VR Training. The formula to raise the perfect soldiers. Which in turns, and thanks to the S3 exercise, becomes the standard procedure for training PMC's.
Absolute Battlefield control
(that's just my guess)
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Metal Gear Solid V (PS3/360/PS4/XBO/Maybe PC) - Extended 9 minute E3 trailer
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VR Training. The formula to raise the perfect soldiers. Which in turns, and thanks to the S3 exercise, becomes the standard procedure for training PMC's.
Absolute Battlefield control
(that's just my guess)
It's not a matter of denial. I have no doubt that BB will be complicit in some wrong-doing this game, considering the theme of revenge. I just think you're looking at this scene too deeply and trying to crowbar it into the thematic undertone when we're dealing with a game that will feature plenty of other opportunities to show BB turning into "a demon."
I also think that it's too large of a slide for his character to take over the course of one game, especially considering Kojima's reluctance so far in making BB outright "bad." He's been pretty much hero-protagonist for three games straight (and even arguably misunderstood hero in MGS4). And now he's going to be suddenly murdering children?
Patriot Infinity
Banned
.
I doubt it'll just happen out of nowhere. Big Boss has been on a downward spiral ever since he had to kill The Boss. I'm betting something in him will just snap.
Rogue Agent
Banned
Kaz is already pissed. I guess Skull Face and his actions after GZ will eventually make him snap.
Hehe, thx. It was more by accident thoughExcellent find of the thicker leg by the way! I would not have noticed that after 100 more views!
Catalix
And on the sixth day the LORD David Bowie created man and woman in His image. And he saw that it was good. On the seventh day the LORD created videogames so that He might take the bloody day off for once.
Of course Big Boss did many heinous things in his later years, that's what makes his character arc so interesting... but straight up killing kids still doesn't seem like his style, especially when they're defenseless behind a cage. But we do know he's capable of using and manipulating child soldiers for his own purposes, which is already fucked up in and of itself.
And the denial thing can go both ways. You want Big Boss' turn to the dark side to be so raw and dirty, that you're dismissing the possibility of that part of trailer being a simple editing trick. It was intentionally ambiguous to mislead the viewer, and get fans talking.
And Kojima said it was Kaz, too.
Rogue Agent
Banned
"The second we settle down, who's to say we won't become the warmongers?"
I couldn't care less about "how dark" they go with Big Boss, I know they're going to show his fall into infamy, and I don't really care how they get there. There's no series of events he must do to get to where he gets to in Metal Gear in terms of infamy, at least not for me.
All I'm saying is that everything in the trailer HEAVILY points toward him killing those children POW's. From the interchange between Snake and the child taking the diamond, to their reaction, and the fact that both scenes take place in the same environment. Everyone else is saying this could all be editing magic (which I guess could be true) and/or that it doesn't fit Big Boss's character, which is a view I don't necessarily agree with but it's really all opinion so who cares.
I really don't even know what the sense of arguing about this is, since we'll likely know for sure come release.
All I'm saying is that everything in the trailer HEAVILY points toward him killing those children POW's. From the interchange between Snake and the child taking the diamond, to their reaction, and the fact that both scenes take place in the same environment. Everyone else is saying this could all be editing magic (which I guess could be true) and/or that it doesn't fit Big Boss's character, which is a view I don't necessarily agree with but it's really all opinion so who cares.
I really don't even know what the sense of arguing about this is, since we'll likely know for sure come release.
It's interesting seeing everyone's ideas on what the new "weapon" could be. It's nice to have something to speculate about with Metal Gear. Haven't done this since 2008. It's strange....it feels....nostalgic.
Kojima has played this trick on us before. lol
Kojima has played this trick on us before. lol
Rogue Agent
Banned
Nukes. Cipher's bringing nukes to Africa. Holy mother of God.
About the new weapon, I still firmly believe it's VR trainnig... now you don't need The Boss or even Big Boss to train a group of soldiers, for the right amount, anyone can do it...
Are you talking about MGS2? if not, when?
Vigilant Walrus
Member
I agree with it.
One of the most powerful moments in the entire series is the discovery of the Boss sacrifice, and about doing something bad for the greater good. There is no easy choices when the world is at stake, and you are playing on the side that manipulates you and does questionable things.
I personally don't want to see BB fall from grace like how Anakin Skywalker (episodic moments that collide into just being evil). I prefer that ´the audience can side with BB, at least partially through a lot of it.
Rogue Agent
Banned
Major Zero does not like coffee since he treats it like muddy water.
Ether_Snake
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Like I said before I'm pretty sure this game will be about the Perfect Soldier project and the Successor Project. They are making the precursors to the Genome Soldiers. The zombie-ninjas are perfect soldier prototypes, and Skull Face or someone else is supposed to replace Big Boss as the ultimate battlefield commander. It makes sense if Gray Fox will be in the game, and XOF would be whoever is supposed to replace Big Boss. It also hints at why BB would return to lead Foxhound (the project fails, they can't replicate Big Boss, they really need him, etc.).
