IncandescentPrecept
Banned
Why would it need more than 4GB of RAM just for the game?
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F'DUPTON 3: Back in the Tub with 5.0/5.5/6/7/several Inches of RAM-Flavoured Water
- Thread starter CrunchinJelly
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Why would it need more than 4GB of RAM just for the game?
Just another nail on consoles for me. I was extremely disappointed from the beginning knowing these "next-gen" systems won't even be able to provide 1080p/60fps for most games. We waited 10 years to jump from 720p to 1080p?
When Valve decides to unveil its Steambox pc-console hybrid next year I just hope that will be the end of consoles as we know them.
When Valve decides to unveil its Steambox pc-console hybrid next year I just hope that will be the end of consoles as we know them.
It is all about the games now.
Nintendo folks have been saying this for a while now. Welcome Sony fans!
please don't ban me!
travisbickle
Member
Also when you have a number of "sources" saying different things, the few within DF's article, and then others on GAF. I think you should consider retracting the article for a short time because there will be only one true set of numbers Sony has given to developers, I mean having conflicting sources isn't a sign of validity, it's the opposite!
Canis lupus
Member
SMH, apart from:
8GB DDR3 vs 8GB GDDR5
1.2 vs 1.84TFLOPs
Mandatory Kinect vs No Kinect
Different boxes and controllers
yes they're not that different
Paracelsus
Member
At least now we know almost for a fact something like a 3gb 7870 can easily match the next generation of consoles so the upgrade will be easy and quite cheap.
LiquidMetal14
hide your water-based mammals
Nah, but they or no one knows how the allocation of memory works.
It's not like Xbone and PS4 have 3GB of memory working all the time reserved for the OS. The memory is there as a pool for accessing the OS and it's features while in game. It's clear to see that the new consoles will be more like PC's in their ability to snap out of a game and watch Netflix, go to the PSN/Marketplace, video/voice chat, and whatever else.
A snappy and responsive OS is very important. This number will get better with time and there's not much more to say about it.
What is that supposed to convey?
Dictator93
Member
wat
cyberheater
PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 PS4 Xbone PS4 PS4
PS4 devs can't rely on that 512Mb of flex memory being real. It could be virtual which means it's getting pulled from the hard drive therefore really slow.
Nightengale
Member
We've seen the OS being used on-stage, it's clearly 'finished' in many ways.
I'm talking in regards to 'optimisation' of the OS, as well as the so-called 'future-proofing' of extra RAM.
Based on what shinobi said, the current build of the OS apparently takes up 1.5GB max. If Sony can trim it down to needing no more than 1GB, then I wouldn't be surprised if the OS allocation is only 2GB by the end of the day.
And then 'future-proofing.' This part is basically just how paranoia Sony will be. If they're no paranoid at all, 512MB for future proofing is more than enough, but it seems that they'll reserve at least 1GB for this.
JonathanPower
Member
It does not. I would be surprised if the actual OS uses more than 250MB of RAM. So if this rumor is true, maybe what they did is to waste 1GB just for video recording, and reserve the rest for "who knows what" potential future applications that we never asked for.
Black Republican
Member
BigTnaples
Todd Howard's Secret GAF Account
Disappointing if true.
Hopefully Sony ends up reserving less for the OS and this only effects launch titles.
I know with optimization and such this is not a precise comparison, but Skyrim Modded on my PC regularly goes above 3-4GB (Of my total 16gb) system ram and that's without taking into account my 2GB of GPU ram.
My dream of a next gen Elder Scrolls or Fallout with no interior/exterior cells is less likely now. But still doable. I hope.
Hopefully Sony ends up reserving less for the OS and this only effects launch titles.
I know with optimization and such this is not a precise comparison, but Skyrim Modded on my PC regularly goes above 3-4GB (Of my total 16gb) system ram and that's without taking into account my 2GB of GPU ram.
My dream of a next gen Elder Scrolls or Fallout with no interior/exterior cells is less likely now. But still doable. I hope.
RibbedHero
Member
SMH, apart from:
8GB DDR3 vs 8GB GDDR5
1.2 vs 1.84TFLOPs
Mandatory Kinect vs No Kinect
Different boxes and controllers
yes they're not that different
In the history of consoles these two are pretty much siblings. Never before have two consoles been so similar.
LiquidMetal14
hide your water-based mammals
Those guys are Xbox fanboys. Let's just state that clear.
