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[Betrayer of hope]

Fuck Kaz, fuck Naughty Dog, fuck GG, just show me what SSM has in store for us and I will have a blank cheque ready.

No disrespect to folks at SSM but there is only one studio at sony that rules the roost when it comes to cutting edge graphics. Actually two.

One is based in netherlands and the other in japan.

If i has kaz hirai i would simply walk up to these guys and just ask them what they want. Simples

 

[Proxy]

Are most games GPU heavy or CPU heavy? Doesn't this perceived advantage depend on the games? Tech noob here..

I'm not really the person to ask just clearing up a mistaken assumption.

 

[Razgreez]

Lherre said "it is a monster" months ago, and he said Durango > Orbis.

I guess things have changed since then.

lherre clearly types the word "thinks" in his posts regarding these consoles. There's a reason for that. It's advisable to stop treating speculation as fact, it's unhealthy. Neither of these machines are monsters

 

[oversitting]

I really doubt there would be "noticeable" difference between the 2 machines. I would imagine it to be very much like this gen.

 

[Kun Aguero]

No. More compute units and TMUs in total than 7850. Just that clock speed has been reduced from 7850. So in essence it is pretty much a 7850.

Performance wise how much improvement could they get over a 7850 in a closed box?

 

[deanos]

Damn you Americans!
Sorry about that, altough i maintain my point. No need to be that aggressive over such a post.

the problem is that many people believe him, too many.

 

[Perkel]

Please stop with the really bad comparisons, especially the Dragon Ball stuff. It's just so overdone.

I think my comparison is actually good one

Back on topic. If rumors are true Orbis will be much more capable than durango. Durango output will also be cut for integration of Kinect and their weird OS (2 cores).

Let's see now Durango leaks. They really need to come with something interesting if they want to keep up. Right now Orbis is much more capable in pure GFX and it can add more things on top of that like physic.

 

[Arkham]

Please stop w. ith the really bad comparisons, especially the Dragon Ball stuff. It's just so overdone.

Agreed.

No, wait!

Durango: Atari ST
Orbis: Amiga

Wait... Wait!

Durango: IntelliVision
Orbis: ColecoVision

Okaydone. Phew.

 

[Reiko]

lherre clearly types the word "thinks" in his posts regarding these consoles. There's a reason for that. It's advisable to stop treating speculation as fact, It's unhealthy. Neither of these machines are monsters

Or maybe because he's under NDA. "Thinks" is the best way to say something without voiding contract.

 

[SneakyStephan]

The PS2 also did 1080i.

xbox did real (native, not upscaled) 720p in quite a few (impressive) games.

As far as I know most ps2 games ran at 512x448 or some such.

 

[Lord Error]

I still don't see how relative performance of the target specs changed compared to what they were eg. 3 weeks ago.

The ratio shifts for the worse in a specific (albeit likely) rendering scenario. On the other hand, in a scenario in which you have a game that doesn't need compute and does just rendering (and dev doesn't want to bother manually scheduling or whatever else would need to be done to use those 4CUs for rendering) the difference would become smaller than it was anticipated before.

 

[StealthGoblin]

Lherre said "it is a monster" months ago, and he said Durango > Orbis.

I guess things have changed since then.

That was before we found out certain other things. For example, Sony only had 2GB RAM planned for a while whereas Microsoft was always at 8GB. Now we have (rumoured) that Durango's RAM is much slower and a lot more of it is reserved for the OS.

Interesting nonetheless.

 

[nelsonroyale]

Lherre said "it is a monster" months ago, and he said Durango > Orbis.

I guess things have changed since then.

Well a few months ago, there were rumour suggesting Durango had some monstrous 8 core cpu...turns out the same one is in Orbis, and isn't so monstrous after all

 

[Baconsammy]

i blame this clown:
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=47002439&postcount=936

i dont understand why so many people here treat his lies as gospel, ban him already.

Cool, now we have juniors ban-begging.

 

[PopcornMegaphone]

the problem is that many people believe him, too many.

Duly noted. Let's move on, shall we?

 

[phosphor112]

Durango = DrinkyCrow
Orbis = bishopl
WiiU = Y2Kev
Virtual Boy = phosphor112

Hey, I've got a super power of no gaems and burning retinas.

