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[Zek]

"Simply fighting each other with no other objectives or choices to make gets old relatively quickly."


Damnit jay, no. These kind of games the community makes their own fun and their own rules.

Every month you delay release is another month where expectations grow exponentially.

That's what people did in D2, and that's why they're adding dueling to D3 probably next month. Structured PvP most likely wouldn't have had any real customization options.

The main issue with dueling right now is the lack of a public game list. They really need to add that, the matchmaking system is clearly not sufficient.

 

[Lothars]

It's always the same in these threads but all I am going to say is I disagree that blizzard with anyone saying that blizzard isn't as good as they use to be.

 

[Fularu]

With D3 they eliminated almost all gore and satanism to get kids onboard.

We haven't played the same game.

Or you're just trolling at this point

 

[glaurung]

They ought to cancel the PvP plans in favor of more single player and co-op content.

If the PvP is in this desperate a situation, let it die.

 

[AllIsOneIsNone]

Blizzard, how many YEARS did you have? Path of Exile (GGG) with its 15 employees have done 10 times the amount that your hundreds of employees have in the past 6 years. Fucking pathetic.

 

[Synth_floyd]

Diablo 2 had such an awesome dark and atmospheric story.

See the ending to act 4: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0ToAJof9VkU

Diablo 3 was just generic. In act 3 the bad guy just uses comic book taunts "MUA HAHA ULL NEVER KILL ME!" All the bad guys in D3 talk like that. So dull.

 

[hitsugi]

This is so ridiculous.. add a hostile option to the game and give people the option of making PVP enabled / disabled games. Jesus. PVPing with no rewards gets old after a while? Try farming.

 

[spirity]

We've brought a lot of people in to try out Team Deathmatch and, while some found it entertaining, most of our testers didn't feel like it was something they'd want to do beyond a few hours. Without more varied objectives, or very lucrative rewards, few saw our current iteration as something they'd want spend a lot of time in.

Their pool of playtesters are likely far more comfortable playing WoW and its pretty clear in the above quote. Too much of WoW's influence is felt in Diablo 3. Blizzard has this Diablo ip and they're not confident enough to let it be Diablo. Instead, Blizz are pulling inspiration from their MMO. When a game doesn't have its own identity, things can get messy, problems occur.

 

[Interfectum]

Blizzard, how many YEARS did you have? Path of Exile (GGG) with its 15 employees have done 10 times the amount that your hundreds of employees have in the past 6 years. Fucking pathetic.

Blizzard is getting fat and slow and they think it's a part of the company DNA to iterate the fun out of everything.

 

[Hero]

Don't we have some Blizzard employees on the forum?

 

[zoukka]

We haven't played the same game.

Or you're just trolling at this point

There was nothing scary or disturbing about the game. The story was quite the normal fantasy fluff and diablo didn't have anything menacing about it. Could've been any generic fantasy adventure.

 

[Belgorim]

There was nothing scary or disturbing about the game.

This is pretty much what I said about diablo 2 after the original

Story is not important in these games.

 

[Bizazedo]

Yep, people have wanted that for YEARS in WoW. Just give skills modified effects in PvP and leave them alone for PvE. Would solve so many problems, but they refuse for some reason.

Yeah, I've never understood that. They always refused to do it. The answer is pretty clear as to why, the amount of work it'd require would probably be fairly large....

I dunno, I'm dating myself, but I miss the original Alterac Valley. Not the landmines, maybe, but everything else. Getting an organized 40 man into an instance and running into an opposing 40 man guild was epic.

Timing the elite wolf / elites / windrider / elemental charges? Awesome.

I bet there are people who don't even know about the elites you could spawn.

Sigh.

Wow, they still haven't implemented PvP of any kind, seven months later? That's pretty amazing.

Not that it's even on the list of things I personally want fixed in D3. My primary concern continues to be just how bad it is as a loot game.

They probably want to monetize it.

I dunno, I still think the loot and AH murdered this game.

 

[Sir Abacus]

Yeah, I've never understood that. They always refused to do it. The answer is pretty clear as to why, the amount of work it'd require would probably be fairly large....

No. It's pretty simple and some skills already have alternate PvP effects. CC for example already has far shorter durations when cast on players. TfB had a bandaid solution of stacking 3 stacks on players but that was abandoned and the entire skill reworked when it was still delivering obscene amounts of burst thanks to the PvP power "fix".