EatChildren
Currently polling second in Australia's federal election (first in the Gold Coast), this feral may one day be your Bogan King.
Not to totally buy into the whole "you're not Big Boss" conspiracy theory, but there certainly is a lot of weirdness surrounding the lead. Based on the two trailers we know Big Boss legit goes on Ground Zeroes, returns to Motherbase to find it fucked, and at some point after lands himself in a coma. Cue wake up, assault on the hospital, escape, meeting with Ocelot, and rescuing Kaz.
Based on the footage continuity, we've got two questions.
A) Where does the horn come from? It's not in the post-Ground Zeroes hospital sequence where Big Boss slips into the coma, but it is in his head during the hospital escape (assuming that's it poking through bandages).
B) Who is the man covered in bandages? During the post-Ground Zeroes hospital sequence Kaz identifies a third party ("What about him?"). This person also appears to use Kiefer's voice in the Phantom Pain trailer, though that could be bait and switch. It's not Kaz, that's for sure.
I suppose the weirdness of it all, relative to the conspiracy theory, is the lengths KojiPro is going to make it mysterious. There's no reason to bandage an entire guy's face unless his identity is important, and the existence of the horn is still a mystery.
Based on the footage continuity, we've got two questions.
A) Where does the horn come from? It's not in the post-Ground Zeroes hospital sequence where Big Boss slips into the coma, but it is in his head during the hospital escape (assuming that's it poking through bandages).
B) Who is the man covered in bandages? During the post-Ground Zeroes hospital sequence Kaz identifies a third party ("What about him?"). This person also appears to use Kiefer's voice in the Phantom Pain trailer, though that could be bait and switch. It's not Kaz, that's for sure.
I suppose the weirdness of it all, relative to the conspiracy theory, is the lengths KojiPro is going to make it mysterious. There's no reason to bandage an entire guy's face unless his identity is important, and the existence of the horn is still a mystery.
Ether_Snake
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The horn I think is either there when he is on the table, or it was added while he was in coma and we'll find out what it really is later (maybe some sort of mind-recording device, to make an AI).
The bandaged guy I think is Gray Fox.
The bandaged guy I think is Gray Fox.
Why would Big Boss and Gray Fox have the same voice if they aren't the same person?
Also in the Phantom Pain being MGS V reveal, you can clearly see the metal fragment or horn is not in his skull. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Pgt8armg0A
At the 59/60 second mark his forehead and skull are clean, no shrapnel has penetrated his skull.
Ether_Snake
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I think they just didn't have the voice actor or recording yet for that trailer, so it was the same voice.
The horn not being there might just have been like Gui_PT said, he just didn't want to show it then. Or it's planted in his head later.
edit: Either way he removes it at some point, so there's bound to be more to it than just a horn. I still think the game will involve this being a recording of his memories. The horn might be part of that. I think that's why everything is filmed continuously; it's one long recording of different people's memories, joined together.
The horn not being there might just have been like Gui_PT said, he just didn't want to show it then. Or it's planted in his head later.
edit: Either way he removes it at some point, so there's bound to be more to it than just a horn. I still think the game will involve this being a recording of his memories. The horn might be part of that. I think that's why everything is filmed continuously; it's one long recording of different people's memories, joined together.
Rogue Agent
Banned
Wasn't the horn also in the artwork with Big Boss and that dog?
The Phantom Pain reveal didn't need voice overs to begin with though, and it would seem strange for Kojima to bring in Kiefer just to voice a side character that doesn't have that much dialog.
Bandage dude could've had any stand in for a voice actor, using Kiefer just for that one character doesn't make sense. Bandaged dude could simply be a figment of Big Boss's imagination, and Psycho Mantis is in full mind game mode.
Dunno if anyone here has seen this but it's a really good short analysis of MGS2 and why it is essentially a stroke of genius, even though I enjoyed the game as a kid I never quite understood its depth until recently:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zx2dgVKYWWU
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zx2dgVKYWWU
Ether_Snake
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I don't think so, when Kaz says what about him, the doctor turns around. There was someone else.
Him being voiced by Keifer would have been because they did all recordings for the complete trailer and needed someone to voice that guy. Why bring someone else who won't be the actual actor anyway?
Can Crusher
Banned
I'm still hoping the Big Boss in the video we saw at the presentation is Gray Fox, who plays the role of BB while he's in a coma.
So many things would make sense too!
So many things would make sense too!
I think I see it, but it's admittedly a bit iffy, with Shinkawa's style.
SJRB
Gold Member
Doesn't really look like it,
I clearly see a horn here as well.