Whether true or not, the pull the string favorably for Xbox in their opinions. No different that some on here. You just can't quote everyone and take them to court over their rubbish.
Have you seen some of the past consoles? This really isn't a ton different but the HW is sort of similar minus some big glaring specs which were pointed out. Those make a tangible difference in real world performance and throughput.
What i am most intrigued by and fascinated with, is not even the RAM, or any console, but November-December-January NPD and Media Create sales. If this is any indication how most people react in regards to just merely RAM numbers then once sales numbers come out i am pretty sure it will be a massacre, unlike anything anyone has ever seen on this forum. Add in Nintendo in the mix as fans are hoping for a resurgence through Mario U and you have a 3-way match for the WWF title
Its like a overtly aggressive rattlesnake in the tall grass, even looking at it and it starts to rise up and hiss
Its like a overtly aggressive rattlesnake in the tall grass, even looking at it and it starts to rise up and hiss
The sources don't really conflict. The original article said 1GB flexible RAM, and that is not refuted in the update, it's just that only half of it is physical RAM and actually useful for game applications.
Canis lupus
Member
More like dad and son.
Fucking haha. I love Steam and all being a PC gamer most of my life but give me a break. I got Dishonored on the sale and installed it yesterday This is one of the more "console-friendly" PC games.
Downloading...
Step 1/5: Installing Microsoft Direct X for Windows (even though it's been installed 100x already)
Step 2/5: Installing Microsoft Visual C++ runtime libraries
Step 3/5: Installing XNA
Step 4/5: Some other PC shit
Step 5/5: Some other PC shit
Launch game.
Change video settings.
Play game for 2 mins
Tweak video settings.
It's fine for people like your and I but it's never going to be as easy as the consoles for normal people. Not gonna happen.
hokagespit
Member
so thats how people hit their thumbs together handling DS i had to figure it out a couple of weeks ago when i heard spacing was improved on ds4 for these circumstances. i was doing it to timidly compared to this though
John Bellomy ‏@cowbs
Reading the comments on these OS mem articles (first mistake) ... There are not enough palms to face.
timtheterrible ‏@timtheterrible1
@cowbs Interesting...but your comment implies that the comments are silly, and not the article itself.
John Bellomy ‏@cowbs
@timtheterrible1 mostly reacting to people extrapolating the implications to ridiculous degrees.
he's not denying it.
Sho_Nuff82
Member
I really hope the people saying this is "not a big deal, totally expected, won't affect games" weren't in previous threads over the past few months calling MS and Nintendo a joke for their RAM allocations.
Not saying that Sony deserves to be reverse trolled but it's obvious that some Sony fans feel disappointed and some MS fans feel vindicated, because everyone had taken the 7 vs 5 comparison as gospel, even the major news sites.
It takes quite a bit of cognitive dissonance to hold MS over the flames for "lol 3GB non-gaming media box" while simultaneously championing Sony for their "forward thinking." If be amazed if their weren't as many posters expressing surprise. And to the insiders who have suddenly decided to share this with us and explain why it's not a big deal - thanks for nothing for the past 3 months of stupidity that you probably could have helped defuse.
Edit: And this kind of situation goes a loooong way in explaining why the PS4 and One games we saw at E3 looked so similar. The "tangible difference" crowd will probably have to wait until Uncharted 4 before they have a graphical showpiece.
Not saying that Sony deserves to be reverse trolled but it's obvious that some Sony fans feel disappointed and some MS fans feel vindicated, because everyone had taken the 7 vs 5 comparison as gospel, even the major news sites.
It takes quite a bit of cognitive dissonance to hold MS over the flames for "lol 3GB non-gaming media box" while simultaneously championing Sony for their "forward thinking." If be amazed if their weren't as many posters expressing surprise. And to the insiders who have suddenly decided to share this with us and explain why it's not a big deal - thanks for nothing for the past 3 months of stupidity that you probably could have helped defuse.
Edit: And this kind of situation goes a loooong way in explaining why the PS4 and One games we saw at E3 looked so similar. The "tangible difference" crowd will probably have to wait until Uncharted 4 before they have a graphical showpiece.
Coulomb_Barrier
Member
vpance
Member
That guy is the source of the update to the article.
Valve: "....and we'll just nick a few GBs of RAM. Just in case people want to check their Facebook feed."
