Avengers Endgame Trailer 2

EviLore

Expansive Ellipses
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May 30, 2004
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Ok I'm entering the debate because it's coming very clear to me when there's a powerful woman, she's labeled a Mary Sue.

Stop. You're wrong and you know it.

So fuck off with this wilful ignorance.

A number of you guys do indeed come of as misogynistic.
You're entering a debate? Looks more like you're slinging insults.
 

Grivenger

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Ok I'm entering the debate because it's coming very clear to me when there's a powerful woman, she's labeled a Mary Sue.
I haven't watched Captain Marvel yet, but the only other female character I can think of as being labeled a Mary Sue is Star Wars' Rey. And for that one, it definitely is not about her being powerful, but that she can effortlessly do nearly everything really well. Which is a valid complain.
 
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Musky_Cheese

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Oct 23, 2016
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I haven't watched Captain Marvel yet, but the only other female character I can think of as being labeled a Mary Sue is Star Wars' Rey. And for that one, it definitely is not about her being powerful, but that she can effortlessly do nearly everything really well. Which is a valid complain.
Yeah.

Also the MCU already has a number of powerful female characters that are well liked. So saying dislike is because she is a woman is a bit lazy.
 
Likes: pramod
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I never thought of female characters like Ellen Ripley or Shosanna Dreyfus as Mary Sues because they were well-written characters with background stories that justified their tough personas. More importantly, there was a lot of focus on exposition, so it was completely clear to me as the viewer what their motivations were. I never once thought anything about their gender, just that I was watching a badass character earn their revenge, and I was rooting for them all the way. Most critically, they had to overcome significant adversity to get there — their badassery wasn’t just handed to them on a platter because they’re a woman and stamped their feet and went blue in the face like Veruca Salt.

The main problem with modern heroines is that there is no real adversity being overcome. Their personas mirror the already established feminist narrative, specifically that the adversity is intrinsic to their gender. Therefore, by simply existing and not being demure little wallflowers, they’re earning their badassery by default. The problem is that, to those of us who don’t believe in the mystical existence of the patriarchy, these so-called heroines just look like spoiled brats whining about an imaginary friend that won’t let them have a turn. It’s not entertaining, there’s nothing heroic about it, and it is antithetical the entire point of superhero movies — they are supposed to be allegorical figures exemplifying all of the best human traits in overcoming significant adversity. They’re supposed to be something to aspire to, not something to be scorned.
 
Jan 17, 2006
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Going right off topic here.
As someone else pointed out, Carol does struggle to get where she is. We see multiple flashbacks where people are putting her down. She has been told all her life she won't succeed, trying to stop her from being her best self. Then the Kree are literally tying her down and physically stopping her from being her best self. Then at the end of the film she is literally tied down and we see a montage of her standing up at different ages pushing herself to succeed and be her best self, at the same time she breaks free of her Kree chains and becomes her best self.

As for Luke, everything fell in his lap too and he could do no wrong. Just happened upon R2D2, just happened to find him in the desert, just happened to come across Obi-Wan. Woops, aunty and uncle are dead so I may as well follow the old guy as there is nothing else to do. The only real decision he made was to help save the princess. And then due to the script he was an incredible X-Wing pilot, we never saw him struggle or learn to use vehicles, he just could.
 
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Likes: DeafTourette
Dec 2, 2010
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Going right off topic here.
As someone else pointed out, Carol does struggle to get where she is. We see multiple flashbacks where people are putting her down. She has been told all her life she won't succeed, trying to stop her from being her best self. Then the Kree are literally tying her down and physically stopping her from being her best self. Then at the end of the film she is literally tied down and we see a montage of her standing up at different ages pushing herself to succeed and be her best self, at the same time she breaks free of her Kree chains and becomes her best self.

As for Luke, everything fell in his lap too and he could do no wrong. Just happened upon R2D2, just happened to find him in the desert, just happened to come across Obi-Wan. Woops, aunty and uncle are dead so I may as well follow the old guy as there is nothing else to do. The only real decision he made was to help save the princess. And then due to the script he was an incredible X-Wing pilot, we never saw him struggle or learn to use vehicles, he just could.
Lol, still peddling the same shit that pretty much ignores the whole movie.
 
