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Before playing RE6, know these mechanics since Capcom don't teach poop

D

Dance Inferno

Unconfirmed Member
Neiteio said:
Yep. In fact, I'd say a player's melee-to-shooting ratio should be like 3:1. This is the first RE in ages where you can actually find yourself running low on ammo (especially if you don't equip the Item Drop skill), and so you're best served shooting only to daze and killing with melees whenever possible. It's amazing what you can melee in this game -- you can even melee Strelats (the lizard-like BOWs) from behind and trigger a brief QTE to finish them off. :)
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My favorite strategy with them is to dash towards them into a shoulder check, which initiates the contextual melee, beat the crap out of them with the QTE (RT -> A -> either RT or X, it randomly picks one of those two), and then stomp on it on the ground. Insta-kill with no ammo used on one of the most annoying enemies in the game.

That's what I love about this game: you have so many strategies to dealing with enemies. When I first faced these guys they pissed me the hell off, but after some experimentation I now chase them down when they run away and destroy them with Chris Redfield's fists of fury. Another strategy is to dive to the ground and shoot at them, rolling left and right every time they fire their spikes at you.
 
H

Heart Attack

Member
Why do you guys act all hipsterlike and defend this game so much. I don't want my RE to play like that. If i want to play Vanquish, i'll play Vanquish. I trust CVXFREAK much more than you guys.
 
S

Squire

Banned
Neiteio said:
It doesn't mean the game itself is bad; only that it suffers in terms of accessibility due to the absence of a proper tutorial. It deserves flak for this omission, indeed, and Capcom should be held to the fire for it. But the point stands that the fundamental mechanics are intact and sound, and my hope is that as more people pick up the game, they will do so knowing what Capcom (for some unknown reason) won't tell them in-game. :)
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ilnadmy said:
Eh? It's a testament to Capcom being idiots and not telling players how to utilize the movement/combat mechanics, it has nothing to do with the quality of the game. But anyway there are 15 other threads where you can complain about the game being the worst thing ever conceived by man, so let's keep that out of here.
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It's not rocket science guys. As others have said, if the game doesn't explain it, it counts against the game. "No proper tutorial". <--- It's a flaw in the game's design. You don't need a degree to tell; it's simple math. It's cool if you like the game, but people seem to be bent on arguing the very objective fundamentals of game design.

Sorry to clutter your thread, but again: it serves the argument of your opposers much better than your own.
 
N

Neiteio

Member
Heart Attack said:
Why do you guys act all hipsterlike and defend this game so much. I don't want my RE to play like that. If i want to play Vanquish, i'll play Vanquish. I trust CVXFREAK much more than you guys.
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Eh? Who's acting hipster-like? We're just explaining what we've figured out about the game and how fun it makes things. :) RE has been a whole different beast for some years now, but that's not what this topic is about. This is about the unique gameplay of RE6, and how it works really well and is a lot of fun once understood. :)
 
T

T.O.P

Banned
Quick recover

awww fuck, it was weird that it took so much time to get up lol

thanks this one was totally black to me :D


Heart Attack said:
Why do you guys act all hipsterlike and defend this game so much. I don't want my RE to play like that. If i want to play Vanquish, i'll play Vanquish. I trust CVXFREAK much more than you guys.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...


then what are you doing here? you don't want to play the game the way it's meant to be played and you don't even trust us, i mean seriously?
 
N

Neiteio

Member
Inorigo said:
It's not rocket science guys. As others have said, if the game doesn't explain it, it counts against the game. "No proper tutorial". <--- It's a flaw in the game's design. You don't need a degree to tell; it's simple math. It's cool if you like the game, but people seem to be bent on arguing the very objective fundamentals of game design.

Sorry to clutter your thread, but again: it serves the argument of your opposers much better than your own.
Click to expand...
Your post is more than welcome in this thread, and actually, I said it was a -fault- of the game not to have tutorial; it works against the game's accessibility and was a poor design oversight. The larger point, though, is that there are loads of fun mechanics here, regardless, and I just hope to bring them to people's attention so they can utilize them if they decide to try the game. :)
 
C

CharlesSurge

Member
Neiteio, thanks for the great thread! I'm not huge into the series and don't own RE6 currently, but the thread looks very helpful and I've bookmarked it. The combat video I just watched looks great, with a lot of fun to be had with the various mix-ups one has at their disposal.
 
T

The Crimson Kid

what are you waiting for
It is hilariously bad that most of the neat tricks listed in the OP (which are pretty neat!) aren't even on the loading screens in the game.

