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[Deleted member 30609]

Why in the world is he naked? Who does that?! On the Internet? Damn.

 

[Negator]

Usually the show is great, but this week just didn't jive with me. Probably for the reasons Grimmy already expressed. This week, the show sounded like every other podcast, and by the end I just didn't care anymore.

 

[sprsk]

Why in the world is he naked? Who does that?! On the Internet? Damn.

It was a photo project I did in college. It was in a zip of my portfolio I passed along to someone on gaf that got spread all over opa ages and then the rest of the Internet.

Why it was posted in this thread I don't know. Kind of would appreciate if it wasn't.

 

[see5harp]

Why does neogaf hate cheapy? Cagcast is the truth.

 

[Deleted member 30609]

It was a photo project I did in college. It was in a zip of my portfolio I passed along to someone on gaf that got spread all over opa ages and then the rest of the Internet.

Why it was posted in this thread I don't know. Kind of would appreciate if it wasn't.

aww, now I feel like a dick for having a go

 

[Curufinwe]

aww, now I feel like a dick for having a go

You're still a million miles from Protocol Snow levels of dickishness.

 

[entremet]

Why does neogaf hate cheapy? Cagcast is the truth.

He doesn't really get any hate here. I'm a big fan of the cagcast, so I don't know where he got that assumption.

 

[cvxfreak]

Thanks for the considerate response Mark. Didn't mean to be so critical but I just listened to another podcast talking about Assassin's Creed and guess I got a bit annoyed that a Japanese-oriented podcast would be essentially covering what everyone else is covering. But I hear you on the fact that you still should talk about the games you are playing, regardless of where it's from. And it was great that you gave props to WARNING! A Huge Podcast, which I am already a fan of.

Again, I appreciate the very level-headed reply - and because of it I will definitely continue to listen to this podcast

I actually would prefer for there to be some Western game discussion on 8-4 Play because there's potential for them to be discussed in the context of being based in Japan. On JACK IT TO HARD, Hiroko was able to talk briefly about the localization of Red Dead Redemption into Japanese and everything that was wrong with its Japanese text. That's not something that is likely to be discussed on a Western podcast. Being based in Japan, I miss out entirely on the hype machines that go on in North America and Europe. Just like Monster Hunter Portable 3rd's impending mega-launch will have very little consequence to people outside Japan, Black Ops hit Japan in a much more subdued fashion, so 8-4 Play can talk about that game without falling into the trap of that hype machine and what it means in the context of being released in Japan. As the podcast matures, I'm sure this is how things will turn out regarding Western game discussion.

I've personally always interpreted 8-4 Play as less of a podcast about Japanese games themselves than it is one about the overall industry and where Japan lies in it. 8-4 is a localization company, so it's always floating somewhere in-between cultures and that's the perspective they (subconsciously) take. I didn't have a problem with their discussion about image epoch because the PSP talk made a lot of sense: why? 8-4's ability to remain viable rests on Japanese companies' willingness to release their content outside of Japan, so it totally makes sense for the PSP's lack of popularity in the West to be discussed.

8-4 Play and WAHP are just too different to be compared directly. They both discuss games from a Japan-oriented perspective and the similarities end there. Japan isn't just one entity that's entitled to one podcast.

 

[GhaleonQ]

Come on, guys. Dig Dug series hero married the Baraduke series hero, birthed the heroes from the Mister Driller series, and THEN got divorced and THEN clashed in Namco x Capcom. OBVIOUSLY. What next, you forget what 8-4 means?

On the Namco resurrections front, have you played Dig Dug DS/Digging Strike? I'm actually a rather big fan of it (and I enjoy the whole subseries), but it met with lukewarm reviews. It crams Dig Dugs 1 and 2 together, and that's at least a fantastic starting point for the next Dig Dug.

 

[Xater]

Come on, guys. Dig Dug series hero married the Baraduke series hero, birthed the heroes from the Mister Driller series, and THEN got divorced and THEN clashed in Namco x Capcom. OBVIOUSLY. What next, you forget what 8-4 means?

On the Namco resurrections front, have you played Dig Dug DS/Digging Strike? I'm actually a rather big fan of it (and I enjoy the whole subseries), but it met with lukewarm reviews. It crams Dig Dugs 1 and 2 together, and that's at least a fantastic starting point for the next Dig Dug.

