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[ephemeral garbage]

I'm gonna get these out of the way

This isn't productive. You might have some sort of point to make if you were replying to somebody in this thread evincing gender bias, but I'm not seeing anybody like that.

 

[kirblar]

I wouldn't say it's the same kind of rape culture that is typically discussed in society, but it is a type of rape culture. Lots of instances of "you liked it, though, right?" and even saying "men can't be raped" is a twisted sort of normalization.

Yeah, there's a lot of the theory surrounding it that's really good - how people dismiss it/don't understand it/contribute to an environment that enables it. There are just a lot of problematic beliefs about who the rapists actually are (in both the uninformed public's eye, and among activists) as the research pointing to serial predators only came up within the past decade.

 

[Miles Quaritch]

I was starting to hallucinate that people were coming to get me. I barricaded myself in my room in the barracks because I heard a key in the lock and thought they were coming in. It was my roommate, but I was screaming, "Don't hurt me!" They took me to the hospital, and that's where I finally told the psychiatrist what had happened. It was a huge mistake. I was put into a mental ward out of One Flew over the Cuckoo's Nest. The doctor would say, "You enjoyed it, didn't you? Come on, tell me the truth."

What the fuck.

What the fuck.

 

[BLACK AMERICAN PSYCHO]

What the fuck.

What the fuck.

WOW

 

[Cybit]

He basically wrote a post saying that men and women should realize they're in this together, and men are the perpetrators in both situations. You're... kind of a dick.

I agreed with that until I saw this

I also hope that the fact that men also get raped can create some sympathy towards female rape victims, and that it can shed a light that the so called "rape culture" is a real thing. Not considering the military or prisons, women are still by far and large the majority of victims, and a lot of them face the same problems those men from the editorial faced: not being in a position to report, feeling pressured not to tell anyone, feeling ashamed, fear of not being taken seriously, fear of stigmatization.

The thread has in the title "military men". Which is summarily disregarded to try to make an "oppression olympics" point. If you switch men and women in this section, watch what happens

I also hope that the fact that women also get raped can create some sympathy towards male rape victims, and that it can shed a light that the so called "rape culture" is a real thing. When you add- n the military or prisons, men are still by far and large the majority of victims, and a lot of them face the same problems those women from the editorial faced: not being in a position to report, feeling pressured not to tell anyone, feeling ashamed, fear of not being taken seriously, fear of stigmatization.

That would be immediately (and rightfully) excoriated as "but what about the Menz!"

(H/T to XX Factor for pointing out that when you add in prison & military, more men are raped then women. Women get raped at a higher rate though; so if you had equal number of women and men in the military and in prison, the numbers would be even more grim for women)

 

[Almighty]

Man some of that stuff was just too much. After I read the last story I teared up a little. This just reinforces my opinion that we need to take investigating and prosecuting sexual assault cases out of the hands of the military.

 

[Trike]

An ex-army friend was just telling me about this. He knew a dude who was so afraid of being raped he asked to carry his gun with him to the bathroom. They wouldn't let him, but they let you have a friend or two stand watch outside with a gun. Hopefully you can trust them. A different air force friend told me before that in basic training they basically told him to watch out because people get raped all the time.

 

[terrisus]

This just reinforces my opinion that we need to take investigating and prosecuting sexual assault cases out of the hands of the military.

It's not like the civilian handling of the issue of male rape is all that much better.

The entire issue of male rape is a sad state of affairs.

 

[mugurumakensei]

It's not like the civilian handling of the issue of male rape is all that much better.

The entire issue of male rape is a sad state of affairs.

This is true.

If you are raped by a woman, you get "Nice"s and "He's a dude so he obviously wanted it since he was a pubescent boy, grown man, etc" or just straight up laughed at. You also get questions about your masculinity if you try to protest that.

If you are raped by a male, you risk being called any number of homophobic slurs, a wuss, laughed at, put in jail depending on country, etc. It's even worse for criminals where people just don't care cause you obviously did something wrong right?

And to top it off, there aren't many outreach programs for male victims of sexual assault or well male victims of assault in general(domestic violence, sexual harassment, various types of hazing, or sexual assault).

We are, after all, supposed to just walk it off cause we are men.

 

[Baki]

If they can do that to their own "comrades". I can't even imagine what they'd do to non-combatants in a war zone.

This is Defibitely a failiure from the administration.

 

[Dead Man]

A buddy in basic training got raped, but off post on a weekend pass. He just sort of disappeared to all of us, it wasn't until I saw him again 4 months later I found out what happened. Fuck all support from his chain of command.

 

[terrisus]

If they can do that to their own "comrades". I can't even imagine what they'd do to non-combatants in a war zone.

This is Defibitely a failiure from the administration.

Because none of this happens outside of the military...

Yup, it's (definitely) a failure from the administration, no other reasoning behind it.

 

[MHWilliams]

And see, handling situations like this would be a good use of men's rights activism. That's a specific problem that effects men to a great degree, something that could be handled by a unified campaign and front. Much better than focusing solely on feminism and women.

