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[ZZZZ]

While the vast majority of reviews have lavished The Last of Us Part 2 with all sorts of praise, a handful of outlets — Polygon included — have been slightly more critical of the blockbuster game. According to Zacny, Vice’s review prompted a Sony representative to reach out on behalf of Naughty Dog.

The Last of Us Part 2 has become a minefield

Devs, critics, and fans butt heads over one of the year’s biggest games

www.polygon.com

Edit: I didn't know this was something that occurred in a daily basis, i think it shouldn't happen but according to people that work in the industry it's part of the job to expect a call depending on how you review the game, especially if you were part of the group that got to review it early.

 

[GaviotaGrande]

AROGANT SONY IS BACK

 

[V2Tommy]

I am suspicious of any outlet that didn't give it a 10.

 

[Kuranghi]

I can't believe I'm about to say this:

I really liked the Polygon review, I thought it was very fair and every time it seemed like they were going to go off on a stupid segway, they actually didn't.

I didn't reread it after release, did they update it with the embargoed stuff? I can't see anything added to it.

 

[Nikana]

Good grief.

 

[JordanN]

Reminds me of the modern day review scale.

If it's not a perfect 10, it's worthless.

 

[ToadMan]

I can't believe I'm about to say this:

I really liked the Polygon review, I thought it was very fair and every time it seemed like they were going to go off on a stupid segway, they actually didn't.

I didn't reread it after release, did they update it with the embargoed stuff? I can't see anything added to it.

It's not the polygon review they're talking about in the article. It was some other place - VICE...

Basically there's nothing in this article that's new.

This is (yet another) stealth TLOU bash and port beg in one like all the others.

 

[Eliciel]

Maybe they should Change Reviews scales to Something Like

1: Don't Play
2: Must Play

 

[Abriael_GN]

While the vast majority of reviews have lavished The Last of Us Part 2 with all sorts of praise, a handful of outlets — Polygon included — have been slightly more critical of the blockbuster game. According to Zacny, Vice’s review prompted a Sony representative to reach out on behalf of Naughty Dog.

The Last of Us Part 2 has become a minefield

Devs, critics, and fans butt heads over one of the year’s biggest games

www.polygon.com

Embarrassing.

I wouldn't give this much credit, to be honest. If the outlets involved and their love for outrage isn't enough of a red flag for you, let me explain a couple of things from the perspective of a gaming writer.

Among the responsibilities of a PR is to compile a list of all reviews from the outlets they work with, with notes on their feedback to give back to the developer. It's part of their post-review report.

It isn't as unusual for PR to ask for more details on why a certain criticism has been leveraged as the article makes it sound at least in my experience, because that helps them do that job. It happened to me several times to be asked to elaborate on my opinion, but never once I've been asked or even implied that I should change it. From what I read in that article, this isn't any different. Maybe the PR expressed their own opinion (which isn't crazy during a convo), but what I read here doesn't imply pressure.

Not all PR will do it, but personally, I don't find anything strange about being asked to elaborate on what I wrote, as long as I'm not pressured to change it (which never even remotely happened), which I don't really think is the case here either. It sounds like making a mountain out of a molehill for clicks.

Incidentally, I'm not here to defend Sony or TLOU Part 2. It's not a game for me and I don't have any particular appreciation for it (not into zombie outbreak stories or super-bleak stuff, and nowadays I like to play things that make me happy, not depressed), but I thought this POV would help to frame the issue in a less skewed way.

 

[Three]

Maybe they should Change Reviews scales to Something Like

1: Don't Play
2: Must Play

1: Don't Play
2: Might enjoy
3: Must Play

 

[Eliciel]

1: Don't Play
2: Might enjoy
3: Must Play

Approved!

 

[TheDuskwalker]

Here is the review in question by the way.

 

[Fake]

According to Zacny, Vice’s review prompted a Sony representative to reach out on behalf of Naughty Dog.

LOL

 

[Mista]

I don't understand. Whats the problem here exactly?

 

[Spukc]

I don't understand. Whats the problem here exactly?

Botw is better

 

[RasAlGhoul]

Wait...wait...wait.....polygon is still a thing?

 

[Abriael_GN]

I don't understand. Whats the problem here exactly?

The writer needed something to reinforce their argument that "The Last of Us Part 2 has become a minefield" and took the chance to frame this into something it isn't. At least, that's my impression.

The stalwart defense of Schreier's ludicrous "games are too long" thing is still the weirdest part of it all, though.

 

[FireFly]

Reminds me of the modern day review scale.

If it's not a perfect 10, it's worthless.

I think it makes more sense with a hundred point scale since you effectively have 10 points to distinguish between great games (90-100). If you're using the whole scale then I don't think you need all that granularity.

 

[firegamer273]

its actually 94 now on metacritic .

 

[Rbk_3]

Any game that runs at 30fps cannot possibly get a 10 from me

 

[Mista]

The writer needed something to reinforce their argument that "The Last of Us Part 2 has become a minefield" and took the chance to frame this into something it isn't. At least, that's my impression.

The stalwart defense of Schreier's ludicrous "games are too long" thing is still the weirdest part of it all, though.