You know you've screwed up as a developer when your game mechanics are more obtuse and hidden than Dark Souls, and in that game where much of the point was to deliberately obfuscate most everything, at least it has the manners to present all of the game's fundamental mechanics and several auxiliary moves to you in the first 15 minutes. Many different facets of the design of Dark Souls worked together to make confusion and obfuscation a positive feature that defines the feel of the game. Such clarity of vision is not present in RE6.

I've tried the demo again with trying to use many of these tricks, and while the combat does become marginally more enjoyable, the looseness of the player controls and the unresponsiveness of the aiming still got in the way too much for me to fully enjoy it. Also, the more I play the demo, the more I notice the myriad errors in scenario design.

I will admit that having both players on their back spinning around in circles is pretty hilarious though!

Retro_ said:
The mechanics in Vanquish that make that game unique aren't formally acknowledged by the game at all

This complaint isn't a common criticism for that game though.
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The difference here is that Vanquish controlled incredibly well on a foundational level and the few mechanics not taught in the tutorial could be extrapolated just by experimenting with and combining the game's mechanics in sensible ways. Also, you might be misremembering the tutorial in Vanquish. There are several unique mechanics introduced clearly in the tutorial.

With RE6, most of these auxiliary mechanics described in the OP are not combinations of previously taught mechanics, but entire new button combos that the game gives no indication (from your AI partner using these moves for example) that something more might be possible. Also, the foundational mechanics in RE6 are just not up to the standard in the genre when it comes to responsiveness. The basic controls are clunky, so why would you expect there to be many deeper mechanics that make the game less clunky? I think that many professional reviewers fell into this category and it probably got dinged too hard on that front.
 
B

Beelzeboss

Member
Man I really wish I had read some of this stuff before finishing the game. Some of the control options you seem to have are amazing to me. All the stuff you can do while sliding like quickly breaking boxes and planting remote bombs are so cool. Quickly making pills would have been handy to know about in that pill tutorial they forced you to do.

But Capcom ignored a lot the lessons other shooters learned about dodging and taking cover to do their own thing so in the end it doesn't matter much.
 
R

Risette

A Good Citizen
Chinner said:
its funny when people try and damage control RE6 by saying its like dark souls. they're entirely differnet games that try entirely differnet things. don't try and excuse RE6s poor tutorial and linear design by using dark souls difficulty as some kind of compensation.
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Seriously, this attempt to damage control RE6 as some hidden deep gem that scrub pleb reviewers just couldn't penetrate is getting bizarre. It's no God Hand, that's for sure.
 
K

Kai Dracon

Writing a dinosaur space opera symphony
I will say I am tired of the complaint that if a game doesn't have a complete tutorial then the entire game is simply shit. That just makes you sound whiny. "I got mad because I didn't know how the game worked, it's such crap." (There are, though, a lot of people playing games who seem to approach them exactly like that.)

Once upon a time, games didn't have tutorials in the game... at all. You were expected to read the manual. And figure out how to play the game well on your own.

Today, it can be a legitimate negative point if a developer doesn't include tutorial or instructions. But that alone does not determine if the core game is good or bad.

The controls in RE6 aren't even unintuitive. Just about everything (not every single thing) you can do branches from the basic character actions in ways that make sense, once you see what those actions are.
 
T

Tain

Member
Nice OP, Neiteio. This game is a blast (on the harder difficulties), and I'm anticipating the hell out of No Hope mode.

It sucks that this game doesn't tell you much, and it sucks that it isn't difficult enough to encourage you to seek out the options available to you (at least on Normal), but that doesn't somehow change the fact that the options are there in the first place and a lot of fun to use.

Heart Attack said:
Why do you guys act all hipsterlike and defend this game so much. I don't want my RE to play like that. If i want to play Vanquish, i'll play Vanquish. I trust CVXFREAK much more than you guys.
Click to expand...

i'm sorry that spiritual reasons are preventing you from enjoying this game
 
I

Iresecia

Neo Member
Some of these things I didn't know and I'm at 60+ hours in so far. Really when you get into the game and start to get a grasp for the controls it's not too bad. This looks like a lot but when you're in a calm environment testing the controls then it'll become second nature. I recommend Leon's campaign just to get your feet wet. Mostly cause zombies are slower moving and it gives you time to learn the important mechanics. That way you're better prepared for when the enemies are mutating.
 
X

XxSlasherMcGirkxX

Member
I agree with the majority of this thread except for the fact melee totaly outclasses shooting. Melee is extremely useful in this game and is vital but to say it's superior as an offensive and defensive tool, c'mon no way. Melee is great at destroying up close enemies and conserving ammo and for adding time in Mercs but shooting still takes the center stage here. When 85% of the enemies excel in close quarters, it's always best to just shoot them down and using the dodge techniques to evade. Why give the enemies a chance?
 