 

[GameGuru59]

Damn. Damn that article is fucking crazy. Ok, she's convinced me. We need to take this out of the chain of command. I've got a friend in the military right now and I'm actually scared for him over this article. I didn't know that feeling was possible.

 

[Christine]

There are a lot of toxic aspects to military culture, and pressures increase as you go up the hierarchy. I had a dude tell me that he was getting the fuck out of becoming a pilot because he was being pressured to cheat on his wife. I guess the idea is that you have to demonstrate your commitment to cover and lie for your squadron when they cheat on their spouses.

I imagine some of that is going on here. People are being pressured into raping to help make more people who'll cover up rapes.

 

[CharminUltra]

Fucking horrible. I feel sick now.

 

[rrc1594]

That shit ain't right

 

[Durask]

BRIAN LEWIS
NAVY, 1997–2001
No commanding officer wants to have to pick up the phone to his or her boss and say, "I've had a sexual assault aboard my command."

THOMSON
That's basically admitting that you can't control your men.

Here's the problem right there. Right now the commanding office is clearly interested in sweeping this under the carpet so as not to damage his career.

The only way to tackle this is to make it a career-ender not to act on sexual abuse allegations.

 

[Almighty]

It's not like the civilian handling of the issue of male rape is all that much better.

The entire issue of male rape is a sad state of affairs.

Fair point. Still taking it out of the hands of people who have motivation to sweep it under the rug is at least a start.

 

[Coriolanus]

Here's the problem right there. Right now the commanding office is clearly interested in sweeping this under the carpet so as not to damage his career.

The only way to tackle this is to make it a career-ender not to act on sexual abuse allegations.

Nope. All that would mean is that they'd be sure to make the problem even more hidden.

Should not report to your commanding officer or to anyone in the military, for that matter, since they clearly failed to tackle this problem. Report to a third party that does not answer to the structure that will be negatively affected by the revelations brought forth.

 

[terrisus]

Fair point. Still taking it out of the hands of people who have motivation to sweep it under the rug is at least a start.

Certainly, I agree with that.
I guess I just feel there's much more that's going to need to be done to actually solve the issue, as opposed to just shifting who it is that's messing up.

 

[Vigilant Walrus]

I think a big problem here is that there exists an ideal image of a man, macho manhood. A real man who doesn't cry when bad things happen. A mad who is stoic and strong enough to be self reliant.

But time and time again, men gets cut off from themselves for not being as good as women are at talking about the problems with friends. It extends to other things. Traumatized men being worse at going to get help for potential PTSD, which can lead to suicide or them become violent towards themselves/others, men being worse at going to the doctor, which leads to premature deaths.
I've seen countless times men talking about other men that they are loser for crying. Several people I know think that nothing is more shameful for a man than to cry. That it's the ultimate sign of masculine weakness and "pussification".

And it's something that from my experience extends way back to elementary school. When I was a substitute teacher the boys were neglected and seen as a problem constantly. When there is averaging a single adult care taker supervising about 12-13 kids, with multiple other tasks simultaniously (dealing with phone, being on the main institution floor, cooking so on and so forth) the boys were always the ones that get sent out. They get none of the brownie points because they often are too wild. they are too energetic compared to most girls. But you still had wild and loud girls who also suffers from this.
It's just that most boys run around with all this energy and being loud and unable to sit still until their parents can pick them up at 5 PM after work, lends themselves to a situation were they get seen as a problem for who they are.
Meanwhile the girls are so much better at being still, and doing quiet activities that don't take up the space. drawing, painting, playing with legos. Sometimes these things are subtle, but I wonder if our children institutions and schools are a part of why boys become shunned from opening up to become men who keep on carrying the stereotype that men who speak up are weak and too be hated. It's also something we see glorified in many of our action heroes in Hollywood and video games.
I think masculinity (particularly in the military) needs to be redefined, and maybe in doing so, the commanders-in-chief will look differently at sexual assault cases. I think it either has to be that, or a full on 100% surveillanced institution from bathrooms to bunk beds.

 

[V_Arnold]

These power structures that allow this to happen on a regular basis without reppercussions for the assaulters are scary.

 

[Monocle]

Sick beyond words. Everyone who commits and enables these atrocities needs to be thrown in prison. Don't forget the disgusting pigs in the medical profession who are so morally compromised as to mentally torture rape victims. I can barely imagine the depravity of these people. Horrific.

 

[Vigilant Walrus]

Sick beyond words. Everyone who commits and enables these atrocities needs to be thrown in prison. Don't forget the disgusting pigs in the medical profession who are so morally compromised as to mentally torture rape victims. I can barely imagine the depravity of these people. Horrific.

But how far does this problem go?


I've hard that in New Delhi, women have to take a separate subway train because rape and sexual assault are such a big problem over there? In Japan I heard they have some exclusive trains for women as well because sexual assault (taking snaps of womens privates) is also a massive problem.

In these countries with massive populations, to create such massive infrastructures to facilitate against these things I wonder if the term "every man is a potential rapist" has more clause than I personally used to think.
I just can't wrap my head around it. Lack of education, massive amounts of build up testosterone. And this seems to be related to so many fields from psychology to sociology, to etnology and demography, to really fnd the clinical sauce of all this, across the cultures.

