Surely you are not so tone deaf given what's been going on with the Weinstein scandal to not see there are structures of powers made to protect individuals and entities from what they view as inconvenient sexual harassment cases?
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An important statement from Naughty Dog
- Thread starter Kenzodielocke
- Start date
Surely you are not so tone deaf given what's been going on with the Weinstein scandal to not see there are structures of powers made to protect individuals and entities from what they view as inconvenient sexual harassment cases?
Publically I will hold off witch hunting because these things should be investigated through proper channels first before damning anyone. On a personal level though, I don't see this person having much to gain by lying about this. It is theoretically possible that the guy is lying but on a human level, my first instinct is to believe him. On a court I would of course be all "we need evidence!".
They might not even have a record of that.
I'm worried there are two sad sides to this story
I believe David was sexually harassed and he kept it to himself like many victims do. It sounds like he had some sort of breakdown and was fired for the breakdown.
Sony probably offered him a nice severance package given how long he'd been there.
Severance packages always have a non disparagement clause. David took it as "They're trying to silence me."
Can you explain further?
Edit: yes I dont work in crisis management, but the response still needs to be we are investigating. Whether or not they actually talk to the dude or not is basically immaterial to that sentiment. Because its going to look bad when/if he drops the names of the person that harassed him, the HR manager that called him, and the people at Sony he complained to.
NormalFish
Banned
When have corporations ever openly admitted to creating a hostile work environment lol
GHG
Member
There would be evidence of the call taking place but calls between HR and employees do not tend to be recorded. If you record a call then you would need to let the employee know which would mean it stops being an open and honest conversation in most cases. People tend to close up when they know they're being recorded.
That doesnt mean every accusation of misconduct should be accepted as fact without scrutiny.
One thing that is definite that some of you would make terrible lawyers and have no common sense concept of "law".
On to more important things what happened to Mr. Ballard is terrible and I could not imagine the bounce back process especially when what occurred happened to be involved within an industry he was passionate about. I'd assume ND wanted to get out ahead of this and are doing due diligence.
I hope this is resolved moreso for David than anything else.
On to more important things what happened to Mr. Ballard is terrible and I could not imagine the bounce back process especially when what occurred happened to be involved within an industry he was passionate about. I'd assume ND wanted to get out ahead of this and are doing due diligence.
I hope this is resolved moreso for David than anything else.
CaviarMeths
Member
The second sentence of the statement is what really sticks out and causes the whole thing to come off as dismissive or non-committal. It sets a bad tone.
Original statement:
Quick revision:
Already reads better.
Original statement:
Quick revision:
Already reads better.
I'm sure no game journalist is going to give up their industry access to find out more about this particular case. They would be as untouchable as this acccuser.
The Last One
Member
They're saying they don't have any evidence of having received allegations from him that he was harassed. I don't think neither of them is lying, isn't the most likely scenario that someone from HR destroyed the allegations at the time after he was fired?
A call with HR from the company that is firing you is not really a smoking gun...
What he needs is an e-mail between him and HR/someone at ND reporting the sexual harassment or a copy from a written statement.
GHG
Member
They might not even have a record of that.
I'm worried there are two sad sides to this story
I believe David was sexually harassed and he kept it to himself like many victims do. It sounds like he had some sort of breakdown and was fired for the breakdown.
Sony probably offered him a nice severance package given how long he'd been there.
Severance packages always have a non disparagement clause. David took it as "They're trying to silence me."
Based on the information we have that's my take on this as well.
Oh boy.
No, that is not the most likely scenario unless somebody has a burning desire to sit in a court room.
They might not even have a record of that.
I'm worried there are two sad sides to this story
I believe David was sexually harassed and he kept it to himself like many victims do. It sounds like he had some sort of breakdown and was fired for the breakdown.
Sony probably offered him a nice severance package given how long he'd been there.
Severance packages always have a non disparagement clause. David took it as "They're trying to silence me."