Jan 17, 2006
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I honestly just want to talk about the Avengers trailer. It's got me pretty damn hyped, watched it 20 times last night.

It's a shame that they showed Tony on Earth, but it's also a good thing. If Feige is to be believed, everything shown is within the first 20 minutes so at least we don't have to see Tony and Nebula drifting in space for an hour or 2.
 
Likes: cryptoadam
Apr 25, 2009
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Going right off topic here.
As someone else pointed out, Carol does struggle to get where she is. We see multiple flashbacks where people are putting her down. She has been told all her life she won't succeed, trying to stop her from being her best self. Then the Kree are literally tying her down and physically stopping her from being her best self. Then at the end of the film she is literally tied down and we see a montage of her standing up at different ages pushing herself to succeed and be her best self, at the same time she breaks free of her Kree chains and becomes her best self.

As for Luke, everything fell in his lap too and he could do no wrong. Just happened upon R2D2, just happened to find him in the desert, just happened to come across Obi-Wan. Woops, aunty and uncle are dead so I may as well follow the old guy as there is nothing else to do. The only real decision he made was to help save the princess. And then due to the script he was an incredible X-Wing pilot, we never saw him struggle or learn to use vehicles, he just could.
Does this sound like something else to you?
 
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  • LMJ

    LMJ

I honestly just want to talk about the Avengers trailer. It's got me pretty damn hyped, watched it 20 times last night.

It's a shame that they showed Tony on Earth, but it's also a good thing. If Feige is to be believed, everything shown is within the first 20 minutes so at least we don't have to see Tony and Nebula drifting in space for an hour or 2.

I suggest you watch the original infinity war trailer again because I have a feeling the Russo's are playing a trick on us, the original infinity war trailer clearly showed Hulk running behind everyone else in Wakanda a scene that never happened in the actual movie...

If you pay close attention to the people walking in the quantum realm suits scenes you'll notice that only in one shot does the order change, and that's the shot with Tony in it...

In regards to everything else you said about the other MCU characters and how they didn't do anything let alone the ramble you went on with Luke Skywalker, I'm gonna need longer to correct you and type something for that as you are wrong on pretty much every possible note lol
 
Apr 25, 2009
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I'm not sure, you'd need to give me a hint.
:messenger_grinning_sweat::messenger_grinning_sweat::messenger_grinning_sweat:
I just realised the bolded text I was referencing was behind the spoiler tag, so I'm not sure if you saw it:

"We see multiple flashbacks where people are putting her down. She has been told all her life she won't succeed, trying to stop her from being her best self. Then the Kree are literally tying her down and physically stopping her from being her best self."

This is patriarchy theory. The Kree are symbolic of men.
 
Jan 17, 2006
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I just realised the bolded text I was referencing was behind the spoiler tag, so I'm not sure if you saw it:

"We see multiple flashbacks where people are putting her down. She has been told all her life she won't succeed, trying to stop her from being her best self. Then the Kree are literally tying her down and physically stopping her from being her best self."

This is patriarchy theory. The Kree are symbolic of men.
Sorry @matt404au, I don't apply politics to the story. The same thing could happen to a young boy. It's all about the family they grow up in. And there are bullies who pick on boys, many movies for example have had scenes where a boy is bullied by a girl in school.
 
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Maybe it's because she is overpowered, boring as sin, and has no interesting traits or rogue gallery. That's why she isn't liked in the comics community, despite being around for decades. She was put on ice for over 20 years because no writer cared for her, and no fans wanted her back.

. Her source material is so boring they had to completely ignore it and focus on the kree/Skrull and give her a adapted version of a story Mar-Vell is famous for. Not Danvers.

