Support NeoGAF

[Unknown?]

I miss "wait until E3" already, this thread would have been packed with it.

End of an Era.

I will say.... someone said it yesterday and it was bittersweet. It might have been the last time (that was genuine).

It's now wait until next gen.

 

[MrA]

Switch didn't pump everyone until pandemic, it didn't outsell ps4 consistently even in 2019.

Switch outsold the ps4 in the US every month of 2019, and was the best seller worldwide 9 out of 12
1st 24 months switch sold more in total than the ps4 first 24 months
The pandemic simply pushed it to fly past the ps4

 

[jm89]

One of the greatest gifs i've witnessed

 

[solidus12]

Let’s be honest, feels like Xbox has been living on potential for the last few years. We’re still waiting for something tangible.

Now imagine if they didn’t acquire the PUBLISHER Zenimax, what games would they have had for 2023 besides Forza Motorsports 8?

 

[feynoob]

ok...

GOW, FF, Hogwarts, SM... those are console sellers. Those are the e kinda games you need in your library to move consoles. Those kinda games have mass market appeal and recognition. And I only mention the ones that are either here, oncoming or did more for PS then they did for xbox.

What does Xbox have? Starfield? Hellblade?

What about their current position and upcoming content leads you to believe they could do like 60M+ in sales? I am not trying to be funny, just really curious to know.

If they get Activision, and the next COD is exclusive to Xbox, fine that would mean something.

Indiana jones(MS has marketing since their 1st party studio is making the game), starfield, avowed, fable, perfect dark, TESVI as of now. Those are system sellers.

 

[Rac3r]

The biggest problem I see is that MS been watching this for the last few months & they are not saying anything to build confidence for Xbox fans . Like I made the thread about PS5 being in the perfect storm in February so I know Microsoft seen this coming but they're not doing anything to offset this & giving PS5 an open floor for the next few months not telling people a change is coming or anything. PlayStation boldly said they will sale 6 million in this usually slow quarter & Xbox didn't even put up a fight.

I think they saw it coming, which is why they did the January showcase and the Hi-Fi Rush shadow drop, as well as confirming a June showcase + Starfield Direct several months in advance. The problem is, no one cares. Xbox has massacred its reputation and its own flagship IPs for years. Their reliance on Game Pass rather than routinely shipping great games has drained any excitement from their past/current/future announcements. The Xbox brand has an identity crisis.

 

[jm89]

Indiana jones(MS has marketing since their 1st party studio is making the game), starfield, avowed, fable, perfect dark, TESVI as of now. Those are system sellers.

You haven't even seen half these games, how can you call them system sellers? If they had some successfuly previous release not too far off then sure, but some of these games have been dormant for years or new ips.

 

[feynoob]

You haven't even seen half these games, how can you call them system sellers?

Are you saying these games are failures?

 

[Mr.Phoenix]

Indiana jones(MS has marketing since their 1st party studio is making the game), starfield, avowed, fable, perfect dark, TESVI as of now. Those are system sellers.

Do you want a list wars?

The only game you mentioned there that could maybe qualify as a system seller is TESVI. Nothing else you mentioned is proven entity r has shown it can and will be a system seller.

If you want us to just ist stuff that could be popular or could sell well, I could do that too. I only listed the stuff that has future status and recognition PS. Didn't even mention GT, GoT, Ratchet....etc cause they don't fit those criteria.

 

[jm89]

Are you saying these games are failures?

Ehhh no.

 

[feynoob]

Ehhh no.

Then why can't people buy Xbox to play these games?
Is that what it means to be a system seller?

 

[feynoob]

Do you want a list wars?

The only game you mentioned there that could maybe qualify as a system seller is TESVI. Nothing else you mentioned is proven entity r has shown it can and will be a system seller.

If you want us to just ist stuff that could be popular or could sell well, I could do that too. I only listed the stuff that has future status and recognition PS. Didn't even mention GT, GoT, Ratchet....etc cause they don't fit those criteria.

What list wars?
Dude, these games are exclusive to Xbox, aside of Indiana jones. You have to buy Xbox to play them. Or play them on pc.

Where else would you play these games aside of Xbox and PC?

 

[demigod]

Spending extra time at the shrine trying to put a hex on Jim Ryan.

