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[Ratrat]

So why isn't it considered a good thing that Nintendo are broadening their software library with something different, something more mature, out of their own pocket?

Regardless of how it will or will not sell, isn't it good for the industry that this game got made, and that Nintendo are expanding the genres of games it's willing to support and fund?

I don't understand the hate, and the glee from some folks, over how B2 will bomb, other than "dis shld b on da playstation becoz of da grafix prowess!"

Seems to be unabated port begging in every B2 thread these days.

I don't think a single post had that inane sentiment but you are welcome to quote them.
If there is any ire its directed at: Nintendo for not promoting the game enough, Platinum fans unwilling to buy a Wii U or Wii U owners unwilling to buy a non-Nintendo game.

 

[Vagabundo]

Responses like this confuse me to no end. How is it such a mystery that people like challenging games that also have some style flair to them? Bayonetta is extremely hard at the higher difficulty & has tons of replay value.

I like challenging games - Dwarf Fortress sadist here - but I don't see what is appealing about it. I didn't get the game or what would make people like it. That said I'm happy that people who do like it have a chance to play the sequel.

 

[KingSnake]

Yea but that statement likely had to do with how they pitched it to Sega and what their forecasting was on their contract. For all we know they were financially incentivized if they hit certain milestones and the title did not, hence this statement and Sega moving on. Sega has operated this way before.

Nintendo is likely more conscious of these things.
I'm not privvy to this deal but it's just as likely they got one contract for hire at a lump budget and built to spec based on Nintendo's own content strategy and happily took their money and made the game they wanted to make.

I'm not saying you, but a lot of people saying these sales put platinum at risk... I really don't see how it does. It's not really how Nintendo does business (which is how they keep getting deals done with third parties of this nature despite the wii u tanking), their partners are generally well taken care of. And seeing how platinum already has revenue from MS and Acti coming in, there's no real reason to be concerned.

Just at its base level, Platinum wanted to make a very specific game. Nintendo wanted specific content on their platform they couldn't make in-house. Fans wanted more of bayonetta. This is honestly a good deal for literally everyone.

Forecasts get revised - it happens. They know their platform is struggling, they take revenue where they can reasonably now. That's how marketing budgets get shifted and whatnot, they won't overspend on the title. Bayonetta fills a role in Nintendo's product release porfolio, and it looks like it's getting amazing reviews - I can almost guarantee at the end of the day some people are happy with that, since that is what they set out to do.

Literally everyone gets something positive from this arrangement that's involved. I hope those who are interested enjoy the benefits!

This is perfectly put. I always enjoy your reality checking posts on here.

And Nintendo invested in a lot of 3rd party games with low selling potential over the years, just to have a better portfolio of games for their platforms. We have even a more "strange" (for those who look at it just from the game sales perspective) example with Devil's Third.

 

[Feindflug]

No, they won't. Bloodborne might be the game that pushes them over the edge and make them buy the console, but it's not the only game. People won't buy a PS4, play Bloodborne and put it in the closet. They buy it, even if now it has a pretty small library, because they trust it'll have all the big 3rd party games + the Sony exclusives that they (hopefully) like + Bloodborne. The same people won't buy a WiiU because they know it'll have Nintendo exclusives and... nothing else. The time of exclusive games selling consoles is over. Exclusives are the icing on the 3rd party cake. They can make you choose an X1 over PS4, but only because the cake is there for both consoles.

I'm getting a WiiU for Bayo2, but I know I'm part of a very small minority of crazy fans with disposable income.

I honestly can't get all those "I'm getting or I'm not getting the X console for only one game". I already have a Wii U, a decent PC rig and I'm getting a Xbone for Sunset Overdrive & a PS4 for Bloodborne...these games are the reasons I'm getting them but this doesn't mean that I will not find more games to play on those systems in the future, It's almost impossible for this to happen unless you have super niche special tastes which is quite rare to see even on this board.

 

[NumberThree]

No, they won't. Bloodborne might be the game that pushes them over the edge and make them buy the console, but it's not the only game. People won't buy a PS4, play Bloodborne and put it in the closet. They buy it, even if now it has a pretty small library, because they trust it'll have all the big 3rd party games + the Sony exclusives that they (hopefully) like + Bloodborne. The same people won't buy a WiiU because they know it'll have Nintendo exclusives and... nothing else. The time of exclusive games selling consoles is over. Exclusives are the icing on the 3rd party cake. They can make you choose an X1 over PS4, but only because the cake is there for both consoles.