Mind you, I haven't even got to Brie and her bullshit yet. Others have gone over the film's flaws multiple times. I won't repeat. Either way this idea that Captain Marvel is being unfairly treated is laughably. Her character sucks. Why is it a shock that people don't care for her? No one has to like her
You forgot to mention the whole "Captain Marvel was so uninteresting in the comics that Rogue stole her powers in an issue of The Avengers" before she was even in X-Men. :messenger_tears_of_joy::messenger_tears_of_joy::messenger_tears_of_joy:


Long live the Queen.

 
Nov 19, 2018
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Fuck I hope they don't ruin this shit. It has been too many movies and too much cool shit that it would suck to have it end lame. Sure there have been some low points but when they get it and they build this universe and do cool shit whit it its really good and really entertaining.
 
Apr 25, 2009
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Sorry @matt404au, I don't apply politics to the story. The same thing could happen to a young boy. It's all about the family they grow up in. And there are bullies who pick on boys, many movies for example have had scenes where a boy is bullied by a girl in school.
Uh, I'm not asking you to apply it. It's pretty clear what the writers' intentions were. If you choose to cover your ears and close your eyes, that's up to you.
 
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Jan 17, 2006
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Uh, I'm not asking you to apply it. It's pretty clear what the writers' intentions were. If you choose to cover your ears and close your eyes, that's up to you.
Just like video games, I am happy to and can separate politics and an actors/directors/production crew members personal thoughts from a film. If there are politics played out within the films world/universe/story, that's fine but I don't care about real life politics..
 
Apr 25, 2009
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Just like video games, I am happy to and can separate politics and an actors/directors/production crew members personal thoughts from a film. If there are politics played out within the films world/universe/story, that's fine but I don't care about real life politics..
Right, and you're allowed to ignore them for the sake of enjoying the movie. But that doesn't mean they aren't there or that anyone who isn't willing to ignore them is wrong.
 
Dec 2, 2010
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Sorry @matt404au, I don't apply politics to the story. The same thing could happen to a young boy. It's all about the family they grow up in. And there are bullies who pick on boys, many movies for example have had scenes where a boy is bullied by a girl in school.
The movie makes a point to only show men bullying her. That isnt an accident. The other non-kree women all talk about how amazing she is. It certainly could be a universal theme but the movie is absolutely coloring it a certain way on purpose and that becomes very clear in the climax.
 
Jan 17, 2006
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The movie makes a point to only show men bullying her. That isnt an accident. The other non-kree women all talk about how amazing she is. It certainly could be a universal theme but the movie is absolutely coloring it a certain way on purpose and that becomes very clear in the climax.
And again, I don't care.
Movies in the 70's, 80's, 90's and 00's had scenes like this and no one gave a shit. Now if a movie has a scene like that people who swing to the right have a big whinge.

0 chance of that happening.
Why do you think it won't happen? Do you think they won't put Rogue in an X-Men film?
 
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And again, I don't care.
Movies in the 70's, 80's, 90's and 00's had scenes like this and no one gave a shit. Now if a movie has a scene like that people who swing to the right have a big whinge.



Why do you think it won't happen? Do you think they won't put Rogue in an X-Men film?
They wont sideline Captain Marvel or make her look weak for political reasons.
 
Apr 15, 2018
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Going right off topic here.
As someone else pointed out, Carol does struggle to get where she is. We see multiple flashbacks where people are putting her down. She has been told all her life she won't succeed, trying to stop her from being her best self. Then the Kree are literally tying her down and physically stopping her from being her best self. Then at the end of the film she is literally tied down and we see a montage of her standing up at different ages pushing herself to succeed and be her best self, at the same time she breaks free of her Kree chains and becomes her best self.

As for Luke, everything fell in his lap too and he could do no wrong. Just happened upon R2D2, just happened to find him in the desert, just happened to come across Obi-Wan. Woops, aunty and uncle are dead so I may as well follow the old guy as there is nothing else to do. The only real decision he made was to help save the princess. And then due to the script he was an incredible X-Wing pilot, we never saw him struggle or learn to use vehicles, he just could.
You should probably rewatch star wars