion

 

[Skyr]

It’s fine if it’s meets your standards but for most of us it’s not gonna cut it. And no offense op but I’m not surprised you think it’s fine if you are judging it on a 9 years old 1080p tv. That’s not exactly enthusiast level anymore. Then again.. most people aren’t enthusiasts which could be the reason for stadia to be successful in the end anyway.

 

[GymWolf]

If you are having fun, i'm happy for you.

 

[Ballthyrm]

Except it won't. Bandwidth is one thing, latency is another, and they're only indirectly connected, sometimes. That round-trip latency is never going away, regardless of how much bandwidth you have, it isn't going to move datacenter A closer to player B. "Space Internet" will make it worse, not better, unless they manage to put a Stadia datacenter in geosynchronous orbit over your house. Good luck with that.

The quoted latency for Starlink is 25 ms, that's comparable to most fiber.

Once operational, I fully expect Data center to have large antennas to connect directly with the system, so yes yo would connect directly to the system.
As such, it would move you closer to the data center in almost every case unless you live close to one, as the data signal in space move in straight lines unlike the fiber on the ground.

It will never be as good as something calculated locally, but it will good enough to make most people not care (This is not were Stadia is right now)
Latency prevention measure that the devs themselves can do inside the game also exist , like GGPO rollback netcode used in fighting games.

BTW, Starlink achieved a stable connection (612 Mbps) with a military plane during testing.
If they can keep that working, i wouldn't worry too much about about the rest.

 

[bitbydeath]

Some people just don’t notice the input lag, and to them, I’m jealous.

To me? Even local games with it are unplayable. Couldn’t finish killzone shadow fall because of it.

RDR2 was the worst.
Must have been like 2 or so second input lag

 

[Kagey K]

Melissa Joan Hart was one of my first crushes. No matter what she does, she will never be better then Clarissa or Sabrina.

 

[Katsura]

This isn't about the laws of physics. Yes there is more input lag depending on circumstances but it's not out of the question that you can have the same or better on stadia in other instances. As an example did you know that a wireless DS4 has less input lag than a wired Xbox one controller? It may seem strange or debatable but things aren't as simple as they seem. DF are probably not lying at all.

It absolutely is about laws of physics. There are limits to how fast you send and receive information and every layer you add will add to the time it takes. That results in input lag. The controller situation is irrelevant here. The correct comparison would be a wireless DS4 vs a wireless DS4 that has to transmit your input to a server which then updates the game and then transmit the information back to you. There is no way that can ever match a well designed local system. Again, they even had input lag at their own reveal event and there are plenty of videos of people playing the thing showing lots of input lag while on good connections.

 

[Nitty_Grimes]

What was the issue with the controller refusing to connect and then suddenly working?

The old 'turn it off and back on again' trick?

 

[Spukc]

Having high standards and being sensitive to frame rates, input lag, etc, can be a curse. So i envy the OP in that sense. But the more people tolerating low standards, they lower they get and that affects everyone.

So yeah, OP, stop having fun with that shit and help us make gaming better.

Boomer

 

[nikolino840]

What was the issue with the controller refusing to connect and then suddenly working?

The old 'turn it off and back on again' trick?

This or the Fonz trick

 

[nkarafo]

we love games and the more people playing games helps this industry/community we are part of.

I appreciate the positive tone and don't want to ruin it but...

Games as a streaming service will damage gaming in the long run. There are a few positives for gamers (mainly convenience) but a lot of negatives and not only technical ones. Ownership, for instance, is not going to be a thing in a streaming only future. It's only renting. Thus the benefits of streaming go to the publishers. It will give them full control over our gaming experiences, decide what to keep and what to kill and take away any little control we have over our games (like modding for instance).

Recently i replayed the original Dungeon Keeper on PC (my favorite game of all time). I wonder, would i be able to play it again after 20 years if gaming was streaming only from the beginning? Would it still be supported in the servers? What if the publisher decides it's not worth keeping anymore? Having the game files locally ensures i will be able to play this game in the future, no matter what the publisher decides for it.

We love games, that's why we hate Stadia and the streaming only future.

