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Next-Gen PS5 & XSX |OT| Console tEch threaD

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TheContact

TheContact

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DJ12 said:
Well duh....

PS1, PS2 and PS3 would always be software based emulation as they are completely different architectures.
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It actually wouldn't be that difficult to hardware emulate PS2, and subsequently PS1 games. I mean, the original Phat PS3 did this with a chip. If you have a hardware PS2 chip, you automatically emulate PS1 games as well. The 3 would be much more difficult and isn't really likely unless you did it via software, which would probably run like garbage. 4 is also absolutely do-able given how close 4 and 5's architecture is.
 
Xander Crews

Xander Crews

Member
David Ricardo said:
Supposing it's real, if history repeats itself, they will present that design among a few others to Jim Ryan for him to choose the final look of the console. He can actually ask for the designer to change them or make something different just like Andrew House did when he had to decide the design of the PS4.

The thing to take from this design, if it's real, is that PS5 unlike xbox series isn't going to be a big box.
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I always wanted to know what the other initial PS4 designs looked like that House chose from. IMO, they've not topped the original PS4 design yet.
 
Gediminas

Gediminas

Banned
Gamernyc78 said:
This dominating the conversation bs is so annoying and dumb. Whoever drops the info dominates the conversation at tht point and tht can happen at any point in time so wtf does it matter? Not to mention ppl talking about dominating yet Sony drops a logo and gets 5,000,000 plus likes in a day 🤦‍♂️This isn't some one sided positive momentum for one console like ppl try to paint based off their frivolous narratives. If anything Sony fans are frothing at the mouth for info lol every second of every day.
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actually sony is dominating. everyone just writes articles about sony. some trash opinions pieces does not count as dominating. xbox pretty much trashed them self with "we won't have any FP xbox sx exclusives for two years". everyone now is booming about playstation meeting next month.
 
Lone Wolf

Lone Wolf

Member
Andodalf said:
Nah, the XO just reads the disc to basically serve as a license, then downloads a version of the game repackaged (I think as an x86 exe?) to run on their emulated platform. As such all BC games are digital, so if a game has licensing problems and can’t be sold digitally, it probably won’t be BC. I imagine PS will have the same issues.
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Doom 3 is backwards compatible and is disc only.
 
J

johnjohn

Member
HGamer said:
Well, looks like this is the PS5's final design? Does this design allow for those proposed rumored specs like 12+ TF and 3.2 GHz CPU clocks? It seems like it ain't as big as Xbox Series X....maybe I'm wrong.

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That is ugly as hell, here's no way that's what it's going to look like.
 
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LED Guy?

LED Guy?

Banned
Hmm....interesting...seems like this design might be a dev kit but not final? Looks near final to me IF it is Sony's choice. 🤔

 
joe_zazen

joe_zazen

Member
My all time favourite design is the 2013 macpro. Something else the internet meme machine killed. :(

Apple-Mac-Pro-Late-2013-image-1.jpg
 
PSYGN

PSYGN

Member
HGamer said:
Hmm....interesting...seems like this design might be a dev kit but not final? Looks near final to me IF it is Sony's choice. 🤔

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That design seems very susceptible to damage from falls, as such I don't think Sony who have been in the hardware industry for decades would be dumb enough to put themselves or their customers in that position.
 
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thicc_girls_are_teh_best

thicc_girls_are_teh_best

Member
Andodalf said:
Nah, the XO just reads the disc to basically serve as a license, then downloads a version of the game repackaged (I think as an x86 exe?) to run on their emulated platform. As such all BC games are digital, so if a game has licensing problems and can’t be sold digitally, it probably won’t be BC. I imagine PS will have the same issues.
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I'm perfectly fine with that tbh; emulators have only been getting better as the years go on.

joe_zazen said:
it would be nice, but sony’s record on getting OS level stuff is poor. Remember, name changes only came in 2019.