You scare me.

 

[GhaleonQ]

Oh, and a request. Danganronpa ("Bullet Disputation?") got great scores and bad sales (if I recall), but it looks really interesting. No one's played it on NeoGAF, and Spike's an interesting developer that deserves attention. Since "Inazuma 11" (as they're calling it worldwide) is getting a European release this winter, at least, now would be a prime time to explain the phenomenon in Japan.

Edit: Oh, and if you know Alexander O. Smith, tell him to visit his alma mater and give a lecture.

You scare me.

The Bible, The Brothers Karamazov, Namco's Driller saga. You remember these things.

 

[Kilgore Trout]

I'll give this a listen. I discovered this podcast some time last week and have gone through two episodes so far. I haven't found a gaming podcast to be worth an hour of my time yet, but with 8-4 I found myself interested in the majority of the discussions even when they covered games that I had no interest in. It really helped that a lot was related back to the industry at large instead of just impressions. Keep up the good work, guys.

 

[farnham]

i really appreciate that you finished with teotoriatte (let us cling together) of queen

such a great song

 

[Grimmy]

I actually would prefer for there to be some Western game discussion on 8-4 Play because there's potential for them to be discussed in the context of being based in Japan. On JACK IT TO HARD, Hiroko was able to talk briefly about the localization of Red Dead Redemption into Japanese and everything that was wrong with its Japanese text. That's not something that is likely to be discussed on a Western podcast. Being based in Japan, I miss out entirely on the hype machines that go on in North America and Europe. Just like Monster Hunter Portable 3rd's impending mega-launch will have very little consequence to people outside Japan, Black Ops hit Japan in a much more subdued fashion, so 8-4 Play can talk about that game without falling into the trap of that hype machine and what it means in the context of being released in Japan. As the podcast matures, I'm sure this is how things will turn out regarding Western game discussion.

I've personally always interpreted 8-4 Play as less of a podcast about Japanese games themselves than it is one about the overall industry and where Japan lies in it. 8-4 is a localization company, so it's always floating somewhere in-between cultures and that's the perspective they (subconsciously) take. I didn't have a problem with their discussion about image epoch because the PSP talk made a lot of sense: why? 8-4's ability to remain viable rests on Japanese companies' willingness to release their content outside of Japan, so it totally makes sense for the PSP's lack of popularity in the West to be discussed.

8-4 Play and WAHP are just too different to be compared directly. They both discuss games from a Japan-oriented perspective and the similarities end there. Japan isn't just one entity that's entitled to one podcast.

No I completely agree with you - I also want to hear about the Japanese reaction to Western games, the difficulties/pitfalls of localization, and stuff that pertains to the industry at large (in the context of Japan). These are insights which sets 8-4 apart, and I find them quite interesting to know.

But the discussion about the Imageepoch's choice of hardware format has very little to do with the Western perspective - it is obvious that these games are intended for the Japanese markets mainly. With both coming out in the summer of next year, it's ludicrous to be so dismissive of the PSP as the choice of platform, especially since the (expensive) 3DS isn't even out yet, Will be the install base of the 3DS even be large enough by next summer? And surely the cost of developing on the 3DS must be higher? All these are important factors. So the dismissive attitude was, I find, quite unwarranted.

Oh, and a request. Danganronpa ("Bullet Disputation?") got great scores and bad sales (if I recall), but it looks really interesting. No one's played it on NeoGAF, and Spike's an interesting developer that deserves attention. Since "Inazuma 11" (as they're calling it worldwide) is getting a European release this winter, at least, now would be a prime time to explain the phenomenon in Japan.

Actually Danganronpa just came out yesterday, so there's no way we know about its sales yet.

 

[cvxfreak]

But the discussion about the Imageepoch's choice of hardware format has very little to do with the Western perspective - it is obvious that these games are intended for the Japanese markets mainly. With both coming out in the summer of next year, it's ludicrous to be so dismissive of the PSP as the choice of platform, especially since the (expensive) 3DS isn't even out yet, Will be the install base of the 3DS even be large enough by next summer? And surely the cost of developing on the 3DS must be higher? All these are important factors. So the dismissive attitude was, I find, quite unwarranted.

