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[Pie and Beans]

I get what you're trying to say, but you've conveniently ignored the Wii in all of this. The Wii-personal opinions notwithstanding-that system reversed Nintendo's downward sales momentum in home consoles in a big way. But it was successful b/c it caught on to new tech that hadn't already worn out its welcome in other markets like smartphones and tablets.

I still think Nintendo can last in the console business, like you, but IMHO they need to really start pushing into an innovative tech like VR, wearable tech, or what have you, and do so BEFORE it reaches market saturation. Something they've failed to do w/ Wii U and it's "been there, done that" Gamepad.

You're correct here and I've argued as such that the WiiU essentially needed to be the Oculus Rift to keep them in the home hardware game. What becomes painfully apparent to us now however, is that we get to see what companies and tech start-ups Nintendo purchases in their financials and budgets. We saw the formation of the Wii with Nintendo picking up various motion control tech and also the 3D screen tech for the 3DS. Right now, Nintendo isn't making those moves and are starkly behind in comparison to mostly every other electronics company on Earth.

The Wii's success was about making things more convenient to non-players. A rectangle you hold like a stick is about as rudimentary concept as you can get. Since then however, the "convenience sometimes-gamer" has a smartphone for such experiences or a tablet. Nintendo would have to 'out-convenience" something like a phone or tablet they have on them at all times and an eco-system people are firmly rooted into with their music, books, films, and of course apps. Thats simply not going to happen. Wii was a one-time lightning in a bottle capture, and they fucked up on actually corking that bottle.

 

[something fishy]

*sigh* Seriously?

It was just yesterday we had the thread. Also, check out the attach rate for the Wii. It wasn't that far behind 360/PS3. I guarantee it's much better than you're thinking. Again, that argument was completely destroyed.

yeah but it seemed to revolve around quite a lot of people who bought a wii buying Mario kart, New Super Mario etc. Nothing that confirmed they would buy a new console to get them again.

 

[MickeyPhree]

I really just got this for my three year old but this is getting beyond ridiculous.

 

[Manmademan]

Wii Party and DKCR came out a few months after SMG2. But it does not really go against the point your making. The Wii was dead after 2010.

Thank you. I might have missed those, but the point is the same. The Wii's base just left overnight somewhere around 2010, and did not come back. Not to the Wii, not to the PS360, not to the WiiU...just gone. Casual gamers simply lost interest. Core gamers were driven to other platforms.

And let me expand on Tablets and iOS for a second.

It's a completely different market, and much smaller in terms of revenue. all of iOS gaming for 2012 was about 3 billion dollars- about half of what Sony alone made in a year. This isn't anywhere close to accounting for the vanished nintendo base.

But it gets worse. 2/3rds of that revenue comes from "Whales" making in-app purchases. so it's not vast amounts of people downloading games at 99cents that makes most of that profit, but a handful that spend $1000s on virtual farms and smurfberries.

Nintendo never really had anything that appealed to that crowd, and no online infrastructure to begin to know how to exploit them if they were even interested. Its not the same market.

They did buy Wii software. They just...stopped eventually. What does buying other systems have to do with whether or not they bought Wii games?

Read what I wrote again. we're not even talking the WiiU. The Wii's failure to sell any significant software for 3 years straight is indicative of the fact that it's base was not interested in playing games, but attracted to the novelty of motion controls and weight loss software. once that wore off, nintendo could not retain them. There is literally no other leading console in any generation that held first place for three years, only to have it's audience collapse that way. The wii was clearly targeted and successful at gaining a customer base that didn't really have an interest in playing console games.

 

[SmokyDave]

No, its the games.

90% of the people who buy consoles at launch are core gamer fanboys most of whom probably were never interested in Nintendo products. These people are not Nintendo's audience. IF they would have launched with games ready like Mario Kart 8, I think things would look a whole lot better, not great, but definitely better. They might have met that very modest target of 5 million units shipped through March.

Nah this is just gross mismanagement on all fronts by company that wants to be smaller than it should be. Nintendo is about 2500 employees total. That covers all departments and they are expected to produce several games for 2 pieces of hardware. It isn't possible. Nintendo is probably realizing that about a year too late.

Can you provide some sort of source for this statistic, please?

 

[pringles]

I'm not really surprised it's doing so bad in Europe. Absolutely ZERO marketing, even if there had been tons of games released no one would know about it.

