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[shinra-bansho]

It's kind of odd when it becomes a cause to rejoice when a port from a prior gen system doesn't perform worse...

 

[Xdrive05]

If WiiU is basically PS360 1.x, then I don't see why you folks are surprised that its 1st gen games are only almost as good as 5th or 6th gen PS360 games. You have to compare like with like.

And of course, Nintendo releasing only marginally improved hardware should have anticipated this is how 3rd party launch ports would be. And they should have launched with a 1st party killer app to at least kind of make it better...

 

[Angelus Errare]

I meant strange decisions regarding BlkOps 2. TTT2 is the only third party game on there I'd consider if I had a Wii U, they seem to have done a respectable job.

Ah my mistake

 

[pieatorium]

Meltdowns on the Nintendo side have been insane.

I'll even admit I didn't expect the RAM to be clocked that low... but I'm still not sure why some are jumping to the conclusion that this means the hardware itself can't keep pace with the PS3/360.

We've been told that the GPU has a more advanced featureset, with comparable brute capability. We've heard (and now seen) that the CPU isn't up to par, and the RAM has less bandwidth than either the PS3 or 360... which was speculated on pretty consistently once the DDR3 rumors started floating.

I don't know. I'm not going to write off the capability of the platform yet... but any Nintendo fan just blaming the devs, or whatever other magical fantasy reasoning they're coming up with needs to just calm down. You're going to get your asses banned.

Always the most sensible person in these threads as usual.

 

[papersleeves]

I'm not so sure I will be opening my deluxe set tomorrow when I'll receive it. I'm now tempted to sell it on Ebay and buy a Wii U only when it'll be worth it

 

[Vibed]

If the Wii U version of Epic Mickey 2 is that bad I'll just get the Wii version. Does anyone know how that one is?

 

[Thunder Monkey]

It's kind of odd when it becomes a cause to rejoice when a port from a prior gen system doesn't perform worse...

They're ports to a next-gen system that happens to have similar capability.

It's not rocket surgery. Different architecture + ported code + similar capability (with increases and drawbacks in comparison) = a crapshoot. Some games will work well, others won't.

 

[Plinko]

They're ports to a next-gen system that happens to have similar capability.

It's not rocket surgery. Different architecture + ported code + similar capability (with increases and drawbacks in comparison) = a crapshoot. Some games will work well, others won't.

Exactly. Your previous post was good, too.

 

[TheNatural]

If the Wii U version of Epic Mickey 2 is that bad I'll just get the Wii version. Does anyone know how that one is?

Sounds like the game, period, is bad on any system.

 

[dark10x]

so I am a lucky cookie ah?

I dunno what to tell you. I'm very sensitive to drops and its plain as day here. The port is better than most but it's still running about the same or worse than the ps3 version which is slower than the 360 and PC versions.

 

[NBtoaster]

Be curious how Bayonetta 2 is handled, given the bandwidth situation.

12.8GB/s + eDRAM on Wii U versus 22.4 GB/s + eDRAM on 360..

Bandwidth problems gave the PS3 issues in the first game..

 

[EDarkness]

If WiiU is basically PS360 1.x, then I don't see why you folks are surprised that its 1st gen games are only almost as good as 5th or 6th gen PS360 games. You have to compare like with like.

And of course, Nintendo releasing only marginally improved hardware should have anticipated this is how 3rd party launch ports would be. And they should have launched with a 1st party killer app to at least kind of make it better...

They did... Mario Bros. U.

 

[nickcv]

Sounds like the game, period, is bad on any system.

damn, they really did a mess with every version of this game... even the 3DS game turned out to be horrible...

i trusted you, warren spector.

 

[Uncle Rupee]

Tank Tank Tank seems to run fine
you guys

hey you guys
Tank Tank Tank runs fine

 

[Vibed]

Sounds like the game, period, is bad on any system.

Well the Wii version is the only one by Junction Point, the others were ported by another developer.

 

[Man-is-Obsolete]

I thought that was pretty obvious considering all the threads about PS3 versions of games including Black Ops 2.

I thought he was trying to say that it is somehow possible that the next Sony and Microsoft system will perform worse than the PS3 and 360, by saying that the PS3 is definitively more powerful but gets worse ports than the 360. That's a laughable thing to even consider.

Here is the quote he was replying to;

i don't think PS4 and the next Xbox will run games worse than the PS3 or 360.

