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[cireza]

No, but that 1 extra second in loading the less available ram will, especially for texture heavy scenes... Not very difficult to understand.

The PS5 can literally load, on average, 90GB of data into RAM (it needs to offload of course) in 10 seconds.

The Xbox can, tops, 60GB.

But sure, no difference, sir!

Xbox can actually address the SSD directly, as if it was RAM, if I understood correctly. This is a very interesting feature.

 

[MCplayer]

We are getting a lot of gaming news today

really? I dont feel like it honestly

 

[Kenpachii]

Man that trailer is hype holy shit.

 

[Dodkrake]

Dude, i saw the PS5 1st party games at the Sony event, to say i was underwhelmed with the graphics is an understatement. It was so disappointing that the unicorn, pixy dust overhyping of the SSD died immediately afterwards.

Cool story bro, I believe you.

 

[Dodkrake]

Xbox can actually address the SSD directly, as if it was RAM, if I understood correctly. This is a very interesting feature.

That's literally virtual ram. Windows 95 had this. Heck, it's prior to my usage of computers, but I'd say windows 3.1 had this.

And the GPU grabbing info from the SSD or RAM does not circumvent the SSDs speeds, which are still not impressive.

 

[DunDunDunpachi]

When it was revealed that the Playstation would use a GPU plus some complex geometry hardware on the CPU, SEGA panicked and slapped a tertiary processor into the Saturn.

See, we have 3D rendering hardware too, they said.

I can't help but feel as though Sony may have done that with SSD, and Microsoft is behaving just like SEGA.

 

[MasterCornholio]

That's literally virtual ram. Windows 95 had this. Heck, it's prior to my usage of computers, but I'd say windows 3.1 had this.

And the GPU grabbing info from the SSD or RAM does not circumvent the SSDs speeds, which are still not impressive.

I think it was also said that the PS5 could do the same thing.

But I agree that it's very slow ram that will have a very limited application.

 

[Ascend]

Half the speed = 50%
Reality though: 5.5/2.4 = 2.29x = 229% slower than the PS5

Nothing can be less than 100% slower. I hope you understand that 100% slower means it "stands still", right? Anything more than 100% slower means going backwards. So basically you're saying the XSX is 129% faster in the opposite direction...

2.4 raw and up to 6 compressed is somehow less than half of 5.5 and up to 22 compressed?

Looks like your fud game needs primary education.

Says the one liking a post claiming the XSX is 229% slower...

 

[OptimistPrime]

robing marketing of PS.

Looser one day, looser forever....

Loose robes.

 

[FranXico]

Another logo for the front of the game case?

The Velocity Architecture logo has been announced a while back.

No joke.

 

[DunDunDunpachi]

So basically you're saying the XSX is 129% faster in the opposite direction...

Beta tested in the future was no lie.

 

[jakinov]

Relatively speaking it does. Mark Cerny said the decompressor does the equivalent job of 9 Zen2 cores and the XSX does the equivalent of ~4 but the XSX’s SSD is also less than half the speed of the PS5’s so it’s pretty similar.

2.4GB/s raw and 4.8GB/s compressed vs 5.4GB/s raw and 8-9GB/s compressed.

Since we're talking about the architecture around the storage as a whole (i.e. "Velocity architecture",) I was referring to also the PS5 architecture around the storage as a whole. The decompression tech is probably effectively the same. But Sony includes other custom components as well to offload CPU/GPU and that's what I was referring to as Microsoft hasn't mentioned yet tackling the same bottlenecks that Sony has.

 

[Larvana]

You got me. It's a 500% difference.

And is love to see sources for that, buddy.

Hey buddy, this isn't about PS5. Take your topic elsewhere.

 

[Great Hair]

Nothing can be less than 100% slower. I hope you understand that 100% slower means it "stands still", right? Anything more than 100% slower means going backwards. So basically you're saying the XSX is 129% faster in the opposite direction...


Says the one liking a post claiming the XSX is 229% slower...

