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14-Year Old Kills Bully. Prosecuted but Case Dismissed

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NAPLES — A 15-year-old who fatally stabbed his school mate will no longer face criminal prosecution.

A judge’s ruling, made public Tuesday, granted a motion to dismiss the second-degree murder charge against Jorge Saavedra in the death of 16-year-old Dylan Nuno on the grounds that he acted in self-defense under Florida’s “Stand Your Ground” law. The State Attorney’s Office has indicated that it will not appeal the ruling.

Nuno’s family and friends criticized Collier County Circuit Judge Lauren Brodie’s decision, calling it “unbelievable” and “heartbreaking.”

“We know this wasn’t the right decision,” said Dylan’s aunt, Adriana Nuno.“(The judge) is showing those kids it’s OK to get away with murder.”

Saavedra, who was 14 at the time of the stabbing, was charged as a juvenile. If found guilty, the former Palmetto Ridge High student would have been released by the age of 21.

Brodie’s ruling concluded that Saavadra, who said he was bullied and tried avoid a fight with Nuno, did not act unlawfully. She added that Saavadra had more than enough reason to believe he was in danger of death or great bodily harm.

Brodie based her decision this week on the findings from a two-day December hearing, during which students who witnessed the events Jan. 24, 2011, testified that several teens announced the fight on the bus, and Saavedra got off several stops early in Golden Gate Estates. Saavedra showed a pocket knife to two teens on the bus that afternoon.

In a nine-page document released Tuesday by the State Attorney’s Office, Brodie stated that by getting off the bus several stops before the location where the fight was to happen, Saavedra “demonstrated that, with or without a knife, (he) had no desire to fight with Dylan Nuno.”


Accompanied by several students, Dylan Nuno, a junior, followed Saavedra, a freshman, off the bus. He then punched him in the back of the head, according to court documents and testimony.

Saavedra attempted to get away once, witnesses said. He then stabbed Dylan Nuno 12 times in the chest and abdomen. Two of the blows caused fatal wounds, including one that nicked his heart.


In her decision, signed Dec. 30, 2011, the judge said Saavedra had “no duty to retreat” and was “legally entitled to meet force with force, even deadly force.”

“The defendant was in a place where he had a right to be and was not acting unlawfully. He had more than enough reason to believe he was in danger of death or great bodily harm ... (He) was under attack from the first punch to the back of his head until he stabbed Dylan Nuno.”

Prosecutors will not be appealing the case, a move that upset Dylan Nuno’s family and friends.

“We’ve reviewed the decision,” said Samantha Syoen, spokeswoman for the State Attorney’s Office. “There does not appear to be any issues to appeal.”

Saavedra’s lawyer, Donald Day, called the case “a tragedy all the way around.” Saavedra is currently living with his family in Miami.

“My reaction is there is no winner at all in this case,” Day said. “My client’s family feels terribly for the Nuno family.”

The judge’s decision came as a surprise to Adriana Aradas, 19, a close friend of Dylan Nuno who sat with his family for the December hearing, wearing a T-shirt emblazoned with messages for the teen.

“I wasn’t’ expecting that at all,” Aradas said. “At the last hearing, there was so much against Jorge.”

During that hearing, students recounted for the judge previous altercations between the two teens, including one instance on the bus when something was lobbed from the back, where Dylan Nuno sat, to the front, where Saavedra was.

The judge also highlighted that Saavedra would skip school or find other ways home to avoid the bus.


Though the judge’s order does not mention the term “bullying,” which was heavily used by the defense, it does describe “taunting comments” from Dylan Nuno and two other male teens shortly before the fight.

Dylan Nuno’s family and friends have defended the teen, saying repeatedly he was not a bully and in fact transferred from Lely High School to Palmetto Ridge to escape taunting himself.

Their hopes for a bench trial before Brodie are now gone, weeks before the anniversary of his death and what would have been Dylan Nuno’s 18th birthday.

“Brodie’s decision is not setting a good example for children or adults,” said Kim Maxwell, Dylan Nuno’s mother. “I truly do not want this type of tragedy to happen to another innocent family.”