Actually, I attended the conference in person, and Image epoch was very much concerned with how JRPGs are perceived throughout the world. They discussed this during the beginning of the conference, they had a video about JRPGs as a genre with an English narrator, and they were quick to announce localization strategies. They have an agenda with pushing JRPGs. In Japan, rarely does one call things "Japanese", so framing a game in the context of being Japanese (J-RPG) just screams one thing: they want a bigger audience for this and they want the Japanese-ness to be the distinguishing factor in their games. You don't need to call an RPG "Japanese" to sell it to Japanese people.

So, as an attendee of the conference, 8-4's discussion made sense. You didn't like the direction that took, and that's understandable, but their discussion was very valid from my perspective.

 

[Grimmy]

Actually, I attended the conference in person, and Image epoch was very much concerned with how JRPGs are perceived throughout the world. They discussed this during the beginning of the conference, they had a video about JRPGs as a genre with an English narrator, and they were quick to announce localization strategies. They have an agenda with pushing JRPGs. In Japan, rarely does one call things "Japanese", so framing a game in the context of being Japanese (J-RPG) just screams one thing: they want a bigger audience for this and they want the Japanese-ness to be the distinguishing factor in their games. You don't need to call an RPG "Japanese" to sell it to Japanese people.

So, as an attendee of the conference, 8-4's discussion made sense. You didn't like the direction that took, and that's understandable, but their discussion was very valid from my perspective.

Yes, but that issue is, in my opinion, separate from the discussion about the actual hardware platform. If they are that concerned with pushing the genre internationally, teaming up with NISA then pretty much already defeats the purpose, since all it does is confine them within the niche that they just said needs expansion.

It seems more like Imageepoch has the ambitions of being the next Level 5 (but in the RPG niche), but frankly releasing mid-tier budget titles (regardless of platform) and a PSN game won't really help them much. Plus, their latest title just bombed, mostly because they made their game too hardcore. How are they supposed to expand the market with these kinds of games? And Imageepoch doesn't have the same relationship with Nintendo like Level 5 does - most likely they were nowhere near the first to get the 3DS dev kits, and as a result they can't suddenly just develop a whole bunch of 3DS games for next summer. Instead they decided to tie themselves with Sony, as evident by the SCE guest speaker.

To me these kinds of discussions are more pertinent to the topic than just complaining about the choice of hardware.

 

[cvxfreak]

To me these kinds of discussions are more pertinent to the topic than just complaining about the choice of hardware.

The choice of hardware was brought up because the PSP has already been a problem for the Western sales of games like Peace Walker. And that is a very real problem. Again, it makes sense to me to talk about it in this context and it makes sense for a podcast about the industry, but if you don't see it that way, then fair enough for you.

I think you're exaggerating on the negativity of that discussion about Imageepoch. Imageepoch was briefly brought up during an entire discussion about the viability of the PSP in Japan versus the rest of the world. They were acknowledging how good the PSP platform was doing in Japan and that many games would still come to it for a few years, but its lack of popularity in Western countries is really going to be a problem at this point. I really don't know why a localization company taking this perspective is surprising you.

 

[Curufinwe]

Listened to it this morning. Great show, but I think I enjoyed the Domino's discussion the most so please continue to talk about that kind of stuff in future podcasts.

A couple of quick notes about two games that CheapyD talked about. The multiplayer in Ass Creed Bro is apparently a lot like a PC game from 2006 called The Ship.

http://www.giantbomb.com/the-ship/61-19960/

And I believe the rewind function in Forza 3 was borrowed from GRID, although, rewind functions had been in other types of games before that. Certainly it's a feature that GT5 could do with.

 

[Empty]

whenever they talk about how awesome their current projects that they can't talk about are i start to get irrationally optimistic about games being localized. please yet one of them be the last story.

would also love to hear you talk about localization decisions on certain games in future episodes.

 

[Grimmy]

The choice of hardware was brought up because the PSP has already been a problem for the Western sales of games like Peace Walker. And that is a very real problem. Again, it makes sense to me to talk about it in this context and it makes sense for a podcast about the industry, but if you don't see it that way, then fair enough for you.