XSX 2.4GB = 100%
PS5 5.5GB = 229% (an increase of 129%, 100% = 2x)

Yeah, i give you that i worded it incorrectly. XSX is 129% slower.

 

[cireza]

And the GPU grabbing info from the SSD or RAM does not circumvent the SSDs speeds, which are still not impressive.

But you avoid having to manage your RAM all the time, which is a good benefit. Otherwise, SSD speed is too slow on both console to replace RAM effectively anyway.

 

[Dodkrake]

I think it was also said that the PS5 could do the same thing.

But I agree that it's very slow ram that will have a very limited application.

Yep, Cerny discussed how they changed the filesystem. As for addressing disc directly, every OS does that.

Nothing can be less than 100% slower. I hope you understand that 100% slower means it "stands still", right? Anything more than 100% slower means going backwards. So basically you're saying the XSX is 129% faster in the opposite direction...


Says the one liking a post claiming the XSX is 229% slower...

Before you accuse me of anything, go read my post. I did not say that, you know full well. I said less than half. Some other poster said 229%. So stop with the bullshit.

 

[Ascend]

XSX 2.4GB = 100%
PS5 5.5GB = 229% (an increase of 129%, 100% = 2x)

Yeah, i give you that i worded it incorrectly. XSX is 129% slower.

The PS5 I/O is 129% faster than the XSX's
The XSX I/O is 56% slower than the PS5's

As a reference...;

Relative difference [(Test – Base)/Base] Use ‘% more/less than’ or ‘times more/less than’. · When using ‘% more/less than’: Five is 25% more than four; four is 20% less than five. · When using ‘times more/less than’: Five is 0.25 times more than four. Four is 0.20 times less than five
Treating relative differences as numerically symmetric: Five is 25% more than four. But four is 20% less than five – not 25% less than five.

https://web.augsburg.edu/~schield/MiloPapers/984OfSigCompare3.pdf

Before you accuse me of anything, go read my post. I did not say that, you know full well. I said less than half. Some other poster said 229%. So stop with the bullshit.

You still liked the post of the other person because it fits your narrative.

 

[Elog]

This thread is still chasing the wrong rabbit for the most part. While theoretical bandwidth maximums are interesting, latency is the king parameter. And so far XSX does not seem to have much dedicated silicon for that while the PS5 has its two I/O co-processors plus cache scrubbers with the sole purpose to decrease latency as in asking for textures from the SSD and have them available for the GPU.

Looking forward to the MS hardware disclosure in August but my assumption is that they have a fairly straight forward PC-like solution and limited dedicated hardware here. The net result will be a very large difference between the two platforms in terms of actual performance to deliver assets to the GPU.

 

[Journey]

I can't look at that video for more than a few seconds without my attention being completely drawn to that blokes beard.

What a terrifying specimen.

The dude is a WIZARD!

 

[Dodkrake]

The PS5 I/O is 129% faster than the XSX's
The XSX I/O is 56% slower than the PS5's

As a reference...;

Relative difference [(Test – Base)/Base] Use ‘% more/less than’ or ‘times more/less than’. · When using ‘% more/less than’: Five is 25% more than four; four is 20% less than five. · When using ‘times more/less than’: Five is 0.25 times more than four. Four is 0.20 times less than five
Treating relative differences as numerically symmetric: Five is 25% more than four. But four is 20% less than five – not 25% less than five.

https://web.augsburg.edu/~schield/MiloPapers/984OfSigCompare3.pdf

You still liked the post of the other person because it fits your narrative.

Did I say it? So you can then kindly go fuck yourself for accusing me of something I didn't say.

 

[Strider Highwind]

I'm just ready for the games, price, and where to input this payment information

And thats @ Sony AND Microsoft lol.