Seriously though, I'm not sure what Phil Spencer has to do with PS outselling Xbox, which was kind of expected anyway. If there is any gripe with Spencer regarding these sales numbers it is just that they need to pump out more XSX units to try and take advantage of the PC gamers that might be looking for a new console home.

Plus, the GP lineup has been sweet this year, making sure I've got plenty to play. No complaints there.

Yeah right, gaf and influencers were calling the xsx the next coming of jesus. How’d that work out. You know what would’ve made the series sale? GAMES. All they had were duds and the usual halo and forza nobody gives a crap about.

 

[Captain Toad]

I'm not sure what Phil Spencer has to do with PS outselling Xbox

Um...

 

[jm89]

Then why can't people buy Xbox to play these games?
Is that what it means to be a system seller?

Huh?

System seller is something that will get people to buy your console.

Alot of the games you've listed we don't have much information on how they will turn out or previous release not too far off to vouch for them, some of them even had to have other studios come in and take over like perfect dark. Too early too call them system sellers.

I'll give you starfield and elder scrolls as system sellers, as bethesda have had successfull releases not too far off in the past like fallout 4.

 

[azertydu91]

Then why can't people buy Xbox to play these games?
Is that what it means to be a system seller?

don't think you understood what he said, he just says that since we barely have seen anything from those games we have no idea if they will be system sellers...Look at some of the recent duds that were hyped to the moon...Look at your list , of all of those games we have only seen gameplay of Starfield and it was ....laggy?
For the other there is either CGI or nothing ,like Indiana Jones.

 

[RyanEvans21]

Then why can't people buy Xbox to play these games?
Is that what it means to be a system seller?

You dont need xbox to play those games!

 

[KungFucius]

It's sad to see Software continue to decline year after year.

What do you expect when there is gamepass? ( I am half joking. Gamepass is not yet that big, but it certainly puts downward pressure on SW sales)

 

[onQ123]

I think they saw it coming, which is why they did the January showcase and the Hi-Fi Rush shadow drop, as well as confirming a June showcase + Starfield Direct several months in advance. The problem is, no one cares. Xbox has massacred its reputation and its own flagship IPs for years. Their reliance on Game Pass rather than routinely shipping great games has drained any excitement from their past/current/future announcements. The Xbox brand has an identity crisis.

Hi-Fi rush & Redfall was never going to move the needle for Series consoles they are supportive titles not system sellers .

Diablo 4 & Minecraft Legends will do more for Xbox even though they are not exclusive

 

[Heisenberg007]

Indiana jones(MS has marketing since their 1st party studio is making the game), starfield, avowed, fable, perfect dark, TESVI as of now. Those are system sellers.

It’s cute how REDFALL doesn’t appear on these lists anymore, isn’t it?

 

[feynoob]

It’s cute how REDFALL doesn’t appear on these lists anymore, isn’t it?

Redfall is from arkane. Sadly, that is their fate.
Their games didn't perform well in terms of sales, when they were multiplat.

 

[XXL]

It’s cute how REDFALL doesn’t appear on these lists anymore, isn’t it?

 

[onQ123]

Are you saying these games are failures?

Perfect Dark didn't even do well in the 360 days

 

[feynoob]

You dont need xbox to play those games!

You need an Xbox to play them. Unless you own pc.

don't think you understood what he said, he just says that since we barely have seen anything from those games we have no idea if they will be system sellers...Look at some of the recent duds that were hyped to the moon...Look at your list , of all of those games we have only seen gameplay of Starfield and it was ....laggy?
For the other there is either CGI or nothing ,like Indiana Jones.

Starfield is from Bethesda. I don't need to say anything about it.
Tes6, same thing.
Fable still has fans.
Perfect dark: same.
Avowed= Obsidian.

All these games are games, which can sell itself. Even if they are shit.

 

[RyanEvans21]

You need an Xbox to play them. Unless you own pc.

Starfield is from Bethesda. I don't need to say anything about it.
Tes6, same thing.
Fable still has fans.
Perfect dark: same.
Avowed= Obsidian.

All these games are games, which can sell itself. Even if they are shit.

Sure!

 

[Sanepar]

They will.
They sold 55-60m during Xbox one.

This gen is different than Xbox one.

