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1st Grade Transgendered Student being barred from using Female Bathroom

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Trojita

Rapid Response Threadmaker
http://www.cnn.com/2013/02/27/us/colorado-transgender-girl-school/index.html?hpt=hp_c1

130227015108-coy-mathis-story-top.jpg


(CNN) -- Just like she did during the first half of the school year, first grader Coy Mathis wants to use the girls' restroom at her Colorado elementary school. But school officials won't let her.

The reason? Coy is transgendered, born with male sex organs but a child who identifies herself as female.


She has dressed as a girl for most of last year. And her passport and state-issued identification recognize her as female.


In December, the Fountain-Fort Carson School District informed Coy's parents that Coy would be barred from using the girls' restrooms at Eagleside Elementary in Fountain after winter break.

She could instead use the boys' bathroom, gender-neutral faculty bathrooms or the nurse's bathroom, the district said.

In making the decision, the district "took into account not only Coy but other students in the building, their parents, and the future impact a boy with male genitals using a girls' bathroom would have as Coy grew older," attorney W. Kelly Dude said.

"However, I'm certain you can appreciate that as Coy grows older and his male genitals develop along with the rest of his body, at least some parents and students are likely to become uncomfortable with his continued use of the girls' restroom."

Coy's parents see it differently.

By forcing Coy to use a different bathroom than all the other girls, the school is "targeting her for stigma, bullying and harassment," Michael Silverman, one of Coy's lawyers and the executive director of the Transgender Legal Defense & Education Fund, said.

"Coy's school has the opportunity to turn this around and teach Coy's classmates a valuable lesson about friendship, respect and basic fairness."


On Wednesday, Coy's parents will announce that they will file a complaint with the Colorado Civil Rights Division.

She looks so happy :D

I was surprised she already has a State Issued ID and Passport labeling her as female already. The school will probably have no grounds to bar her.
 
I consider myself fully a transgender ally but I don't know that I disagree with this call, especially if they make those other gender-neutral facilities available for her. Maybe someone can convince me otherwise.
 

Gannd

Banned
Aren't the girl's bathrooms stalls anyway? How would anyone know if he is behind a stall going to the bathroom. Let the kid live as the kid views herself.
 

Aiii

So not worth it
Doesn't really make sense. She'll go in a stall and close the door, as will the others. Nobody will see her genitals and neither should see be seeing those of others.

The reasoning makes no sense at all.

I could understand if this was about the showers after gym class or something, but the bathroom?
 

Link

The Autumn Wind
Tough situation. I can certainly understand where the school is coming from with their decision.
 

JiuJitsuka

Neo Member
the future impact a boy with male genitals using a girls' bathroom would have
She could instead use the nurse's bathroom

I believe it has little to do with them being against such issues. I guess it's just them not really knowing how to deal with this situation properly, hence taking such measurements which I can understand somehow.
 

BadWolf

Member
Why not just put her in another school and not tell them she is transgender? Her passport and identification show her as female. It will be easier than going through the fuss of dealing with hate and being treated unfairly.
 

Dead Man

Member
They really want that kid to use the male bathrooms? That will end well.

Tough situation. I can certainly understand where the school is coming from with their decision.

Not really, it's not like they have anything but stall in the girls bathroom. It makes no sense.
 
I'm not quite certain I understand how a child that age would be able to self-identify their gender. It seems like a rather heavy topic for a person under 6 years old.

I ask this in open curiosity as I don't know a whole lot about transgender issues.
 

lexi

Banned
They really want that kid to use the male bathrooms? That will end well.

Yeah, really. Try to make it less obvious that you don't give a shit about the girl.

And honestly? Her having purple hair is more of a distraction than her using the girls bathrooms. I don't understand what the big deal is.
 
Why the sudden change? She had apparently been using the female restrooms for half a year. Seems odd that they'd decide suddenly she couldnt use the female facilities. Hope they work things out. Sidenote: I had never seen the word coy being used as a name.
 

Dariee

Member
I consider myself fully a transgender ally but I don't know that I disagree with this call, especially if they make those other gender-neutral facilities available for her. Maybe someone can convince me otherwise.

The kid wants to be (i.e. is) a girl.

Why not let the kid use both female and gender neutral bathrooms? Why include the male bathroom as a sugestion at all if that's not what the kid wants? Actually, by saying 'you can use the boy's bathroom' you are indirectly mandating the kid to choose the 'boyish' option.
 

Vanillalite

Ask me about the GAF Notebook
I consider myself fully a transgender ally but I don't know that I disagree with this call, especially if they make those other gender-neutral facilities available for her. Maybe someone can convince me otherwise.

It probably comes back to the whole separate is actually not equal deal.
 

Acerac

Banned
Tough situation. I can certainly understand where the school is coming from with their decision.

Honestly I can't. Would you mind explaining to me, as her genetalia would never be an issue in a girls' bathroom?
 

Luigiv

Member

Cipherr

Member
Stuff like this will honestly probably make us look at the whole separated bathrooms thing in general. It probably needs to go. I would miss the in an out no nonsense and space saving urinal, but we may as well just slap stalls in all bathrooms and get rid of the boys/girls room shit.

Aren't the girl's bathrooms stalls anyway? How would anyone know if he is behind a stall going to the bathroom. Let the kid live as the kid views herself.

And what about transgendered students the other way around? We going to hinge on the "b...b..bbut urinals" thing and not allow them to use the boys rooms? That's not going to go over very well either. Just do away with the whole thing and put unisex restrooms all over.
 