I think you're exaggerating on the negativity of that discussion about Imageepoch. Imageepoch was briefly brought up during an entire discussion about the viability of the PSP in Japan versus the rest of the world. They were acknowledging how good the PSP platform was doing in Japan and that many games would still come to it for a few years, but its lack of popularity in Western countries is really going to be a problem at this point. I really don't know why a localization company taking this perspective is surprising you.

Yet still a whole bunch of JRPGs have been announced for the PSP in North America lately - much moreso than the DS. So I don't see why the negativity is warranted, nor why as a localization company this platform choice would matter to them. We don't have the actual sales figures, but at least from figures announced by Atlus, games like Persona 3 Portable in North America have exceeded expectations. Of course, these are not AAA games like Peace Walker which is expecting big sales, but seems to me (and those, say, on the WAHP podcast) that niche RPGs releases are doing fine here. And despite whatever grandiose claims that Image Epoch may make, their announced games so far *are* niche RPGs.

As a stop-gap console the PSP still makes sense right now, especially for their two releases next summer (which is only 6-7 months away). They probably didn't go for a full PS3 game because of the high overhead and longer development times, but I wouldn't be surprised if one of their later upcoming releases is going to be for the PS3. With the DS software sales plummeting in Japan, and the 3DS still building a userbase by early next year, I think they made the most conservative but reasonable choice. But by late 2011, the 3DS will most likely be their main platform.

 

[Kiriku]

Just wanted to say there's a game that came out waaaay before (in 2006) both Spy Party and Ass Creed: Brotherhood with very similar gameplay: The Ship
Thought it deserved a mention.

 

[Gomu Gomu]

am i one of the few people who listen to podcasts because i care about the specific opinions expressed on them? i don't expect 8-4 to follow any particular format or content model other than "totally awesome". i don't care about hearing discussion on the same game/event/story 3-4 times a week as long as something new is at least brought to the table every time.

Ditto.

Great episode as usual. Keep up the good work 8-4.

 

[Phenomic]

Just started listening despite being a little late for this one considering it's past Black Friday. Perhaps this might be the new gaming podcast to listen to haven't really found one either. Interesting to hear about the Japanese grab bag sale custom, funny how things are so radically different in various areas.

 

[meppi]

Almost at the end of this one and just wanted to say thank you for bringing Kevin Gifford back for the upcoming Super Famicom episode.

Didn't really find much for myself in this weeks episode since I'm more of a retro gamer or at least a fan of games with retro sensibilities.
Looked up Need for Speed now though after hearing from you guys.
Would love to see you guys do a retrogaming podcast, especially as the major ones all died this past year it seems.
But also since you have access to people with incredibly detailed knowledge and awesome stories in the field.

*edit* Oh yeah, I'd love to hear about the random Japanese stuff as well.

 

[LiK]

Listening to the show and i LOVE how John wasn't even phased by that puny earthquake. What a man.

 

[goo3r]

8-4 is great so far. I have been looking forward to every episode that comes out. I agree they are in a unique position to be in Japan, in the industry, and have a podcast, but to ignore the western world and focus solely on Japan I would think is a poor decision. Gaming in the west and the east influence each other so it would only be natural that it came up. They are also in the position to comment on the rise of western games in Japan and how well they are being received as the paradigm shift in video game development is moving more toward western developers.

Overall, 8-4 is doing a great job and I look forward to their evolution in the future.

 

[LiK]

Done.

Great show, I hope you invite CheapyD back on soon for any major US releases. I loved his impressions for NFS and AC Brotherhood. Great chemistry.

 

[cvxfreak]

So I don't see why the negativity is warranted, nor why as a localization company this platform choice would matter to them.

You don't, but I do. Different world views.

 

[Kingsgoon]

Great show and CheapyD fit in nicely.

 

[AgentOtaku]

Another great episode and yes, please include more stories about life over there. Love it.
Also, hearing CheapyD made me wanna start listening to CAGcast again ...got sort of a on/off relationship with it.

 

[LiK]

Another great episode and yes, please include more stories about life over there. Love it.
Also, hearing CheapyD made me wanna start listening to CAGcast again ...got sort of a on/off relationship with it.

CAGcast forever

 

[Raging Spaniard]

Just listened to it, thanks for getting to my question and I'm looking forward to the MH talk

For what its worth, I hope that ideas for changing MH for American audiences don't include things like auto-lock. At that point it wouldn't be MH anymore!

