Mercury Land-Snake
Member
I'd rather Sony spend money on devs like Naughty Dog to make amazing games like TLOU over spending money to moneyhat temp exclusives.
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Hey, how come Sony didn't invest in any big 3rd party exclusives?
- Thread starter DR3AM
- Start date
Measurable way? Well I guess you would have to do something like average metacritic scores per studio or something. Otherwise it's all subjective.
Anticitizen One
Banned
That's very interesting
KoopaTheCasual
Junior Member
Oh, my apologies, good sir. I guess I did misinterpret something you've said months ago, then. You did mention a Sega deal tho, yes?
Not quite. Verendus has appeared in the thread and shot my claim of his claim down, haha.
SwiftDeath
Member
But we don't know where Sony spends its money is my point
MS throwing around numbers is great but if Sony spent a billion in R & D on PS4 while MS spent 500 million does that matter?
I don't know but I know I don't have enough knowledge to compare
And honestly being Bill gates pet project does not somehow make Xbox's budget > PS budget
Like I said it's likely the case but people were getting into pretty specific territory here and I just meant without numbers on all sides comparing numbers doesn't help
gundamkyoukai
Member
It would be a better move to give ND a new team , own the IP and make much more off of it .
Didn't you say that they let go of Sonic in order to secure two Sega exclusives?
As many others have said, they are investing in their first party and second party studios, which is typical behavior for any software development business. The primary reason I can think of is that they don't want another PS3 scenario in their hands where they had a software drought from third parties.
I think the only benefit of "moneyhatting" third party exclusives (aside from bragging rights and exclusivity of course) is to establish a mindshare to your potential customers. If the game is tied to the platform owner, even if it loses its exclusivity, people will still think that the superior version of the game belongs to that platform owner. I believe this is Microsoft's take on this, which is the same approach they're doing right now with the XB1+FIFA EU bundle + earlier release date than Sony.
Of course, with all this said, it doesn't hurt for Sony to secure a 3rd party exclusive or two. Maybe they are just looking for the right game for their platform.
I think the only benefit of "moneyhatting" third party exclusives (aside from bragging rights and exclusivity of course) is to establish a mindshare to your potential customers. If the game is tied to the platform owner, even if it loses its exclusivity, people will still think that the superior version of the game belongs to that platform owner. I believe this is Microsoft's take on this, which is the same approach they're doing right now with the XB1+FIFA EU bundle + earlier release date than Sony.
Of course, with all this said, it doesn't hurt for Sony to secure a 3rd party exclusive or two. Maybe they are just looking for the right game for their platform.
Who says they didn't invest in third party exclusives? Just because Sony hasn't announced anything yet doesn't mean there aren't deals in the works.
But also it seems that Sony thinks first party games are the new third party exclusives. So that's where they will invest most of their money and effort.
But also it seems that Sony thinks first party games are the new third party exclusives. So that's where they will invest most of their money and effort.
Yes, indeed. Two games from them. Maybe more in the future.
This is the correct answer
Not that I recall. I mentioned Sega came to them with Sonic, but they decided for something else. They're not related though. If I did say they exchanged them, then that would be a blatant lie from me.
gundamkyoukai
Member
No he would be wrong .
Just look at how many games Sony brought out this year alone show that BS .
They just rather spend the money and own the IP .
silver.tongue
Member
They have the largest (and arguably best) first party development team (studios).
You get better results by investing in them.
Just think about. If MS paid $100 mil just for GTA4 DLC, how much do you think securing a game costs?
Take half of that, give it to Naughty Dog and watch them make The Last of Us sequel.
You get better results by investing in them.
Just think about. If MS paid $100 mil just for GTA4 DLC, how much do you think securing a game costs?
Take half of that, give it to Naughty Dog and watch them make The Last of Us sequel.
Yes, this is what I meant.
Since they "decided for something else" I wonder if one of them is a Yakuza, then.
I don't think Sega would put the series anywhere else.
Wolfenstein7
Banned
They didn't need to.
SwiftDeath
Member
I'm not sure Sony would bother securing the exclusivity for a game that's not going to be localized outside Japan
Not sure they need to for Yakuza to be honest
As without external localization, there's no point to release it on Xbox as the install base in Japan for it will be next to nothing as per usual
He's no longer in executive control of the company, and Xbox has been pushed down the corporate pecking order since he left. It has a strict fiscal environment to work within.