 

[Wilbur]

Absolutely horrific. Awful, awful situations

 

[Sesuadra]

i can't read that article, trigger danger.. but i faced the same things.

my mother said "oh, that was so long ago, it should not be problem to see him every christmas"

or when my female neighbor (55 year old woman.) molested me "women do not molest, she was just joking around"

yeah. of course.

 

[Monocle]

But how far does this problem go?


I've hard that in New Delhi, women have to take a separate subway train because rape and sexual assault are such a big problem over there? In Japan I heard they have some exclusive trains for women as well because sexual assault (taking snaps of womens privates) is also a massive problem.

In these countries with massive populations, to create such massive infrastructures to facilitate against these things I wonder if the term "every man is a potential rapist" has more clause than I personally used to think.
I just can't wrap my head around it. Lack of education, massive amounts of build up testosterone. And this seems to be related to so many fields from psychology to sociology, to etnology and demography, to really fnd the clinical sauce of all this, across the cultures.

It's troubling to think how deeply this culture of sex abuse is embedded in ponderous institutions like the US military, where everyone but rape victims seems to have incentive to sweep these crimes under the rug. The problem seems flat out unsolvable, except by some massive cultural shift or an improbable weak point somewhere in the awful cycle of social influence, abuse, and suppression. The scale of this issue just about drives me to despair.

Every statistic represents so much pain and injustice. It's nauseating.

 

[wildfire]

What the fuck.

What the fuck.

Earlier I said we needed doctors with backbone but that's because I didn't have the fortitude to read all of those excerpts. Jesus. We need doctors who aren't dickheads as well.

Here's the problem right there. Right now the commanding office is clearly interested in sweeping this under the carpet so as not to damage his career.

The only way to tackle this is to make it a career-ender not to act on sexual abuse allegations.

I would like video cameras all over the bases but this is also a great idea.

i can't read that article, trigger danger.. but i faced the same things.

my mother said "oh, that was so long ago, it should not be problem to see him every christmas"

or when my female neighbor (55 year old woman.) molested me "women do not molest, she was just joking around"

yeah. of course.

Holyshit. Your mom is a total dick for saying that and I sort of suspect she would still the same thing if you were the opposite gender. There is no way I would be on neutral terms with someone who raped a family member. *mind blown*

 

[The Technomancer]

I never really know what to say in these threads since everyone seems to be on the same page that its a horrific problem covered up by a corrupted power structure...

But yeah, its those things

 

[terrisus]

i can't read that article, trigger danger.. but i faced the same things.

my mother said "oh, that was so long ago, it should not be problem to see him every christmas"

or when my female neighbor (55 year old woman.) molested me "women do not molest, she was just joking around"

yeah. of course.

I'm so sorry to hear that.

So sick and depressing and disgusting that this happens.

 

[Messofanego]

Just read this, feel like crying. Thanks for bringing this up, wouldn't have known.

Kole Welsh Army, 2002–07

I had actually let the assault go, because I didn't want it to interfere with my career. I wanted to be an officer, and I just said, "Bad experience, won't let that happen again." But there was some residual damage. A month and a half later, I was brought into a room with about nine officers and told, "You've tested positive [for HIV]." I was removed from the military and signed out within a day. It was a complete shock.

Traumatising.

 

[Morrigan Stark]

I was about to go to bed, then stupidly decided to read the whole thing. Nightmare fuel, I know, but I felt like I had to. Those poor men, holy shit... Good on Kirsten Gillibrand for fighting the good fight, even if it seems dead in the water right now.

 

[Messofanego]

Has there been any documentary about this like there was for women with The Invisible War?

 

[andthebeatgoeson]

I'm glad my wife got out of the military because of a traumatic injury.

My kids talk about it and I scream internally.

 

[Antti]

There's a documentary on Netflix called The Invisible War that examines sexual assaults in the military. While slightly sensationalistic, it was still pretty interesting.

EDIT: Looks like Messofanego already mentioned it.

 

[Holy_Chic]

disappointing statistics

clickbait thread title tho

 

[terrisus]

clickbait thread title tho

How is it a "clickbait thread title?"
It has a direct quote, and then a specific statistic.

If it was a "clickbait thread title," it would be something like "You won't believe what this guy says about men being sexually assaulted in the military" or "You'll be shocked at how many men are sexually asssaulted in the military each day" or "38 of this type of people are sexually assaulted each day" or something.

 

[Anton Sugar]

disappointing statistics

clickbait thread title tho

The hell are you talking about?

 

[Nakho]

Just read this, feel like crying. Thanks for bringing this up, wouldn't have known.

Traumatising.

Holy shit!

 

[demon]

There's a shit ton of rape denial going on in this country, against both men and women. It's pretty disturbing. No one wants to admit to themselves they live in a rapey culture.

 

[Rentahamster]

disappointing statistics

clickbait thread title tho

I don't think that word means what you think it means.

 

[Monocle]

disappointing statistics

clickbait thread title tho

Nope. It's specific and informative.