It is shit like that that, and expecting teams of 60-100 people to makeAAA games, that makes me very negative when it comes to Sony spending money on playstation. I am hoping ps5 is the exception, but personally, i am fully prepared for < 9tf console with launch games approximating what they had for ps4 In terms of quality and number.
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I'm still thinking it'll be between 9.2 and 9.7tf, but I'm hoping the 1st party launch titles are stronger than PS5's. PS Mini's emulation was poorly implemented and a bit of a bad sign from Sony regarding classic system emulation, but I hope they took the criticism to heart and will make sure they get it much better for PS5.
 
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sonomamashine

sonomamashine

Member
pawel86ck said:
2304 SP (36 CUs) x 1800MHz x2 = 8.3TF.

8.3TF vs 12TF would be still really big difference.
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That doesn't make any sense at all and wont happen, this is Sony we talking about, this is a huge gap.
Shmunter said:
Hmm think about it, 12th Feb, 12teraflops. it’s all adding up now
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hahaha
Imtjnotu said:
or if they wait till the feb 28th we get 28TF
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:messenger_neutral:
ThaMonkeyClaw said:
Wait, this year is a leap year, so February has 29 days! 29TF Confirmed!
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:lollipop_neutral:
ethomaz said:
Random twitter trying to be a insider to get attention :messenger_tears_of_joy:
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lol
Insane Metal said:
Some people are saying that twitter dude DrunkCat is legit, he leaked the PS5 devkit. The actual console image was leaked to 4chan but he's saying it's real, just not final. :messenger_hushed::messenger_hushed::messenger_hushed::messenger_hushed::messenger_hushed:

Oh God please no.
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I'm ready to go Baby Mode like @timdog & bet my account it wont be like that design
joe_zazen said:
My all time favourite design is the 2013 macpro. Something else the internet meme machine killed. :(

Apple-Mac-Pro-Late-2013-image-1.jpg
Click to expand...
That's what i'm hoping for (ps5) to be + a blue light ring on top.
 
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ThaMonkeyClaw

ThaMonkeyClaw

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thicc_girls_are_teh_best said:
Doesn't Xbox have native back-compat with 360 and OG Xbox, though? As in you can have a physical copy of the disc, put it in, then it rips the disc contents to storage and runs the game that way?

X basically uses a software emulator IIRC for OG Xbox and XBO, but they still run natively on local hardware. If PS5 doesn't support PS3 back-compat with that method, and we know chances it'll have a Cell co-processor are almost 0%, then that just leaves streaming.

TBH I don't know how much to believe PS5 won't feature some emulation-base PS3 back-compat. PC has cracked that a good while ago, Sony's own team can certainly manage that with PS5 hardware.

EDIT: Oh you mean hardware-based back-compat as in not emulation? TBH I think they'll use emulation for all the systems, and why not? The tech's matured now, they can optimize their emulations specifically for PS5 and get pretty close to the real deal. Most people who play via emulation do not care about 100% hardware cycle accuracy anyway, otherwise they'd just buy the older consoles or an FPGA-based variant (if available).



That's a reasonable concern for the price-related stuff, but again, keep in mind Sony and MS will be choosing one specific drive at large bulk. Now the issue with getting a drive that's both cheap and fast enough would depend on how many NAND modules they set up in parallel; if they went with a 1TB drive that's simply 2x 512GB modules for example, they won't hit near the maximum speed of the controller's limits. But they would save money that way vs. 8x 128GB modules, or 16x 64GB modules, etc. etc., per drive.

But yeah, I can see where you're coming from about the pricing. It's kind of why I think IF they try going with a drive to get around that bandwidth, out of necessity it'd have to be custom, because equivalent 1TB QLC NAND drives on the market right now are not getting anywhere near 6-8GB/s. And you bring up heat as well, which is important, which means that kind of drive in a console would very likely be tightly connected to the board and (likey) non-replaceable. That way it could be cooled with the general system cooling solution the consoles will use.