Not really. Sony's total R&D budget is about half Microsoft's.
The top guy in charge of Sony right now is from the PlayStation division. He has named Playstation as one of three areas that will receive 70%+ of Sony's R&D budget. Playstation has probably never been in a better position than it is today in terms of access to its corporate parent's checkbook. For example, something like the Gaikai acquisition was probably a whole lot easier post-Hirai's ascension to CEO.
Meanwhile, I recall reading recently that MS would be spending up to 90% of its budget on cloud related development.
Are you kidding? Playstation's expenses for the last quarter were over $1.3bn. Last year their total spend was in the order several billion dollars.
This argument about MS's finances = more money for Xbox do not follow through. In the run up to this coming generation, I've seen that argument levelled on countless fronts, to argue why such-and-such would be the case (e.g. 'Xbox 720 will be more powerful than PS4, MS has more money!'). The consequences people forecast seem hardly ever to come to pass.
PanicFreak
Member
Well you can dig around a bit and find some answers. Sony spent 6.7 percent and 8.7 percent of revenues on R&D for all of its products during FY13 and FY12 respectively. That equates to approximately $4.84 billion and $5.37 billion during the last two years.
Microsoft spent $10.4 and $9.8 billion on R&D during the last two years. Some of that went to these systems but just looking at the two R&D budgets, it looks like Microsoft probably had more to devote to the development of their console.
It took me 10 minutes to find that data and it points toward the argument of "Microsoft has a larger war chest than Sony" being valid.
Found R&D to sales ratio for Sony in Sony's 6-K.
Income sheet data: Microsoft & Sony
Syphon Filter
Member
Sony does not have the money like MS does. Not worth trying to compete with MS on that. they did it in the past with ps1 and ps2 but it's not really possible now.
Yakuza doesn't need to be secured. It's the kind of game best left to Sega to decide what to do with as whatever the decision, it doesn't hurt Sony. In other words, the two games I'm referring to have nothing to do with Yakuza PS4.
Yeah, also that. But since I learned about the two games I immediately thought "Yakuza and something else" but maybe Yakuza is not even considered since it'll come regardless.
Yiss. 0,001% more chances it's Valkyria Chronicles 4.
PanicFreak
Member
Where is the breakdown between manufacturing costs and content development though? COGS vs. Operating Expenses is a very important distinction.
And Epic Games own the IP. So, it can go Multi-Platform at anytime. In fact, there are rumors that the next GoW could be multi-platform.
Diablo Rosso
Member
I have to ask, do you know if Sony turned down Bayonetta 2?
There is no breakdown, that was their total expenditure.
But where's the breakdown on the timeline of that figure given by MS? Is it for year one? Or is it for the extent of the visible pipeline so far (i.e. a couple of years at least?) If it includes marketing deals, there's some CoGS pollution there too.
In either case, my point is, these are not numbers that would intimidate a budget the size of Playstation's. Its total budget last year was $7bn+
I would very confidently say that over the last generation Sony has spent a lot more on content development than MS, and would confidently say that currently they remain doing so. This relationship some have drawn between MS's resources at large and Xbox resources hasn't held historically or in numerous predictions made about next-gen to date.
Subjective eh? this is something that's being used rather selectively here lately by the Playstation fans, on one hand you have so many people that say with such ease that Sony has the best exclusives by far! it's a fact! e.t.c. and on the other hand if someone says that it's a fact that Evolution is a B-tier studio or that Knack looks underwhelming people suddenly play the subjective card a la "well that's your opinion man", "some people loved the Motorstorm series!" or "Knack may not be for you but it looks amazing to me".
Happens all the time.
Devilgunman
Member
Yakuza Ishin?
ZeroMaverick
Member
Do people forget about the EA published Mass Effect?
I've played more Mass Effect on PS3 than 360.
Either way, Sony is in financial trouble and has been for a while. I'm surprised the PS4 managed to be that awesome given the situation. I thought third party exclusives were falling by the wayside anyways.
I've played more Mass Effect on PS3 than 360.
Either way, Sony is in financial trouble and has been for a while. I'm surprised the PS4 managed to be that awesome given the situation. I thought third party exclusives were falling by the wayside anyways.
Now you are just grouping a whole bunch of people into one.
