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[scydrex]

The average speed of the XSXs 13.5gig of RAM for games is 500GB/s, while the 13.5gig of PS5 RAM for games is 448GB/s. So 10% faster RAM for XSX.
The XSX GPU is more powerful by 18%.
The CPU is faster.
The CPU and GPU have fixed speeds, unlike the PS5. Far better for developers.
The XSX has both VRS and ML that the PS5 doesn't.
The PS5 has a faster SSD, which will give faster game load times....by maybe a second or two.
In game streaming of assets there will be of no benefit.
The XOX put out full 4k resolution using a old mechanical drive with 140MB/s speed, feeding into slower GDDR 5 RAM on a smaller bus. The XSX SSD will feed 4.8GB/s of data into faster GDDR6 RAM. There will.be no bottlenecks from the XSX point of view. If you say there will be, well that doesnt bode well for PS5, as it has slower RAM than the XSX, so it's bottleneck will be worse.
Sure the PS5 will load up PS5 games twice as fast as XSX. Sony want games loaded up in one second. Which means the XSX will load games up in two seconds. I'm not sure anyone is going to care about that in the slightest.

Now having said all that, the PS5 will be just fine. I expect third party devs to use the PS5 as lead and port over to XSX. So unless the game has frame rate issues on PS5 I expect parity from third party games. So, the extra power will be in the hands of MSs studios to do something with.

How do you know it doesn't have VRS or ML? Because Sony didn't mention it? Both are RDNA 2 base no? Maybe it will...

 

[JareBear: Remastered]

reminds me of this:https://www.neogaf.com/threads/base...it-arguably-counts-foliage-breakdown.1471556/

that guy was legend

 

[JareBear: Remastered]

They're not custom cards..... the PS5 ones are off the shelf but have to fit the port....

have to be specific size and specification

they aren’t available on shelves currently, no idea when they will be available and who from.

Almost certainly will cost more than than the Seagate XsX expansions

nvme pci 4.0 cards are not cheap

 

[Bryank75]

According to Eurogamer, the Sony GPU might not be complete feature RDNA2. They're not sure yet till they look at the internals and performance. I have awful feeling Sony ray tracing will not be same as Microsoft.
MS implies they have dedicated hardware AC in the box that offloading the ray tracing and shading/lighting changes are not done on the GPU.
MS claiming a performance of 25 teraflops with ray tracing on. Claim right now till we see for real!

LOL... all raytracing is done on the GPU.

 

[scydrex]

Honestly in the long run the XsX SSD expansion will probably be simpler and cheaper though. The custom cards required for PS5 might not even be available at launch and will be expensive as fuck

SSD was expensive at launch too. The XsX SSD will never be cheaper, that depends on MS pricing.

 

[Bo_Hazem]

Honestly in the long run the XsX SSD expansion will probably be simpler and cheaper though. The custom cards required for PS5 might not even be available at launch and will be expensive as fuck

You can always transfer un-used games to external SSD/HDD though. So can't see more than 1TB extension needed. I remember buying my 1TB Samsung 970 Pro for around $300 or more with a discount last year, 3.5GB/s read and 2.7GB/s write.

EDIT: Currently using 2TB HDD, owning 180+ games on PS4. Just delete old games.

 

[Marlenus]

You forgot that XSX has slower RAM bandwidth for CPU than PS5. And also if dev will use more than 10 GB of RAM ( in this case 13.5 for games like it says in spex sheet) average bandwidth speed falls to 476 GB/s. So, 28 GB more than PS5s. Also, PS5 RAM usage for games is still unknown thing

So do PCs by a long long way yet they obilterate current gen consoles and will still be faster than both these upcoming consoles.

 

[Bryank75]

It's really hilarious that Xbox people think these specs are going to make any difference... look at this year for example..

Dreams, Nioh 2, FFVII, Ghost of Tsushima, TLOU2 and loads more....

Xbox crowd looking at a spec sheet and have been told they won't get anything good for 2 years, I'd go further and say you will hardly get anything good for the entire generation with the record XBox have now.

Enjoy the spec sheet!

 

[Neur4lN01s3]

We still don’t have the hardware acceleraltion procedure for the PS5. That’s MS secret sauce for switching from the shaders. If the PS5 has a similar approach it might not be as bad that guys claims- the PS5 gpu not completing the work- it is passed off to dedicated hardware on the RDNA2 chip. There will be still low level shading on the GPU, but ray tracing will run alongside the shaders on dedicated hardware on the chip.

wait, Cerny said that Raytracing is based on amd rdna2 tech, he never said nothing about different dedicated hardware RT, am I wrong?