Keep going in 1 or 2 years u guys gonna say xbox one sold 65-75 million.

Xbox one barely touched 50 million.

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

ok feynoob i think is time to sleep. next week is going to be intense.

 

[feynoob]

Sure!

 

[feynoob]

ok feynoob i think is time to sleep. next week is going to be intense.

I have my shirt and popcorn ready.

 

[onQ123]

You need an Xbox to play them. Unless you own pc.

Starfield is from Bethesda. I don't need to say anything about it.
Tes6, same thing.
Fable still has fans.
Perfect dark: same.
Avowed= Obsidian.

All these games are games, which can sell itself. Even if they are shit.

When was the last time Perfect Dark sold well?

 

[El Pistolero]

Indiana jones(MS has marketing since their 1st party studio is making the game), starfield, avowed, fable, perfect dark, TESVI as of now. Those are system sellers.

Fable and Perfect Dark will not be system sellers, imo. The ES may be, but it will arrive so late into this generation (if it does not skip it), its impact will not change a thing. The true test remains Starfield: It has become the number one Xbox/GP IP, in terms of potential, and I doubt any other title by MS studios releasing in the next 24 months could approach it...If it enables the platform to record great sales, and becomes a hot commodity, then all hope is not lost;But if it fails to move the needle, then it is game over until 2028/2029.

 

[feynoob]

When was the last time Perfect Dark sold well?

Why cant it sell well? Is there a reason why it cant?

Fable and Perfect Dark will not be system sellers, imo. The ES may be, but it will arrive so late into this generation (if it does not skip it), its impact will not change a thing. The true test remains Starfield: It has become the number one Xbox/GP IP, in terms of potential, and I doubt any other title by MS studios releasing in the next 24 months could approach it...If it enables the platform to record great sales, and becomes a hot commodity, then all hope is not lost;But if it fails to move the needle, then it is game over until 2028/2029.

On what do you think these games wont move Xbox? Is there a criteria that you need to fill, in order to sell alot of consoles?

You guys are adamant that the average users wont buy xbox because of these games.

 

[azertydu91]

You need an Xbox to play them. Unless you own pc.

Starfield is from Bethesda. I don't need to say anything about it.
Tes6, same thing.
Fable still has fans.
Perfect dark: same.
Avowed= Obsidian.

All these games are games, which can sell itself. Even if they are shit.

Using that definition any game is a system seller, but more important all of your justifications are bullshit....Bethesda released Fallout 76, it sucked, last Fable got cancelled and barely anybody reacted, Perfect Dark has been dormant for like what 20 years ?and is rumored to be in dev hell, I do concede that obsidian generally releases great games, even if I didn't like their last release, TES is so far away it is like it is not even existing right now.
Look at Halo it has always been a system seller , but Infinite hasn't really moved the world ....Well not in a good way though.

 

[azertydu91]

Why cant it sell well? Is there a reason why it cant?

On what do you think these games wont move Xbox? Is there a criteria that you need to fill, in order to sell alot of consoles?

You guys are adamant that the average users wont buy xbox because of these games.

The thing is the average consumer barely knows or like these IPs, simply because he is average might buy a console for his kids a friend or a family member, those IP don't really ring a bell, they are barely advertised too.
So yeah it will probably helps sell some consoles but it won't move the needle much.

 

[onQ123]

Why cant it sell well? Is there a reason why it cant?

Good question


So you think a game that didn't do to good in the Xbox 360 days is going to be a system seller in the Xbox Series days?

 

[feynoob]

Look at Halo it has always been a system seller , but Infinite hasn't really moved the world ....Well not in a good way though.

Halo couldnt do anything for xbox, due to the abysmal draugh content that xbox had.

They released XBS in november 2020. for 8-9 months, xbox didnt have AAA game drop. Their AAA game started in august 2021 and lasted until december 2021. Then went quite until now, with no major AAA game, aside of deathloop and ghostwire tokyo, which had 1 year timed exclusive with PS. They went 15 months, plus this month without AAA 1st party drop.

 

[feynoob]

The thing is the average consumer barely knows or like these IPs, simply because he is average might buy a console for his kids a friend or a family member, those IP don't really ring a bell, they are barely advertised too.
So yeah it will probably helps sell some consoles but it won't move the needle much.

