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thicc_girls_are_teh_best
Member
Shmunter
Member
Maybe we are living in a simulation, nothing is real and there are no consequences to anything
HeisenbergFX4
Gold Member
The 9TFLOP PS5 leak doesn't sound right to me, I am leaning more towards 10-11 TFLOPS, 12-13 TFLOPS would be ideal.
Tommy Fisher ,
OsirisBlack , @VFXVeteran , and
HeisenbergFX4 other insiders can you please answer this question:
Will PS5 and XsX have Wifi6? I cant see any reason why it would not. Please, my mind needs to be at ease!!!
or in other words: KUCHIYOSENOJITSU!!
For what its worth everyone I have spoken with today is still in agreement that both consoles are super close.
Since I missed the boat on 12 tf spec not sure how much my posts are worth atm
Kazekage1981
Member
For what its worth everyone I have spoken with today is still in agreement that both consoles are super close.
Since I missed the boat on 12 tf spec not sure how much my posts are worth atm
:/
You dont know if both consoles will have wifi6?!
Sosokrates
Report me if I continue to console war
The argument about the simulation theory Elon musk puts up is rather compelling, but your deflection is usually a sign that u have no argument or a weak one.
HeisenbergFX4
Gold Member
I don't know but I don't expect it honestly.
Kazekage1981
Member
Tqaulity
Member
So check my post history...I've been saying between 11-13TFOPS since back in May last year. This won't be the last opportunity for me to say "told ya" before the system launches (cough* RAM, BC).
Anyway, yes the next gen of gaming should be pretty exciting. Given how bottlenecked this generation has been in terms of HDD speed, weak CPUs, and memory bandwidth, we should finally see the game software evolve in some meaning ways. Notice i said "next gen gaming" because it'll apply to PC, consoles, streaming etc. The consoles will up the baseline and the developers will follow with the bump in software which will benefit virtually all platforms. I'm emphasizing the software because the hardware is just metal and plastic...it's the software bump that will really bring the "next gen" experience.
But how much of a graphical leap with 12TFLOPs of RDNA 2 really be? Well consider this: The current flagship AMD GPU on the market is still the Radeon VII which is a Vega (GCN 5) architecture spec'd at roughly 13.8 TFLOPs. The current top RDNA GPU from AMD is the 5700 XT spec'd at roughly 9.75 TFLOPs (10TFLOPs if overclocked i.e. Anniversay Edition). So let's just round up and say 10TFLOPs RDNA vs 14TFLOPS GCN 5 to have easier numbers to work with. Now by most accounts, the performance delta between the Readeon VII and 5700 XT (OC) is anywhere from 3% - 7% (Radeon VII vs 5700 XT (1), Radeon VII vs 5700 XT (2)). Let's say 5% on average. First, that's real world data that shows you just how much more efficient RDNA is over GCN (40% more compute power = 5% increase).
Now a 12TFLOPs RDNA GPU is about 20% higher theoretical performance compared to the 5700 XT. So first of all, that says that the XBSX (and likely PS5) will come with GPU horsepower ahead of anything that AMD will have commercially available at least through the 1 Half of 2020. Compare that to the 7850 GPU in the PS4 at launch in 2013 which was decidedly mid-range by the time PS4 released and AMD had at least 6 GPUs more powerful than it available by that time (7870, 7950, 7970, R9270, R9280, R9 290).
Now when compared to Nvidia, we know that the 5700 XT is within roughly 12-15% of a Nvidia RTX 2080 on average (link) and within ~18-20% of a 2080 Super on average (link). Thus a 12TFLOP RDNA based GPU (20% higher perf than the 5700XT) should exceed a RTX 2080 and be very close to matching a RTX 2080 Super.
HOWEVER, all of that is assuming RDNA 1.0! The big X-Factor currently is how much more efficient is RDNA 2 really? Rumors suggest 30-50% which does seem a bit high. But even if we very conservatively say that RDNA 2.0 is 10% more efficient than RDNA 1.0, then a 12 TFLOP RDNA 2.0 GPU should be roughly as performant as a 13.2 TFLOP RDNA 1.0 card. That's >30% increase when compared to the 5700 XT. So yeah, that card would be above a RTX 2080S in real world performance. In fact, that is definitely approaching RTX 2080TI levels which is ~35% faster than a 5700XT in most games (link). Remember i was very conservative with the efficiency gains of RDNA 2.0. If the gains exceed 10% and is even closer to 20%, then folks we would be looking at RTX 2080TI level perf in a console for real!