K

Krabboss

Member
Gonna bookmark this. I've said this before, but they way they've obscured a lot of the game's controls seem a lot like Monster Hunter and Lost Planet to me. I really liked the learning process in those games, but I don't know if it really suits a game like RE6. This will help if I ever get around to playing the game.

Kaijima said:
Once upon a time, games didn't have tutorials in the game... at all. You were expected to read the manual. And figure out how to play the game well on your own.
Click to expand...

To be fair, the game doesn't come with a manual. Or, at the very least, review copies didn't.
 
B

bomb

Unconfirmed Member
Thanks for this info. There is no conceivable way if reviews knew about all of these contols they would rate it so low. The game just has a lot of awesome features which should add positivity to a review.
 
T

Tain

Member
Iresecia said:
I'm partial to Ada's quick shot myself. That backflip is just too sweet. Though Helena's two follow ups are awesome as well.
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Ada's quick shot is great, but that bow's unique side dodge suuuuuuucks. Which, honestly, is a neat touch, as otherwise the bow might be a little too good.
 
N

Neiteio

Member
As the OP, I should also note that my first impressions of the demo were terrible, but now I play through those same sections and the pacing, the flow, the variety, the atmosphere, everything feels immaculate. And I was most definitely not determined to like the game. In fact, at first I was planning to skip it for Dishonored or XCOM (I'll still get those, trust me). It's just that a series of things have since clicked into place with me, including learning these control intricacies and where and when to apply them, and suddenly the game's design makes a great deal of sense. :)
 
T

T.O.P

Banned
animlboogy said:
A game giving you a lot of tools if you choose to use them just can't be seen as a negative...
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tumblr_mad496Benb1qdf6w8o2_r1_250.gif


Neiteio said:
As the OP, I should also note that my first impressions of the demo were terrible, but now I play through those same sections and the pacing, the flow, the variety, the atmosphere, everything feels immaculate. And I was most definitely not determined to like the game. In fact, at first I was planning to skip it for Dishonored or XCOM (I'll still get those, trust me). It's just that a series of things have since clicked into place with me, including learning these control intricacies and where and when to apply them, and suddenly the game's design makes a great deal of sense. :)
Click to expand...

lol yeah i bailed out of the demo after like 2 minutes and i wasn't going to buy it (people shitting over it didn't help), thank god that i choosed differently
 
N

Neiteio

Member
Coconut said:
The fact that this thread exists says a lot about the game.
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It says the game is a great deal of fun with many cool mechanics at the player's disposal, greatly expanding their combat and mobility options, but Capcom fucked up by neglecting to include a tutorial explaining everything. Again, I'm not excusing Capcom leaving out a tutorial, but I am saying that there is a lot of fun stuff here regardless. :)
 
H

How About No

Member
Krabboss said:
Gonna bookmark this. I've said this before, but they way they've obscured a lot of the game's controls seem a lot like Monster Hunter and Lost Planet to me. I really liked the learning process in those games, but I don't know if it really suits a game like RE6. This will help if I ever get around to playing the game.



To be fair, the game doesn't come with a manual. Or, at the very least, review copies didn't.
Click to expand...

No retail copy comes with the manual :/

pizzaroll said:
Seriously, this attempt to damage control RE6 as some hidden deep gem that scrub pleb reviewers just couldn't penetrate is getting bizarre. It's no God Hand, that's for sure.
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I think the OP's title makes it clear Capcom's the one who fucked up in this matter, and I can't really blame anyone who couldn't figure this stuff out.
 
N

Neiteio

Member
How About No said:
I think the OP's title makes it clear Capcom's the one who fucked up in this matter, and I can't really blame anyone who couldn't figure this stuff out.
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I wouldn't blame them either, which is why I hope my thread will help, because once learned this game is a ton of fun. :)
 
I

Iresecia

Neo Member
Tain said:
Ada's quick shot is great, but that bow's unique side dodge suuuuuuucks. Which, honestly, is a neat touch, as otherwise the bow might be a little too good.
Click to expand...

I usually shoot and then side dodge. At least as far as campaign is concerned, it's hard for them to get a shot in that way. And it just looks awesome lol.
 
M

Mechazawa

Member
All these Vanquish comparisons are confusing the shit out of me. Now I don't know whether I should care about RE6.

I will say that claiming Vanquish's mechanics are obtuse, or whatever, is pretty silly. Game taught you practically everything you needed to know in the tutorial, save for the boost-roll.
 
D

Dance Inferno

Unconfirmed Member
Here's a cool 150-combo S Rank Mercenaries video I found that has time stamps for some cool moves the guy did while playing. The time stamps are a few seconds late so you'll have to rewind it a little to see what he's talking about. He does some cool stuff like dropping mines while sliding, counter-attacking a zombie out of the air, and rolling around on the ground while shotgun blasting a super-fat zombie.
 