So people are mad because they didn't give it a 10? Please don't say yes

 

[ZZZZ]

So people are mad because they didn't give it a 10? Please don't say yes

Yeah, VICE didn't shower the game with praise so Sony gave them a "what's up call" since they were part of the group that got to review it early. Apparently, this is normal.

 

[Abriael_GN]

So people are mad because they didn't give it a 10? Please don't say yes

No. No one is mad (well, I imagine some fanboys are, but that's irrelevant). Polygon's writer simply seems to be trying to create some artificial controversy with the usual "making a molehill into a mountain" thing.

 

[Bolivar687]

94.

 

[Oddvintagechap]

Damn do I hate Polygon and Kotaku opinion pieces. They sound like shit I would write to please my writing teacher. The arictle insinuates so much.

 

[stranno]

Some 10s are pretty random. IGN was like: playing non-lethally doesnt work but, oh well, 10/10.

 

[ZZZZ]

94.

Vice was part of the group that got to review it early.
The group that got the review 1 week early made it into the 96 MC score.
The average of the ones that didn't get to release the score 1 week early is 87, that's why it's down to 94.

 

[Nymphae]

I can't believe Troy Baker felt the need to jab Jason because he said games are too long, without even specifically calling out The Wokest of Us Too. Like I'm all for knocking the media whores down a peg, but he's not wrong on that one. "Critics don't matter" but I'm so fragile I'm attacking his non controversial tweets about games in general.

 

[Bolivar687]

Vice was part of the group that got to review it early.
The group that got the review 1 week early made it into the 96 MC score.
The average of the ones that didn't get to release the score 1 week early is 87, that's why it's down to 94.

Gotcha.

Since you mentioned it, it does raise an interesting question that the group who reviewed it after launch graded it 10 points lower on average than the early reviewers.

 

[samporter]

TLOU2 is not 96, it's 94 on metacritic. It's user score is below a 50.

There is clearly some manipulation with the critic's score. The shill game journalist gave it 10/10 when it should have been 8/10 or 9/10. This game is too divisive to get 10/10.

 

[Fake]

So people are mad because they didn't give it a 10? Please don't say yes

As I read the article, the VICE review of TLOUSpart2 make Sony guys reach Naughty Dog about what happens and them Naughty Dog reach the VICE reviewer about 'why' and maybe asking to open his mind or question about his reviewer ability.

According to Zacny, Vice’s review prompted a Sony representative to reach out on behalf of Naughty Dog.


“They felt some of the conclusions I reached in my review were unfair and dismissed some meaningful changes or improvements,” Zacny told Polygon over Twitter messages.

 

[Dibils2k]

*94

 

[Mista]

I can't believe Troy Baker felt the need to jab Jason because he said games are too long, without even specifically calling out The Wokest of Us Too. Like I'm all for knocking the media whores down a peg, but he's not wrong on that one. "Critics don't matter" but I'm so fragile I'm attacking his non controversial tweets about games in general.

ND doesn't like JS. Thats why Troy took a jab because they knew he meant TLOU 2

Lets be real here, that wasn't a general tweet. It was obviously aimed at ND and with JS being a cunt I don't expect anything else

Yeah, VICE didn't shower the game with praise so Sony gave them a "what's up call" since they were part of the group that got to review it early. Apparently, this is normal.

Umm this is pathetic. So you either highly praise it even if you didn't like it or you'll get a call? Lol

This even makes me not trust any review out there more now

 

[Mista]

dp sorry.

 

[Abriael_GN]

Umm this is pathetic. So you either highly praise it even if you didn't like it or you'll get a call? Lol

This even makes me not trust any review out there more now

There is no indication that the call was intended to pressure the writer to change their mind or anything similar, and according to my experience, that is extremely unlikely. Any PR, even the worst newbie, would know that's a very bad idea.

It's a PR's job (one of them) to gather and deliver feedback from reviews into a handy report for the developers, and it isn't strange that they may ask for clarification or more details. Which is what appears to have happened here.

 

[Mista]

There is no indication that the call was intended to pressure the writer to change their mind or anything similar, and according to my experience, that is extremely unlikely.

It's a PR's job (one of them) to gather and deliver feedback from reviews into a handy report for the developers, and it isn't strange that they may ask for clarification or more details. Which is what appears to have happened here.

Okay then, did they call any other site that gave the game a low score?

 

[Barakov]

Sony is going to have to take the L here. Try as they might they won't be able to dethrone Tony Hawk's Pro Skater 2.

 

[Nymphae]

ND doesn't like JS. Thats why Troy took a jab because they knew he meant TLOU 2

Lets be real here, that wasn't a general tweet. It was obviously aimed at ND and with JS being a cunt I don't expect anything else

Fair enough, just seems a little petty.

 

[Bryank75]

There is no indication that the call was intended to pressure the writer to change their mind or anything similar, and according to my experience, that is extremely unlikely.

It's a PR's job (one of them) to gather and deliver feedback from reviews into a handy report for the developers, and it isn't strange that they may ask for clarification or more details. Which is what appears to have happened here.

At least someone uses some reason and logic here.... asking for details for feedback is not a crime. These PR people are not working for the mob, they don't come around with bats (or golf clubs) if you didn't give the game a 10...