 

[Manmademan]

The PS2 also did 1080i.

no it didn't. The only game that claimed to do 1080i was GT4 (and maybe tourist trophy?)- and that wasn't true native 1080i resolution.

The Xbox 1 had a TON of games that ran 1080i natively.

 

[cyberheater]

Lherre said "it is a monster" months ago, and he said Durango > Orbis.

I guess things have changed since then.

He said that both machines will be close.

In my opinion both machines will be very close, with some details in favor for each one, but I think we will have a ps360 situation again with 2 machines very close...

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=46551080&postcount=274

 

[szaromir]

The ratio shifts for the worse in a specific (albeit likely) rendering scenario. On the other hand, in a scenario in which you have a game that doesn't need compute and does just rendering (and dev doesn't want to bother manually scheduling or whatever else would need to be done to use those 4CUs for rendering) the difference would become smaller than it was anticipated before.

Those 4CUs have been rumored for quite a while. thuway specifically said "Durango just got weaker", which is simply not true.

 

[PopcornMegaphone]

He said that both machines will be close.


http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=46551080&postcount=274

Monsters for everyone!


I'm buying both and I'm hoping for parity.

 

[Cyborg]

Is the 4 CUs a problem?yes or no

 

[Reiko]

xbox did real (native, not upscaled) 720p in quite a few (impressive) games.

As far as I know most ps2 games ran at 512x448 or some such.

Crazy huh? Dreamcast had more 640x480 games than PS2. And had more progressive scan games too.

no it didn't. The only game that claimed to do 1080i was GT4 (and maybe tourist trophy?)- and that wasn't true native 1080i resolution.

The Xbox 1 had a TON of games that ran 1080i natively.

Nope. Xbox had a few Xbox games that ran in 720p which you can count on both hands.

There were no 1080i native games. The resolution was scaled to a 1080i signal.

Not Enter the Matrix, or Dragon's Lair 3D.

 

[beast786]

Lets just all get along and imagine how mighty kratos and fenix will look on these machines.

 

[Baconsammy]

Durango = DrinkyCrow
Orbis = bishopl
WiiU = Y2Kev
Virtual Boy = phosphor112

Just a heads-up: in the other thread when these dumb comparisons started taking over the thread Bish brought out his lawnmower.

 

[Corto]

Monsters for everyone!


I'm buying both and I'm hoping for parity.

Well, but which one is Godzilla and which one is King Kong?

 

[nelsonroyale]

Those 4CUs have been rumored for quite a while. thuway specifically said "Durango just got weaker", which is simply not true.

The two consoles already seem to be locked in a symbiotic relationship in some peoples minds, where any potentially positive info for one, has a negative effect in the other

 

[Valnen]

Durango has special sauce. I've heard nothing about Durango being any sort of a compute monster. Microsoft's machine is designed around efficiency, profit, and bang for the size. It is pretty obvious what is going on with Orbis. 4 CU's for compute is fucking amazeballs.

The current specs, on paper, show that Durango is weaker overall. However, I will agree with ProElite that it will have a slightly better edge in triangle/vertices drawing power.

Is that not bad for Orbis?

 

[Razgreez]

Performance wise how much improvement could they get over a 7850 in a closed box?

In terms of pure computational performance the GPU is closer to a 7870 than a 7850 on the bandwidth side (actually slightly above a 7870) so performance should be around that when looking at the GPU on it's own. In a system where everything is connected "synergistically", performance gains can be quite large

 

[Robot Pants]

Damn 500gb! So nice.
Step it up MS. You had me this generation, but next gen I'm looking to move back to my beloved Playstation.

 

[televator]

I might say I'm in @ $500. I mean I bought my PS3 for $550 + free blu-rays, but seeing as how companies treat release hardware as extended quality testing periods, I think I can wait out after the first sales/price drop.

Still though, all this talk of GDDR5 + CUs giving considerable boosts to hardware that already might trounce what's in the nextbox is making me salivate. I hope it's all true.

 

[Corto]

Is that not bad for Orbis?

Only on angular graphics.

 

[Manmademan]

Is that not bad for Orbis?

not really, since games are more than just how many triangles one can draw in theory.

