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Sony need to seriously start talking about enhanced BC
- Thread starter KAL2006
- Start date
I Love Rock 'n' Roll
Member
No. There was an important survey a few months ago. About next gen, people care the most about:
- BC at first,
- 2nd the price,
- 3rd the power.
If you don't care about BC, you are the minority (it's ok to be in the minority but don't inverse facts).
Self High Five
Member
Don Mattrick's "We have a console for that" argument by Jim Ryan:
/cdn.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_asset/file/19815897/acastro_200318_1777_ps5_0001.jpg)
Sony clarifies that PS5 will support ‘overwhelming majority’ of PS4 games
After the company hinted it might not support the broader library earlier this week.
www.theverge.com
Oh look. Eerily similar to MS's stance on BC
Goddamn biased media and their basic comprehension of the English language!
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Rattlehead121
Member
I'd really like this too.
Anyone who says "Na, just give us new games" is fucking in the wrong.
Anyone who says "Na, just give us new games" is fucking in the wrong.
Gamerguy84
Member
Can I get a link to the exact poll? Its just not making sense to me.. If thats the case than it is what it is but of course im skeptical.
If its true neither company should bother with a powerful next gen machine. Just a all in one BC machine.
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Rhazer Fusion
Member
If the PS5 has backwards compatibility, cool. If not, then it’s not a deal breaker to me. Question is, are people willing to pay even more of a premium price to get backwards compatibility with several generations of older video games? I’ll probably do it, but it really depends on the enhancements and how much more money we are talking about. Honestly, I rather they focus on the future with new games and make the PS5 the best it can be first, but having access to generations of games would be nice too.
I Love Rock 'n' Roll
Member
I was wrong, sorry. I think it was this poll were gamers want at 1st a good price and then BC.
You're kind of right. People by far want an affordable next gen and BC.
Gamerguy84
Member
Thanks for finding it. Lol thats kind of an odd poll.
The categories were cheaper price which did win at 37%, plays last gen games at 30%(which is extremely important), better graphics at 19%, exclusive games at 13%.
He should have next gen games as an option. I guess his poll is just saying next gen games are assumed.
In my mind I was defining BC as full BC. I agree with the poll saying play previous gen games.
I couldnt imagine the bloodbath either would take if they tried to cut off previous gen BC.
Sony should drop an emulator for PS2. They already have one for PS4 because I can download PS2 games and play locally. That would also cover PS1. PS3 would be the only one left out and they can cover that with NOW.
ANIMAL1975
Member
You make it sound like this happens with all games.
No, they have to be uncapped! If a game is capped at 30fps, devs have to make a patch.... and the exact same thing happens in ps4 pro when in boost mode.
Dude, ps pro also has an internal 4k upscaler... Wth!?
The_Mike
I cry about SonyGaf from my chair in Redmond, WA
My mistake if it came out like that, but no of course not. Only the games that got the treatment of course. But it was just for saying that it is possible.
I Love Rock 'n' Roll
Member
I'm so mad after Sony for no BC before PS4. At least, MS does it right.
TheCrimsnFuckr
Member
Yeah, Sony absolutely needs to clarify their backwards compatibility stance. When they first detailed the specs of the system, Mark Cerny stated that they expect most of the top 100 PS4 games to work at launch, which is laughable compared to Xbox and then failed to fix that gaf with the blog post until they were being torn to shreds by the media. But then, a dew days later when they did they only said this:
"With all of the amazing games in PS4’s catalog, we’ve devoted significant efforts to enable our fans to play their favorites on PS5. We believe that the overwhelming majority of the 4,000+ PS4 titles will be playable on PS5. "
Notice something missing there? There is no clarification of the overwhelming majority of games being playable at launch, just that they will in fact be playable at some point. Even though I shouldn't, I am willing to give them the benefit of the doubt and say that they absolutely meant at launch with this, but I am still hesitant from years of dealing with contracts.
But anyway, say that the overwhelming majority will be playable at launch. Will they automatically have better performance and run better? Will consumers need to enable boost mode to get better performance? Will every game work with boost mode? If a game does not work with boost mode, will Sony fix their system to make it work or will they leave that to developers? Will Sony or Sony's studios go back and patch their older games to be playable? Will there be any automatic enhancements applied to all BC games like on Xbox (16x Ansiotropic Filtering, forced V-sync, auto HDR etc)?