Agree. I probably wouldn't have bought a Wii U if it wasn't for Bayonetta 2, but that doesn't mean I bought the console for Bayonetta 2 - I wouldn't have bought it if Bayonetta 2 was the only game on the console I was interested in.

Same for Bloodborne, I'm fairly sure I'll buy a PS4 before the game's released so I get to play it, but I know I'll also have other games to play (such as TLoU).

 

[Aeriscloud]

I'm getting a WiiU for Bayo2, but I know I'm part of a very small minority of crazy fans with disposable income.

You're locking your WiiU in the closet after? Of course I didn't mean it like that.

 

[Mihael Mello Keehl]

Keep doing your thing JP

Lol!

 

[SmokyDave]

I honestly can't get all those "I'm getting or I'm not getting the X console for only one game". I already have a Wii U, a decent PC rig and I'm getting a Xbone for Sunset Overdrive & a PS4 for Bloodborne...these games are the reasons I'm getting them but this doesn't mean that I will not find more games to play on those systems in the future, It's almost impossible for this to happen unless you have super niche special tastes which is quite rare to see even on this board.

'Just buy 'em all' only works when you're young enough to have disposable income and gaming time falling out of your arse. It's not feasible for everyone.

 

[danmaku]

You're locking your WiiU in the closet after? Of course I didn't mean it like that.

Well, I have Bayo2 and W101 to play. Maybe Devil's 3rd if it's not complete shit. But who cares about me, I was talking about the market in general. When the average gamer gets a console, he expect to find the 3rd parties and some exclusives. WiiU can't provide that. It only has exclusives, and it's simply not enough.

 

[Burai]

'Just buy 'em all' only works when you're young enough to have disposable income and gaming time falling out of your arse. It's not feasible for everyone.

Plus buying everything was far easier when you could buy all three for less than $500 (Thanks failed GameCube and Xbox!) as you could in 2003.

To do that now will cost you nearly $1,100. Then once you add the yearly subs, etc...

Even if you bought all of the last gen consoles right now you wouldn't get much change from $720.

 

[sd28821]

Yea but that statement likely had to do with how they pitched it to Sega and what their forecasting was on their contract. For all we know they were financially incentivized if they hit certain milestones and the title did not, hence this statement and Sega moving on. Sega has operated this way before.

Nintendo is likely more conscious of these things.
I'm not privvy to this deal but it's just as likely they got one contract for hire at a lump budget and built to spec based on Nintendo's own content strategy and happily took their money and made the game they wanted to make.

I'm not saying you, but a lot of people saying these sales put platinum at risk... I really don't see how it does. It's not really how Nintendo does business (which is how they keep getting deals done with third parties of this nature despite the wii u tanking), their partners are generally well taken care of. And seeing how platinum already has revenue from MS and Acti coming in, there's no real reason to be concerned.

Just at its base level, Platinum wanted to make a very specific game. Nintendo wanted specific content on their platform they couldn't make in-house. Fans wanted more of bayonetta. This is honestly a good deal for literally everyone.

Forecasts get revised - it happens. They know their platform is struggling, they take revenue where they can reasonably now. That's how marketing budgets get shifted and whatnot, they won't overspend on the title. Bayonetta fills a role in Nintendo's product release porfolio, and it looks like it's getting amazing reviews - I can almost guarantee at the end of the day some people are happy with that, since that is what they set out to do.

Literally everyone gets something positive from this arrangement that's involved. I hope those who are interested enjoy the benefits!

Except angry fanboys XD .

Though thanks again for this post.

 

[Lernaean]

Well, I have Bayo2 and W101 to play. Maybe Devil's 3rd if it's not complete shit. But who cares about me, I was talking about the market in general. When the average gamer gets a console, he expect to find the 3rd parties and some exclusives. WiiU can't provide that. It only has exclusives, and it's simply not enough.

For some it is enough. I'll have all consoles next month (handhelds included) and i'm only interested in the exclusives, except a couple of exceptions, like TEW and MGSV, both of which there is 50% chance i'll get on PC.
For a lot of people, exclusives are the only reason to buy consoles.