Yet after months of seeing Saavedra in the courtroom, there is some closure in the fact that they will no longer have to see the teen’s killer on what at times in 2011 was on a monthly basis.

“Whatever happens, whether (Saavedra) would have gotten time, it’s not going to bring Dylan back,” said Adriana Nuno. “We’ll have to move on, unfortunately without our Dylan.”

Link with Pictures

Considering some of the recent threads, I'm interested to see how Gaf reacts.

Personally, I feel the judge's decision was just. How about you?

Fake Edit: This was mentioned in the other recent bullying thread, but I think it deserves its own thread.


Mod edit: A user posted some court documents that might be of interest, so I am editing them in here:
Court documents:

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Another two pages.
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tapedeck

Do I win a prize for talking about my penis on the Internet???
Bully deserved a proper ass whoppin, not death. That sad, I aint even mad.
 

harSon

Banned
Oh, fuck off.

Bullying is horrible but it's not an act worthy of death, especially to a fucking 16 year old. It takes a special kind of crazy to stab someone 12 times to death, and while it certainly sucks that he was bullied, he shouldn't be given a free pass to kill for it. Many serial killers were abused, physically and sexually, and bullied as children. They're still punished, and so should this kid.
 

DJ_Lae

Member
I was with it until the 'stabbed him 12 times' part.

Seems a bit much for self defense somehow.
 

akira28

Member
Sad, but the bullied kid didn't deserve jail time. Nuno family, I can understand their grief, but they need to see this from a different perspective, which might be hard for them.

edit:
kid tried to run away, they chased him and cornered him. He was going to be attacked by a group, he defended his life. It wasn't the first incident. It doesn't make the bullying issue any easier though. Bullies won't necessarily change their ways if they think they might be stabbed in the chest. Or the changes might be aggressive ones.
 

DY_nasty

NeoGAF's official "was this shooting justified" consultant
Wait.... so instead of people saying that someone, somewhere, any adult should've stepped in, we're supposed to be like YAY about some kid being killed by another kid?

The fuck?
Something about this I don't like. Self defense is one thing, but stabbing 12 times? That's crossing the line.

Heat of the moment, I'm not surprised or upset by that. But a 16 year old kid's death being pretty much celebrated is ridiculous.
 

Duki

Banned
ahahaha thats straight up murder with no proportional self defense involved what the fuck

what kind of law is that florida
 

Gaborn

Member
I hope the kid is forced into therapy as a result of this. I understand why he would not be criminally responsible but he needs to now deal with his mental stability.
 
Stabbed him 12 times?

Holy crap.

I feel for the kid... but 12 times?

When adrenaline, anger and self-justification kicks in and you think about everything you're been through, sometimes 12 stabs seem normal.

That said, I don't know what the kid went through or what, but it sucks that a kid who was being bullied ended up becoming a bully himself.
 

King Boo

Member
it was fair. lol about the 12 times comments. how is the kid suppose to know that the fight was over when he nicked the heart? this isn't a perfect world where we have health bars above our heads and have time to pause the game so we can reconsider choices that the brain immediately makes for self defense.
 

Baron Aloha

A Shining Example
The bully only has himself to blame. If you attack someone and that person has a knife you are going to get stabbed. I'm glad the case was dismissed.
 
Something about this I don't like. Self defense is one thing, but stabbing 12 times? That's crossing the line.
It's horrible on paper, but it's a phenomenon, imho.

I've seen non-violent people defend themselves and go over the line a few times, like having to pull a relatively peaceful person off of someone they were ground and pounding...

This kid deliberately got off a few stops early, basically saying "I'd rather go out of my way to take longer to get home, rather than fight."
I don't know what the kid went through or what, but it sucks that a kid who was being bullied ended up becoming a bully himself.
bullying has shown cyclical patterns...people who were bullied become bullies to redistribute their anger and pain.
 
Here's the Law

Florida Stand Your Ground Law said:
* It establishes that law-abiding residents and visitors may legally presume the threat of bodily harm or death from anyone who breaks into a residence or occupied vehicle and may use defensive force, including deadly force, against the intruder.