Both machines will be dope and they will excel in areas where the competition won't. Thats a given, now lets see the fruit of those studio acquisitions

I have faith in both MS and Sony...I think the next 5-7 years of gaming is about to be fire

 

[Darius87]

Traditially, drive speeds (HDD/SDD) are stated as peak performance. Microsoft has made it clear that the 2.4GB/s is sustained.
Has Cerny or have Sony clarified if PS5's SSD speed is sustained or peak?

sustained Sweeney said in one of his tweets if i remember correctly.

 

[DynamiteCop!]

When it was revealed that the Playstation would use a GPU plus some complex geometry hardware on the CPU, SEGA panicked and slapped a tertiary processor into the Saturn.

See, we have 3D rendering hardware too, they said.

I can't help but feel as though Sony may have done that with SSD, and Microsoft is behaving just like SEGA.

This is just a foolish statement, the console has been in development since 2016 and Spencer for literally years has been saying that they're not going to release a console just because a certain period of time has passed or that it's some expected tick on a box that a new console generation needs to kick off. Like the Xbox One X it needs to be because of a profound step forward in gaming, HDR and 4K was a profound step forward, SSD's and high frequency processors are a profound and now affordable step forward.

 

[Ascend]

Did I say it? So you can then kindly go fuck yourself for accusing me of something I didn't say.

I never said you said it. You still supported it. Now you don't have the balls to back up your actions. So, the joke's on you.

This is just a foolish statement, the console has been in development since 2016 and Spencer for literally years has been saying that they're not going to release a console just because a certain period of time has passed or that it's some expected tick on a box that a new console generation needs to kick off. Like the Xbox One X it needs to be because of a profound step forward in gaming, HDR and 4K was a profound step forward, SSD's and high frequency processors are a profound and now affordable step forward.

Indeed. SSDs have become affordable, so it is a necessary next step for gaming consoles to incorporate the technology.

 

[Zato]

Nor does variable clocks alleviate the discrepancies of a nearly a 2tf power advantage with sustained peformance at all times and a 40% advantage in Ray Tracing capabilities due to the significant CU advantage.

Enjoy the mere 1-2 second faster loading times. At least the PS5 has a hardware win in something.

I never said it did.

Relax.

I will enjoy the great exclusives, you can play Halo again I suppose.

 

[Vognerful]

I didn't watch this video. But I read the articles. But it also includes a bunch of software solutions as well that's supposed to further help get better results. I don't believe it removes as much work from the CPU/GPU as the PS5 SSD, at least with what is currently disclosed. But it's better than nothing. Another benefit besides loads times, is that compression of data on disk is less expensive and will likely happen more (or be forced) if it isn't happening already with most games.

Hi, could you explain more about the compression on disk part?

 

[Mod of War]

Dial back the hostilities towards each other.

These consoles can't come out soon enough.

 

[Dodkrake]

Dial back the hostilities towards each other.

These consoles can't come out soon enough.

I've ignored the user. Sorry for going over the top, but it grinds my gears being accused of saying something I did.

 

[JeloSWE]

Hi, could you explain more about the compression on disk part?

If you have free decompression due to the hardware solution then you can store everything as compressed on the disk to save on space. Also reading 2GB uncompressed data will only fill the RAM with 2GB. While reading 2GB data that is actually 4GB compressed, then you are filling RAM with 4GB for the time it takes to read 2GB.

 

[jakinov]

Hi, could you explain more about the compression on disk part?

Well for both consoles they have a dedicated chip for decompressing data. Developers may more likely compress the data before storing it on the SSD or maybe be forced to compress their games as Microsoft/Sony can technically force them to do things in order to be allowed to have their games released (like how trophies/achievements are forced and nobody can circumvent online rules). Or it might actually all be done automatically when downloaded/stored and no forcing is needed, not sure about those details. If they aren’t forced in any way, they are more likely to because there’s no longer a drawback to compressing because now you don’t have to waste CPU to decompress and you get much better throughput by compressing. When things are stored compressed, you’ll save more space as user however that is done.