 

[BratmanDu]

I don't think a single post had that inane sentiment but you are welcome to quote them.
If there is any ire its directed at: Nintendo for not promoting the game enough, Platinum fans unwilling to buy a Wii U or Wii U owners unwilling to buy a non-Nintendo game.

The post above you..that's not a port beg?

 

[Sami+]

The Wii U was the first console I've ever gotten buyer's remorse from so soon after the purchase. The people here saying that nobody actually buys a console for just one game are totally right, and I've done it before (bought a Vita on P4G's launch date and ended up playing nearly the entire Metal Gear series on it a year later among other things), but after Mario Kart there's literally nothing I want on the system until Smash and Xenoblade (which are coincidentally the reason why I haven't sold it).

When it comes to the Wii U, the "just one game" mentality doesn't work unless you like Nintendo games, IMO. Especially if you have a PS4 or XB1 too.

 

[pablonerru]

The Wii U was the first console I've ever gotten buyer's remorse from so soon after the purchase. The people here saying that nobody actually buys a console for just one game are totally right, and I've done it before (bought a Vita on P4G's launch date and ended up playing nearly the entire Metal Gear series on it a year later among other things), but after Mario Kart there's literally nothing I want on the system until Smash and Xenoblade (which are coincidentally the reason why I haven't sold it).

When it comes to the Wii U, the "just one game" mentality doesn't work unless you like Nintendo games, IMO. Especially if you have a PS4 or XB1 too.

Seeing things like this doesn't help either

 

[jimi_dini]

Seeing things like this doesn't help either

I've seen worse

 

[Feindflug]

'Just buy 'em all' only works when you're young enough to have disposable income and gaming time falling out of your arse. It's not feasible for everyone.

Where did I say "just buy 'em all"?

 

[krizzx]

bayonetta 2 is the only reason i bought a wii u. Too bad it isnt selling well alot of people are missing out.

It shippsed 60,000 (from what I heard) and sold through over half that in 2 days. Seems well to me.

I think some people may be intentionally taking the numbers out of context. I'm sure all of the gaming news sites that cover it will.

Do we know the profit margins for the games or the expected sells from Nintendo?

 

[Here For The Free Feed]

I honestly can't get all those "I'm getting or I'm not getting the X console for only one game". I already have a Wii U, a decent PC rig and I'm getting a Xbone for Sunset Overdrive & a PS4 for Bloodborne...these games are the reasons I'm getting them but this doesn't mean that I will not find more games to play on those systems in the future, It's almost impossible for this to happen unless you have super niche special tastes which is quite rare to see even on this board.

truth

 

[MrNyarlathotep]

It shippsed 60,000 (from what I heard) and sold through over half that in 2 days. Seems well to me.

I think some people may be intentionally taking the numbers out of context. I'm sure all of the gaming news sites that cover it will.

Do we know the profit margins for the games or the expected sells from Nintendo?

Only shipping 60,000 copies of a title suggests that 60,000 copies was a best case scenario of sales by Nintendos estimates (unless people want to believe in that old "creating artificial demand by holding back supply" myth)

 

[Mxrz]

Should've went with Lolipop 2, Nintendo. Hold that L close.

 

[Lernaean]

Should've went with Lolipop 2, Nintendo. Hold that L close.

Maturity.

 

[ninjablade]

]For some it is enough.[/B] I'll have all consoles next month (handhelds included) and i'm only interested in the exclusives, except a couple of exceptions, like TEW and MGSV, both of which there is 50% chance i'll get on PC.
For a lot of people, exclusives are the only reason to buy consoles.

your talking about a very small market when it comes to people buying consoles for exclusives only, not even close to making a console successful. the reality is the average gamer only owns one console each gen, you have to be a hardcore gamer to own 2 consoles.

 

[Laconic]

Should've went with Lolipop 2, Nintendo. Hold that L close.

What L?

Is that supposed to be higher mathematics?

Is it a quantity in a logic equation?

Like, "L", where L represents the butthurt of port-beggars worldwide?

 

[krizzx]

Only shipping 60,000 copies of a title suggests that 60,000 copies was a best case scenario of sales by Nintendos estimates (unless people want to believe in that old "creating artificial demand by holding back supply" myth)

That goes into the rest of what I was saying. Exactly how much did Nintendo need to sale in Japan? Japan has different profit margins than the U.S.