* In any other place where a person “has a right to be,” that person has “no duty to retreat” if attacked and may “meet force with force, including deadly force if he or she reasonably believes it is necessary to do so to prevent death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another to prevent the commission of a forcible felony.”

* In either case, a person using any force permitted by the law is immune from criminal prosecution or civil action and cannot be arrested unless a law enforcement agency determines there is probable cause that the force used was unlawful.

* If a civil action is brought and the court finds the defendant to be immune based on the parameters of the law, the defendant will be awarded all costs of defense.
 

DY_nasty

NeoGAF's official "was this shooting justified" consultant
The bully only has himself to blame. If you attack someone with a knife you are going to get stabbed. I'm glad the case was dismissed.

Yeah... its not a grown man kicking some kid in a parking lot. Its two kids basically. You don't stop bullying by letting kids kill each other.
 

The Technomancer

card-carrying scientician
The bully only has himself to blame. If you attack someone with a knife you are going to get stabbed. I'm glad the case was dismissed.

Bully didn't attack him with a knife. If he did I doubt there would be any controversy at all, similar to how most of the criticism against the mother with the shotgun evaporated when it came out that the guy was charging at her with a knife at the time.
 

Arde5643

Member
I'm still not sure about jail time, but I agree with Gaborn, the kid will need some psychiatric evaluation or even some rehab time since he has pretty much murdered someone - even if it's un-premeditated.
 
Smart decision on the judge's part.

He was violently attacked and had every right to defend himself, including using deadly force.
 

harSon

Banned
it was fair. lol about the 12 times comments. how is the kid suppose to know that the fight was over when he nicked the heart? this isn't a perfect world where we have health bars above our heads and have time to pause the game so we can reconsider choices that the brain immediately makes for self defense.

He stabbed him in the fucking chest and abdomen, the other party is no longer a threat after only a few in that area.
 

mr jones

Ethnicity is not a race!
I don't know how to feel about this.

He was taunting and picking on the guy. The guy stabs him to death. They were just 14 and 15 at the time.

It really sucks all around.
 

Baron Aloha

A Shining Example
Bully didn't attack him with a knife. If he did I doubt there would be any controversy at all, similar to how most of the criticism against the mother with the shotgun evaporated when it came out that the guy was charging at her with a knife at the time.

I didn't mean the bully had a knife.... I mean that the person he attacked had a knife.
 
I'm kinda tired so I'm not sure if I'm reading this right:
dude got attacked by a bully, tries to escape and subsequently kills the bully

Awesome if so. Fuckin' A.

Edit: 12 times is a tad psycho tho. One stab would've sufficed.
But after being bullied for who knows how long, I can sorta understand this kind of 'overkill' reaction.
 

Moaradin

Member
Was looking at some of the pictures and came across the comments. Here is a fine example:

http://www.naplesnews.com/photos/2011/jan/25/277854/
yfbabyy writes:

babyboy we miss u :( ur in a betetr place. i wish all dis was a dream :( please look over us ur family and ashley are destroyed give them strenght. i promise you that jorge will pay:( lely as well as palmetto will miss you and ur spongebob bookback :)) our lil angel my fav jerker you will forever be in our hearts

rip dylan nuno 1994-2011</3
 

Satyamdas

Banned
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I just hope that once before I die, I will see a story like this where the family doesn't try to defend the fucked up behavior of their relatives. Just once, I'd like to see a quote that says "Well, I loved my son Dylan with all my heart, but it's clear he was doing some horrible things and those things unfortunately led to his death. I will miss my son and my sympathies go out to Jorge."

Sometimes kids go haywire even with good parenting. When parents rush to defend the violent and sociopathic behavior of their children it just makes them look like the shittiest goddamn parents ever.
 

Vaporak

Member
I've never been stabbed but I'm guessing the bully kept punching to stop the stabbing and the victim kept stabbing to stop the punching.

I'm betting this was exactly how it happened. If a group of adults follows someone home and attacks them unprovoked and the defender happened to have a knife and used it in self defense then he/she did the right thing. Being under 18 doesn't change that.
 

Ryaaan14

Banned
That kid deserved to be stabbed 12 times then have time rewound just so he could see the crazy shit that would happen to him without it actually happening.

Yeah chew on that.
 
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