Now everyone is throwing around the TFLOPs figures trying to make sense of it. The truth is that TFLOPS are just a theoretically calculation that by itself cannot be used to determine actual game performance. But notice what I did here was use actual game performance data from commercially available cards to estimate performance. This takes much (but not all) of the "theory" out of the numbers.
Expect great things next gen. Exciting times ahead!
Anyway, yes the next gen of gaming should be pretty exciting. Given how bottlenecked this generation has been in terms of HDD speed, weak CPUs, and memory bandwidth, we should finally see the game software evolve in some meaning ways. Notice i said "next gen gaming" because it'll apply to PC, consoles, streaming etc. The consoles will up the baseline and the developers will follow with the bump in software which will benefit virtually all platforms. I'm emphasizing the software because the hardware is just metal and plastic...it's the software bump that will really bring the "next gen" experience.
But how much of a graphical leap with 12TFLOPs of RDNA 2 really be? Well consider this: The current flagship AMD GPU on the market is still the Radeon VII which is a Vega (GCN 5) architecture spec'd at roughly 13.8 TFLOPs. The current top RDNA GPU from AMD is the 5700 XT spec'd at roughly 9.75 TFLOPs (10TFLOPs if overclocked i.e. Anniversay Edition). So let's just round up and say 10TFLOPs RDNA vs 14TFLOPS GCN 5 to have easier numbers to work with. Now by most accounts, the performance delta between the Readeon VII and 5700 XT (OC) is anywhere from 3% - 7% (Radeon VII vs 5700 XT (1), Radeon VII vs 5700 XT (2)). Let's say 5% on average. First, that's real world data that shows you just how much more efficient RDNA is over GCN (40% more compute power = 5% increase
).Now a 12TFLOPs RDNA GPU is about 20% higher theoretical performance compared to the 5700 XT. So first of all, that says that the XBSX (and likely PS5) will come with GPU horsepower ahead of anything that AMD will have commercially available at least through the 1 Half of 2020. Compare that to the 7850 GPU in the PS4 at launch in 2013 which was decidedly mid-range by the time PS4 released and AMD had at least 6 GPUs more powerful than it available by that time (7870, 7950, 7970, R9270, R9280, R9 290).
Now when compared to Nvidia, we know that the 5700 XT is within roughly 12-15% of a Nvidia RTX 2080 on average (link) and within ~18-20% of a 2080 Super on average (link). Thus a 12TFLOP RDNA based GPU (20% higher perf than the 5700XT) should exceed a RTX 2080 and be very close to matching a RTX 2080 Super.
HOWEVER, all of that is assuming RDNA 1.0! The big X-Factor currently is how much more efficient is RDNA 2 really? Rumors suggest 30-50% which does seem a bit high. But even if we very conservatively say that RDNA 2.0 is 10% more efficient than RDNA 1.0, then a 12 TFLOP RDNA 2.0 GPU should be roughly as performant as a 13.2 TFLOP RDNA 1.0 card. That's >30% increase when compared to the 5700 XT. So yeah, that card would be above a RTX 2080S in real world performance. In fact, that is definitely approaching RTX 2080TI levels which is ~35% faster than a 5700XT in most games (link). Remember i was very conservative with the efficiency gains of RDNA 2.0. If the gains exceed 10% and is even closer to 20%, then folks we would be looking at RTX 2080TI level perf in a console for real!
Now everyone is throwing around the TFLOPs figures trying to make sense of it. The truth is that TFLOPS are just a theoretically calculation that by itself cannot be used to determine actual game performance. But notice what I did here was use actual game performance data from commercially available cards to estimate performance. This takes much (but not all) of the "theory" out of the numbers.
Expect great things next gen. Exciting times ahead!
saintjules
Member
I'd be happy if we get something like this at the start of next-gen. And most are saying this is even based at low expectations.
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Dabaus
Banned
The reason people keep wanting some insider to claim the Ps5 is more than 9 teraflops is because people don’t want to believe that it’s true. I guarantee back in 2017/2018 when Sony said we want something powerful but we’re aiming for 399. Well how do you do that? Use less silicon but crank up the wattage, hence the cooling patent. But some unforeseen things happened, some parts are more expensive than they anticipated so while they planned on having a 399 decently powerful console they now may have to compete at the same price point Microsoft was aiming for at 499 but without the muscle to justify the price.