Most games in Japan do no break 100k. If millions were needed to be sold to make a profit like in the US., then the entire game industry would have collapsed in Japan a long time ago.

Do you think Nintendo shipped less than what they though would be profitable them?

 

[Lernaean]

your talking about a very small market when it comes to people buying consoles for exclusives only, not even close to making a console successful. the reality is the average gamer only owns one console each gen, you have to be a hardcore gamer to own 2 consoles.

It's irrelevant. The market exists, no matter how small it is.
There are certain developers like Cave for example that make games that sell about 20k. Should they and their market stop existing? Because i know that i bought a 360 for Cave back in the day.
If an exclusive sells even just a few consoles, it is a victory. A small one, but a victory nevertheless, and as i said before, without these exclusives and the niche genres they represent, a lot of people have no reason to buy a console.

 

[ninjablade]

That goes into the rest of what I was saying. Exactly how much did Nintendo need to sale in Japan? Japan has different profit margins than the U.S.

Most games in Japan do no break 100k. If million were needed to be sold to make a profit then the entire industry would have collapsed in Japan a long time ago.

The game has no chance of selling in the US or Europe to the wiiu audience, if games like batman, AC4, COD and ninja gaiden 3 bombed, what chance does baynetta 2 have.

 

[krizzx]

The game has no chance of selling in the US or Europe to the wiiu audience, if games like batman, AC4, COD and ninja gaiden 3 bombed, what chance does baynetta 2 have.

What does that have to do with anything I just said?

 

[Peff]

Only shipping 60,000 copies of a title suggests that 60,000 copies was a best case scenario of sales by Nintendos estimates (unless people want to believe in that old "creating artificial demand by holding back supply" myth)

Nintendo didn't "ship 60,000" copies, that's simply all they managed to get retailers to purchase according to their own estimates.

 

[Laconic]

The game has no chance of selling in the US or Europe to the wiiu audience, if games like batman, AC4, COD and ninja gaiden 3 bombed, what chance does baynetta 2 have.

What.

No, seriously.

What.

 

[CosmicQueso]

That goes into the rest of what I was saying. Exactly how much did Nintendo need to sale in Japan? Japan has different profit margins than the U.S.

Most games in Japan do no break 100k. If millions were needed to be sold to make a profit like in the US., then the entire game industry would have collapsed in Japan a long time ago.

Do you think Nintendo shipped less than what they though would be profitable them?

are you saying that the console market in japan has not collapsed? maybe you should look again... because it certainly has.

 

[ninjablade]

What does that have to do with anything I just said?

you asked how much baynetta 2 needs to sell in japan to do ok, it needs at least 350k, cause it ain't gonna sell any where else.

 

[Mael]

you asked how much baynetta 2 needs to sell in japan to do ok, it needs at least 350k, cause it ain't gonna sell any where else.

You're privy to the budget cost of the game?
You have internal projections too?

 

[Laconic]

you asked how much baynetta 2 needs to sell in japan to do ok, it needs at least 350k, cause it ain't gonna sell any where else.

It would go a long way towards lending your argument a sense of credibility if you were to know how to spell the name of the game of which you are debating's merits. After that, it would help if your argument actually made sense.

 

[TyrantGuardian]

There are way too many weird posts in this thread for me to cover my thoughts on all of them, but I would like to chip in on the discussion about this sort of stuff taking the "fun" out of video games.

I mean, these things are completely separate mentally, at least for me. Why can I not have a problem with Bayonetta 2 being sent to die sales-wise on a ridiculously underperforming platform while at the same time purchasing a Wii U specifically to play B2 and W101 and having crazy amounts of fun with them? I'm interested in the video game industry and seeing amazing games from P* perform somewhat poorly when it comes to sales make me worried for the future of this type of title. Especially the character action genre, which happens to be my favourite. Bayonetta 2 almost never happened because Bayo 1 underperformed, and that should tell you all you need to know about why I'm worried about this sort of shit.

No, I don't know how Platinum Games are being run or what their deals with publishers are, but I do know that money talks. If they can keep developing games like these with sales like these, no one will be happier than me, but I also can't help but worry.

 

[ninjablade]

You're privy to the budget cost of the game?
You have internal projections too?

well sega did 370k in japan with the first one, and they weren't happy with the sales WW, now if you look at the trend and see how wiiu third party games are selling, even huge franchises are bombing you should see my point if you use a bit of common sense.