An analogy, would be if had a machine that can automatically build furniture in less than a second at the customers house. I can store my furniture all packed up in boxes (taking up less space) and not worry about the added cost (Time/money) of building the furniture for the customer. I have an interest in keeping everything small at the warehouse because there’s no downside to building the furniture (decompressing) at the customers house anymore; and I can fit more boxes than ever before on the truck to the customers house by keeping everything unbuilt.

 

[Stuart360]

yeah, that 1 second loading difference is going to be unbearable i tell you.

Hey you joke, but if XSX does get better multiplatform versions of games in some way, those 2 or 3 extra seconds will be MASSIVE, and the real gamechanger next gen (even though we would be coming from a gen with regular 1-2min loading).

 

[Great Hair]

The PS5 I/O is 129% faster than the XSX's
The XSX I/O is 56% slower than the PS5's

As a reference...;

Relative difference [(Test – Base)/Base] Use ‘% more/less than’ or ‘times more/less than’. · When using ‘% more/less than’: Five is 25% more than four; four is 20% less than five. · When using ‘times more/less than’: Five is 0.25 times more than four. Four is 0.20 times less than five

https://web.augsburg.edu/~schield/MiloPapers/984OfSigCompare3.pdf

XSX SSD achieves 43% OF the PS5 SSD 5.5GB/s
XSX 43% + 43% + 14% = PS5 100% (2x 43% + 1x 14%)
PS5 SSD IS 2.29x times faster than the XSX

5.5GB = 100%
2.4GB = 43% or 56% slower

2.4GB = 100%
5.5GB = 229% +129% faster

Why do you think they mentioned "half the speed OF"? Because saying, admitting the PS5 is 2.29 times faster (twice as fast as our SSD) would be counterproductive. Sounds more like promo material by ign with added "npis".

I´ve never seen someone benchmark a super car, a gpu using the fastest, newest product as their outgoing basis (100%) and then go backwards. Imagine telling a racing driver, that his closest rival only achieved 89% of his hot lap.

 

[pasterpl]

When it was revealed that the Playstation would use a GPU plus some complex geometry hardware on the CPU, SEGA panicked and slapped a tertiary processor into the Saturn.

See, we have 3D rendering hardware too, they said.

I can't help but feel as though Sony may have done that with SSD, and Microsoft is behaving just like SEGA.

wasn’t it ms who went first with the reveal? It seems more like Sony up-clocked their gpu to chase Microsoft teraflops.

 

[Leyasu]

No, but that 1 extra second in loading the less available ram will, especially for texture heavy scenes... Not very difficult to understand.

The PS5 can literally load, on average, 90GB of data into RAM (it needs to offload of course) in 10 seconds.

The Xbox can, tops, 60GB.

But sure, no difference, sir!

How big are games at the moment??

 

[jakinov]

yeah, that 1 second loading difference is going to be unbearable i tell you.

It’s not just about not making the user wait it’s the fact that in that 1 second Or half a second you could have swapped out twice as much data from RAM. It’s so that there’s less potential CPU/GPU overhead. Then there’s the other custom components that further reduce CPU/GPU overhead/bottlenecks. The Xbox can get the same loading times as the PS5 but by simply asking for less. If future games are going to be designed around using data from secondary storage “just in time” (Which is something even Microsoft is pushing) then loading screens will be hardly a thing to be comparing because games won’t be trying to preload ur RAM as much in loading screens. They are just going to try to load data as soon as they need it and the PS5 will have double the data in X amount of time for the CPU/GPU to use.

 

[SatansReverence]

It's amazing how many people skip over this little tid bit

The XSX doesn't need the raw throughput due to efficiently streaming only what texture data it needs (which accounts for the largest part of a games memory footprint). It can stream in, use, then replace texture data mid frame.

While the overall throughput will still tip in Sonys favour, the gap is smaller than what the mere paper specs would have you believe.

 

[Panajev2001a]

I can't look at that video for more than a few seconds without my attention being completely drawn to that blokes beard.

What a terrifying specimen.

Why do they keep calling him a Lead Engineer? He is a project manager ... sigh... oh well.