 

[Jigsaah]

Wow...the sheer amount of panic threads in the last 24 hrs have been mind boggling. The PS5 is gonna be dope, regardless of the specs. Calm down folks. My head is on backwards watching all of this spin.

 

[Filippos]

You realize you will see every game in 120fps@4K as your output right?

Dreams, Nioh 2, FFVII, Ghost of Tsushima, TLOU2 and loads more....

true! Can't wait for those. Are they confirmed to be working on PS5 though? Have they confirmed all games are going to work? The blog still says only selected/tested titles : /

 

[Bryank75]

You realize you will see every game in 120fps@4K as your output right?



true! Can't wait for those. Are they confirmed to be working on PS5 though? Have they confirmed all games are going to work? The blog still says only selected/tested titles : /

I hope so, I guess I'll keep my Pro around for a bit... just in case!
Still a great console.

 

[sonomamashine]

that guy was legend

Some say he's the direct descendant of Big Boss, Solid/Liquid Snake where flawed sperm tests.

 

[Bankai]

Now for something REALLY important: I just got a NEOGAF ACHIEVEMENT!

Lots of Buzz (20 points)

So yeah, my work here is done. Bye!

 

[Insane Metal]

A super fast SSD does not instantly make up for a much weaker GPU and a weaker CPU. Sorry.

 

[Bo_Hazem]

This is the difference between RTX 2080 (10.1 TF) vs 2080 super (11.1 TF) vs 2080ti (13.4 TF)



Not to mention SSD advantages and "Secret Sauce"

 

[Filippos]

I hope so, I guess I'll keep my Pro around for a bit... just in case!
Still a great console.

Me too

 

[sonomamashine]

Now for something REALLY important: I just got a NEOGAF ACHIEVEMENT!

Lots of Buzz (20 points)

So yeah, my work here is done. Bye!

You should care about Gaf community achievement , you probably affected someone.

 

[Bryank75]

A super fast SSD does not instantly make up for a much weaker GPU and a weaker CPU. Sorry.

Yes it does!
Someone needs to explain it to you properly, why it's significant.

 

[sonomamashine]

Yes it does!
Someone needs to explain it to you properly, why it's significant.

Dozo

 

[n0razi]

At the end of the day... one of them has like ~$1000 worth of titles in its ecosystem that I bought and the other has nothing. I already have a gaming PC for the multi-plats so the XSX is a non-starter.

 

[Bo_Hazem]

It's really hilarious that Xbox people think these specs are going to make any difference... look at this year for example..

Dreams, Nioh 2, FFVII, Ghost of Tsushima, TLOU2 and loads more....

Xbox crowd looking at a spec sheet and have been told they won't get anything good for 2 years, I'd go further and say you will hardly get anything good for the entire generation with the record XBox have now.

Enjoy the spec sheet!

 

[Neur4lN01s3]

This is the difference between RTX 2080 (10.1 TF) vs 2080 super (11.1 TF) vs 2080ti (13.4 TF)

RTX 2080 have sustained 10.1 GFlops, is not 9.2 Gflops with peaks of 10.2 underclocking the cpu

 

[Bo_Hazem]

RTX 2080 have sustained 10.1 GFlops, is not 9.2 Gflops with peaks of 10.2 underclocking the cpu

It's within 2% as Cerny says, so it can go even beyond 2.23Ghz in favor or the other way around. Watch it thoroghly.

 

[Bankai]

You should care about Gaf community achievement , you probably affected someone.

I affected ALL OF YOU

Whether you like it or not, this thread has become entwined with thy souls.
Remember: IF IT AIN'T BALANCED, IT'S KINDA CROOKED

 

[sonomamashine]

I affected ALL OF YOU

Whether you like it or not, this thread has become entwined with thy souls.
Remember: IF IT AIN'T BALANCED, IT'S KINDA CROOKED

It's like CRACK.

 

[JTCx]

Bruh so the fuck what if the ps5 is a slightly weaker console? Everything is gonna be ok. Price and games is whats gonna dictate next gen.

Good lord the meltdown.

 

[Dunnas]

XSX 44% more powerful than Ps5 in Raytracing

No, it will scale with with the CU count and frequency, not just CU count, so the difference in RT capability will be the same as the different in TF. Everybody just took the 44% figure they saw someone tween because they liked the sound of it and ran with it, as is so often the case.

 

[ViciousAgenda]

This is as bad as the time MS was proclaiming the same nonsense with the XB1.

Just accept it. Sony got outgunned and outclassed.