The real reason is that GC doesn't want to learn two sets of skills and thinks we can't either.

 

[la flama blanca]

How come these new game designers take game mechanics and storytelling techniques from older games as something that was limited with it's technology? Just take the same formula of past games and make them look better. I really fucking hate all these newer game designers these days....Jay Wilson can eat a giant fucking dick.

 

[Interfectum]

This is pretty much what I said about diablo 2 after the original

Story is not important in these games.

Well in Diablo 3's case the story was so bad it actually turned me off in some instances. Horrible writing. All that money and they can't even write a passable script nor hire some quality voice actors.

 

[Anoregon]

Well in Diablo 3's case the story was so bad it actually turned me off in some cases. Horrible writing. All that money and they can't even write a passable script nor hire some quality voice actors.

TEAR-ROAR

 

[zoukka]

Well in Diablo 3's case the story was so bad it actually turned me off in some cases. Horrible writing. All that money and they can't even write a passable script nor hire some quality voice actors.

Same thing with SC2. I guess money can't buy talent...

 

[Bizazedo]

No. It's pretty simple and some skills already have alternate PvP effects. CC for example already has far shorter durations when cast on players. TfB had a bandaid solution of stacking 3 stacks on players but that was abandoned and the entire skill reworked when it was still delivering obscene amounts of burst thanks to the PvP power "fix".

The real reason is that GC doesn't want to learn two sets of skills and thinks we can't either.

I will disagree with you in a friendly way, there. TfB was clunky in PvE as well and the new version will be much simpler for people to use, which is what Blizzard has always been about.

I know, crazy, but I'm on a PvE server due to real life friends now and all the PvP hating warriors are happy about this.

I'm not .

CC is a bad example since you could do a blanket change to the effect as opposed to the ability.

(casual guild ).

It would be work, more work, to change everything than the route they do now and as such I can see why they'd refuse to do it in a non-subscription game.

 

[The Lamonster]

Wow @ this thread.

 

[Anoregon]

Wow @ this thread.

Sweet adjectives before the edit. At least you didn't call us entitled.

 

[The Lamonster]

Sweet adjectives before the edit. At least you didn't call us entitled.

Seems like all my favorite games in the last couple of years have been on Gaf's shit list. Sucks, man.

 

[Bizazedo]

Wow @ this thread.

Yeah, I missed you before the edit, but honestly? It's hard not to call it justified with your two examples.

Halo looked amazing, but I (also) don't think it's as good as prior games in the series. Forward Unto Dawn hooking me back in...

Diablo I'm not as much against, but I do think the trend towards making games easier and easier and then adding an AH does work against it.

 

[Perkel]

We haven't played the same game.

Or you're just trolling at this point

i agree we played different game.

and there are pentagrams and impalemented bodies
and most of mobs are representation of occultistic fantasies about devils (for example goatmen)
and lore is strictly connected to angels and demons

and game is called...................... Diablo

 

[AppleSmack]

Same thing with SC2. I guess money can't buy talent...

But outside of plot (which wasn't even that awful) the SC2 campaign was varied in its missions and very entertaining. The multiplayer even more so.

 

[fizzelopeguss]

I think they should just scrap their work with PvP and just enable hostile option on party screen like D2 used.




No.

Dark rooms filled with evil spawn, gothic style buildings (like act 4 church) realistic looking armor and weapons, even diablo 2 desert is more atmospheric than D3 one,

As of PoE that is completely false. Their art is evolution of what D2 did in 2D and aside from that it very good looking game with fantastic art. Act 1 beach isn't looker but prison/caves and Act2 is amazing.

D3 art is good for titan quest like game or torchlite. With D3 they eliminated almost all gore and satanism to get kids onboard and they lost what was awesome about D2 art

If you want comparison then imagine Dark Souls with WoW art style
because that happened with D2>D3
Beside that D3 art is poor in details.

Get real, diablo 2 was rightfully hammered back at release for looking like shit.

Diablo 3's hand drawn visuals are a fucking revelation in todays jizzmapping climate.

