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Next-Gen PS5 & XSX |OT| Console tEch threaD

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D

Deleted member 775630

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Brudda26 said:
Except microsoft isnt pushing 3rd party developers for it. They are leaving it upto them wether or not to support it. Which is exactly what sony is doing.
Click to expand...
By pushing Smart Delivery so hard in their marketing and have CD Project and Ubisoft on board, they are pushing other publishers for this. Because I'm pretty sure Cyberpunk will have the same thing on PS4/PS5, right? So Sony should push this forward too, imo.
 
B

Bladed Thesis

Member
Neo Blaster said:
Sony have made compatibility with PS5 mandatory to every game released(forward compatibility) starting July 13th, so in the worst case scenario a third party won't offer free upgrades, you can at least play the exact same PS4 game on PS5 if you don't want to pay.

Anyway, I'm struggling to think a third party publisher would offer a free upgrade on one platform and charge for it on another, unless the platform holder is paying for it. Are we going to see free upgrades exclusivity coming next gen?
Click to expand...
July 13th doesn't cover TLOU2. So in a worst case scenario we would be playing a current gen copy on the PS5 with boost mode. Should be good but definitely not a upgraded, remastered quality PS5 version. I'm not saying you won't be able to play it. I'm saying it will be a backwards compatible version which isn't the same.

I hope we don't see more moneyhatting for exclusives, even if its just free upgrade bs. What a turd that would be!
 
Vae_Victis

Vae_Victis

Banned
Isn't Smart Delivery an optional program as well? Microsoft is using it for its first party games and is offering third parties the option to use it, but there is no mandate.

Isn't that's exactly the same thing Sony is doing?

You buy a game for XB1/PS4
  • If it is first party or the developer supports Smart Delivery/Cross-buy, you get the XBSX/PS5 version for free
  • If the developer doesn't support Smart Delivery/Cross-buy, you play the XB1/PS4 version on the XBSX/PS5 through backwards compatibility

EDIT: I guess Sony didn't come out and state explicitly that all first party games will support cross-buy, but since they did with pretty much everything that has a PSVita version I can't see them backtracking completely now when they need the push towards the new console the most. If there will even be first parties from Sony with two proper distinct versions, that is.
 
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ToadMan

ToadMan

Member
Bladed Thesis said:
So the XSX will launch with current gen graphics at 4k/120fps for first party games is what you're saying?
Click to expand...

Not necessarily. Perhaps they will sex up the graphics and make it 60fps.

I'm just saying there is a finite amount of power.

If a game maxes out an xb1p at sub 4k/60fps - bumping it to 4K/120fps on xsex will max out the xsex.

Xsex is twice as powerful (in terms of GPU tflops which isn't the whole story but whatever) as an xb1p - doubling the frames and the res will be a push anyway depending on the base res.

If you want Raytracing, more polygons, better textures and so on, then a compromise has to be made - lower the res or lower the fps.

It will depend on the game though - simple games won't be a problem but something like Halo - I don't think MS will want that not looking as good as possible on the xsex, so they'll be pushing next gen graphics as much a they can.


Also, bear in mind, a lot of TVs don't support more than 60Hz - perhaps if you bought a high end TV within the last couple of years it might, but most "mid range" 4k TVs of the last few years don't offer genuine refresh rates higher than 60Hz (avoid the marketing stuff offering enhanced frame modes - they're often not genuine refresh rate increases).
 
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Neo Blaster

Neo Blaster

Member
quest said:
When i buy the last of us 2 in july. In 3 years when they remaster it to help sell the last of us 3 they should upgrade my copy. Just like cyberpunk or Microsoft is doing there is no difference except Sony waited longer to do a ps5 version.
Click to expand...
That's a lot of 'what ifs' you're just assuming as fact and using to criticize Sony, why don't you just wait till they put all their cards on the table? They're yet to disclose info about features and services.
 
IntentionalPun

IntentionalPun

Ask me about my wife's perfect butthole
Vae_Victis said:
Isn't Smart Delivery an optional program as well? Microsoft is using it for its first party games and is offering third parties the option to use it, but there is no mandate.

Isn't that's exactly the same thing Sony is doing?

You buy a game for XB1/PS4
  • If it is first party or the developer supports Smart Delivery/Cross-buy, you get the XBSX/PS5 version for free
  • If the developer doesn't support Smart Delivery/Cross-buy, you play the XB1/PS4 version on the XBSX/PS5 through backwards compatibility
Click to expand...
It's cross buy with a backend system in place to support the concept.