 

[siekro1983]

I think you mean the opposite of balanced. come on man this is like seriously fanboy logic. the console is a hot mess.

 

[Filippos]

I think you mean the opposite of balanced. come on man this is like seriously fanboy logic. the console is a hot mess.

 

[Neur4lN01s3]

No, it will scale with with the CU count and frequency, not just CU count, so the difference in RT capability will be the same as the different in TF. Everybody just took the 44% figure they saw someone tween because they liked the sound of it and ran with it, as is so often the case.

no, RT units are more sensible to bandwidh than frequency

 

[Barnabot]

the 5 stages of loss and grief:

- denial and isolation
- anger
- bargaining -> you are here!
- depression
- acceptance

 

[XICEMAN]

- The Xbox has 16gigs of GDDR6, with a portion of it being used for OS and such. 10gigs of it is even faster than its PS5 counterpart (6 gigs is slower though).
- The Xbox SSD is a lot slower than the PS5's: roughly 4.8Gb/s VS 8.5Gb/s

In theory, the SSD on PS5 could just about act as a pool of "extra RAM". At least, that is what is speculated now.

An SSD, with actual techology, it's NOT a viable option as " pool of extra ram" even at 10GB/s (which won't be reached by ps5 disk) it's slower than DDR3 memory performance

 

[KlickKlack]

Yes it does!
Someone needs to explain it to you properly, why it's significant.

you mean that when i put the fastest ssd on the market to a system with gtx 1080ti and a midrange ssd to a system with rtx 2080ti that 1080ti will on paar?


faster ssd make only the load times in games better thats all and dont give you magical advantages...

 

[oldergamer]

why do we care about what a couple of ND employees think? Are they going to be anything other than impressed with the hardware? Can’t wait to see their first PS5 game in 2024.

Naughty dog has been streaming data in for their games since psx so i can see them being excited to change how they design levels to handle this with better hardware.

Still i dont see how this is a game changer in a way that it is any different then what is offered by the new xbox. Sure they have given more bandwidth to load quicker but to be honest i dont think you will see a difference in most games but some of the open world games.

What i mean to clarify is

1. How much data us really needed to benefit a game environment in real-time
2. Where does the nvme performance drop off? i have a nvme drive and its great when copying large files like 2GB but drops off on smaller files. Depends on the file system i suppose.

 

[KlickKlack]

I think you mean the opposite of balanced. come on man this is like seriously fanboy logic. the console is a hot mess.

stop trolling!

the console is LOUD hot mess

 

[Nero_PR]

SSD in this gen is an acronym to Secret Sauce Drive.

 

[Nero_PR]

Naughty dog has been streaming data in for their games since psx so i can see them being excited to change how they design levels to handle this with better hardware.

Still i dont see how this is a game changer in a way that it is any different then what is offered by the new xbox. Sure they have given more bandwidth to load quicker but to be honest i dont think you will see a difference in most games but some of the open world games.

What i mean to clarify is

1. How much data us really needed to benefit a game environment in real-time
2. Where does the nvme performance drop off? i have a nvme drive and its great when copying large files like 2GB but drops off on smaller files. Depends on the file system i suppose.

I agree with you here. The solution presented by Sony in delivering fast streaming of data is fascinating and game-changing, but... and this is a big BUT. Xbox is delivering something similar that can turn out to be the most targeted method used by the average developer, then what Sony is presenting can be seen as a gimmicky feature and only 1st party studios will get advantage from it. The average joe will probably stick with the brand of their already owned console, but the platform with the best 3rd party line up generally gets ahead in the long run.

 

[Leyasu]

I have a hunch that SSD will indeed be more than it looks, that it will affect to the REAL next gen experience

More cpu+gpu power = can output more and prettier pixels

but much faster SSD = can affect to game design of worlds, areas, physics, mechanics and the whole deal

Can you give some examples that will make games that much better? A few seconds faster than the xbox isn't going to be a gamechanger for sony

 

[JareBear: Remastered]

but much faster SSD = can affect to game design of worlds, areas, physics, mechanics and the whole deal

You need CPU power for these things too

 

[Jigsaah]

You're currently at Stage 3: Bargaining.

 

[Leyasu]

Just to add. Back in the day, GAF roasted microsoft when they claimed to have made a perfectly balanced system.

Now it seems ok

 

[ResilientBanana]

How do you know it doesn't have VRS or ML? Because Sony didn't mention it? Both are RDNA 2 base no? Maybe it will...