 

[ANIMAL1975]

Mmmh... someone with a not fast internet have tried stadia? Of course works well...but someone with a low internet Speed Is important to know if he was thinking to not spend Money on a new hardware

And in your last sentence you destroyed the top selling point of the streaming services marketing PR _ "play anywhere without having to buy a new hardware " and the cherry on the cake is having to buy the software too, not for me. Stadia isn't available in Portugal and not counting on it any time soon (lol Portugal is sonyland and only recently, after five years of waiting, Sony delivered PSNow _ adding a new server farm in Spain, not Portugal, Spain ) so, even if we had Stadia, with my crapy 12mb ADSL Internet (8mb down 1 up real count being in the end of the line to the phone central), the almost inevitable long distance to servers, and having to buy chromecast to play on TV, and the games.... No, wouldn't even try it with this business model.

 

[RealGassy]

Yeah if someone complains about input latency with Stadia, then they haven't played Stadia or have a terrible connection. There are a lot of valid arguments against Stadia, but input latency isn't one of them. Glad you're enjoying it OP. I broke down and bought a new video card for my PC recently, but before that I was considering using Stadia as a stop gap between console generations.

Over the years having had many conversations regarding framerates, refreshrates and input latencies,
I've come to accept that some people are essentially "brain dead" - and what I mean by that is that they simply don't notice those things, or their brain already has some sort of built in massive delay, so what's extra 50ms on top of that?

Other times those people simply haven't experienced the "good" things and have no frame of reference.

I can easily notice differences between as low as additional 5ms or 15ms latency, and I can't stand games at 30fps, and even 60fps is not nearly as comfortable as 120-144hz or more.

And if some people do don't notice the difference or enjoy crazy latency, well good for them.

 

[Gavin Stevens]

RDR2 was the worst.
Must have been like 2 or so second input lag

I could deal with RDR2 because it was third person, and it was a slower paced game that didnt need instant reactions. But KZ? Ugh, first person games with any sort of lag are horrible. I have Dishonoured 2 for Xbox One X and I can't even get far in it because while they upped the resolution and details, they did nothing about the quite frankly awful input lag. The first was amazing though... Pitty.

 

[Pidull]

Using actual data.

Yeap... no.
Stadia close to double the input lag.
I read on consoles the input lag is around 100ms for Destiny.

Remember when Killzone 2 had 150 ms input lag and the internet meltdown over it?

Even best case Stadia barely hits that. Yikes.

 

[UltimaKilo]

Maybe you did have a good experience but after the countless reviews I've read, it is obvious that you are one of the very lucky ones. Someones enjoyment really shouldn't depend on luck.... that is what Console and PC will always have over streaming.... consistency no matter the conditions.

It's no good if 1 person in 100 is really enjoying the service.... that is a failure in my opinion.

“Always” is so finite. It appears that streaming really is the future. The immediate future? No. 10,15, 20 years from now? Certainly. The infrastructure is just not there. Even under perfect conditions, there’s still considerable lag.

Nonetheless, it’s good enough for a lot of people right now, so they should be the testers. Call me in a decade when it’s improved, meanwhile I’ll stick to local play.

 

[V4skunk]

This thread reeks of damage control.
Stadia is a flop.

 

[too much eslim]

Yeah if someone complains about input latency with Stadia, then they haven't played Stadia or have a terrible connection. There are a lot of valid arguments against Stadia, but input latency isn't one of them. Glad you're enjoying it OP. I broke down and bought a new video card for my PC recently, but before that I was considering using Stadia as a stop gap between console generations.

Why not use xcloud? More bang for your buck.

 

[DeepEnigma]

Even your own personal enjoyment was delayed, like latency.

 

[Naru]

I can live with the latency since you have access to so many games with your subscr.... ohhhh.
Seriously though? Who is going to buy games on that thing? This needs a GamePass like sub to make it attractive.

 

[synchronicity]

This worries me the most. They will start developing all games with streaming services latency in mind. So there will be no difference in comparison gameplaywise.
They see the enthusiasts in their business model as the last of the dinosaurs.

Yes, as much as we like to think we drive the industry, that's probably not nearly as true as it used to be. If this method of delivery became the standard, I'd hope that services like Steam still allowed downloads, and of course there's always retro and emulation options to fall back on. I have no interest in a third party hosting hardware for me.

 

[Dontspeakforme]

I disagree. I’d consider myself an ‘enthusiast’ as you say

You’re gaming on a 1080p TV from 9 years ago. You’re not an enthusiast.

 

[-Arcadia-]

You’re gaming on a 1080p TV from 9 years ago. You’re not an enthusiast.

You know, we’re not all made out of money. It doesn’t mean we love games any less...

 

[VFXVeteran]

I don't think Stadia is going to go away as fast as some people here think. MS may have a better implementation and Google may sort out all the kinks in it. Who knows?

 

[RScrewed]

Using actual data.

