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Drama Clickbait Apple's M1 Max GPU is as powerful as an Nvidia RTX 2080 desktop GPU and the Sony PS5 gaming console

DonJuanSchlong

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We went through this same kinda bs comparisons when the original M1 was released, and everyone realized that Apple makes the dumbest comparisons, with even dumber graphs that don't mean shit.

I'll believe when I see them running similar to a GPU that's ACTUALLY in the same range.
 

Epic Sax CEO

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Being discussed already on the other thread: https://www.neogaf.com/threads/appl...anced-gpu-performance-increase.1604948/page-7

This is a bigger SOC, but still smaller than the GPUs from AMD and Nvidia.
Apple could very well make GPU-only dies to offer standalone upgrade to the big Mac that would shatter anything AMD could offer. It's not just Intel that lost a market, AMD also.

We went through this same kinda bs comparisons when the original M1 was released, and everyone realized that Apple makes the dumbest comparisons, with even dumber graphs that don't mean shit.

I'll believe when I see them running similar to a GPU that's ACTUALLY in the same range.

If I remember right the GPU on the M1 with only 8 cores in a SOC that consumed 35W max was running Shadow of Tombraider at very high 1080p around 50fps. Do the math.


Anyway, no one will be able to buy GPUs from Apple like you buy from AMD, Intel or Nvidia.
You need to buy the whole computer.
 
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DonJuanSchlong

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Being discussed already on the other thread: https://www.neogaf.com/threads/apple-preparing-a-‘portable-hybrid-console’-with-a-brand-new-soc-that-offers-enhanced-gpu-performance-increase.1604948/page-7

This is a bigger SOC, but still smaller than the GPUs from AMD and Nvidia.
Apple could very well make GPU-only dies to offer standalone upgrade to the big Mac that would shatter anything AMD could offer. It's not just Intel that lost a market, AMD also.
Any proof that apple can actually compete with AMD on the GPU market? Nvidia is doing so much more than AMD in this department, but I don't believe for one second, that Apple can suddenly overtake AMD on regards to GPU. Maybe on paper, but there are no real life scenarios that I've seen.
 

DonJuanSchlong

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Being discussed already on the other thread: https://www.neogaf.com/threads/apple-preparing-a-‘portable-hybrid-console’-with-a-brand-new-soc-that-offers-enhanced-gpu-performance-increase.1604948/page-7

This is a bigger SOC, but still smaller than the GPUs from AMD and Nvidia.
Apple could very well make GPU-only dies to offer standalone upgrade to the big Mac that would shatter anything AMD could offer. It's not just Intel that lost a market, AMD also.



If I remember right the GPU on the M1 with only 8 cores in a SOC that consumed 35W max was running Shadow of Tombraider at very high 1080p around 50fps. Do the math.


Anyway, no one will be able to buy GPUs from Apple like you buy from AMD, Intel or Nvidia.
You need to buy the whole computer.
Yeah but that's just one game. I'm out of the loop, but have they released multiple game benchmarks with in depth analysis, like every other comparison does? Cause anyone can show a scene where a GPU is better than the next GPU.

That is impressive, but I have my doubts because of the track record Apple has with dumb comparisons that only work in a specific scenario.
 

STARSBarry

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Joking aside though, it will be interesting to see how it works in terms of real world performance, even within the Nvidia vs AMD space, sponsored titles focusing on developing there title for a specific brand of GPU leaves alot of potential performance at the door for the none sponsored hardware (See Geforce performance on Assassin's Creed Valhalla for example). So imagine how much is going to be left on the table when no one is developing games to take it into account because no one buys a Mac to primarily play games on...
 
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Epic Sax CEO

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Any proof that apple can actually compete with AMD on the GPU market? Nvidia is doing so much more than AMD in this department, but I don't believe for one second, that Apple can suddenly overtake AMD on regards to GPU. Maybe on paper, but there are no real life scenarios that I've seen.

People fail to realize that Apple always had the best GPU on mobile, PowerVR.
After they learned how to make GPUs and broke with Imagination they started to develop GPUs for their own needs instead of making do with what Imagination worked for the needs of the whole market. They did the same thing they make with their CPUs, why is hard to believe that Apple could achieve the same success?
Like I said the small 8 core GPU on the M1 already performs amazingly.
 

kyliethicc

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Yup they are basically delivering similar to console specs, but in mobile chips.