And yet, somehow the PS3 runs most games worse than the 360 even though the hardware is definitvely better.

 

[TheGreatDivide]

Wii games never really improved much over time graphically. At least not to the same extent as 360 and PS3. I don't expect Wii U games to either.

 

[TreasureHunterG]

If WiiU is basically PS360 1.x, then I don't see why you folks are surprised that its 1st gen games are only almost as good as 5th or 6th gen PS360 games. You have to compare like with like.

And of course, Nintendo releasing only marginally improved hardware should have anticipated this is how 3rd party launch ports would be. And they should have launched with a 1st party killer app to at least kind of make it better...

If this is real, than when Iwata told Nintendo don't focus on specs, he REALLY meant it.

 

[Thunder Monkey]

I dunno what to tell you. I'm very sensitive to drops and its plain as day here. The port is better than most but it's still running about the same or worse than the ps3 version which is slower than the 360 and PC versions.

Which in itself is insane.

Either the system itself can't keep up (CPU, bandwidth, GPU even) or it's a cheap port. Given the consistency with these ports... I'm not willing to blame the devs. Confluence of all sums maybe? Certain parts work well alone, but bring them together and it's a clusterfuck?

 

[Captain Tuttle]

Well it wouldn't be a hardware launch without the lazy developer meme being thrown around.

A real shame about the performance issues though, hopefully things will improve as we move forward.

 

[Maxrunner]

Be curious how Bayonetta 2 is handled, given the bandwidth situation.

12.8GB/s + eDRAM on Wii U versus 22.4 GB/s + eDRAM on 360..

Ridiculous...

 

[StuBurns]

Be curious how Bayonetta 2 is handled, given the bandwidth situation.

12.8GB/s + eDRAM on Wii U versus 22.4 GB/s + eDRAM on 360..

Bandwidth problems gave the PS3 issues in the first game..

Less crazy alpha hair effects?

 

[shinra-bansho]

They're ports to a next-gen system that happens to have similar capability.

It's not rocket surgery. Different architecture + ported code + similar capability (with increases and drawbacks in comparison) = a crapshoot. Some games will work well, others won't.

I don't really disagree. I can't really say I'm surprised at the current outcome. But it's still odd really.

It would be nice though if people would stop ignoring that the bolded does play a role in this. As you and others have pointed out: sure there are lazy devs and lazy ports, but the notion that this is all developers' fault that's been repeatedly espoused in this and other threads is being blind. At a certain point one has to assume that the common denominators - the hardware and development tools - are also issues at play.

 

[Akkad]

Let me guess when the next Sony and MS consoles release Nintendo will claim that they are not competing with them like last time.

 

[dwu8991]

TTT2 and Sonic Racing, also.

They both looked slow !!!

30 fps at best !

 

[user_nat]

Anyone remember how launch Wii titles that were ports from PS2/Xbox (such as CoD 3 and NFS: Carbon) performed, was it similar to this?

 

[vocab]

They both looked slow !!!

30 fps at best !

tt2 is not running at 30fps.

 

[ViewtifulJC]

Be curious how Bayonetta 2 is handled, given the bandwidth situation.

12.8GB/s + eDRAM on Wii U versus 22.4 GB/s + eDRAM on 360..

Bandwidth problems gave the PS3 issues in the first game..

Sub-HD, baby

 

[Thunder Monkey]

I don't really disagree. I can't really say I'm surprised at the current outcome. But it's still odd really.

It would be nice though if people would stop ignoring that the bolded does play a role in this. As you and others have pointed out: sure there are lazy devs and lazy ports, but the notion that this is all developers' fault that's been repeatedly espoused in this and other threads is being blind. At a certain point one has to assume that the common denominators - the hardware and development tools - are also issues at play.

Meh, I've always been one of them saying "Guys just expect the worst because at best it's going to a mid-gen system."

I still expected at worst to be 360+ extra pad pixel crunching. Still possible... but admittedly becoming less and less likely.

 

[flippedb]

Anyone remember how launch Wii titles that were ports from PS2/Xbox (such as CoD 3 and NFS: Carbon) performed, was it similar to this?

I don't remember, but really don't think so, since it was basically a GameCube.

 

[SmithnCo]

"Technical issues" is putting it lightly for Epic Mickey 2 based on that stream. Holy shit.

 

[TreasureHunterG]

Blops 2 has framerate drops, but visually it's better than PS3/360 and worse in some areas.