 

[MasterCornholio]

wasn’t it ms who went first with the reveal? It seems more like Sony up-clocked their gpu to chase Microsoft teraflops.

And redesigned the cooling system so it can deal with the higher temps?

I kind of doubt that. Just like I doubt that Microsoft panicked over Sonys SSD and made up alot of last minute software solutions to help compensate.

 

[Dural]

The XSX doesn't need the raw throughput due to efficiently streaming only what texture data it needs (which accounts for the largest part of a games memory footprint). It can stream in, use, then replace texture data mid frame.

Yeah, he mentioned that there was custom hardware in the GPU to address this.

 

[On Demand]

I’ve never seen so much spin based on software.

SX ain’t making up for PS5’s 3x faster SSD.

It’s funny seeing XB fans make fun of PS5 fans about raw teraflops of the SX. That PS5 can’t match it with whatever it’s doing. Yet here y’all are going gaga over buzzwords and software implementations thinking it’s a match for what PS5 SSD is doing, and even more laughable, thinking it’s better.

 

[SatansReverence]

SX ain’t making up for PS5’s 3x faster SSD.

Love how this number keeps growing by the day.

And SFS isn't "just software", there are hardware optimisations required to make it work beyond just an SSD.

 

[RaySoft]

We chat with Jason Ronald, one of the lead engineers on the Xbox Series X, about Xbox Velocity Architecture, the mixture of hardware and software that aims to eliminate load times on Microsoft's next-gen console.

Ouch.. It really doesnt look good when you try to highlight a feature that is only half as good as your main competitor...

 

[UnNamed]

Don't care about specs, I care about games. Give me a game who clearly shows the next gen leap, or your specs are meaningless. This is also valid for PS5, of course.

 

[LostDonkey]

According to the Velocity trailer it gives them 2.5x Multiplier of SSD performance.

so that puts the XSX SSD above ps5 speeds theoretically??

I'm lost now.

 

[The Hamburglar]

The physical hardware may not be as good but their control of it and capability of usefulness via software may be better.

So you’re saying they know how to jerk off a smaller dick better?

 

[SatansReverence]

According to the Velocity trailer it gives them 2.5x Multiplier of SSD performance.

so that puts the XSX SSD above ps5 speeds theoretically??

I'm lost now.

It's only applicable for texture data.

 

[OverHeat]

When it was revealed that the Playstation would use a GPU plus some complex geometry hardware on the CPU, SEGA panicked and slapped a tertiary processor into the Saturn.

See, we have 3D rendering hardware too, they said.

I can't help but feel as though Sony may have done that with SSD, and Microsoft is behaving just like SEGA.

Like Sony did by pushing the GPU to crazy speed with variable clock because of the low CU count

 

[jimbojim]

According to the Velocity trailer it gives them 2.5x Multiplier of SSD performance.

so that puts the XSX SSD above ps5 speeds theoretically??

I'm lost now.

No. It just means what Andrew Goossen said during EG interview few months ago, theoretical max for XSX SSD is 6.x GB/s.

 

[RaySoft]

I think it was also said that the PS5 could do the same thing.

But I agree that it's very slow ram that will have a very limited application.

Don´t be hyped by marketig buzzwords.. Call it RAM, ROM, FAST-SHITS, whatever... All that matters is «How fast can you deliver specified data at the given pointer»

 

[Ascend]

No. It just means what Andrew Goossen said during EG interview few months ago, theoretical max for XSX SSD is 6.x GB/s.

That was the speed of the decompression block.

"Our second component is a high-speed hardware decompression block that can deliver over 6GB/s," reveals Andrew Goossen. "This is a dedicated silicon block that offloads decompression work from the CPU and is matched to the SSD so that decompression is never a bottleneck. The decompression hardware supports Zlib for general data and a new compression [system] called BCPack that is tailored to the GPU textures that typically comprise the vast majority of a game's package size."

Inside Xbox Series X: the full specs

This is it. After months of teaser trailers, blog posts and even the occasional leak, we can finally reveal firm, hard …

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