Anyways, great stuff, thanks for spending your limited free time in this venture.

 

[john tv]

Thanks for the comments guys.

Just a heads-up: we decided to wait until next week (Dec. 10) for the Monster Hunter ep, so we can get a nice, solid chunk of playtime in with MHP3. If we do it this week, we have to record it on 12/2, which would only give us like a solid day of play -- hardly enough to really dig in! (especially with a game like MH)

LiK - we just had a much bigger earthquake like 20 mins ago. Good times!

 

[Gomu Gomu]

Thanks for the comments guys.

Just a heads-up: we decided to wait until next week (Dec. 10) for the Monster Hunter ep, so we can get a nice, solid chunk of playtime in with MHP3. If we do it this week, we have to record it on 12/2, which would only give us like a solid day of play -- hardly enough to really dig in! (especially with a game like MH)

LiK - we just had a much bigger earthquake like 20 mins ago. Good times!

I REALLY hope that episode would be easy to listen to & understand for us non-MH players. Non of my friends play this game, non of the podcasts I listen to talk about it and since everyone on Gaf either doesn't give a shit or is super hardcore, every time I get into a MH thread in gaf wanting to understand the game and the appeal, I get lost.
This podcast is my final attempt to understand what is so compelling about MH series :lol So go easy on us.

 

[cvxfreak]

I REALLY hope that episode would be easy to listen to & understand for us non-MH players. Non of my friends play this game, non of the podcasts I listen to talk about it and since everyone on Gaf either doesn't give a shit or is super hardcore, every time I get into a MH thread in gaf wanting to understand the game and the appeal, I get lost.
This podcast is my final attempt to understand what is so compelling about MH series :lol So go easy on us.

That's why I'll be returning for this podcast, to be the one who doesn't quite understand MH yet giving feedback as a n00b. It'll provide some balance to the show, hopefully!

 

[AgentOtaku]

oh yeah lol, wtf is up with the Fable hate!?

I happen to think it's art style is one of it's most stand out qualities. Love it.
Now on a technical level...

 

[The Dutch Slayer]

Thanks for the comments guys.

Just a heads-up: we decided to wait until next week (Dec. 10) for the Monster Hunter ep, so we can get a nice, solid chunk of playtime in with MHP3. If we do it this week, we have to record it on 12/2, which would only give us like a solid day of play -- hardly enough to really dig in! (especially with a game like MH)

LiK - we just had a much bigger earthquake like 20 mins ago. Good times!

so no "normal" ep this week? .

Ow well np guys keep up the great work and Looking forward to the next show as a MH noob myself I'm interested in the discussion about the games.

 

[Gomu Gomu]

That's why I'll be returning for this podcast, to be the one who doesn't quite understand MH yet giving feedback as a n00b. It'll provide some balance to the show, hopefully!

That's great to know

 

[Jonnyram]

Just got done with listening to this one myself.

I had no idea about the Queen references in Matsuno games.
I'm addicted to Tactics Ogre right now, so I'm afraid I'm gonna have to pass on the MHP3rd festivities.

 

[lybertyboy]

oh yeah lol, wtf is up with the Fable hate!?

I happen to think it's art style is one of it's most stand out qualities. Love it.
Now on a technical level...

For the record Mark hates all things British. I think the Queen might have given him the finger when he was younger. :lol

 

[Jex]

In terms of multiplayer modes where you hunt others, I'm surprised no-one brought up The Ship: Murder Party. That came out on PC in 2007 and was essentially the same core concept- Hunt someone down on board the ship while also being hunted yourself.

I imagine both Assassins Creed and Spy Party may have been inspired by this game. I'm surprised it took other companies this long to try and create a more unique multiplayer experience, but I suppose it doesn't fit into too many settings.

 

[Helmholtz]

Listening to this for basically my first time. Enjoying it quite a bit so far, aside from the deals talk which I'm not particularly interested in. I mainly only care about western games though, so if the podcast continues to strike a balance between those and japanese ones I'll keep listening. Also CheapyD is a good personality, get him on more often! (he also sounds exactly like Blackace from the gafcast)

 

[Raging Spaniard]

I REALLY hope that episode would be easy to listen to & understand for us non-MH players. Non of my friends play this game, non of the podcasts I listen to talk about it and since everyone on Gaf either doesn't give a shit or is super hardcore, every time I get into a MH thread in gaf wanting to understand the game and the appeal, I get lost.
This podcast is my final attempt to understand what is so compelling about MH series :lol So go easy on us.