That backend system is what Sony is lacking; or at least they don't have anything as advanced as smart delivery offers.

Will anyone support Smart Delivery only and not offer Cross buy on PS5? I doubt that.. but nobody really knows yet.
 
Vae_Victis

Vae_Victis

Banned
IntentionalPun said:
It's cross buy with a backend system in place to support the concept.

That backend system is what Sony is lacking; or at least they don't have anything as advanced as smart delivery offers.

Will anyone support Smart Delivery only and not offer Cross buy on PS5? I doubt that.. but nobody really knows yet.
Click to expand...
Yeah, but what does that backend system really entails? That the console automatically unlocks the different version if you put in the old disk and starts the download? I doubt Sony will make it much more obtuse to use, if not exactly the same, given how simple the whole thing is.
 
ToadMan

ToadMan

Member
IntentionalPun said:
That makes absolutely zero sense considering what we know about how smart delivery works.
Click to expand...

"When Halo Infinite launches alongside Xbox Series X and Xbox One this holiday, you only have to buy the game once and you’ll get the best version for whichever console you own, or both. If you pick up Xbox Series X for your living room, Smart Delivery will recognize that and deliver you the Optimized version there. If you decide to move your existing Xbox One to a bedroom or the office, Smart Delivery will recognize that too and deliver that version when you’re playing on Xbox One. "

https://news.xbox.com/en-us/2020/06/15/what-is-smart-delivery-xbox-series-x/
 
B

Bladed Thesis

Member
ToadMan said:
Not necessarily. Perhaps they will sex up the graphics and make it 60fps.
Click to expand...
So next gen graphics?
I'm just saying there is a finite amount of power.
Click to expand...
Nobody said there wasn't.
If a game maxes out an xb1p at sub 4k/60fps - bumping it to 4K/120fps on xsex will max out the xsex.
Click to expand...
That's an assumption. Also, you keep siting sub 4k/60fps current gen games like its the common denominator. On either console, it's not as common or that simple.
Xsex is twice as powerful (in terms of GPU tflops which isn't the whole story but whatever) as an xb1p - doubling the frames and the res will be a push anyway depending on the base res.
Click to expand...
What? These is all assumptions and severely underestimating the SSD, GPU, RAM, etc.
If you want Raytracing, more polygons, better textures and so on, then a compromise has to be made - lower the res or lower the fps.
Click to expand...
This applies to everything. Even the PS5. I don't see how this is anything more than hyperbole.
It will depend on the game though - simple games won't be a problem but something like Halo - I don't think MS will want that not looking as good as possible on the xsex, so they'll be pushing next gen graphics as much a they can.
Click to expand...
So next gen? You have said it wouldn't be next gen because it was an XB1 game but now its next gen. Which is it? Is it next gen graphics at garbage frame rates or not? Also, of course there's more than TF but why doesn't this apply to all next gen consoles then? Also, what about the Dirt developer who said they were hitting 120 fps and those trailers and gameplay graphics looked awesome? Is Dirt somehow a simple game?
Also, bear in mind, a lot of TVs don't support more than 60Hz - perhaps if you bought a high end TV within the last couple of years it might, but most "mid range" 4k TVs of the last few years don't offer genuine refresh rates higher than 60Hz (avoid the marketing stuff offering enhanced frame modes - they're often not genuine refresh rate increases).
Click to expand...
This applies to everything, not just the XSX. Don't see the relevence unless you're saying MS has decided to forgo next gen graphisc to focus on high fps while also knowing that a small portion of the market will be able to see that focus come to realization? Are you saying MS is that dumb? What? I mean, come on.

This is coming from a guy buying both next gen consoles day one but if we expect to cut out the fud when Xbox fans come in here with it, we gotta be able to call it out when the other fanbase peddles it.

Maybe its just me.
 
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IntentionalPun

IntentionalPun

Ask me about my wife's perfect butthole
Vae_Victis said:
Yeah, but what does that backend system really entails? That the console automatically unlocks the different version if you put in the old disk and starts the download? I doubt Sony will make it much more obtuse to use, if not exactly the same, given how simple the whole thing is.
Click to expand...
Yeah I think it's more about being able to tie 2 SKUS easily together and then it's all automatic from the purchase/download standpoint and acts like 1 SKU for the buyer whether they buy digital or physical.