Unfortunately I don't know what the read/write speeds of general NAND chips are, but I found an article saying it can range from generally 1Gbps (128 MB/s) (some lower than that actually) to 3D NAND chips hitting an average of about 1.4Gbps (176 MB/s). Newer tech has some pushing closer to 3Gbps (384 MB/s).

So say the custom drives are using these newest of new chips (not unreasonable; Universal Flash Storage cards probably use chips like this since even Gen 2 UFS can hit around 1165 MB/s); to saturate say 7 GB/s bandwidth they'd need about 18-19 of those chips in parallel access. That'd at least handle the bandwidth issue, but not necessarily the capacity issue (each of those chips'd need to be about 64GB in size; technically 56.8 but chips aren't manufactured at that capacity).

But that'd be the best outcome; with 1.4Gbps chips they'd need 40 of chose chips, at 32GB capacities. And 1Gbps chips? About 55 chips (odd number, so probably 56), but the problem there is they'd need about 18GB capacity chips. So really either 16GB (they don't hit 1TB), 24GB (not as commonly produced) or 32GB (they'd push over 1.7TB of storage). That's probably the worst option, let alone NAND with even lower Gbps.

So yeah, it might be more economical if they're targeting closer to 3 GB/s speed with a 1TB custom drive sort of like AMD's SSG cards; best option then would be 8 chips in parallel, 3Gbps I/O, 128GB capacity. Or if they upped it to 12 of those chips in parallel, they could get around 4.6 GB/s. In either case, more cost-effective and TDP-friendly than targeting 7 GB/s - 8 GB/s, that's for sure.

...That's considering other specs for XSX in particular and figuring what the BOM for those would be, plus the power draw. If PS5 is closer to the 9.2TF - 9.7TF range, they would actually have more headroom for a faster SSD with the setup I mentioned above than Microsoft, because of the savings on TDP due to less-demanding GPU and less GDDR6 memory. Not to mention the price savings; all of that could be shifted to more NAND in parallel for a faster custom SSG-style SSD drive, even if both systems use a similar setup fundamentally speaking and go for same size (1TB).

At least that's how I figure it could go. Would still necessitate need for an optional drive, probably internal M.2, and regardless of whatever speed the custom drive would be (3-4 GB/s or 7-8 GB/s), would be noticeably slower than that. But that's okay, since it'd be mainly for cold storage.

Technically speaking, this kind of custom drive would be a good way for Sony and MS to create another potential peripheral segment; they'd use smart memory management regardless for them but power users would eventually start to wear them down, and desire a replacement. So those drives COULD be replaceable, but only with custom peripheral drives from Sony and MS. Honestly don't think this would be a big issue; people already buy multiple controllers, headphone sets, and other peripherals as-is. At least the custom drive brings something new to the game.
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You have this very well thought out! A couple other concerns that have been floating in my head is if they end up doing a non-replaceable solution what happens when you eventually max out the IOPS of the chips and that internal non-removable drive shits the bed, that is my worry if they do down that path then eventually you are going to have an essentially 'bricked' console because of the failed drive. I also worry about Sony and MS going custom on the drives if they make them replaceable because we all know the premium you pay for a 1st party accessory, the drive will end up costing more than a similar drive online. I am super curious how they are going to approach the storage in the system, and at this point it is just a waiting game.

onQ123 said:
I can't think of a logical reason for that design lol
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Brain hemorrhage?
 
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ANIMAL1975

ANIMAL1975

Member
Gediminas

Gediminas

Banned
gaming_noob said:
Sony fans: It’s gunna be Sony related 😎

Xbox fans: It’s gunna be Xbox related 😎
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it is related to polishing the game. no one wants witcher 3 technical bugs/glitcher at launch. it's sad news but they need just to take their time.
it was actually easy to spot that they are going to delay the game. no surprise here.
 
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