 

[Rikoi]

Yeah, VICE didn't shower the game with praise so Sony gave them a "what's up call" since they were part of the group that got to review it early. Apparently, this is normal.

Wow that's incredible. So if you don't give the game the vote that they want they intimidate you with a call.
It's obvious why people think game journalists don't make honest reviews.

There is no indication that the call was intended to pressure the writer to change their mind or anything similar, and according to my experience, that is extremely unlikely. Any PR, even the worst newbie, would know that's a very bad idea.

It's a PR's job (one of them) to gather and deliver feedback from reviews into a handy report for the developers, and it isn't strange that they may ask for clarification or more details. Which is what appears to have happened here.

This makes no sense though. If they want to know what the reviewer didn't like they can just read the review.

 

[kretos]

That's why you gotta love Sony, they seek

 

[Chromata]

I think game reviewers should be held more accountable for objectively inaccurate details within their reviews. For example, in the referenced Vice TLOU2 review, he says that you always have plenty of ammo, characters never question their vengeance, and the game doesn't explore why they sustain their quest for vengeance beyond just anger/grief. All of these things are just plain wrong. Resource scarcity can be adjusted to fit your desired difficulty, characters question their vengeance through multiple pivotal parts of the game, and the game explores the tensions/feelings of characters far beyond anger/grief.

This isn't to say that there shouldn't be dissenting opinion. There are a lot of reviewers who hated TLOU2 and for good reason. However, there's a big difference between "I felt disconnected from the characters and I believe the game did a poor job of contextualizing their vengeance in a realistic or believable way" vs. "characters never question their vengeance". This goes far beyond TLOU2 and it's why I just can't take mainstream reviews seriously. I'm talking things like IGN's criticism of Resident Evil 2 Remake having similar playthroughs for its playable characters when it doesn't and the reviewer just didn't do their due diligence. There's also the time when some review site docked points off Kingdom Come Deliverance for not having enough representation, when the game is clearly set in a time period where that would not have made any sense whatsoever.

What I really like about reviewers like SkillUp (who hated TLOU2, by the way) is that he does his research and makes in-depth reviews. Karak from ACG also recently released a review of TLOU2 and it was a really good one. Similar things can also be said for Angry Joe, his reviews are awesome. I just feel that there's such a large disparity in the quality of content outputted by independent reviewers compared to mainstream reviewers.

 

[Mista]

That's why you gotta love Sony, they seek

 

[Evangelion Unit-01]

Reminds me of the modern day review scale.

If it's not a perfect 10, it's worthless.

Definitely some truth to this. I also take issue with how every game gets compared on the same scale. Games are different. I am not going to review a FPS the same way I review Zelda. They are different and should be reviewed as such.

Games should also be reviewed by people invested in that genre. I should be reviewing RPGs and Shooters but should never review a fighting game, or at least not until I've spent time playing them. The audience should be kept in mind. Destiny is a massive game that a ton of people play everyday. It's not a 7/10 to those sorts of people.

Also live games need to be re-evaluated. Rainbow Six Siege is one of the best FPS experiences ever but it did not become that until a while after launch. Its not fair for it to still be judge by an old review score.

 

[Abriael_GN]

Okay then, did they call any other site that gave the game a low score?

No idea, but that doesn't necessarily matter. Their job is to write a report, so they'll likely call people who they believe can use some more details in order to provide them in that report.

The score here is irrelevant since Vice's reviews don't have any score, so I'm confused as to why scores have been mentioned in this thread several times.

 

[Bragr]

I never understood the reviews for this game, I like it a lot and would likely give it a 95 or something, but it's not hard to see why people would dislike the excessive length and very uneven pacing. I fully expected half the critics to give it like an 8 because of it, but for some reason, it seems 95% of the critic's feels it's mind-blowingly brilliant. The reception feels off like something is up, it's weird.

 

[Nikana]

There is no indication that the call was intended to pressure the writer to change their mind or anything similar, and according to my experience, that is extremely unlikely. Any PR, even the worst newbie, would know that's a very bad idea.

It's a PR's job (one of them) to gather and deliver feedback from reviews into a handy report for the developers, and it isn't strange that they may ask for clarification or more details. Which is what appears to have happened here.

In my reviewing days the only publishers I got a call was from Sony and Ubisoft. It's wasn't common at all for me.

 

[Mista]

No idea, but that doesn't necessarily matter. Their job is to write a report, so they'll likely call people who they believe can use some more details in order to provide them in that report.

The score here is irrelevant since Vice's reviews don't have any score, so I'm confused as to why scores have been mentioned in this thread several times.

True but I still find it weird since clearly their review wasn't to Sony's liking at the end of the day

Have you ever been approached by anyone after a review you wrote?

 

[kretos]

Umm this is pathetic. So you either highly praise it even if you didn't like it or you'll get a call? Lol

This even makes me not trust any review out there more now

“I was happy to unpack a bit of my reasoning, however, and received a perfectly cordial message in response,” Zacny said.

 

[SantaC]

Pewdiepie gave it a 6/10 and yes He has been streaming the game.