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Big Boss or Solid Snake? Why?

jwhit28 said:
I'm honestly not sure how that is going to happen. From what I remember of Metal Gear 1 and 2, he becomes a warmonger (stealing the FUELX or whatever it's called, his speech about using child soldiers to create more war and child soldiers) but it seems like all of the children he rescued were appreciative and really felt like he gave them a home and a great purpose. Maybe it's just brainwashing I don't know.

The warmonger stuff certainly seems to be kind of retconned into Kaz's character going forward though. He sees war as a business and is banking on the war economy. Maybe that was his reason to eventually end up with the Patriots.
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Makes me wonder how Kojima will explain Miller ending up in Foxhound and supporting Snake during Zanzibar. Maybe BB goes too far. Maybe it's part of some stupid ass scheme to off him for Zero. I'd personally hope for the former. Big Boss could end up abducting and, as you said, indoctrinating child soldiers into fighting for him, which would properly turn him into a villain and at the same time, provide a reason as to why they still revere him as the "One-Eyed Uncle".
 
Dick Justice said:
Makes me wonder how Kojima will explain Miller ending up in Foxhound and supporting Snake during Zanzibar. Maybe BB goes too far. Maybe it's part of some stupid ass scheme to off him for Zero. I'd personally hope for the former. Big Boss could end up abducting and, as you said, indoctrinating child soldiers into fighting for him, which would properly turn him into a villain and at the same time, provide a reason as to why they still revere him as the "One-Eyed Uncle".
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The Foxhound mystery is a lot more complicated than just Kaz Miller switching sides or Big Boss going too far in MGSV. Don't forget Big Boss ends up in Foxhound too by MG1, they don't "separate" as it were (unless you're speaking ideologically), Big Boss serves as the Commanding Officer and Miller as a Survival Instructor. Both in some form mentor Solid Snake in that organization. But Miller stays in Foxhound and isn't privy to Big Boss going on to create the final version of the Outer Heaven Mercenaries behind the scenes. Miller is our radio support in Zanzibar Land, obviously.
 
Solid snake can big boss do the stuff he did in twin snakes? Jumping missiles and backflips to avoid detection. Seriously though I like them pretty much equally but Big boss is more fun to play as though, especially in MGS 3.
 
On that topic Liquid Snake got even worse treatment than Solid Snake. He gets killed off then comes back as a fucking hand that takes over Ocelots mind (so lame) then Liquid Ocelot which is like Ocelot pretending to be Liquid or some crap.

He was the only good antagonist. Would be nice if they make some kind of game about him.
 
Style Fox said:
On that topic Liquid Snake got even worse treatment than Solid Snake. He gets killed off then comes back as a fucking hand that takes over Ocelots mind (so lame) then Liquid Ocelot which is like Ocelot pretending to be Liquid or some crap.

He was the only good antagonist. Would be nice if they make some kind of game about him.
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Both Ocelot and Liquid were so much cooler as individual characters :(
 
Style Fox said:
On that topic Liquid Snake got even worse treatment than Solid Snake. He gets killed off then comes back as a fucking hand that takes over Ocelots mind (so lame) then Liquid Ocelot which is like Ocelot pretending to be Liquid or some crap.

He was the only good antagonist. Would be nice if they make some kind of game about him.
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mgsv_e3_11.jpg
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"Solid Snake's storyline has ended with MGS4," he continued. "But there's still a lot more when it comes to Naked Snake's storyline. The Cold War was a time where people, neither good nor evil, were manipulated by various factors, and they became good or evil. The same goes for Liquid Snake, and we'll get to see just what happened to him." - From an early interview about Peace Walker. But we never get to see what happens to Liquid Snake in that game.

Liquid's probably getting a big part in MGSV. And after that who knows? I think a game featuring Liquid would be great.
 
Rogue Agent said:
The Foxhound mystery is a lot more complicated than just Kaz Miller switching sides or Big Boss going too far in MGSV. Don't forget Big Boss ends up in Foxhound too by MG1, they don't "separate" as it were (unless you're speaking ideologically), Big Boss serves as the Commanding Officer and Miller as a Survival Instructor. Both in some form mentor Solid Snake in that organization. But Miller stays in Foxhound and isn't privy to Big Boss going on to create the final version of the Outer Heaven Mercenaries behind the scenes. Miller is our radio support in Zanzibar Land, obviously.
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Maybe Gray Fox breaks up the happy home some how. There has to be at the very least a digital comic to fix MG1 and MG2. Maybe Phantom Pain will play all the way through Kaz and Big Boss pretending to pledge their allegiance to the US again to get to Zero before Kaz secretly helps Solid Snake for some reason while Solid is being jerked around by Big Boss during the Outer Heaven mission. Maybe Outer Heaven was becoming too close to absolute nuclear deterrence because of Metal Gear for Kaz's liking. He might have seen the war economy beginning to crumble.
 