I can give the same examples of Microsoft fanboys too
Flatline
Banned
Because they've learned from PS2 that it's a terrible investment long-term. When you buy a third-party exclusive you overpay for just one game not the franchise so it ends up biting you in the ass because if you don't continue paying for the franchise it looks to the customers like you "lost" the exclusive when it eventually goes multiplatform.
As for the customer, companies buying 3rd party exclusives is a lose-lose situation. The ones who don't have the console can't play a game they might like and those who have it lose a potential 1st party exclusive since the money goes to pay off the third party dev.
As for the customer, companies buying 3rd party exclusives is a lose-lose situation. The ones who don't have the console can't play a game they might like and those who have it lose a potential 1st party exclusive since the money goes to pay off the third party dev.
I hear what you're saying, but IMO, Sony should have locked up more devs like Platinum and Valhalla tbh. I need/want more Japanese games on my Japnese indigenous console.
Can't leave guys like
StrongArmSteady
Member
Would any of those games have an old sega legend working on one of them.
Thank god Sony had the brain cells to not accept sonic as one of the exclusive games if Verendus is telling the truth. Those games only really sell well on Nintendo platforms.
And after the bomb that was Yakuza 1+2 on WiiU I don't think Sony needs to moneyhat that series, Sega knows where that fanbase is. Same thing with tales (though it will be a while until a PS4 game gets announced)
And after the bomb that was Yakuza 1+2 on WiiU I don't think Sony needs to moneyhat that series, Sega knows where that fanbase is. Same thing with tales (though it will be a while until a PS4 game gets announced)
PanicFreak
Member
7 billion is a meaningless figure when you consider that it includes manufacturing costs and marketing costs associated with marketing of the PS brands. Somewhere in your 7 billion is the number I'm looking at but it isn't immediately obvious.
I do agree that Sony has probably spent more over the last generation than Microsoft has on content creation but given that things can change from year to year, that won't necessarily hold into perpetuity. Microsoft claims to have allocated $1 billion to content on content for Xbox One.
That figure can grow after the first batch of titles is out. Who knows what they will end up spending but it could be more than Sony. And given that they have more money to devote to all products than Sony does, all it would take is enough motivation among the management to make it happen.
Not surprising, par for the course lately. For whatever reason they don't seem to push much for courting third party titles, nor keeping them.
I think there was enough time for them to react after Demon's Souls import/internet popularity to make an agreement with From on making exclusives, but they didn't. Thatgamecompany was almost synonymous with Sony and their promotion of artsy games, now they're multiplatform. Ninja Theory delivered a high production game with Heavenly Sword, then left just as quickly. The PSP thrived in Japan through Monster Hunter, Sony let it slide at the turn of the generation. Their investments seem very focused on first party.
I think there was enough time for them to react after Demon's Souls import/internet popularity to make an agreement with From on making exclusives, but they didn't. Thatgamecompany was almost synonymous with Sony and their promotion of artsy games, now they're multiplatform. Ninja Theory delivered a high production game with Heavenly Sword, then left just as quickly. The PSP thrived in Japan through Monster Hunter, Sony let it slide at the turn of the generation. Their investments seem very focused on first party.
SwiftDeath
Member
It points to MS spending more on R&D as a company
That's great because MS (and Sony for that matter) can't possibly be spending that elsewhere?
Unless we have solid numbers for just the games divisions, aggregated numbers for the companies doesn't mean much
To believe the xbox division has open access to the whole of MS's warchest is silly
I don't believe it ever came up. I'm not really sure who that even belongs to. They certainly wouldn't accept it though. Not worth the investment.
I think people will be surprised by some of the third party exclusives coming to the PS4, new IP or not.
And who said that MS fans are any better with their stupid 180's about how "better multiplatform versions don't count anymore" or how "it's all about AAA, who gives a fuck about indies"? it's that lately I've seen a lot of PS fans trying to pass their opinion as facts (just take a look at this thread and the GT top 5 xbox 360 exclusive one), that's why I talked about PS fans and the whole "subjective" thing.
Do you know what genres they are?
SwiftDeath
Member
Sometimes it's good that 3rd party get money hatted. For example with TitanFall. MS paid them, devs get payed, more incentive to make a good game and give it the budget and marketing it needs. Finally PS4 will likely get the game anyway after time exclusivity is over. Win win for everyone.
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