M1 ~ PS4 / XBOS / Steam Deck
M1 Pro ~ PS4 Pro / XBSS
M1 Max ~ PS5 / XBSX

Issue is of course MacOS isn't made for console / PC games, Apple only cares about mobile games.
 
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Wooxsvan

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so hows the single-core performance CPU stack up against last years m1 in their $999 macbook air?

GPU portion looks pretty slick though
 
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DonJuanSchlong

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People fail to realize that Apple always had the best GPU on mobile, PowerVR.
After they learned how to make GPUs and broke with Imagination they started to develop GPUs for their own needs instead of making do with what Imagination worked for the needs of the whole market. They did the same thing they make with their CPUs, why is hard to believe that Apple could achieve the same success?
Like I said the small 8 core GPU on the M1 already performs amazingly.
I will agree with you here %100. They do amazing with their own hardware. They have been above snapdragon on CPU and GPU for a long time now. The issue is, they only optimize for their own sake. You can't install steam on a Mac, and just play your steam library. Only a handful of titles work. So apple could very well have the best GPU in existence, and it would mean absolutely nothing at the end of the day. Gamers don't use Apple, as they don't care about gamers.


What makes matters worse is the pricing and lack of relationship with game devs. No one is going to buy a $5k Mac when it comes with a RX580. That's insult on top of injury.
 
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gundalf

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TFLOPs alone are not an exact metric for real world performance.

Besides we have to wait and see how AMDs CPU and GPU designs will fair on 5nm. Apples lead comes on big part of having exclusive manufacturing capacity with TSMC on 5nm. But I can see Apple being in a good spot to play this game with TSMC for the next decade.
 

scydrex

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What is the cheapest computer that will have this chip.?

The 14" Macbook Pro with 512gb ssd and don't remember what else. Is the cheapest 14" and cheapest computer that let you configure with the M1 Max. It cost around $2900 and $3100 with taxes in FL.
 
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Epic Sax CEO

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I will agree with you here %100. They do amazing with their own hardware. They have been above snapdragon on CPU and GPU for a long time now. The issue is, they only optimize for their own sake. You can't install steam on a Mac, and just play your steam library. Only a handful of titles work. So apple could get well have the best GPU in existence, and it would mean absolutely nothing at the end of the day. Gamers don't use Apple, as they don't care about gamers.


What makes matters worse is the pricing and lack of relationship with game devs. No one is going to buy a $5k Mac when it comes with a RX580. That's insult on top of injury.

Apple only "invested" on Mobile because it was what made sense in the past.
They had "mobile grade hardware", so they tried to get games on that scale.
Now they have console and high end PC hardware, they can invest on bigger games.
But they don't even needs, these chips are perfectly able to emulate x86, they do this in hardware. The example I game of Tomb Rider (a bit lower than I remembered) was running emulated:



Also, do achieve that performance the GPU was using only 7W (plus 7.5W for the CPU).
Now scale this 4 times or more, give it more power, add the early generation improvements.
It doesn't need to be "the best", but don't you agree that it's good enough? Most gamers actually don't own the top dog GPUs and are very happy with their performance.

Besides we have to wait and see how AMDs CPU and GPU designs will fair on 5nm. Apples lead comes on big part of having exclusive manufacturing capacity with TSMC on 5nm. But I can see Apple being in a good spot to play this game with TSMC for the next decade.

Better process is not always a guarantee that the chip will use that much less energy.
Didn't worked for Vega, remember?
Alder Lake with a mature 10/7nm process and dropping AVX512 will use more energy than previous gen.
 
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Sep 19, 2017
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Now, Apple needs to create an exclusive indie (for the fun factor) + an exclusive AAA (for the woao factor) studio. We need big exclusives , like Crisis, for Apple silicon.
 
Dec 12, 2018
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M1 is such an amazing little chip. They should hurry up making everything native though. Thats my only gripe with M1 Macs right now (even though emulation works surprisingly good most of the time).
 