Solid easily. I find Big Boss to be somewhat of a bland character personality wise. He just isn't as interesting to me. Then again, I have only played one game with him, and three with Solid. Maybe my opinion will change with The Phantom Pain, but it will hard for me to get over that voice.
 
Big Boss, because he's organic. He wasn't formed by any Science experiments. So he's a better, purer solider. His story is far more tragic.

Snake was formed by science, engineered etc.

I'm saying this as someone who started with MGS1 at the age of 7, but 3 is my favourite.
 
Although BB has a more interesting backstory, Solid's personality i like better, he just seems cooler and more badass.

Which is why it's so fucking tragic that we only get one 3D game with SS in his prime.
 
Tough choice

Solid Snake
Even at the lowest point of his life, he still did what he have to do.

Big boss
got awesome characted development. Depend on how ground zeroes goes, there's a possibility he become greater character.

I have to choose Solid though.
 
Tookay said:
Big Boss is easily the more relatable of the two, at least in MGS3. I don't feel like we really understand how Solid ticks in the way we know BB.
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I don't think this is necessarily true, especially if you consider the non-canon ending of MGS1 where Meryl dies which showed Snake at his most vulnerable state in the series. Big Boss may have had a more canon moment of extreme grief but it's clear that Snake has some triggers as well, even if a lot of them are inherited from Big Boss (most notably distaste of the way the government/military treats war orphans and refugees).
 
A fun thing I constantly think about is "which Snake has endured more physical pain?"

Solid Snake:
Captured in MGS1, torture by electrocution. 4,000 volts of AC/DC power.
Almost drowned when escaping from a sinking tanker in MGS2.
Gets knocked out by strut explosion in MGS2.
Weird Ocelot related stabbing in MGS4.
Microwave hallway in MGS4.

Big Boss; MGS3
Broken arm.
Thrown off bridge into river, huge drop. Multiple fractures and cuts.
Gets royally fucked up by Volgin, Volgin can generate up to 10 million volts of electricity at will.
Further torture by Volgin, right eye gets permanently damaged by the barrel of a shot revolver.
Jumps into a river, almost drowns again.

Portable Ops/Peacewalker:
Tortured.

Ground Zeroes/Phantom Pain:
Gets royally fucked up by something.

Big Boss doesn't have any nano-anything either.
 
Big Boss and Solid snake are, bad asses in their own right. Big boss is a guy who i feel like had been learning the ropes about everything his entire existence. Snake always seemed like the guy who had some sort of plan or could come up with quickly a very knowledgeable fellow very cool. Big boss while cool it seems like a lot more thing effected him . Two different takes on two different people who i very much appreciate in the MGS universe. And in video games in general.


And while.. weirdly written very nice ventures into commentary of military and war itself, from the perspective of kojima. These men are two of the best video game characters, period, like strait up. And it has my he hype for MGS5

So who do i pick.

Raiden.

He was snake once and went from whiny rookie to ripping off giant mech arms with in the first 20 minutes of his game and stabbing the mech with it. Big boss ended up and old bitter spiteful mess and snake ended up presumably old and dead after a series of very weird shenanigans that was mgs4. Raiden became a cool ass ghost in the shell ass cyborg with his prosthetics.

I want a rising 2, I want a whole after MGS4 future Possibly leading into ZOE universe.


Big boss and Solid Snake are cool doe.
 
foxtrot3d said:
Stone cold, and I love it. Plus, the whole point of the game was watching Snake grow from this detached solo asshole into an actual human being and by MGS2 he's fighting for a cause and his beliefs and what not. Of course MGS4 threw that all the way and made him a grumpy old man. I've always found Snake more compelling than BB.
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Snake was never a "detached solo asshole", even in MGS1; that's just you taking at face value what he say to push away others, since those he cares about have a tendency to manipulate him and/or die by his hands. Examine what he does during the game, not what he says. There's a reason the organization he creates right after Shadow Moses is called "Philanthropy".
 
Weltall Zero said:
Snake was never a "detached solo asshole", even in MGS1; that's just you taking at face value what he say to push away others, since those he cares about have a tendency to manipulate him and/or die by his hands. Examine what he does during the game, not what he says. There's a reason the organization he creates right after Shadow Moses is called "Philanthropy".
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Umm yeah he pretty much was that's what his whole character development was about. It's why Grey Fox before he died told Snake that he always at least fought for something he believed in, whereas at this point in Snake's life he simply fights because he enjoys it. Multiple characters mention this to Snake and Snake even flat out states it himself, it's only by the end that he takes a meaning to his life and decides to live it for himself.