 

[PBY]

Meh, I've always been one of them saying "Guys just expect the worst because at best it's going to a mid-gen system."

I still expected at worst to be 360+ extra pad pixel crunching. Still possible... but admittedly becoming less and less likely.

I haven't been following the system/am not tech-spec literate, only approaching it from the live stream today- is it basically 360 tier graphics?

 

[MisterHero]

Anyone remember how launch Wii titles that were ports from PS2/Xbox (such as CoD 3 and NFS: Carbon) performed, was it similar to this?

a closer example(?)

Zelda TP on GC was slightly slower and didn't have widescreen

 

[TreasureHunterG]

a closer example(?)

Zelda TP on GC was slightly slower and didn't have widescreen

As far I remember, outside of COD2, 360 release games were pretty bad performance-wise.

 

[Thunder Monkey]

I haven't been following the system/am not tech-spec literate, only approaching it from the live stream today- is it basically 360 tier graphics?

Give or take. With a few pixel crunching for the pad.

There's potentially the capability for more... but I'm beginning to question how much.

 

[Jackson]

Launch titles (especially ports) have issues because devs are learning new hardware and using continually updating, non-final SDKs under a hard set, uncompromising deadline.

I speak from very recent experience.

 

[MikeE21286]

Epic Mickey and Batman (especially Mickey) are seemingly disasters.

Lumping Blops 2 in with those two seems pretty unfair.

 

[El Pescado]

Anyone know how Skylanders Giants runs?

 

[ohlawd]

Launch titles (especially ports) have issues because devs are learning new hardware and using continually updating, non-final SDKs under a hard set, uncompromising deadline.

I speak from very recent experience.

Here comes the damage control.

Spoiler

I believe you. It's better if I act as the asshole rather than someone else lol

 

[ascii42]

As far I remember, outside of COD2, 360 release games were pretty bad performance-wise.

Or lacking in content, as was the case with EA Sports games.

 

[chertipros]

Launch titles (especially ports) have issues because devs are learning new hardware and using continually updating, non-final SDKs under a hard set, uncompromising deadline.

I speak from very recent experience.

But some of these Devs Had 2 years to port already finished games.............

 

[Hiltz]

Anyone know how Skylanders Giants runs?

Not sure how it runs, but Kotaku said it's one of the better ports and didn't notice any visual improvements or downgrades. It also supports OFF-TV play.

 

[andthebeatgoeson]

"Issues" might not be the right word for it. Is not like is unplayable or close to that. dark10x reported:

- Lower resolution shadowmaps than the 360 version.
- Lower framerate (than the 360 version) at certain spots.

The game itself plays "fine".

Any videos of it? Besides that gametrailers video?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qGI3cU7DJHk

Found one

 

[Mikey Jr.]

Jesus, that Epic Mickey 2 vid was an absolute disaster at that one part. ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

 

[DyslexicAlucard]

As far I remember, outside of COD2, 360 release games were pretty bad performance-wise.

Kameo, Condemned, Amped 3, and PGR 3 all ran pretty much flawlessly.

 

[Neuromancer]

Launch titles (especially ports) have issues because devs are learning new hardware and using continually updating, non-final SDKs under a hard set, uncompromising deadline.

I speak from very recent experience.

Sounds reasonable. It's not going to help Nintendo's case in the short term though.

 

[Lonely1]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but Darksiders 2 seems to be screen tearing free on Wii U. I should check into areas with framerate drops to see if they happen on Wii U too.

You own the game? Yours would be the first report we get about its permanence.

 

[AlStrong]

It can, but it's not exactly a flawless connection in terms of the performance you'd want.

Well, it depends on what you're trying to do (or thinking about qualitatively ). RSX can read XDR with a decent amount of bandwidth (~15GB/s IIRC) e.g. access textures/buffers. Write bandwidth is lower (~10GB/s), but that's just how it goes if you want to use SPUs for graphics processing (e.g. lighting, post-fx, z-culling).

Cell read/write access to GDDR3 though is pretty poo - 16MB/s & 4GB/s, respectively. (I think that's what you're referring to?)

 

[Thunder Monkey]

Launch titles (especially ports) have issues because devs are learning new hardware and using continually updating, non-final SDKs under a hard set, uncompromising deadline.

I speak from very recent experience.

I mean, of course there's going to be some reactionaries on each side. Those chomping at the bit to tear Nintendo down, those defending more than they have any right... but a chunk of us are just shocked at how badly some of these ports are turning out.