DonJuanSchlong

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Apple only "invested" on Mobile because it was what made sense in the past.
They had "mobile grade hardware", so they tried to get games on that scale.
Now they have console and high end PC hardware, they can invest on bigger games.
But they don't even needs, these chips are perfectly able to emulate x86, they do this in hardware. The example I game of Tomb Rider (a bit lower than I remembered) was running emulated:



Also, do achieve that performance the GPU was using only 7W (plus 7.5W for the CPU).
Now scale this 4 times or more, give it more power, add the early generation improvements.
It doesn't need to be "the best", but don't you agree that it's good enough? Most gamers actually don't own the top dog GPUs and are very happy with their performance.
With 4x the power, this wouldn't be a bad chip, agreed with that as well. What I don't agree with, is the asking price. How much more would you have to pay for that performance, compared to on PC? You'd need to spend at least 2x, or 3x, or even more. Which kills any enticing factor Apple may have had.

Don't get me wrong, I would love to see more competitors in the gaming space, as competition is good for us consumers. But at this point, I just don't see it competing. I'll never own anything Apple, as they are the worst when it comes to price to performance, or intentionally crippling their own products to make you upgrade, how they prefer form over functionality, etc.
 
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Topher

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I want to see it run a game like Cyberpunk or Metro Exodus that's hammering the Gpu with multiple raytracing features.

This isn't made for gaming at all. Apple never even marketed it as a gaming laptop. It is for doing heavy lifting in video production and stuff like that.

With 4x the power, this wouldn't be a bad chip, agreed with that as well. What I don't agree with, is the asking price. How much more would you have to pay for that performance, compared to on PC? You'd need to spend at least 2x, or 3x, or even more. Which kills any enticing factor Apple may have had.

Don't get me wrong, I would love to see more competitors in the gaming space, as competition is good for us consumers. But at this point, I just don't see it competing. I'll never own anything Apple, as they are the worst when it comes to price to performance, or intentionally crippling their own products to make you upgrade, how they prefer form over functionality, etc.

This isn't made to compete with anything in the gaming space. I watched the event and they showed off a grand total of ZERO games. I don't even remember the word "game" being mentioned in regards to these processors or laptops. Apple doesn't give a shit about gaming outside of iOS. They know that is just a futile venture.
 
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i noticed that. faster than a PS5 lol. Apple are really doing amazing things with their chips.

but it means nothing for gamers. Apple aren't interesting in gaming on MacOS. but just imagine if they took it seriously....they'd come in swinging and kicking.
 
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Rikkori

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Oh stop, you. That's too rich. Let's see how it runs game first, because the much touted M1 ran WoW more like a PC from 2010 than all that it was cracked up to be.

jean yoon laughing GIF by Kim's Convenience
 
Dec 12, 2018
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It's a great chip but who the fuck is doing any serious gaming on a macbook?
also this. I love my M1 Mac, and it actually works quite well for emulation and the games I've tried, but I usually just use my PC for gaming because of compatibility reasons and a bigger selection of games. They're amazing for working though and as a general everyday device.
 

DonJuanSchlong

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This isn't made for gaming at all. Apple never even marketed it as a gaming laptop. It if for doing heavy lifting in video production and stuff like that.



This isn't made to compete with anything in the gaming space. I watched the event and they showed off a grand total of ZERO games. I don't even remember the word "game" being mentioned in regards to these processors or laptops. Apple doesn't give a shit about gaming outside of iOS. They know that is just a futile venture.
On a gaming website, about games, an thread about the apple m1 was posted. Inside that thread was conversations about games running on this chip. Sure, it might not be the intention for games, but you'd be a fool to not think people are going to discuss or even attempt to play games on this. Otherwise, we wouldn't be having this conversation now.

And it's kinda crazy to compare it to other GPU's that are literally used for gaming 90% of the time. Especially with rumors of a gaming console potentially coming out. We both commented on that article as well.
 
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ripeavocado

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Apple is literally two steps ahead of any other relevant hardware manufacturer.

The future for consoles (and everything else) is an ARM based CPU and APUs like the Apple ones.

if they want to get into console gaming for the next gen they may easily win as long as they don't overcharge their products and have stupid practices.
 
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Mar 28, 2021
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I'd rather take my $3500 and build a proper gaming PC. Apple makes scalpers look like the good guys.
yeah sure if you want to play games then your $3500 is better put into a PC.

these laptops are not aimed at people who want to play games. just like you might go spend $3500 on a PC for gaming there are people out there who would pay $3500 for a computer that they can use to improve their coding, rendering, or music production performance. i'm in the UK and the 16" macbook pro tops out at £5,900. for someone who makes £200-250 a day it quickly pays for itself. earning £200/day in a 5 day week it'd pay itself off in about a month and a half. when you need a tool for your job you want something high quality that will get the job done easier/faster, right?