Factor in lockheart at 299, your looking at potentially losing huge amounts of market share in North America. Japan doesn’t really buy home consoles Anymore so now Sony is left with Europe being the main focus for market share. That’s ps3 era type stuff.
I get it , we haven’t seen what games Sony has. It’s not concern trolling, any criticism of Sony is immediately dismissed and that reminds me of 2005/2006. Sony went from complete domination to humiliation before. It’s a cut throat, volatile industry. But all this “Sony will be fine” waving things away is a mistake. I think Sony’s silence is a mistake right but I’m just an angry guy yelling into an (x) cloud.
Factor in lockheart at 299, your looking at potentially losing huge amounts of market share in North America. Japan doesn’t really buy home consoles Anymore so now Sony is left with Europe being the main focus for market share. That’s ps3 era type stuff.
I get it , we haven’t seen what games Sony has. It’s not concern trolling, any criticism of Sony is immediately dismissed and that reminds me of 2005/2006. Sony went from complete domination to humiliation before. It’s a cut throat, volatile industry. But all this “Sony will be fine” waving things away is a mistake. I think Sony’s silence is a mistake right but I’m just an angry guy yelling into an (x) cloud.
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TLZ
Banned
Is that you Klee?
Roronoa Zoro
Gold Member
I don't think Sony is going over $499. They gotta sell a lot of PS5 and don't have a weaker version to get the price conscious people
TLZ
Banned
Where can I find that tweet by the PS5 guy?
Roronoa Zoro
Gold Member
Sony would eat the cost before they'd let that happen. Xbox would suffer just as much from more expensive components and Sony isnt $200 more and a year late like PS3
saintjules
Member
Mendou
Banned
Absolutely incredible specs. If it's priced at $500 then that seals the deal for a lot of us. Hopefully Sony comes out with a similar spec to make the bar high for next-gen games.Looks like MS is preparing for the big, full reveal:
What You Can Expect From the Next Generation of Gaming - Xbox Wire
The future of gaming has never been more inspiring. Creativity in games is flourishing. New services empower you to discover more games—and bring you closer to the games and creators and streamers you love. The cloud creates a massive opportunity to stream console-quality games and play with the...news.xbox.com
saintjules
Member
I first started gaming playing games that looked like the ones below (and I loved them) so to me, what you are posting is mind blowing and kids don't know how good they have it!
OsirisBlack
Banned
Still my most anticipated game.
They mean everything. Also .... Sony.For what its worth everyone I have spoken with today is still in agreement that both consoles are super close.
Since I missed the boat on 12 tf spec not sure how much my posts are worth atm
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ph33rknot
Banned
Let me get my swordI am okay with that.
Oddspeak
Member
After all these years, this still gets me. He dodged that first shoe so fucking good.
LED Guy?
Banned
Yeah I can see you being very insecure, not saying CGI movie-like GFX, but it will be close.
Be happy and excited, consoles always move the graphics baseline in every generation when it comes to games.
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gamechanger87
Member
Tom posted 4 and 12 in November. No one picked up on it until the Series X reveal and he pointed it out.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
what do you make of the rumor from a poster here who said that the ps5 devkits were over 12 tflops but the final target was 10 tflops. is it possible your sources gave you just the devkit number and not the final retail number?Still my most anticipated game.
They mean everything. Also .... Sony.
Sinthor
Gold Member
WTF? Is that a PS4 title? That looks like Dark Souls on fucking STEROIDS...I mean...assuming that WAS actually gameplay and not some kind of clever cut scene? Looks pretty damn good to me! I'm with you...this would be fine with me!
Kusarigama
Member
For folks still misinterpreting Matt Hargett's tweet, they are called what is known as "Rhetorical Question"
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Sinthor
Gold Member
Well, I think your partially right. People want confirmation of the 9TF question specifically because of so many developers supposedly saying that BOTH the new PS5 and XBSX are so very close in performance. With MS saying 12 TF it's kind of hard to reconcile those statements. So people are understandably curious. Some are probably concerned. But bottom line, there's no hard evidence of ANYTHING to really give people a firm feel for where the PS5 will fall. We have those GitHub 'leaks' and then all these other supposed feedback from developers that would seem to run contrary to those leaks. Bottom line, time will tell.