Even my WDTV Live Media players have social media features built in. And no, I didn't want them, I just wanted to stream MKVs.
Melchiah
Member
Yes, they can. Sony lowered the PS3 OS reserve from 120MB to 50MB in 2010.
EDIT:
http://www.joystiq.com/2010/02/23/70mb-of-additional-ram-unlocked-for-ps3-developers/
LiquidMetal14
hide your water-based mammals
John Bellomy ‏@cowbs
Reading the comments on these OS mem articles (first mistake) ... There are not enough palms to face.
timtheterrible ‏@timtheterrible1
@cowbs Interesting...but your comment implies that the comments are silly, and not the article itself.
John Bellomy ‏@cowbs
@timtheterrible1 mostly reacting to people extrapolating the implications to ridiculous degrees.
he's not denying it.
Why would he need to be transparent about a non issue though?
It's like some TMZ level garbage some are looking for here.
I don't know all the parties but the sources are red flags left and right. I don't know these guys like the back of my hand nor do I care to.
John Bellomy ‏@cowbs
Reading the comments on these OS mem articles (first mistake) ... There are not enough palms to face.
timtheterrible ‏@timtheterrible1
@cowbs Interesting...but your comment implies that the comments are silly, and not the article itself.
John Bellomy ‏@cowbs
@timtheterrible1 mostly reacting to people extrapolating the implications to ridiculous degrees.
he's not denying it.
Yea, like I said, why not then just stick to developing for PS3 given how he's making out the amount of ram to be inconsequential. Dat 512MB is pit of challenge. Clearly, developing for a PS4 is a luxury and not a necessity for greater fidelity or anything.
Seriously however, that comment did piss me off but I hope he's right, in that it suffices for now
That is what happens when the media and companies emphasize something that a lot of people have no clue about. The bit wars is a prime example. You build hype on it then have a huge backlash if something varies.
The funny part is that the 8 gigs isn't gone, no hardware specs where downgraded, and the total allotted memory will go up in time.
zomgbbqftw
Banned
I figure bish deleted that other thread for a reason...
ps4 is dying
gigantor21
Member
Yeah, I don't get why the OS would need to take up that much memory. I was hoping to see something with a smaller footprint, to maximize how much of the RAM devs could utilize.
But people were SERIOUSLY cancelling their pre-orders over this? Why? If they were already making stuff like Killzone SF and The Dark Sorcerer when they thought it would just be 4GB of RAM, is it really that big a deal? They've already done plenty with the piss poor 512MB this generation as it is.
But people were SERIOUSLY cancelling their pre-orders over this? Why? If they were already making stuff like Killzone SF and The Dark Sorcerer when they thought it would just be 4GB of RAM, is it really that big a deal? They've already done plenty with the piss poor 512MB this generation as it is.
LiquidMetal14
hide your water-based mammals
Its in our nature to compare and be competitive, but I agree, we're upgrading our units so the real focus should be how great this upgrade is. There is such a thing as overkill, if developers are saying they're having a tough time knowing what to do with all this memory (Respawn) then that's a good sign that this time consoles added enough.
We don't need you playing patrol. If you're not going to specifically call out people being disingenuous, then please don't post this at all. Let me know if this is unclear.
lol ok
reptilescorpio
Member
Tweets are from yesterday aren't they?
John Bellomy ‏@cowbs
Reading the comments on these OS mem articles (first mistake) ... There are not enough palms to face.
timtheterrible ‏@timtheterrible1
@cowbs Interesting...but your comment implies that the comments are silly, and not the article itself.
John Bellomy ‏@cowbs
@timtheterrible1 mostly reacting to people extrapolating the implications to ridiculous degrees.
he's not denying it.
hokagespit
Member
lol. hes not worried
Agreed .
Do you think that happened because it was such a shitfest or because he believes the article to be in error. If the latter is true and this thread remains untouched despite all the shit there is already and all that there is be to come, then it would mean that the information now is accurate.
Yes, well, Sony can, MS has blocked 3gb off for good.
PS3 (and Vita?) saw their OS footprint shrink a good margin over time.
Reserving RAM is smart for now, what if MS or Sony buy Oculus Rift, we'll be happy they had that RAM, or Streaming games, or something we haven't dreamed of yet.
The OS footprint will most likely shrink, especially if devs demand it over time...though I have no idea wtf someone could do with 7gb Gdddr5 ram without more powerful gpu/cpu to funnel all that info through.
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