The Wii didn't have a ton of great releases in the first 6-12 months, but it was marketed everywhere and people knew about it. I know people who love Mario and Zelda games and still play their Wiis but even they barely know what the WiiU is or that it exists.

Nintendo better have a huge marketing campaign planned for the fall/holiday to turn the WiiU ship around.

 

[RustyRobot]

That's just sad.
It's always the same with Nintendo. They say they have learned from past mistakes and then look at this. Iwata should be sacked.

 

[lvlzero]

Nintendo better have a huge marketing campaign planned for the fall/holiday to turn the WiiU ship around.

Right now that plan seems to be capsize the boat.

 

[smurfx]

I wonder if Nintendo should have tried something like oculus rift. I don't know if it has the same mainstream appeal as Wii did but its pretty obvious their tablet is a pale imitation of already popular market trends...they need to trailblaze. I wonder if they could have made OR mainstream.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gc0WXMTOAAI

nintendo needs to finally make the ON a real thing!

 

[GetemMa]

Can you provide some sort of source for this statistic, please?

Launch editions of the PS4 and Xbone are largely sold out, 4 months ahead of their release date.

Do you think that it is kids and casual gamers watching E3, getting online, and preordering $400/$500 consoles in June?

Feel free to think that but know that it reflects on you poorly.

 

[FalsettoVibe]

Horrible Nintendo........just horrible

 

[LordGouda]

Can you provide some sort of source for this statistic, please?

90% of all statistics are bullshit.

 

[Kerub]

Oh well, look on the bright side. If you have a Wii U, it will become a collector item very soon. Some of the games will be rare too.

 

[Josh7289]

Hoooly shit. Is this beyond Vita bad?

 

[stryke]

Nintendo better have a huge marketing campaign planned for the fall/holiday to turn the WiiU ship around.

They do. It's called the faultless master plan of spreading the word through Mii-verse.

 

[SmokyDave]

Launch editions of the PS4 and Xbone are largely sold out, 4 months ahead of their release date.

Do you think that it is kids and casual gamers watching E3, getting online, and preordering $400/$500 consoles in June?

No, I think it's core gamers looking forward to the next gen. I don't think they all have a platform allegiance and I'd wager many of them would've grabbed a Wii U if it represented an upgrade over their current systems.

Feel free to think that but know that it reflects on you poorly.

Sure thing hoss.

 

[AniHawk]

Can you provide some sort of source for this statistic, please?

aw, you can come up with statistics to prove anything, smokydave. forty percent of all people know that.

 

[DragonSworne]

This should highlight Nintendo's incompetence at managing software development:

Nintendo has spent 2+ years developing Wii U Fit when it takes an iOS/Android developer a couple weeks to come up with something similar for free.


Until Nintendo can compete with the fast pace of the appstore and google play market, they need to step out of the casual realm and concede that their model of game development is not fit for the casual gaming market. Once they do this and focus on newer IPs that inspire gamers, their sales will increase.

 

[TheDarkKnight774]

Worst year head start of all time? I'm sure Sega might have a couple that were worse.

 

[sixteen-bit]

I'd rather Nintendo died than let people who want Nintendo to go third party have their way.

That's irrational.

 

[Aquamarine]

The forecast is absurd. There is no "if" or "but" to it. It was absurd 3 months ago, it remains absurd now. That they haven't revised their forecast is ridiculous.

It is absolutely ridiculous. I have half a mind to call up NCL's Kyoto office and complain.

12.45 million through March, when the Wii U only managed 0.16 on barren stock refreshers, is literally impossible to achieve (for the console).

Does Nintendo really expect us to believe that the Wii U will actually ship 8.84 million consoles in NINE MONTHS?

 

[Plinko]

yeah but it seemed to revolve around quite a lot of people who bought a wii buying Mario kart, New Super Mario etc. Nothing that confirmed they would buy a new console to get them again.

The argument was that people who bought Wii never bought any games, which is total garbage. The attach rate was good--very close to competitors.

That said, I agree on your other point. I just was pointing out that his statement was totally false.

 

[KillerMan91]

Yeah. Like some have said games are not the only or even the biggest problem with WiiU. It's that the platform just isn't appealing to customers. PS3 actually had to compete against other same gen platforms, had similar problems with software droughts and had insane 599$ price tag and still it never got even close to these abysmal numbers.