 

[Bashtee]

The hardware specs are pretty decent for both consoles. However, the bigger bandwidth from GDDR5 and the better GPU + the GPGPU functionality indicate that we will have more juice on Orbis.

The "special sauce" on Durango won't be able to outperform this so easily. Microsoft will most likely rely on their muscles as a software developer, meaning a better debugger and stuff like that.

Too much RAM??

You can never have too much RAM. If anything the RAM on orbis is frankly a complete let down.

Within 2 years the ps4 will be bandwidth starved and devs would be back to making compromises again.

Anything less than 8GB is frankly a dissapointment

Holy... 8GB of GDDR5 RAM. Planning the next Mars mission, are we?

3,5GB will probably be more than enough for the next years. High-res textures incoming.

Next gen games in Full HD @ 30fps will look awesome, nothing less.

 

[Baconsammy]

Is that not bad for Orbis?

It feeds the theory that there isn't going to be a single console that dominates graphically.

 

[shinnn]

He said that both machines will be close.


http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=46551080&postcount=274

Is he from the OP site? He is using the leaked image from Vgleaks for Gears Judgment E3 trailer.

 

[TheJollyCorner]

Is the 4 CUs a problem?yes or no

I guessing not a problem. Right?

 

[THE:MILKMAN]

Is that not bad for Orbis?

Other posters earlier were basically saying that it is irrelevant for today's GPUs?

 

[cyberheater]

Is he from the OP site? He is using the leaked image from Vgleaks for Gears Judgment E3 trailer.

He is a verified (by Neogaf mods) game dev.

 

[whitehawk]

xbox did real (native, not upscaled) 720p in quite a few (impressive) games.

As far as I know most ps2 games ran at 512x448 or some such.

Amped 2 ran at 720p. Unfortunately it was inferior to Amped 1.

 

[Clay Davis]

Is the 4 CUs a problem?yes or no

it's a problem for microsoft and durango.

 

[Dizzan]

Anyone? Any pics or vids of games on comparable pcs?

 

[SneakyStephan]

Crazy huh? Dreamcast had more 640x480 games than PS2. And had more progressive scan games too.

xbox was quite a beast (considering how fucking expensive a decent gaming pc was back then, though prices for hardware seemed to drop sharply in the 2 years after)
Dreamcast was crazy for 1999.

Native res wasn't a big deal back then though, CRT monitors handle scaling like a champ.
Now it's a way bigger deal, LCD panels shit themselves when you feed them anything that isn't their native res (or a denominator of their native framerate).

Hence why for me if next gen games don't all strive for 1080p as baseline I'll be hugely dissapointed.
I've been playing through infamous 2, ratchet and clank, bayonetta and some LBP2 this week and they are all painful to look at, the IQ is SO frigging rough.

 

[Cyborg]

I guessing not a problem. Right?

Im not a tech guy but it seems theres a problem cause it 14+4 and not just 18 CUs

 

[abadguy]

Lets just all get along and imagine how mighty kratos and fenix will look on these machines.

Can't wait to see these games in action. Going by what was done with both consoles in later years by devs like Naughty Dog and 343I. The wait for E3 is going to be torture.

 

[cyberheater]

it's a problem for microsoft and durango.

We still don't know what special sauce MS has secreted in Durango yet...

 

[FuturusX]

No, no, no. You are of course entitled to your opinion, it's just that your opinion is utterly wrong.

Well I bought - Both Dance Central 1 & 2 so it couldn't have been that bad right? But yeah when it got scratched to death I wasn't really too upset. It's expansion pack that could have been delivered digitally.

But I digress we are comparing leaks or something.

So which leaked spec's are more powerful than other?

 

[Lynn616]

it's a problem for microsoft and durango.

I thought they also can extra CUs? Or that was the rumor anyway.

 

[Baconsammy]

it's a problem for microsoft and durango.

The specs we don't fully comprehend are making the makers of another console whose specs we don't know yet scared?

 

[ZROCOOL]

Hype! Bring on next gen

 

[Proxy]

Is the 4 CUs a problem?yes or no

My uneducated opinion. If GPGPU really is the future then it's a smart idea. If not then they still can be used for rendering just not as well, presumably, if they weren't dedicated.