For Xbox we know that the goal is every single game playable at launch, and their only backtracking was a carefully thought out statement in legalese basically saying "our intention is every game, but there may be some games that have issues needing to be fixed" and I personally believe that they will fix any games with issues that get reported. Additionally, we know that there will be forced 16x Ansiotropic filtering, forced V-Sync and an Auto-HDR renderer applied to every single backwards compatible game, and we know that the Xbox team will also go back and increase the resolutions and possibly frame rates of older games all without developer input or messing with game code. Huge leap in communication and I hope that Sony will fix it soon
"With all of the amazing games in PS4’s catalog, we’ve devoted significant efforts to enable our fans to play their favorites on PS5. We believe that the overwhelming majority of the 4,000+ PS4 titles will be playable on PS5. "
Notice something missing there? There is no clarification of the overwhelming majority of games being playable at launch, just that they will in fact be playable at some point. Even though I shouldn't, I am willing to give them the benefit of the doubt and say that they absolutely meant at launch with this, but I am still hesitant from years of dealing with contracts.
But anyway, say that the overwhelming majority will be playable at launch. Will they automatically have better performance and run better? Will consumers need to enable boost mode to get better performance? Will every game work with boost mode? If a game does not work with boost mode, will Sony fix their system to make it work or will they leave that to developers? Will Sony or Sony's studios go back and patch their older games to be playable? Will there be any automatic enhancements applied to all BC games like on Xbox (16x Ansiotropic Filtering, forced V-sync, auto HDR etc)?
For Xbox we know that the goal is every single game playable at launch, and their only backtracking was a carefully thought out statement in legalese basically saying "our intention is every game, but there may be some games that have issues needing to be fixed" and I personally believe that they will fix any games with issues that get reported. Additionally, we know that there will be forced 16x Ansiotropic filtering, forced V-Sync and an Auto-HDR renderer applied to every single backwards compatible game, and we know that the Xbox team will also go back and increase the resolutions and possibly frame rates of older games all without developer input or messing with game code. Huge leap in communication and I hope that Sony will fix it soon
Slings and Arrows
Banned
I don't buy the argument that people care more about BC than price or power for a next gen console.
Surely, if price and power come under BC, wouldn't those people just buy an X or Pro for pennies?
Surely, if price and power come under BC, wouldn't those people just buy an X or Pro for pennies?
Umbral
Member
Well, of course, but I still think I’m right on this.
Gamerguy84
Member
Yep. I understood PS3 but give us PS2, and PS1.
Trogdor1123
Member
Fingers crossed, that would be great. PS1 at least would be terrific... And seems like a no brainer.
oldergamer
Member
I don't think sony can do this as easy as ms has. When you play a ps4 game on a ps4 pro, you dont get a benefit from the added hardware. Its literally running at the same speed. Part of the reason xbox can do this is due to abstraction. It lets ms not get locked into certain hardware specs in the same way.
Shmunter
Member
Go into settings and turn on boost mode. You’re welcome.
A.Romero
Member
You know who was on top of BC? Ken Kutaragi. Say what you will about Crazy Ken but he was 100% focused on product. Probably too much.
We all know Microsoft is really good at it. It's not Sony's strong suit.
When developing a product some things have to be prioritized. Sony's strategy seems to be to direct pretty much all investment into the development of games. Regretfully, that means losing features like BC. Microsoft decided to invest in BC and I think is paying off.
I really want PS5 to have BC just so I can play again some games from my older catalog but I'd be content with having BC back to PS4 as long as they continue delivering the games we have grown accustomed to.
We all know Microsoft is really good at it. It's not Sony's strong suit.
When developing a product some things have to be prioritized. Sony's strategy seems to be to direct pretty much all investment into the development of games. Regretfully, that means losing features like BC. Microsoft decided to invest in BC and I think is paying off.
I really want PS5 to have BC just so I can play again some games from my older catalog but I'd be content with having BC back to PS4 as long as they continue delivering the games we have grown accustomed to.