Whereas Crossbuy is more of a policy from Sony where they let devs give away licenses but not some structured delivery system behind that.. which is why some games gave away codes last gen, and some had like menu options to unlock versions.
ToadMan said:
"When Halo Infinite launches alongside Xbox Series X and Xbox One this holiday, you only have to buy the game once and you’ll get the best version for whichever console you own, or both. If you pick up Xbox Series X for your living room, Smart Delivery will recognize that and deliver you the Optimized version there. If you decide to move your existing Xbox One to a bedroom or the office, Smart Delivery will recognize that too and deliver that version when you’re playing on Xbox One. "

https://news.xbox.com/en-us/2020/06/15/what-is-smart-delivery-xbox-series-x/
Click to expand...
Yes you can play it on both... not 2 copies though. (although like any digital purchase you can probably double dip, but that's been true on both PS4/XBO this gen)
 
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Metroiddarks

Metroiddarks

Member
From the user phfceramic of Era
CaIaMLi.gif


:lollipop_neutral:
 
Last edited:
Neo Blaster

Neo Blaster

Member
Bladed Thesis said:
July 13th doesn't cover TLOU2. So in a worst case scenario we would be playing a current gen copy on the PS5 with boost mode. Should be good but definitely not a upgraded, remastered quality PS5 version. I'm not saying you won't be able to play it. I'm saying it will be a backwards compatible version which isn't the same.

I hope we don't see more moneyhatting for exclusives, even if its just free upgrade bs. What a turd that would be!
Click to expand...
Sony's FP is a case on its own, I don't think they would risk all incoming backlash for charged upgrades for their titles.
 
ToadMan

ToadMan

Member
Bladed Thesis said:
July 13th doesn't cover TLOU2. So in a worst case scenario we would be playing a current gen copy on the PS5 with boost mode.
Click to expand...

I think Sony won't cut off such a highly rated game if there's an opportunity to push some consoles with it - not this close to release of the PS5.

I think after TLOU2 is out (they don't want people to hold off buying it right now), Sony will "reveal" the PS5 upgrades to try and tempt people to buy a PS5 run it on for the improvements.
 
JareBear: Remastered

JareBear: Remastered

Banned
Last edited:
Metroiddarks

Metroiddarks

Member
I was reading in the other site and now looks like Cerny said the numbers of 8-9 GB/s taking into consideration
the Oodle Texture when I found this absurd for the next.

5.5*1.5 (same number Cerny use for ZLib)=8.25 (here you 8 GB/s)
5.5*1.5*1.1 (Kraken was around 10% better)=9.075 (here you 9 GB/s)

So now with the Oodle Texture this number of kraken will increase even more, how much will depend of
different factors like how much data is texture and how good was compressed.

I am sure XSX also will use it but exists a difference the max point of decompression is already close in
the XSX 4.8 GB/s (real) vs 6 GB/s (max), instead PS5 has much more space to work 22 GB/s.
 
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ToadMan

ToadMan

Member
Bladed Thesis said:
So next gen graphics?

Nobody said there wasn't.

That's an assumption. Also, you keep siting sub 4k/60fps current gen games like its the common denominator. On either console, it's not as common or that simple.

What? These is all assumptions and severely underestimating the SSD, GPU, RAM, etc.

This applies to everything. Even the PS5. I don't see how this is anything more than hyperbole.

So next gen? You have said it wouldn't be next gen because it was an XB1 game but now its next gen. Which is it? Is it next gen graphics at garbage frame rates or not? Also, of course there's more than TF but why doesn't this apply to all next gen consoles then? Also, what about the Dirt developer who said they were hitting 120 fps and those trailers and gameplay graphics looked awesome? Is Dirt somehow a simple game?

This applies to everything, not just the XSX. Don't see the relevence unless you're saying MS has decided to forgo next gen graphisc to focus on high fps while also knowing that a small portion of the market will be able to see that focus come to realization? Are you saying MS is that dumb? What? I mean, come on.

This is coming from a guy buying both next gen consoles day one but if we expect to cut out the fud when Xbox fans come in here with it, we gotta be able to call it out when the other fanbase peddles it.

Maybe its just me.
Click to expand...

There's 2299 pages of great data in this thread to answer your questions - perhaps if you review some or all of it, your questions will be answered!