I still think it's hilarious though that people seem to think that pricing difficulties with common components would affect only one manufacturer and not the other. To follow your logic here let's say Sony WAS targeting $399 for their box which falls in the middle power wise between two new Xbox systems. Let's say MS WAS targeting $499 or even $599 for the new "X" So if component shortages are making Sony target $499 instead of $399, do you really think that Microsoft can somehow magically still target $299 and $499 or whatever themselves? Seriously? That's not generally how this stuff works. Not unless they are both using very different components and that doesn't seem very likely. So I think there's a lot of wishful thinking on that end as well.
But again, in the end, time will tell and then we'll be able to analyze the WHY's of what is, till we're all blue in the face!
hemo memo
Gold Member
Just a reminder. Only 4 days until the end of Feb.
trancefreak64
Member
This looks hot AF. I am definitely interested in this game.
existensmaximum
Member
I loved having to use your imagination with these graphics though. I mean if some enemy threw a square at you, you just knew that was a grenade!I first started gaming playing games that looked like the ones below (and I loved them) so to me, what you are posting is mind blowing and kids don't know how good they have it!
existensmaximum
Member
I've noticed some people are throwing the 27:th of February around. That's actually my birthday and I've wished for Sony to reveal the specs so.. Yeah if say pretty much everything points to this date being the one! 
Classicrockfan
Banned
Damn cant wait to see the new eldersrolls running on these next gen systems,I hope they are using a new engine.
luca_29_bg
Member
TLZ
Banned
Exactly.
Fnord
Member
I first started gaming playing games that looked like the ones below (and I loved them) so to me, what you are posting is mind blowing and kids don't know how good they have it!
Me, too. My first system was a Pong machine. Every once in a while I stop and think about how far we've come. I imagine taking a current game like, say GTS, back in time and showing my Pong-owning self where things are. I wouldn't believe me. I'd say what I'm seeing is impossible. It's a good time to be a gamer.
Stuart360
Member
Oh yeah. And have you gone back to try and play some of them? They are tough! Lucky as a kid I had hours and hours to play. Definitely improved my persistence.
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devilNprada
Member
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LED Guy?
Banned
Well, we now have Xbox Series X with:
- 12 TF RDNA 2.0 with Hardware RT & VRS.
- 8 cores & 16 threads Zen 2 CPU at 3.2 GHz or around it.
- 16 GB GDDR6 with very high memory bandwidth (I think it's the safest bet).
- NVMe SSD as fast as the fastest ones out there.
Well, this here is better than 95-98% of PC gamers' gaming rigs, rivals high-end gaming PCs, that means PC gamers have to upgrade their PCs to be up-to-par with consoles now to be able to play those Next-gen games at 60FPS or higher settings, I would only imagine how much more powerful GPUs/CPUs/RAM/SSDs you'll need to even run next-gen games at 60FPS and higher settings and especially Ubisoft's un-optimized games.....Oh my!
- 12 TF RDNA 2.0 with Hardware RT & VRS.
- 8 cores & 16 threads Zen 2 CPU at 3.2 GHz or around it.
- 16 GB GDDR6 with very high memory bandwidth (I think it's the safest bet).
- NVMe SSD as fast as the fastest ones out there.
Well, this here is better than 95-98% of PC gamers' gaming rigs, rivals high-end gaming PCs, that means PC gamers have to upgrade their PCs to be up-to-par with consoles now to be able to play those Next-gen games at 60FPS or higher settings, I would only imagine how much more powerful GPUs/CPUs/RAM/SSDs you'll need to even run next-gen games at 60FPS and higher settings and especially Ubisoft's un-optimized games.....Oh my!
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ph33rknot
Banned
Thought Klee said no rnda2
LED Guy?
Banned
No he didn't say that at all.
Kagey K
Banned
Or they didn’t want to show all their cards before the river. (To borrow a poker term.)Gotta love it. MS released ALL that info about the new Xbox, but ZIPPO on price and no one thinks that's odd? Maybe there's a reason for that? Oh, but I forgot, ONLY SONY is affected by component pricing issues....silly me!
ph33rknot
Banned
He's not the twitter guy?
LED Guy?
Banned
No he was on ResetEra.
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