ZehDon
Member
With the 36CU count of the PS5 mapping 1:1 to the PS4 and PS4Pro's CU Counts, and Cerny's description of the hardware having specific modes that reduce its processing power to match the legacy hardware for legacy titles, I would presume "enhanced BC" is a patch from the Developer to enable a specific PS5 mode to take advantage of the additional grunt.
I doubt many developers will bother, because if the title already works exactly as it does on PS4, there's little incentive from the developers perspective to make it run better at additional expense to themselves. Enhanced BC titles is a benefit to the platform holder, not the developer. That's why Microsoft is handing it's enhanced BC in-house without developer input.
I doubt many developers will bother, because if the title already works exactly as it does on PS4, there's little incentive from the developers perspective to make it run better at additional expense to themselves. Enhanced BC titles is a benefit to the platform holder, not the developer. That's why Microsoft is handing it's enhanced BC in-house without developer input.
wipeout364
Member
BC for me is the one of the most important features. I have seen several people in this thread say Sony will have backwards compatibility for PS4. Has Sony said that BC is guaranteed on the PS5? I don't follow things that closely but the last I heard they had said they were trying to get the top 100 titles functioning, did they go beyond that.
According to this renowned expert on PS5, Sony will have perfect Backwards compatibility so I guess there is nothing to worry about, this was his response when I questioned whether Sony had their shit together on BC in another thread:
According to this renowned expert on PS5, Sony will have perfect Backwards compatibility so I guess there is nothing to worry about, this was his response when I questioned whether Sony had their shit together on BC in another thread:
TheGrat1
Member
Not accusing you of this op, but I find it funny how people portray BC as some kind of killer app or system seller when the two consoles that launched this gen without it easily outsold the two that had it, and one of those consoles is the second best-selling console of all time.
The general audience does not care about bc. It is a nice feature to have for us enthusiasts but it does not move the needle in the grand scheme of things.
The general audience does not care about bc. It is a nice feature to have for us enthusiasts but it does not move the needle in the grand scheme of things.
geordiemp
Member
Learn how to read, 3 and 4 are different numbers.
Your mocking my comment about ps3 to make a point about ps4.
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Panajev2001a
GAF's Pleasant Genius
Not completely true. First it may bring some sales from people picking up older titles, some people may get to play it from their backlog directly on PS5 as you are working or announcing your sequel for example. Giving people a good impression is a powerful marketing tool too. Especially if you can get nice results with very little developer involvement.
Explosive Zombie
Banned
I want to hear news but they don't really HAVE TO do anything, do they? It's not like you're going to BUY the Series X right now if they don't tell you this for sure, right? Because you currently can't?
nuttyevans
Member
I suspect the best we're going to get is BC with PS4 tbh. The vast majority of Playstation users won't give a shit about being able to play PS1-PS3 games on PS5. Sucks but it is what it is.
I'll be very happy to be proven wrong by the way..
I'll be very happy to be proven wrong by the way..
Bernd Lauert
Banned
I haven't played like half of the PS4 exclusives. They should run at 4K60 on the PS5. I'm hoping for the best.
bhunachicken
Member
You know, up until a few days ago, I thought the XBox Series X was BC with literally every Xbox game that's ever been made.
Turns out, that 100% claim is just clever wording in the marketing.
So, it's 100% compatible with all the Xbox One games, as well as 100% compatible with all the 360 and original Xbox as the Xbox One, therefore making it the most BC console every made. But it's not 100% compatible with the entire library. It's about 1/4 of 360 games and fewer than 50 original Xbox games.
This has made me change my perspective on console BC - it's clear that, while MS has done a good job with the BC (better than Sony), it's not exactly a major priority for them, either.
I can't see MS and Sony dedicating their own resources towards getting all these games working on the system, to be honest. I think it would be better if a 3rd party were to do the BC themselves, offering it was an app that can be bought. Even then, you'd expect to see constant updates to it, and it would take years and years to get it right.
And, to be fair, it might never be right. Even the best emulators for older systems are not 100% accurate and use various tricks to paper over the cracks.
Turns out, that 100% claim is just clever wording in the marketing.