 

[LordGouda]

This should highlight Nintendo's incompetence at managing software development:

Nintendo has spent 2+ years developing Wii U Fit when it takes an iOS/Android developer a couple weeks to come up with something similar for free.


Until Nintendo can compete with the fast pace of the appstore and google play market, they need to step out of the casual realm and concede that their model of game development is not fit for the casual gaming market. Once they do this and focus on newer IPs that inspire gamers, their sales will increase.

1. I'm not even sure if you're being serious.
2. People have been saying this for a while now: "New IPs =/= increased sales". Not nowadays anyway.

 

[Fox Mulder]

No shock.

You don't launch a console with zero high profile games for half a year and the worst third party support possible.

 

[Kerub]

Is there a risk that Nintendo stops producing Wii U?

 

[GetemMa]

No, I think it's core gamers looking forward to the next gen. I don't think they all have a platform allegiance and I'd wager many of them would've grabbed a Wii U if it represented an upgrade over their current systems.

Can you provide some sort of source for this statistic, please?

SmokyDave wants to see those stats from which you are basing your opinions.

 

[Pie and Beans]

It is absolutely ridiculous. I have half a mind to call up NCL's Kyoto office and complain.

12.45 million through March, when the Wii U only managed 0.16 on barren stock refreshers, is literally impossible to achieve (for the console).

Does Nintendo really expect us to believe that the Wii U will actually ship 8.84 million consoles in NINE MONTHS?

More accurate would be Five Months from November on. I'm pretty flabbergasted they didn't revise forecasts. I guess Iwata and co are just in this for as many paychecks as possible before being angrily removed at this point if they're to lie to investors faces at that degree.

 

[DragonSworne]

It is absolutely ridiculous. I have half a mind to call up NCL's Kyoto office and complain.

12.45 million through March, when the Wii U only managed 0.16 on barren stock refreshers, is literally impossible to achieve (for the console).

Does Nintendo really expect us to believe that the Wii U will actually ship 8.84 million consoles in NINE MONTHS?

Nintendo will have to see a 20X increase in shipment per month starting the beginning of July.

Consider July is over... They are already falling behind...

 

[Aquamarine]

Is there a risk that Nintendo stops producing Wii U?

If numbers stay this bad, and a new CEO comes in, there's always the chance next March / next June that Nintendo abruptly cancels it in a Virtual Boy-esque situation.

But the chances of that are honestly quite small. I'm willing to bet the Wii U will perform adequately enough throughout the holidays that Nintendo will keep it in production.

 

[freddy]

Trying to please everyone and pleasing no one. I like the tablet, but it wouldn't be enough if it weren't for my Mario fetish.

 

[something fishy]

The argument was that people who bought Wii never bought any games, which is total garbage. The attach rate was good--very close to competitors.

That said, I agree on your other point. I just was pointing out that his statement was totally false.

Fair enough, the evidence is clear that they did indeed.

 

[FalsettoVibe]

Is this worse than Gamecube? Vita?

 

[Bigmac1910]

Only 10.000 in other territories as absolutely abysmal, first party will not save the Wii U. I believe that the only way to get some sales, is to drop the controller and the price. I think that most casual people are intimidated by it or doesn't even know what it is. If people haven't seen the value of by now, I think it's pointless to keep trying to convince them that it adds value, people have already made up their minds i think.

 

[DragonSworne]

1. I'm not even sure if you're being serious.
2. People have been saying this for a while now: "New IPs =/= increased sales". Not nowadays anyway.

So you think spending 2+ years and millions of dollars to develop Wii U Fit is a smart strategy?

Nintendo's whole approach to casual gaming is archaic. You do not take the standard software development lifecycle approach for how traditional games are made and apply them to casual games. It's slow and expensive with even bigger risk.

When you compare Nintendo's model for casual games to the app store and google play, it's a shining example of incompetence.

 

[Manmademan]

The argument was that people who bought Wii never bought any games, which is total garbage. The attach rate was good--very close to competitors.

That said, I agree on your other point. I just was pointing out that his statement was totally false.

I didn't say that. I said the wii sold to people with no interest in PLAYING games.

stay with me here.

buying wii sports or wii fit to enjoy the novelty of motion controls and waggle isn't really an audience who likes playing games. this is an audience attracted to the novelty of motion control. there's a big difference. People who fire up a tablet to fool around with songpop or candy crush for 15 minutes and nothing else aren't really an audience who like playing games either. it's simply the most convenient way to waste time for 15 minutes.

people who enjoy playing games *gasp* keep buying them! This didn't happen with the wii.