Variable Rate Shading and Machine Learning has nothing to do with RDNA2. Not to mention these would be very important to mention in a technical briefing, but Microsoft has been all over both of these technologies for years.

Variable Rate Shading (VRS): Our patented form of VRS empowers developers to more efficiently utilize the full power of the Xbox Series X. Rather than spending GPU cycles uniformly to every single pixel on the screen, they can prioritize individual effects on specific game characters or important environmental objects. This technique results in more stable frame rates and higher resolution, with no impact on the final image quality.

DirectML – Xbox Series X supports Machine Learning for games with DirectML, a component of DirectX. DirectML leverages unprecedented hardware performance in a console, benefiting from over 24 TFLOPS of 16-bit float performance and over 97 TOPS (trillion operations per second) of 4-bit integer performance on Xbox Series X. Machine Learning can improve a wide range of areas, such as making NPCs much smarter, providing vastly more lifelike animation, and greatly improving visual quality

What You Can Expect From the Next Generation of Gaming - Xbox Wire

The future of gaming has never been more inspiring. Creativity in games is flourishing. New services empower you to discover more games—and bring you closer to the games and creators and streamers you love. The cloud creates a massive opportunity to stream console-quality games and play with the...

news.xbox.com

 

[thelastword]

The internet today reminds me of 2013: "but the ESRAM", "but the Power of the cloud", "but the secret chip".

Apart from the fact that there was nothing on XBONES that was as fast vs PS4 vs some of these PS5 parts here against Series X......No one is talking about imaginary performance through the cloud either, people are talking design decisions and real silicon on the PS5 mainboard which removes bottlenecks from the GPU/CPU.....What we are talking here is tangible as opposed to imagined....

 

[BadBurger]

No one outside of these specialized online communities are going to know what the fuck a teraflop is or that playstation has more or less than xbox. This reminds me of when people were arguing about how much weaker the Xbox One was, even though the shit looked the same to me. Sometimes actually better. Fuck it man. We're talking about specs so much higher than what we currently have that there's no way it will disappoint unless you allow it to.

 

[Jigsaah]

It's really hilarious that Xbox people think these specs are going to make any difference... look at this year for example..

Dreams, Nioh 2, FFVII, Ghost of Tsushima, TLOU2 and loads more....

Xbox crowd looking at a spec sheet and have been told they won't get anything good for 2 years, I'd go further and say you will hardly get anything good for the entire generation with the record XBox have now.

Enjoy the spec sheet!

I'm actually more excited about the possibilities with Xbox offerings. What we've seen so far is great. Hellblade II and Halo Infinite is gonna be awesome. I don't doubt Sony is gonna be great as well. I don't really think of it who's better. More like, what's different. I appreciate the dichotomy in the offerings of both companies. I need my Ghost of Tsushima FFVII and the like, but that is not mutually exclusive to Halo Infinite Hellblade and whatever The Initiative has in store for the players. I just love games and the more diverse they can be in their offerings, the better. I get some people don't have a wide range of tastes and that's fine, it's your preference after all, but I would feel only half fulfilled if I only had one of the systems.

Hell I still feel I'm missing out because I don't have a Switch.

 

[Filippos]

An SSD, with actual techology, it's NOT a viable option as " pool of extra ram" even at 10GB/s (which won't be reached by ps5 disk) it's slower than DDR3 memory performance

oh no. So no secret dDDRSSD, no hidden ram in SSD

 

[Moneal]

No, PS5 is a 2019 console with RT thrown on top. I was sure Sony weren't going to be caught with their pants down, but they have been. If this were releaseed last year, it would have been a Pro/X situation and no one would care. Sure it is gonna sell well, this isn't a Sony is doomed post. If there is price parity, I expect PS5 to be at least $100 cheaper, we will see sales similar to 360 vs PS3.

 

[Filippos]

I'm actually more excited about the possibilities with Xbox offerings. What we've seen so far is great. Hellblade II and Halo Infinite is gonna be awesome. I don't doubt Sony is gonna be great as well. I don't really think of it who's better. More like, what's different. I appreciate the dichotomy in the offerings of both companies. I need my Ghost of Tsushima FFVII and the like, but that is not mutually exclusive to Halo Infinite Hellblade and whatever The Initiative has in store for the players. I just love games and the more diverse they can be in their offerings, the better. I get some people don't have a wide range of tastes and that's fine, it's your preference after all, but I would feel only half fulfilled if I only had one of the systems.

Hell I still feel I'm missing out because I don't have a Switch.

lol since I have a switch I didn’t touch my pro. Lol
Will dust it as soon as Got arrives - as long as it has great reviews/gameplay.