For me it has everything I like about Diablo mixed with everything I like about Capcom's fighting systems.

Theres a lot of ways to kill monsters, every weapons plays like a different game and it rewards good timing and learning every aspect of the game. Playing with other people you realize that everybody has a role, and a very important one.

Its basically grinding made fun.

 

[pancakesandsex]

All feedback is welcome, and wanting more talk about Japanese games, as we -are- in Japan (and that's the basic thrust of the show, after all) is a perfectly valid request.

What I can say is that we hear you, and we agree, and we wish we had time recently to play more Japanese games to talk about, too. Hopefully we will soon.

That said, we are always going to talk about Western games to some extent, just 'cause we will always be playing them too. Hopefully, as we evolve, we can find a good balance. (But if you're really into imports, may I also recommend WARNING! A Huge Podcast Is Approaching Fast!)

Finally: We consider our audience's time extremely, EXTREMELY valuable, so if anyone doesn't want to listen to a game/section/or even whole episode they don't think is worth their precious time (see: Monster Hunter episode next week , we don't want them to either! Which is why we try to let listeners know beforehand what all we talk about (with stuff like the timestamps that go up with each episode at 8-4.jp), so they can decide for themselves if they want to listen or not.

Anyway, thanks for the feedback, and thanks for listening (or having listened, if you are now sworn off us!)

Hi. I haven't really popped into these threads yet, but I've been listening to the podcast since the first episode.

I've been having an issue with the western game talk as well. You guys really are in a unique position, and as cvx freak mentioned, it's not that you should talk into a vacuum, and ignore western games altogether, but my god, why do I have to hear about the latest call of duty on yet another podcast? Can't you just like, shelve that one for later, or find a way to bring it home like the red dead segment.

It's like a bait and switch. I feel like you guys aren't following through on the "advertised" premise of the show. I came for knights in the nightmare and I got knights of the old republic. I'm not even asking for you to talk only about imports none of us can effectively play either, but there are plenty of Japanese games coming out in the US every week that are not necessarily made by capcom, nintendo, or platinum games, so are no shortages of potential discussion topics.

Also, next time you have magweasel on, let the man finish a thought. That was by far the most interesting episode I've heard so far, but it felt like you were rushing to shut the guy up when he had a ton of things to say far more interesting than cheapy d's uninterrupted impressions of assassin's creed.

 

[LiK]

personally, i don't care what they talk about. no Western games is fine with me if they're not playing it. i just like their conversations and anecdotes. they should just talk about whatever interests them because that's when they're having fun. when they try to please everyone then it'll just be another gaming podcast talking about stuff that other people talked about already. let them do their thang, folks. it's what makes them interesting to listen to.

 

[No_Style]

I listen to 8-4 Play for their opinion and views on games. If there's a lot of western games talk? So be it.

This is one of the two podcasts that I listen to regularly now. I love the vibe of it and the silliness of MarcMacD's nicknames. It's not overly negative or whiny on things which I appreciate.

However, I know this sounds crazy, but it seems like they should have spin-off podcast that focuses on key subjects like that episode with Kevin Gifford or the upcoming Monster Hunter one. Because it looks like people have different expectations on what the "8-4 Play" podcast should be.

 

[Blast Processing]

I'm pretty sure John was right about being able to go back and explore other story branches in Tactics Ogre. I'm pretty sure that's being called the Wheel of Fortune system, though the CHARIOT system is indeed just he battle move rewinding.

 

[pancakesandsex]

I'm pretty sure John was right about being able to go back and explore other story branches in Tactics Ogre. I'm pretty sure that's being called the Wheel of Fortune system, though the CHARIOT system is indeed just he battle move rewinding.

I think he's confusing it with Radiant Historia.

 

[hamchan]

Heard good things about this podcast so I'll try it out.

 

[john tv]

I think he's confusing it with Radiant Historia.

Ah no, I was talking about TO (I have zero interest in RH). None of my info was wrong - talk to sprsk!