Hence why in MGS2 he's super idealistic and part of an organization called Philanthropy, but to say he was always that way would ignore his entire arc in MGS1.
 
MormaPope said:
A fun thing I constantly think about is "which Snake has endured more physical pain?"

Solid Snake:
Captured in MGS1, torture by electrocution. 4,000 volts of AC/DC power.
Almost drowned when escaping from a sinking tanker in MGS2.
Gets knocked out by strut explosion in MGS2.
Weird Ocelot related stabbing in MGS4.
Microwave hallway in MGS4.

Big Boss; MGS3
Broken arm.
Thrown off bridge into river, huge drop. Multiple fractures and cuts.
Gets royally fucked up by Volgin, Volgin can generate up to 10 million volts of electricity at will.
Further torture by Volgin, right eye gets permanently damaged by the barrel of a shot revolver.
Jumps into a river, almost drowns again.

Portable Ops/Peacewalker:
Tortured.

Ground Zeroes/Phantom Pain:
Gets royally fucked up by something.

Big Boss doesn't have any nano-anything either.
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A lot of those were fuck ups by BB, things like chasing MGR and go into the Microwave require bigger balls than BB will ever have
 
Solid Snake for fucking ever. I'm so sick of Big Boss that it's unbelievable. All of Big Boss' mystique has been completely shattered... filling in the gaps mentally between Metal Gear Solid 3: Snake Eater and the original Metal Gear was so great after how MGS3 played out, and then they've decided to just shit all over that by showing us more and more and more of him.

People requesting a game starring the Boss should be careful what they fucking wish for, man.
 
foxtrot3d said:
Umm yeah he pretty much was that's what his whole character development was about. It's why Grey Fox before he died told Snake that he always at least fought for something he believed in, whereas at this point in Snake's life he simply fights because he enjoys it. Multiple characters mention this to Snake and Snake even flat out states it himself, it's only by the end that he takes a meaning to his life and decides to live it for himself.

Hence why in MGS2 he's super idealistic and part of an organization called Philanthropy, but to say he was always that way would ignore his entire arc in MGS1.
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I was not contending the statement about him not having ideals to fight for in MGS1 (even though it's not entirely true; he's fighting to save Meryl and stop a nuclear strike, after all). It's the "detached solo asshole" that I disagree with. Unless not believing in any ideals equates to being an asshole in your opinion.

The development arc in MGS1 is him opening up to others (Otacon, Meryl) and letting them in, not caring about them in the first place. It's obvious he cares about people from minute 1, otherwise he wouldn't even be there. He doesn't magically develop empathy over the course of a few hours.
 
Big Boss by a mile. Solid Snake no doubt was a great hero but he was a tool.
thats why Big Boss told him to live his life at the end of 4.
 
As close as it is, Solid.

Big Boss is better characterized throughout the series, and has to be given his era and circumstance. And he was more social by comparison to Snake, but somehow Snake socializing/confiding in only a few people make him more interesting.

Solid feels like an embodiment of his own code name, even as a weaker old man cheated out of a normal (human) lifespan, among other things. If David and John had to switch places, maybe they would've made the same choices in their respective eras, maybe not.

Both broke away from official service kind of early and sought their own path, directly against the establishment, and yet David never had a character like the Boss hovering directly over his existence for so long; David moreso followed Gray Fox's code of "but I always fought for what I believed in"

My answer might change after TTP though.
 
Didn't like Solid Snake at all after the first MGS game. He was an absolutely terrible character in MGS4... just completely passive and allowing himself to be used at everyones whim. Made him look incredibly weak in my eyes... nothing like the Solid Snake from the first game.
 
Style Fox said:
On that topic Liquid Snake got even worse treatment than Solid Snake. He gets killed off then comes back as a fucking hand that takes over Ocelots mind (so lame) then Liquid Ocelot which is like Ocelot pretending to be Liquid or some crap.

He was the only good antagonist. Would be nice if they make some kind of game about him.
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I assume you haven't played MGS4.

Major spoilers:
He never took over Ocelot's mind. Ocelot was pretending to be possessed by Liquid.

And I'd say Big Boss. Snake is too perfect. Big Boss is more of a character, flaws and all.
 
cj_iwakura said:
I assume you haven't played MGS4.

Major spoilers:
He never took over Ocelot's mind. Ocelot was pretending to be possessed by Liquid.

And I'd say Big Boss. Snake is too perfect. Big Boss is more of a character, flaws and all.
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He actually did take over Ocelot's mind in MGS2, but in MGS4 Ocelot already got rid of Liquid's arm (we find out right at the end). He took therapy so that he believed he was Liquid and fooled everything into thinking that Liquid completely took over his mind.

It is confusing some times.
 
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