I wasn't arguing for when Big Boss is initially comatose, I'm talking about the escape from whatever medical facility Big Boss was held at. My point about Kiefer was Kojima already knew Kiefer would be Big Boss or a major character in MGS V, around the time The Phantom Pain reveal happened last year.
It would be an odd mistake or choice to have someone voice a seemingly unimportant character while assigning that same voice actor to another character later. If bandaged dude still exists in MGS V but has a different voice than before, that seems like a mistake or oddity Kojima wouldn't commit.
Unless Bandaged face is integral to either the story or Big Boss. I just don't see Kojima calling Kiefer in to be a main character and then asking him to also voice a side character, unless there's a good reason for doing so.
AuthenticM
Member
What if the big twist at the end of the game is that Snake didn't wake up from his coma, but was inserted into a virtual reality ?
Doesn't look like a horn, looks like stylized sharpness applied to his forehead. On the right side of his face you can also see a sharp black line, the horn in MGS V is also really jarring and chunk like. The horn isn't subtle when its shown in MGS V. So while it looks like it could be underneath his forehead in that drawing, I doubt that's a horn at all.
Sure, there's a third man in that scene, but that doesn't necessarily mean "Ishmael" is real.
Possible scenario: the third man becomes a Big Boss decoy ("Punished Snake"), and "Ishmael" is just a figment of his imagination, hence the identical voice and the weird "I- we..." and "who are you? -*points at Punished Snake*"...
Could be a manifestation of his true (pre-Big Boss decoy) identity, for example (although I guess I'd be using a different voice actor for him, in that scenario, personally).
Can Crusher
Banned
Unfortunately I don't really think Kojima would make such an awesome thing. He would rather make us play as BB or Raiden again than Gray Fox, something gamers have been clamoring for years and years.
That's what it looked like to me. The kids retreated with a scared look on their faces, so I'm not convinced it was just editing.
Rogue Agent
Banned
But there's a horn in the more recent concept art.
Whoa. Big Boss looks badass. Feels really authoritative.
Doesn't really look like it,
He clearly has a horn there.
SJRB
Gold Member
Here's the highest available resolution of that image, in which I upped the contrast:
The place on his forehead, the point upwards, the texture, everything is identical to the horn.
I couldn't see Campbell, a patriot being apart of Diamond Dogs. Almost certain it's Miller.
Here's the highest available resolution of that image, in which I upped the contrast:
The place on his forehead, the point upwards, the texture, everything is identical to the horn.
It honestly looks more like a cable that's embedded into his head. It also leads right into his missing eye, maybe those "binoculars" really are a digital/robotic eye.
keltickennedy
Member
Is it still canon that both twin brothers have blonde hair and solid snake just dyes his? Or was this something I just made up from playing the old games when I was younger? lol
I never knew this was canon to begin with! :lol
Can Crusher
Banned
I thought Liquid had a blond hair and darker skin because of the sun?
I think we're talking about the protrusion above the line leading into his eye. The eye line looks to be a sharp depiction his forehead's contour, rather than an actual object on his face.
I totally forgot about those images with the horn :lol
I believe I read somewhere that they dismissed that.
Solid Snake does have white hair in the debriefing tapes but it's apparently because of the light in the room or it was a style decision or something like that.
I believe I read somewhere that they dismissed that.
Solid Snake does have white hair in the debriefing tapes but it's apparently because of the light in the room or it was a style decision or something like that.
Ether_Snake
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It doesn't. All indications are Gray Fox is supposed to look more like Raiden than Snake, and considering the rest of his story it would make no sense at all.
You say it's a mistake, I say it's a production reality: they did a recording session with just a few people (Ocelot, Kaz, Big Boss, the doctor and that woman voice), and that's it. It is possible they didn't have anyone to voice bandaged dude at this point, and that's all. So they had one of their actor voice him. They don't "call in" the actor to do a few lines for a trailer. They do recording sessions for the game, and it's very difficult to do all the casting, flying people over at the right time, etc.
He says "I... we" probably because he refers to a group of people who he is part of. The guy was driving the truck.
It would be dumb to have a figment of his imagination give him a shot. The guy is certainly actually present.
Hopefully we'll find out soon enough, I'm on the Big Boss after Ground Zeroes isn't really Big Boss train, and bandaged dude during the escape seems oddly placed no matter the circumstances.
I understand that, that was part of my point. Kiefer was already cast as Snake or someone else, so him voicing another character and then Kojima swapping character voices later seems odd.
Can Crusher
Banned
Either way that ain't Big Boss. Look how Ocelot was sort of bossing him at the beginning of the presentation video. Clearly it has to be someone else.
Another clone? That would be cringe worthy.
Ether_Snake
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Not if the production logistics didn't allow them to have the actual actor voice that guy at that point.
ichtyander
Member
If the Punished Snake isn't Big Boss idea is true, then this Snake guy could've gotten the horn from an accident or other similar event. It doesn't have to be implanted or anything.
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