So, it's 100% compatible with all the Xbox One games, as well as 100% compatible with all the 360 and original Xbox as the Xbox One, therefore making it the most BC console every made. But it's not 100% compatible with the entire library. It's about 1/4 of 360 games and fewer than 50 original Xbox games.
This has made me change my perspective on console BC - it's clear that, while MS has done a good job with the BC (better than Sony), it's not exactly a major priority for them, either.
I can't see MS and Sony dedicating their own resources towards getting all these games working on the system, to be honest. I think it would be better if a 3rd party were to do the BC themselves, offering it was an app that can be bought. Even then, you'd expect to see constant updates to it, and it would take years and years to get it right.
And, to be fair, it might never be right. Even the best emulators for older systems are not 100% accurate and use various tricks to paper over the cracks.
Wizz-Art
Member
What are you talking about?
Microsoft has a whole BC team working on Xbox One titles to be BC with the XSX. The only thing preventing them from saying it's 100% BC is because of a couple Kinect and license heavy games like most of the sports games.
Before they went for fully Xbox One BC they were working on Xbox 360 and OG BC for the One. New titles were added weekly or even twice a week. There's no doubt in my mind that the BC team will continue with Xbox 360 and OG games after the XSX release.
Talking about Xbox not being commited to BC like Sony (or as you say it not a priority either) is plain wrong. They are very commited to BC. Over the years I had over 150 previously bought digital XBOX games joining my library on my One and over 50 that I still had on disc, all for free! And better then ever some even 4K enhanced.
Downplay Sony's commitment to BC all you want but leave Xbox out of it as it has no place there!
Roberts
Member
I'm not getting PS5, but it would be great if Sony allocated more resources towards BC and enchantments it can bring to older games. More people should be able to experience the joy of seeing an old favorite look so much better with higher res and stabler framerate (as well as other smaller improvements).
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SaucyJack
Member
SaucyJack
Member
As far as current gen games goes it appears that both companies are in pretty much the same place.
Almost all PS4/XBO games will work on PS5/XSX. And many of those games will be enhanced on nextgen just by virtue of the improved hardware, whilst others may get additional enhancements if the developer chooses to patch them in.
Why only "almost all"? Because there will be a handful of games that were borderline broken on current gen and will just not work on nextgen, or there is a hardware dependency, like Kinect, which is not supported. There also will be other games that have an online dependency but game servers are shut down.
The biggest difference, potentially, between the two is prior generations. We know that XBO supports a lot of 360 and a handful of original Xbox games and you would expect those to carry over. We have no idea on whether PS5 will support any of PS1-3 as they have been absolutely silent on the subject so far. There are much speculation on this but my own position is that absence of confirmation is not confirmation of absence.
SentientStone
Member
Agreed, I’m counting on PlayStation Plus free PS4 games to get me through the first few years.
ManaByte
Gold Member
Don Mattrick's "We have a console for that" argument by Jim Ryan:
Sony clarifies that PS5 will support ‘overwhelming majority’ of PS4 games
After the company hinted it might not support the broader library earlier this week.
Oh look. Eerily similar to MS's stance on BC
Goddamn biased media and their basic comprehension of the English language!
As a person who is married with a baby I don't have time to finish my backlog as quick as some people here. Also during Corona I have been working from home.
BC is overated if your talking PS1-PS3. I'm saying PS4 is still important to this day and will be when PS5 releases. A simple patch that removes limitations would be easy to implement for some games that have options for performance mode and resolution mode.
I'm playing God of War right now (yes still haven't played this game fully) and noticed the 2 modes you can play this game in. Surely PS5 would let you have both modes turned on at the same time with a simple patch.
That's all I want confirmation on for some games as by the time I get a PS5 on launch I can continue to enjoy my PS4 backlog with better performance. If games play exactly the same on PS5 I will hold out on buying day 1 and finish my PS4 backlog.
RAIDEN1
Member
Who wouldn't want to play Ridge Racer though? What about Nuclear Strike? What about Virtua Fighter 4? Sony's backward compatibility on the PS4 was a joke, to this day some games haven't been bettered, even on the PS4 I am talking Burnout Revenge, Panzer Dragoon Orta, Renegade Ops...