Kusagari

Member
It's not like she's going to be using a urinal in the girls restroom. Nobody is going to see her genitals regardless.
 

Dead Man

Member
I'm not quite certain I understand how a child that age would be able to self-identify their gender. It seems like a rather heavy topic for a person under 6 years old.

I ask this in open curiosity as I don't know a whole lot about transgender issues.
I know I didn't decide I was male until I was 16 ;) But seriously, it's pretty simple until people start adding all sorts of layers that the person self identifying doesn't really need. She knows she feel like what girls are described as feeling like.

I'm not trans, so if anyone has a more elegant description feel free to correct me.

I consider myself fully a transgender ally but I don't know that I disagree with this call, especially if they make those other gender-neutral facilities available for her. Maybe someone can convince me otherwise.
If she is identifying and living as a girl, what facilities do you expect her to use when she is at the mall? Or at the movies? Or at the park? There is no downside to her using the fmale rooms, and and many possible ones to her using the male ones.
 

Juicy Bob

Member
Maybe we need to seriously consider whether the very concept of gender separate toilets or changing rooms is one that is compatible with our ambitions for a more equal society.

Because the fact that we have such separation is likely to continue to cause these troubles for transgendered people into the future.
 

dan999

Banned
Doubt a 1st grader knows anything about itself let alone what "gender" it is. Smells like meddling parents to me.
 
Lol, you know that for certain? It's a kid, you never know what they'll do.

I'm pretty sure most girls' bathrooms don't have urinals. I've been in a few that have (oh, university), but they were in co-ed dorms converted from men's dorms.


Doubt a 1st grader knows anything about itself let alone what "gender" it is. Smells like meddling parents to me.

Maybe you should do some reading.
 

Kastrioti

Persecution Complex
Doubt a 1st grader knows anything about itself let alone what "gender" it is. Smells like meddling parents to me.

Seriously. Boggles my mind how a 1st grader could make a decision about his/her sexuality or gender at that age.
 

Gallbaro

Banned
Maybe we need to seriously consider whether the very concept of gender separate toilets or changing rooms is one that is compatible with our ambitions for a more equal society.

Because the fact that we have such separation is likely to continue to cause these troubles for transgendered people into the future.

There is a quality difference to where the Female's bathroom is disgusting compare to the males.

As a Man, I would prefer to avoid that downgrade.
 

Dariee

Member
Smells like meddling parents to me.

That could be said about a lot of parents that force their child to behave in a way that is 'expected from their genitals'.


Let alone the parents (and doctors and lots of more involved people) changing genitals right after birth because these are too 'ambiguous' for our limited gender-binary-system in the first place.
 
Segregated restrooms are outdated. I think all places should break down the wall between separate restrooms and create a massive unisex one. The only problem is, women typically take much longer to pee than men. So if they did this, they would need to make sure that they keep the urinals for men to get in and get out quickly.
 
Eh, I could understand this if it was a male-to-female transgendered student, as there are urinals in male bathrooms and the expectance of the transgendered male to use it might cause problems.

Or something.

But in this case, it makes no sense as I assume that the toilets are hidden away behind stalls.
 

Kastrioti

Persecution Complex
Again, at what age did you decide you were a male (apologies if you are female, the question stands).

That's a good point. I didn't know the difference between straight or gay at 6 years old but looking back on it I knew I was straight when I got a boner watching the Pink Ranger at that young age.

Gender is a more complicated issue and one that GAF has educated me greatly on.
 

Trojita

Rapid Response Threadmaker
That's a good point. I didn't know the difference between straight or gay at 6 years old but looking back on it I knew I was straight when I got a boner watching the Pink Ranger at that young age.

Gender is a more complicated issue and one that GAF has educated me greatly on.

Wut
 

Dariee

Member
Weren't the power rangers gender neutral when in their suits? Like you never saw who was underneath the helmet.

Maybe you even jacked of to someone else than you were expecting to?

(Okay, I stop fooling around. Back ontopic now)
 

Dead Man

Member
That's a strange question. For most people the question itself is never presented. I'm sure lots of teenagers question their sexuality but very few question their gender.

Which is my point. People saying she is too young to know whether she is a boy or a girl must feel there is an age before which people don't know, so I am asking what age they were when they decided their gender.

It was supposed to be Reductio ad absurdum but it was obviously not very good.
 

Kastrioti

Persecution Complex

I guess I worded that poorly. I didn't know what gay was then, because I always remember being attracted to girls and Kimberly from Power Rangers was my first crush.

I'm sure the same is the case for people of the opposite sexual orientation.
 

jason10mm

Gold Member
Is this a case where the child is genetically male but had ambiguous genitalia thus the parents decided to raise him as a female? If so, then authorities ought to treat him as a female. If this is just a boy who really likes being a girl, I'm sure he can tolerate using the boys room as he has the equipment to do so, or could use a stall. Whether the other boys will tolerate him, that is the real question.
 

Monocle

Member
What's the problem with her using the girls' restroom though? Unless she's relieving herself in the sink or something, what difference would the shape of her genitalia make?

Seriously. Boggles my mind how a 1st grader could make a decision about his/her sexuality or gender at that age.
My understanding is it's not a decision, but an expression of the individual's personality that just sort of makes itself apparent in the natural course of daily life. Kind of like how you don't have to choose whether you're left- or right-handed.
 

Feature

Banned
Who cares if he/she uses the girls restroom. They all piss and shit in stalls anyway, nobody will see the genitalia. Unless there's stuff happening in girl bathrooms I'm unaware of.
 
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