Enjoy :messenger_ok:
 
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sircaw

sircaw

Banned
B

Bladed Thesis

Member
ToadMan said:
There's 2299 pages of great data in this thread to answer your questions - perhaps if you review some or all of it, your questions will be answered!

Enjoy :messenger_ok:
Click to expand...
I've been here since day one and read everything since page one.

What you're saying just isn't there. Guess we'll see in July if these first party titles look current gen.

🤷‍♂️
 
Lunatic_Gamer

Lunatic_Gamer

Gold Member
Xbox Series S Could be Priced half as Much as the XSX: ~$200

According to sources, Microsoft may launch the Xbox Series S console, the Digital Edition meant for streaming for as low as $200. This will supposedly be the third console of the next-gen Xbox lineup, with the top-end Series X with an optical disk costing around $500, the disk-less variant at $400 and the streaming low-cost solution for a meager $200.

www.hardwaretimes.com

Xbox Series S Could be Priced half as Much as the XSX: ~$200 | Hardware Times

According to sources, Microsoft may launch the Xbox Series S console, the Digital Edition meant for streaming for as low as $200. This will supposedly be the third console of the next-gen Xbox lineup, with the top-end Series X with an optical disk costing around $500, the disk-less variant at...
www.hardwaretimes.com www.hardwaretimes.com
 
FranXico

FranXico

Member
Bladed Thesis said:
July 13th doesn't cover TLOU2. So in a worst case scenario we would be playing a current gen copy on the PS5 with boost mode. Should be good but definitely not a upgraded, remastered quality PS5 version. I'm not saying you won't be able to play it. I'm saying it will be a backwards compatible version which isn't the same.

I hope we don't see more moneyhatting for exclusives, even if its just free upgrade bs. What a turd that would be!
Click to expand...
Both Naughty Dog and Sucker Punch have confirmed TLoU2 and GoT to already meet the July 13th requirements. 1st party studios tend to start using new SDK versions sooner.
 
Lunatic_Gamer

Lunatic_Gamer

Gold Member
Gran Turismo PS5 Could Target a Mind Melting 240 Frames-Per-Second

We’ve already seen Gran Turismo Sportrunning in 8K resolution, but speaking with Australian media at a recent event, Polyphony Digital honcho Kazunori Yamauchi revealed that he believes 4K is good enough for games. The veteran believes that framerate is much more important, and he’s potentially aiming big for the PlayStation 5’s first incarnation of the massive simulation racing series.

“In terms of frames-per-second, rather than staying at 60fps, I’m more interested in raising it to 120fps or even 240fps,” he said. “I think that’s what’s going to be changing the experience from here on forward.”

www.pushsquare.com

Gran Turismo PS5 Could Target a Mind Melting 240 Frames-Per-Second

Need for speed
www.pushsquare.com www.pushsquare.com
 
Andodalf

Andodalf

Banned
Lunatic_Gamer said:
Gran Turismo PS5 Could Target a Mind Melting 240 Frames-Per-Second

We’ve already seen Gran Turismo Sportrunning in 8K resolution, but speaking with Australian media at a recent event, Polyphony Digital honcho Kazunori Yamauchi revealed that he believes 4K is good enough for games. The veteran believes that framerate is much more important, and he’s potentially aiming big for the PlayStation 5’s first incarnation of the massive simulation racing series.

“In terms of frames-per-second, rather than staying at 60fps, I’m more interested in raising it to 120fps or even 240fps,” he said. “I think that’s what’s going to be changing the experience from here on forward.”

www.pushsquare.com

Gran Turismo PS5 Could Target a Mind Melting 240 Frames-Per-Second

Need for speed
www.pushsquare.com www.pushsquare.com
Click to expand...

First thought

www.google.com

PS3 Tech Demo Runs Gran Turismo 5 in 2160p or 240 FPS

What's the team a Polyphony Digital doing besides finishing their upcoming Gran Turismo 5 racing simulator? Making some crazy ass tech demos with four PlayStation 3s hooked together to share rendering time. Not only can four PS3s create a 2160p image (that's four 1080p images for a resolution of...
www.google.com www.google.com
 
FranXico

FranXico

Member
Lunatic_Gamer said:
Gran Turismo PS5 Could Target a Mind Melting 240 Frames-Per-Second

We’ve already seen Gran Turismo Sportrunning in 8K resolution, but speaking with Australian media at a recent event, Polyphony Digital honcho Kazunori Yamauchi revealed that he believes 4K is good enough for games. The veteran believes that framerate is much more important, and he’s potentially aiming big for the PlayStation 5’s first incarnation of the massive simulation racing series.