 

[Mael]

well sega did 370k in japan with the first one, and they weren't happy with the sales WW, now if you look at the trend and see how wiiu third party games are selling, even huge franchises are bombing you should see my point if use a bit of common sense.

And you know on what Sega based its internal projections and the budget allocated how?
You know how much Sega poured in the project? You know how much Nintendo then poured to salvage the project?
The game bombing isn't indicating that people want more Bayonetta only not on WiiU, it's indicating that people don't want Bayonetta.
You can be happy that Nintendo wasted time and money on it but you still won't get another Bayonetta....and that's more the fault of the market not carrying the product than P*, Sega, Nintendo, Sony or whomever.

Seriously how is that a good thing? And I mean for anyone at all.

Do people really hate Nintendo more than they actually care about Bayonetta/P*?

 

[MrNyarlathotep]

well sega did 370k in japan with the first one, and they weren't happy with the sales WW, now if you look at the trend and see how wiiu third party games are selling, even huge franchises are bombing you should see my point if you use a bit of common sense.

But Nintendo funded Bayonetta 2 and it is not just plausible but likely that Nintendo have different goals and expectations in doing so.

 

[ninjablade]

And you know on what Sega based its internal projections and the budget allocated how?
You know how much Sega poured in the project? You know how much Nintendo then poured to salvage the project?
The game bombing isn't indicating that people want more Bayonetta only not on WiiU, it's indicating that people don't want Bayonetta.
You can be happy that Nintendo wasted time and money on it but you still won't get another Bayonetta....and that's more the fault of the market not carrying the product than P*, Sega, Nintendo, Sony or whomever.

Seriously how is that a good thing? And I mean for anyone at all.

I agree with you here. people don't want baynetta, if people want platinum to have success they need start focusing on making art styles, stories, and characters that people want. still we can't deny that third party games just don't sell on wiiu.

 

[krizzx]

are you saying that the console market in japan has not collapsed? maybe you should look again... because it certainly has.

No. I do not believe it has collapsed for the aforementioned reasons. Profit margins are different.

Comparing general U.S. sales to Japanese sales without context make it look bad, but that is without context. The plain raw numbers aren't as high, but then they don't need to be.

Its like a processor with a high clock speed, and one with and efficient architexture. Take a core 2 Duo at 2.2 Ghz vs a Athlone Xp at 2.6 Ghz. Just looking at numbers would say the athlon is better. But in pracitice the core 2 duo turned out better. Context makes a lot of difference.

Look at Blue Dragon on the Xbox360. That likely has a much higher budget than Bayonetta 2. Sakaguchi said it only needed to sale 200k in Japan to be successful.

The numbers are low at a glance, but we do no know how much was needed to make a profit for Nintendo. It they shipped only 60k, then I'm going to take a guess and say that 60k is all they needed to sale.

Monster Hunter Tri Ultimate for the Wii U did a little over 100k in Japan. Capcom said it was a smash hit. In fact, I've noticed that a lot of games re considered hits by their developers in Japan if they break 100k.

 

[Mael]

I agree with you here. people don't want baynetta, if people want platinum to have success they need start focusing on making art styles, stories, and characters that people want. still we can't deny that third party games just don't sell on wiiu.

Or perhaps focus on something that people actually want, because seriously looking at the numbers of latest staples in the genre is not looking like there's much of a market for stuffs like DMC either.

 

[StevieP]

No. I do not believe it has collapsed for the aforementioned reasons. Profit margins are different.

Comparing general U.S. sales to Japanese sales without context make it look bad, but that is without context. The plain raw numbers aren't as high, but then they don't need to be.

Its like a processor with a high clock speed, and one with and efficient architexture. Take a core 2 Duo at 2.2 Ghz vs a Athlone Xp at 2.6 Ghz. Just looking at numbers would say the athlon is better. But in pracitice the core 2 duo turned out better. Context makes a lot of difference.

Look at Blue Dragon on the Xbox360. That likely has a much higher budget than Bayonetta 2. Sakaguchi said it only needed to sale 200k in Japan to be successful.

The numbers are low at a glance, but we do no know how much was needed to make a profit for Nintendo. It they shipped only 60k, then I'm going to take a guess and say that 60k is all they needed to sale.