And that is where marketing comes in to play. I know currently, their marketing is shit, but if average gamers sees Xbox with these games, he might go and buy xbox.
Xbox moto during Xbox one has been "No game console".

Good question


So you think a game that didn't do to good in the Xbox 360 days is going to be a system seller in the Xbox Series days?

Current graphics, any game can change people's mind.
It depends on how they execute the game.

 

[azertydu91]

Halo couldnt do anything for xbox, due to the abysmal draugh content that xbox had.

They released XBS in november 2020. for 8-9 months, xbox didnt have AAA game drop. Their AAA game started in august 2021 and lasted until december 2021. Then went quite until now, with no major AAA game, aside of deathloop and ghostwire tokyo, which had 1 year timed exclusive with PS. They went 15 months, plus this month without AAA 1st party drop.

And you think that will help when they will finally release something ?All those people disapointed in Halo and that had to wai a year and a half to finally get games wil suddenly buy a xbox when those games releases?You know that they would need to release banger after banger to regain trust among gamers.Something big that will appeal to everyone not some 20something years old IP, they need good games and they need it now, it does't look like redfall will hit the mark, maybe I'm wrong, hopefully I'm wrong, but it doesn't sound good.
We have no idea when Forza will release but the simulation version probably won't get a lot of people in the ecosystem and Starfield had a mild presentation and will release at the end of the year...

And that is where marketing comes in to play. I know currently, their marketing is shit, but if average gamers sees Xbox with these games, he might go and buy xbox.
Xbox moto during Xbox one has been "No game console".

So what did you see in those games that made you want to buy an Xbox ?The truth is nothing or a CGI ....Halo, their juggernaut didn't help but you want to tell me that after almost 2 years of draught they won't be seen as the no game console?
If you want an anecdotal evidence I have a few friends that bought a series X at launch, but since then most of them have switched to ps5 and are quite happy to regularly play good games...Something that seem really far off from MS...Hell look at the reveal of the consoles where are those games?
It is weird because usually ...well when it wasn't Spencer at their head, they start strong with lots of games then it dries out to be ready for next gen,the Xb1 was the sahara so it was safe to assume that they'd be ready for this gen and if they hadn't bought Bethesda they'd have nothing how is this a selling point?

 

[feynoob]

And you think that will help when they will finally release something ?All those people disapointed in Halo and that had to wai a year and a half to finally get games wil suddenly buy a xbox when those games releases?You know that they would need to release banger after banger to regain trust among gamers.Something big that will appeal to everyone not some 20something years old IP, they need good games and they need it now, it does't look like redfall will hit the mark, maybe I'm wrong, hopefully I'm wrong, but it doesn't sound good.
We have no idea when Forza will release but the simulation version probably won't get a lot of people in the ecosystem and Starfield had a mild presentation and will release at the end of the year...

If horizon zero down can do it, why cant these games do it?

So what did you see in those games that made you want to buy an Xbox ?The truth is nothing or a CGI ....Halo, their juggernaut didn't help but you want to tell me that after almost 2 years of draught they won't be seen as the no game console?
If you want an anecdotal evidence I have a few friends that bought a series X at launch, but since then most of them have switched to ps5 and are quite happy to regularly play good games...Something that seem really far off from MS...Hell look at the reveal of the consoles where are those games?
It is weird because usually ...well when it wasn't Spencer at their head, they start strong with lots of games then it dries out to be ready for next gen,the Xb1 was the sahara so it was safe to assume that they'd be ready for this gen and if they hadn't bought Bethesda they'd have nothing how is this a selling point?

Because these games are RPG type games which sell alot of copies?
Perfect dark is a shooter game, which is going to attract people who love that genre.

I am saying these because, that is the type of games the public want. I have been that type of gamer before I come to this forum.

 

[azertydu91]

If horizon zero down can do it, why cant these games do it?

Because these games are RPG type games which sell alot of copies?
Perfect dark is a shooter game, which is going to attract people who love that genre.

I am saying these because, that is the type of games the public want. I have been that type of gamer before I come to this forum.