“In terms of frames-per-second, rather than staying at 60fps, I’m more interested in raising it to 120fps or even 240fps,” he said. “I think that’s what’s going to be changing the experience from here on forward.”

www.pushsquare.com

Gran Turismo PS5 Could Target a Mind Melting 240 Frames-Per-Second

Need for speed
www.pushsquare.com www.pushsquare.com
Click to expand...
No. He mentioned 240fps as a dream of his.
GT7 targets 60fps.
 
HAL-01

HAL-01

Member
Lunatic_Gamer said:
Xbox Series S Could be Priced half as Much as the XSX: ~$200

According to sources, Microsoft may launch the Xbox Series S console, the Digital Edition meant for streaming for as low as $200. This will supposedly be the third console of the next-gen Xbox lineup, with the top-end Series X with an optical disk costing around $500, the disk-less variant at $400 and the streaming low-cost solution for a meager $200.

www.hardwaretimes.com

Xbox Series S Could be Priced half as Much as the XSX: ~$200 | Hardware Times

According to sources, Microsoft may launch the Xbox Series S console, the Digital Edition meant for streaming for as low as $200. This will supposedly be the third console of the next-gen Xbox lineup, with the top-end Series X with an optical disk costing around $500, the disk-less variant at...
www.hardwaretimes.com www.hardwaretimes.com
Click to expand...
these rumors are starting to make less and less sense by the minute.
now there's 3 boxes? How did lockhart go from a 4TF 1080p box to a streaming only box. And why is it so expensive compared to Stadia's equivalent ($130)
 
saintjules

saintjules

Member
HAL-01 said:
these rumors are starting to make less and less sense by the minute.
now there's 3 boxes? How did lockhart go from a 4TF 1080p box to a streaming only box. And why is it so expensive compared to Stadia's equivalent ($130)
Click to expand...

Wasn't there something about a dongle version being released? I wonder if that's the streaming only thing that's being talked about.

Edit: The rumor came from a forum - https://forum.beyond3d.com/threads/...-speculation-spawn.61679/page-17#post-2133292
 
Last edited:
Killer Sakoman

Killer Sakoman

Member
Bladed Thesis said:
I disagree with his seemingly annoyance at Sony, but he really is talking about the same thing as you.

Let me address your points in order:

Remastered: he is saying that Sony doesn't want to give you a PS5 copy of a PS4 game when you purchase a PS4 game because they want to remaster it and make you pay for it again. Again, I disagree this is the current sentiment but it has been done previously. TLOU for example.

Backward compatibility: you don't want backwards compatibility where you are effectively playing a PS4 game on the PS5. You want the PS5 copy of the game on the PS5. There is a difference. For example. If Cyberpunk 2077 launches on PS4/XBO and then comes out with a PS5/XSX version there will obviously be some changes to the quality of the game. Telling people "hey just play the PS4/XBO version on your next gen system, its basically the same" is doing a disservice to the changes and upgrades (if any) in the PS5/XSX release of Cyberpunk 2077. So there is a difference here.
Click to expand...
TBH, remastering games is not cheap. A company spends money and they need to make it back. If microsoft is providing these upgrades for free, it is because they are planning to grab that money from you from something else. It's not free.
 
Gediminas

Gediminas

Banned
Lunatic_Gamer said:
Gran Turismo PS5 Could Target a Mind Melting 240 Frames-Per-Second

We’ve already seen Gran Turismo Sportrunning in 8K resolution, but speaking with Australian media at a recent event, Polyphony Digital honcho Kazunori Yamauchi revealed that he believes 4K is good enough for games. The veteran believes that framerate is much more important, and he’s potentially aiming big for the PlayStation 5’s first incarnation of the massive simulation racing series.

“In terms of frames-per-second, rather than staying at 60fps, I’m more interested in raising it to 120fps or even 240fps,” he said. “I think that’s what’s going to be changing the experience from here on forward.”

www.pushsquare.com

Gran Turismo PS5 Could Target a Mind Melting 240 Frames-Per-Second

Need for speed
www.pushsquare.com www.pushsquare.com
Click to expand...
don't care, unless it is 2020 release. i really hope it is coming 2020 :/
 
HAL-01

HAL-01

Member
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