T

TheBryanJZX90

Member
So I had a question that it seems like people in this thread might be able to help out with. I loved Mercenaries in 4 but not so much in 5. I felt like in 4 there was always, always, a balance between staying stocked on health & ammo, keeping your combo going, and refilling the timer. That balance felt pretty off in 5, where it seemed best to just run through the whole stage and get all of the timer pickups, then just kill as many guys as possible. Admittedly, I put a lot more time into mercs mode in 4 than 5.

So for people who have played mercs in 6: (1) was I on to something about mercs in 5 or am I full of shit? (2) is mercs in 6 closer to 4 or 5?

Edit: the video directly above this post answered my question! go get all the time first, then kill stuff like in RE5 :( maybe I just wasn't playing mercs in 4 the right way?
 
B

BIONIC-ARRRMMM!!

Member
Reading this topic is all the proof I need to tell me that gamers are getting dumber by the day. Kinda reminds me when people thought that the swinging controls in Bionic Commando (2009) were bad because they weren't automatic like in Spiderman 2 :lol
 
R

Retro_

Unconfirmed Member
The Crimson Kid said:
The difference here is that Vanquish controlled incredibly well on a foundational level and the few mechanics not taught in the tutorial could be extrapolated just by experimenting with and combining the game's mechanics in sensible ways. Also, you might be misremembering the tutorial in Vanquish. There are several unique mechanics introduced clearly in the tutorial.

With RE6, most of these auxiliary mechanics described in the OP are not combinations of previously taught mechanics, but entire new button combos that the game gives no indication (from your AI partner using these moves for example) that something more might be possible. Also, the foundational mechanics in RE6 are just not up to the standard in the genre when it comes to responsiveness. The basic controls are clunky, so why would you expect there to be many deeper mechanics that make the game less clunky? I think that many professional reviewers fell into this category and it probably got dinged too hard on that front.
Click to expand...

Was the demo loading screen control description not in the full game? because alot of these are on there.

Stuff I learned was cover recovering stamina and target painting, which are both really cool.

I guess I'm just different in that when I see new stuff I didn't know about, my gut reaction is "Wow this is cool" instead of "Why didn't you tell me this fucking capcom"

I will say that claiming Vanquish's mechanics are obtuse, or whatever, is pretty silly. Game taught you practically everything you needed to know in the tutorial, save for the boost-roll.
Click to expand...

Game didn't teach you any of the cancelling mechanics, which I think are more crucial to the pace of the game than any other mechanic
 
F

fernoca

Member
Great thread!
Really helpful and I'm in the half that loves the game. Sent a link to my friend which I play coop with.

With years I got used to ignore reviews and I'm glad I still did for this game. Really incredible so far.
 
N

Neiteio

Member
ilnadmy said:
Here's a cool 150-combo S Rank Mercenaries video I found that has time stamps for some cool moves the guy did while playing. The time stamps are a few seconds late so you'll have to rewind it a little to see what he's talking about. He does some cool stuff like dropping mines while sliding, counter-attacking a zombie out of the air, and rolling around on the ground while shotgun blasting a super-fat zombie.
Click to expand...
Damn, dropping mines while sliding and countering zombies out of the air -- sogood.gif. :)
 
N

Neiteio

Member
Crewnh said:
4's camera is no where near as bad as RE6. It gives you plenty of screen real estate and is locked behind the character.
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Out of fairness to RE6, the full game changes the FOV scene by scene and most of the time you have quite a bit of screen real estate. I actually think the bits in the demo were the most crowded, and perhaps that was to create a heightened sense of tension via blind spots in Leon's section, and to create a sense of chaos in Chris'. Regardless, I feel the camera pulls back more in many other scenes, and it all feels second-nature to me after several runs through the demo and now playing the full game. :)
 
T

T.O.P

Banned
OP there's a guide anywhere to understand how the boss fight triggers in mercs?

I heard something about the Ship deck level but never saw anything
 
N

Neiteio

Member
T.O.P said:
OP there's a guide anywhere to understand how the boss fight triggers in mercs?

I heard something about the harbor level but never saw anything
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This sounds like a question for Sectus! All I know is it's not random. I think someone claimed in the OT that ~15 consecutive counter kills will guarantee their appearance.
 
T

T.O.P

Banned
Neiteio said:
This sounds like a question for Sectus! All I know is it's not random. I think someone claimed in the OT that ~15 consecutive counter kills will guarantee their appearance.
Click to expand...

I countered about 15 enemies. You might not be able to see it, but I'm only on the 20th enemy on the stage. Suddenly, a quick caption with the words "Shit, be on the lookout for an unknown BOW!"
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from a YT video


seems like it, i'll try later :D
 
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