Horizon had a very impressive first showing, not those games...
Rpg wwill sell because RPG sells ...Like every RPG? Just lmike people that like FPS will buy every FPS and the console on which they are ... Instead of a pc where they can play those and more?Look at the facts they might be system sellers just as they might not be.You are looking at things like everybody is eager to buy an Xbox but is waiting for a reason, maybe that's how you see things but most consumer will not care that Perrfect dark is a fps that some of them might have played 20 years ago.The elder scrolls will sell on it's brand regarding of its qualities but it won't be enough MS simply need to release good finished and polished games and not just a few of them, they need to wow people instead of being the butt of a joke like Halo

ERdit sorry for the typos it is 5 am here and I haven't slept for 2 days

 

[feynoob]

MS simply need to release good finished and polished games and not just a few of them, they need to wow people instead of being the butt of a joke like Halo

That is why I listed those games for you.
Those are the games that will take Xbox to the next level.

I am not gonna argue with you about their quality, since people have their own perception.

But all I can say is that, these games will shape Xbox future. It will be the much needed content for the platform.

 

[azertydu91]

That is why I listed those games for you.
Those are the games that will take Xbox to the next level.

I am not gonna argue with you about their quality, since people have their own perception.

But all I can say is that, these games will shape Xbox future. It will be the much needed content for the platform.

How can you know that?
You haven't seen shit of them but already assume that they will be great...that's not a matter of taste but of hope, you hope that they will be good and move the needle, maybe after we've seen gameplay of it then you will be able to make an informed opinion but so far it is conjecture, that's what people are telling you.A game that we heven't seen running is nothing you want them to be good but you can't know that they will be, especially after those rumuors about developpement hell that they've been into.
You have just seen nice cinematics maybe that is enough for you to judge the quality of a game ...But then you must be really satisfied with those mobile games, they have superb cinematics too.

 

[feynoob]

How can you know that?
You haven't seen shit of them but already assume that they will be great...that's not a matter of taste but of hope, you hope that they will be good and move the needle, maybe after we've seen gameplay of it then you will be able to make an informed opinion but so far it is conjecture, that's what people are telling you.A game that we heven't seen running is nothing you want them to be good but you can't know that they will be, especially after those rumuors about developpement hell that they've been into.
You have just seen nice cinematics maybe that is enough for you to judge the quality of a game ...But then you must be really satisfied with those mobile games, they have superb cinematics too.

You know the answer. There is no need to act like this.

 

[azertydu91]

You know the answer. There is no need to act like this.

Then stop being so obtuse about it.
You keep mentionning that list that have 1 game with gameplay and it was so good they had to delay it for a year.Not a lot to be hopeful, the rest is just hopeful ignorance because none of us know how they will end up.They might be some of the best games this gen, or average or the worst or a mixed bag of both, nobody knows so stop thinking they will change anything and wait to see what and how they are.

 

[feynoob]

Then stop being so obtuse about it.
You keep mentionning that list that have 1 game with gameplay and it was so good they had to delay it for a year.Not a lot to be hopeful, the rest is just hopeful ignorance because none of us know how they will end up.They might be some of the best games this gen, or average or the worst or a mixed bag of both, nobody knows so stop thinking they will change anything and wait to see what and how they are.

Because you dont want to admit the reason, and keep going around with this nonse stuff.

The studios that is making these games are proven. That is enough for me to make these statement.

 

[azertydu91]

Because you dont want to admit the reason, and keep going around with this nonse stuff.

The studios that is making these games are proven. That is enough for me to make these statement.

So obsidian yeah, but after Fallout 76 bethesda has a lot to prove...And the rest are proven to you?

 

[Bernardougf]

Man.. "PC gamers" do very much enjoy arguing in favor of xbox/ms this days ... is really altruistic of them

On another topic ...

So ... gamepass is xbox strategy for now on.. and they dont care about hardware sales... but they need to sell consoles so they can move gamepass .. but they dont care about this sales .. I think my brain just died

 

[feynoob]

So obsidian yeah, but after Fallout 76 bethesda has a lot to prove...And the rest are proven to you?

They are proven, unless you think they are shit.

 

[azertydu91]

They are proven, unless you think they are shit.

I just think anybody can fail, like with Fallout 76, or Redfall or Halo, or a lot of games , you just think that they can't

 

[bender]

Indiana jones(MS has marketing since their 1st party studio is making the game), starfield, avowed, fable, perfect dark, TESVI as of now. Those are system sellers.