Unfortunately I can see this being the case.
esmith08734
Member
I might have the chain of events mixed up. I apologize if I do and I do not mean to make any assumptions but I wonder if the $20K offer was not a silence offer but a severance for his breakdown.
Gemüsepizza
Member
That's not how this works. That's not how any of this works. What do you think happens when Ballard has emails/records which can prove certain things, and Naughty Dog suddenly doesn't. If they tried to cover this up and tried to make evidence disappear, they would get destroyed by courts. It is much more likely that they simply don't have records, that this incident, as unfortunate as it is, wasn't reported/documented properly, so it couldn't be investigated. Like others already have written, it's perfectly possible that both are saying the truth, and that this simply wasn't known by the right people at Naughty Dog.
There actually was evidence, for example voice recordings of an incident where Weinstein harassed an actress, also there were multiple victims/witnesses.
Well yeah, of course. I'm going to *try* to believe this person because if they are lying they are using a raw climate of human suffering just to put themselves over and that would be a reprehensible action for this guy to take.
for starters they could be accused of harassment, or trying to shut him up...this is not two kids talking out a disagreement on the playground...these are serious allegations, with serious legal and financial implications
They said they have no record of it. Meaning HR was negligent, HR wrongfully destroyed records, or David never filed an official complaint.
Same.
Serenitynow
Member
Quoting myself from the other thread:
So hopefully David Ballard has something to show. I'd hate for him to share anything he isn't comfortable sharing, but this situation could get bad for him. Hopefully it doesn't, but there are some really passionate fans out there who might attack him on Twitter. I hate the victim has to prove it mentality.
Not suggesting he does this, but maybe if he gave a name, it would be a Nick Robinson situation, in that more people would come forth. Just throwing out the possibility that maybe this harasser has a reputation.
So hopefully David Ballard has something to show. I'd hate for him to share anything he isn't comfortable sharing, but this situation could get bad for him. Hopefully it doesn't, but there are some really passionate fans out there who might attack him on Twitter. I hate the victim has to prove it mentality.
Not suggesting he does this, but maybe if he gave a name, it would be a Nick Robinson situation, in that more people would come forth. Just throwing out the possibility that maybe this harasser has a reputation.
TimeEffect
Member
Seems like hed have to specifically name the lead in order to maybe get more people out to support him. Doubt itll go any further at this point
Like posted above. Based on the info we have there's probably a reason why all of this played out the way it did.
Like I said earlier, naming the harasser would potentially open up Ballard to a defamation lawsuit if he does not have any evidence or corroboration to back up his claims.
Nice clickbait title. Thought this was going to be a new game announcement
I'm out.
Given the subject its perhaps something that could be taken up by someone outside sycophantic industry press. Although losing gated corperate access might still be an advantage for a journalist if theyre seen as supporting individual developers first. Not all access is run through PR first.
David already mentioned that when he initially came out with the story. They basically said his position was redundant or no longer needed. ND themselves would likely not provide that information because it is private to the employee.
metalslimer
Member
I hope he has something to show and fuck ND if they are covering their asses without trying to actually look into the story. Fucking games journalists should be all over stories Ike this but most of them are just the PR wing of the industry
Marvel
could never
Far from clickbait.Nice clickbait title. Thought this was going to be a new game announcement
esmith08734
Member
Nice clickbait title. Thought this was going to be a new game announcement
Not a clickbait title if you visited the Internet yesterday.
I don't think any company can publicly or privately state why they let someone go. That's against the law I believe.
rochellepaws
Member
I think more important than what it says literally is the subtext which indicates no knowledge of the events ever occurring and no expressed intention to investigate or reach out to the alleged victim. No part of the statement entertains the notion that the claim could be true or the possibility of wrongdoing on behalf of their HR, which is especially revealing considering this has all taken place over the weekend so they probably couldn't have even had an opportunity to discuss the matter with all relevant staff.
It's a cold message intent on denying accountability and seeking to preserve the companies reputation.