I think you need a little dose of reality here. I don't even mean the fact that 60k is not likely a break even amount for this title. The console market in Japan is in the dumps and likely won't recover. I would even say Japan's current market is a precursor as to how the worldwide traditional market is going to look like sooner than later.

 

[ninjablade]

No. I do not believe it has collapsed for the aforementioned reasons. Profit margins are different.

Comparing general U.S. sales to Japanese sales without context make it look bad, but that is without context. The plain raw numbers aren't as high, but then they don't need to be.

Its like a processor with a high clock speed, and one with and efficient architexture. Take a core 2 Duo at 2.2 Ghz vs a Athlone Xp at 2.6 Ghz. Just looking at numbers would say the athlon is better. But in pracitice the core 2 duo turned out better. Context makes a lot of difference.

Look at Blue Dragon on the Xbox360. That likely has a much higher budget than Bayonetta 2. Sakaguchi said it only needed to sale 200k in Japan to be successful.

The numbers are low at a glance, but we do no know how much was needed to make a profit for Nintendo. It they shipped only 60k, then I'm going to take a guess and say that 60k is all they needed to sale.

Monster Hunter Tri Ultimate for the Wii did around 100k in Japan. Capcom said it was a smash hit. In fact, I've noticed that a lot of games re considered hits by their developers in Japan if they break 100k.

Nintendo didn't "ship 60,000" copies, that's simply all they managed to get retailers to purchase according to their own estimates.

.

 

[Stone Ocean]

The game bombing isn't indicating that people want more Bayonetta only not on WiiU, it's indicating that people don't want Bayonetta.

The first game sold over a million copies with pretty much no marketing and with one of the worst ports ever for the PS3

Second game is on a single console that isn't doing so hot and that has basically neither userbases that bought the first game, so it isn't looking so good.

You have to be completely delusional to think people don't want Bayonetta period. Which sadly I think applies to SEGA execs.

 

[krizzx]

I think you need a little dose of reality here. I don't even mean the fact that 60k is not likely a break even amount for this title. The console market in Japan is in the dumps and likely won't recover. I would even say Japan's current market is a precursor as to how the worldwide traditional market is going to look like sooner than later.

That is plausible, but are you 100% certain? Too my understanding, numbers have always looked like this on average in Japan for consoles.

Also, going back to MH Tri on the Wii U. Capcom called it a smash hit. The initial sales of the game in Japan were just around 100k. 100k has always been regarded as "HIT!!!" status for the majority of games in Japan from what I have garnered over the years.

I think people are taking numbers way out of context.

 

[Peff]

Also, going back to MH Tri on the Wii U. Cacpcom called it a smash hit. The initial sales of the game in Japan were just 100k.

So where is Monster Hunter 4 G Wii U?

 

[Y2Kev]

Everyone has such a loose definition of "no marketing". What counts as marketing? Sega advertised heavily in Japan and there were lots of "going in for the kill" commercials in the US.

Not that TV advertising is the best way to sell this kind of game but I do enjoy the "no marketing" random citation.

Responding to the poster above talking about the first game.

Also lol at the 60k being all they need to sell suggestion.

 

[krizzx]

So where is Monster Hunter 4 G Wii U?

Ask Capcom. RE4 was a million+ seller on the Wii, but they didn't give the Wii RE5.

 

[Mael]

The first game sold over a million copies with pretty much no marketing and with one of the worst ports ever for the PS3

Second game is on a single console that isn't doing so hot and that has basically neither userbases that bought the first game, so it isn't looking so good.

You have to be completely delusional to think people don't want Bayonetta period. Which sadly I think applies to SEGA execs.

It didn't sell enough to warrant the attention of its original publisher (and IP owner to boot no?) and NO ONE but Nintendo salvaged the project.
What does that tell you?
Sega isn't interested and literally everyone but Nintendo think it would have been a waste of money to make it.
Seriously if you want more Bayonetta, it'll soon be out and fucking buy it.
It is that simple, if the game sell enough it won't be seen as a waste of everyone's time.
Clearly Bayonetta fans aren't as numerous as they think they are.

 

[Peff]

Ask Capcom. RE4 was a million+ seller on the Wii, but the Wii didn't get RE5.

The Wii couldn't run MT framework and RE5 still sold three times as many copies as 4 Wii. Making a glorified HD remaster to be out as a first re-release (not second like 3G HD) is much, much less resource intensive, yet they don't seem to think it's worth the effort.