Yeap... no.
Stadia close to double the input lag.
I read on consoles the input lag is around 100ms for Destiny.

The real issue is how much it varies, you could even get used to the input lag if it was ALWAYS 213ms, but the fact it varies a little here and a little there means you can never ever become skilled at a game.

 

[cormack12]

T Thanati is like

now Seriously though I appreciate the different insights from experiences. It's kind of infuriating at times when discussing streaming because there are so many variables. Even now, I cannot go into a thread where people say PS4 remote play works flawlessely and take them serious. I mean, it's a bunch of dirty ass and I know this kind of stuff inside out. It just doesn't function at a good, stable and leg free experience that I can overlook.

Then there are people like the OP who can just accept the inherent flaws because they're no big deal. Sometimes it would be nice to be like the OP and just be able to enjoy sub optimum fidelity for the sake of convenience. Stadia has drawbacks but cloud gaming in general is going to need people like the OP to make strides forward to get us to a level that is acceptable for most of us.

Here's to you op - enjoy your stadia and keep us informed over the next 6-8 months on big updates/bad upgrades etc.

 

[Slings and Arrows]

OP

Were you playing stadia from a Chromecast wired in to your modem or were you playing it on your mobile?

Because of all the reviews I've seen, it is local hardware vs local stadia

Someone show me this shit running on a phone, like they promised, because convenience.

Until then, Stadia is worse than any other streaming service (PSnow, Xcloud etc) because it doesn't offer the Local alternative

 

[Three]

It absolutely is about laws of physics. There are limits to how fast you send and receive information and every layer you add will add to the time it takes. That results in input lag. The controller situation is irrelevant here. The correct comparison would be a wireless DS4 vs a wireless DS4 that has to transmit your input to a server which then updates the game and then transmit the information back to you. There is no way that can ever match a well designed local system. Again, they even had input lag at their own reveal event and there are plenty of videos of people playing the thing showing lots of input lag while on good connections.

I'm not for streaming and I dislike the input lag but sometimes an advancement isn't about breaking the laws of physics. If a game is running at 30fps you have 33ms per frame. If a server can render that frame in half the time ot even in advance berfore user inpuy and you have a ping lower than 16ms you absolutely can get less input lag more responsive games but luke I said this is all too dependent on other factors region/network etc. You get a lot of pushback with that because it srems it's counterintuitive but I get the same pushback about laes of physics if I tell someone a wireless DS4 has less input lag than a wired Xbox one controller until they actually measure it. Other/all parts of the system come into play not just the distance between you and the local machine or the 'speed of light' that a lot of people quote. If somebody says it's not bad then it may be because things work well for them not because they are lying.

 

[Dipsed]

So, I actually purchased a Stadia founder edition and thought I’d post some thoughts regarding the whole thing.

Day 1 - setup

I was one of the lucky ones and received my code, all good. Setting up though was a nightmare! I couldn’t get the controller linked with the chromecast and no matter what I tried, I couldn’t get it working. I quit.

Day 2 - 2nd attempt

I got the controller linked and fired up Destiny and, I have to admit, I was impressed. I did a lot of ‘tests’ where I’d press a button and see how long it took to react and it was fine, no issues. I played for around 30 mins and after the first few minutes, I completely forgot I was playing in Stadia, it just felt like playing on a local console. It was that good.

Day 3

Fired up mortal kombat 11. Again, no problem at all. I had a blast and aside from one or two stutters, it was fine.

Day 4 - the ah-ha moment

I wanted to play some world of warships on my PC (yeah, yeah, sue me. I like it ) and hadn’t logged in for around 2 weeks. The first thing that greets me is a huge update which takes (in total) around 45 - 50 mins to download and update. Urgh.

Being a parent, I often only have a limited amount of time to game and I was somewhat peeved. However, that’s when I remembered I had Stadia and fired up Destiny. Sure enough, I was playing within moments and it was all good. I loved the fact I didn’t have to bother with downloads.

This one moment sold me. Sure, time will tell regarding the service but at that exact moment, I was more than happy with it.

Now, I do have a relatively fast connection (200 up and down on unlimited) but if someone had said to me 10 years ago that this would be possible, I’d have laughed at them. Hell, I remember playing unreal tournament on my 56k modem!

I know there are a lot of haters out there, but I thought I’d share this with you all.

Hey thank you for the AD but I’m good! Now ps5 and Scarlett can’t wait!!!!

 

[Grinchy]

Destiny 2 on PS4 already had borderline unplayable input lag. To imagine it could get worse than that is horrifying.