Nice clickbait title. Thought this was going to be a new game announcement
As for that subbject. Not much else they can say, I guess.
Jesus Christ.
Nice clickbait title. Thought this was going to be a new game announcement
As for that subbject. Not much else they can say, I guess.
This was pretty heavily discussed lately.
ronaldthump
Member
Keyboard warriors coming out talking about this not being a good look for ND
What did anyone expect them to say?
What did anyone expect them to say?
Not saying its the case here. But this can happen from something who suffers mental breakdown from stressful situations: i.e Mental breakdown from a 12 month hostile work environment that initiated from Sexual Harassment, or Mental Breakdown from 17 months of no jobs offers from seemly being untouchable in the industry you love
Of course I understand that, but to immediately indict a company for a massive cover-up after they release a simple statement saying it wasn't reported? It's way too early to say something like that just based on their response. C'mon.
Brotherhood93
Member
Obviously a tweet proves nothing but this is a tweet I saw from after David left Naughty Dog.
It would seem to me from this that he didn't really have any issue with Naughty Dog as a company. A scan of his timeline shows many supportive tweets of them and some of his ex-colleagues too, including people high up in the company. On this basis it doesn't seem to me like Naughty Dog were involved in a mass cover-up because if it caused him this much distress surely he would have some big issues with them and people involved there? If David is telling the truth about sexual harassment it seems like a big failing on Sony's HR department above all else. However, it's probably best not to speculate too much. I don't want to believe David would make this up, I don't want to believe Naughty Dog has a sexual harassment problem and I don't want to believe Sony would refuse to investigate. Hopefully somebody gets to the bottom of what did or didn't happen.
It would seem to me from this that he didn't really have any issue with Naughty Dog as a company. A scan of his timeline shows many supportive tweets of them and some of his ex-colleagues too, including people high up in the company. On this basis it doesn't seem to me like Naughty Dog were involved in a mass cover-up because if it caused him this much distress surely he would have some big issues with them and people involved there? If David is telling the truth about sexual harassment it seems like a big failing on Sony's HR department above all else. However, it's probably best not to speculate too much. I don't want to believe David would make this up, I don't want to believe Naughty Dog has a sexual harassment problem and I don't want to believe Sony would refuse to investigate. Hopefully somebody gets to the bottom of what did or didn't happen.
absolutely not...ironically (or maybe unfortunately in this case), ND is not legally allowed to release that information...
I get that you cant say too much but something along the lines of While we have no record of this incident occurring, we take any type of workplace harassment allegation very seriously and will work through the appropriate channels to determine what, if anything, happened. Something like that.
They are FUCKED if he has any proof whatsoever. They better hope their ducks are in a row...
Are you a keyboard warrior too? It certainly seems like you are on a crusade of some sort...
As for what I expected, I expected something along the lines of "We here at Naughty Dog have heard the allegations made by David and frankly we find them to be extremely disturbing. This is not who we are as a company. We assure you that we will be investigating these claims thoroughly".
Are you a keyboard warrior too? It certainly seems like you are on a crusade of some sort...
As for what I expected, I expected something along the lines of "We here at Naughty Dog have heard the allegations made by David and frankly we find them to be extremely disturbing. This is not who we are as a company. We assure you that we will be investigating these claims thoroughly".
Nothing mightve been better tbh. Waiting until the workweek wouldve improved the optics too.
SliceSabre
Banned
I believe it entirely possible for the victim and Sony/ND to be telling the truth.
Their statement merely says:
So it is entirely possible that he was a victim of sexual harassment but there was never anything put on the official record of it happening so Sony/ND in fact don't have any evidence of it happening. I don't believe he's lying nor do I believe Sony/ND are lying either.
Their statement merely says:
So it is entirely possible that he was a victim of sexual harassment but there was never anything put on the official record of it happening so Sony/ND in fact don't have any evidence of it happening. I don't believe he's lying nor do I believe Sony/ND are lying either.