The Wii's attach rate is only respectable because nearly all of it's software was sold up until 2010...then sales collapsed and their audience got tired of playing games. This has never happened to any other console in gaming history, and didn't happen to their two closest competitors.

 

[SatoAilDarko]

These horrible results make me kind of excited to see what drastic actions Nintendo makes. Their original plan to just wait for big games to release and ride it out is obliviously not working out. They really have to learn to start release titles quicker. Their need for extra polish is usually unnecessary. They need titles now. Mario Kart should have been this year, why did a game like Wii Party U even need more time and how can they delay a system update?

I'm still content with my day 1 Wii U purchase, really enjoy it. It has my most anticipated games coming out on any system, The Wonderful 101, X and Smash as well as a whole lot of other games. Still, after Nintendo's lackluster E3 it's clear they need to improve their development system. These horrid sales are exactly what Nintendo needs to try and fix the problem. This isn't the Dreamcast, Nintendo has the successful 3DS and a large amount of cash. They won't sink from this, they'll learn and put the necessary resources to improve the Wii U.

 

[evilromero]

Read what I wrote again. we're not even talking the WiiU. The Wii's failure to sell any significant software for 3 years straight is indicative of the fact that it's base was not interested in playing games, but attracted to the novelty of motion controls and weight loss software. once that wore off, nintendo could not retain them. There is literally no other leading console in any generation that held first place for three years, only to have it's audience collapse that way. The wii was clearly targeted and successful at gaining a customer base that didn't really have an interest in playing console games.

To be fair Skylanders and Just Dance apparently sold very well late in the Wii's life.

 

[gigantor21]

Is this worse than Gamecube? Vita?

Yeah, it's still behind the Gamecube, according to Aquamarine. Probably ahead of the Vita, though. For whatever that's worth... *sigh*

 

[RukusProvider]

Called this failure many times ages ago. Glad to see I'm right, again.

My other repeated predictions:

Vita in the west has no chance. Continues to be correct.
3ds will not sell as well as previous handheld. Continues to be correct.

 

[Wolfgunblood Garopa]

That's just sad.
It's always the same with Nintendo. They say they have learned from past mistakes and then look at this. Iwata should be sacked.

It's like Nintendo has gone insane, stumbling around the streets going door to door dragging around the Wii corpse for all to see thinking it's still alive. Knock knock, we would still like to play. Remember when we played.

 

[popeutlal]

Chances of a turn around from this disaster....so far looks to be none.

 

[Laurent]

Wii U Shipments:
Q3 2013 - 3.06 million LTD
Q4 2013 - 3.45 million LTD
Q1 2014 (June 2013) - 3.61 million LTD

Just pointing out that you meant Q3 2012, Q4 2012 and Q1 2013… or am I missing something?

 

[BlackJace]

It is absolutely ridiculous. I have half a mind to call up NCL's Kyoto office and complain.

12.45 million through March, when the Wii U only managed 0.16 on barren stock refreshers, is literally impossible to achieve (for the console).

Does Nintendo really expect us to believe that the Wii U will actually ship 8.84 million consoles in NINE MONTHS?

Iwata believes in his Black Magic. That's literally the only way that forecast can be met

 

[mxgt]

Is this going to light a fire under Nintendo's ass?

Spoiler

probably not

 

[$h@d0w]

Hoooly shit. Is this beyond Vita bad?

Sony's Q1 FY2013 investor meeting is tomorrow, haha.

 

[Manmademan]

To be fair Skylanders and Just Dance apparently sold very well late in the Wii's life.

as well as the 30+ million who bought mario kart? wii sports? wii play? where did the tens of millions of people buying those titles go?

 

[KennyLinder]

as well as the 30+ million who bought mario kart? wii sports? wii play? where did the tens of millions of people buying those titles go?

apple.com/ipad or they are done. They had their fill, they don't need or want another gaming system.

 

[popeutlal]

Out of 160k shipped units, how many have they sold?

 

[RurouniZel]

Utterly calamitous.

Nintendo better unleash some fuckin MAGIC this holiday.

Spoiler

Cut the damn price already!