 

[Fularu]

There was nothing scary or disturbing about the game. The story was quite the normal fantasy fluff and diablo didn't have anything menacing about it. Could've been any generic fantasy adventure.

Same could be said about D2's story. Typical generic dark fantasy stuff. Diablo never shone because of the story/lore but because of the gameplay.

Anyway, D3 doesn't lack blood/satanism/gore at all, it's just much more varied and interesting than *just* a damp cave with blood/satanism symbols around (like D1)

 

[Claymores]

Still amazed anybody plays this, I got to about 80 hours and realised I had never dropped anything worth while and was just grinding gold for the next upgrade which was boring as hell after that never logged in again.

 

[Bizazedo]

Still amazed anybody plays this, I got to about 80 hours and realised I had never dropped anything worth while and was just grinding gold for the next upgrade which was boring as hell after that never logged in again.

So did they ever back down on saying drop rates of quality stuff were linked to the AH or do they still insist it's separate?

 

[Fularu]

i agree we played different game.

and there are pentagrams and impalemented bodies
and most of mobs are representation of occultistic fantasies about devils (for example goatmen)
and lore is strictly connected to angels and demons

and game is called...................... Diablo

All of that is in D3. So what's your point again?

 

[zoukka]

But outside of plot (which wasn't even that awful) the SC2 campaign was varied in its missions and very entertaining. The multiplayer even more so.

Yeah I was solely speaking of the story and its presentation.

 

[ZombieSupaStar]

I think act 1 is the best act in Diablo 3, art especially.

The desert areas were just boring, same with the barb areas.

 

[Claymores]

So did they ever back down on saying drop rates of quality stuff were linked to the AH or do they still insist it's separate?

No Idea haven't really bothered with Diablo 3 since about July/August, everybody I know went back to Diablo 2 so I play that once or twice a week again.

 

[Perkel]

1.0.7 they will release duels. Let's wait and see how this train wreck goes

Get real, diablo 2 was rightfully hammered back at release for looking like shit.

Diablo 3's hand drawn visuals are a fucking revelation in todays jizzmapping climate.

what ?

1. Diablo 2 was good looking game especially on Voodoo (glide)
2. We discuss in game art, levels, characters armor not paintings.
Who cares about 2D not in game art. It is relevant to discussion as devianart art of diablo2

 

[Fularu]

I think act 1 is the best act in Diablo 3, art especially.

The desert areas were just boring, same with the barb areas.

While too short, I loved Act IV and the Oasis portion of Act II. I also enjoyed hunting down the cult.

 

[Trickster]

So did they ever back down on saying drop rates of quality stuff were linked to the AH or do they still insist it's separate?

They will never say that, even though everyone knows it.

 

[buhdeh]

Diablo 3 looks like garbage. I'd take Diablo 2's sprites over it. No joke.

 

[Jackl]

We haven't played the same game.

Or you're just trolling at this point

He's using hyperbole.

They did get rid of some satanic imagery and gory imagery. If you look into the original alpha videos you'll see 3 women get liquified during an event in sacrifice to create and elite ghoul. The same event in current game has sans the women.

 

[ZombieSupaStar]

While too short, I loved Act IV and the Oasis portion of Act II. I also enjoyed hunting down the cult.

act 4 to me didn't even feel finished, they just got some assets done and laid out a few quick maps. More like 3 1/2 acts in D3.

Also act 2 I did love those elephant (?) bones, the art was very cool on them, they looked 2d but weren't

*sigh* I just want Diablo 2 with Diablo 3s graphics / "combat-gameplay-feedback-feel-thing".

 

[Perkel]

All of that is in D3. So what's your point again?

ok if my words don't ring a bell to you then here is quote from D3 dev about D3 style:

In the previous games I think there was a sense of “Oh it’s a demon, Diablo, devil, Satan, satanism… pentagram!” and while certainly there are those influences, what we’re creating now and have been creating for quite some time is evolving the game world and making something more complete. A complete world where every aspect is fully realized, maybe even if it doesn’t show up in the game.
I think that same sort of world-crafting can be seen between Warcraft II and Warcraft III. A big shift in focus to fleshing out a unique fantasy world and story.

and quote from one of interviews with original D2 dev about D3 style change:

FLUX: As we’ve seen recently ...Blizzard has removed all of the crosses and pentagrams from Diablo and also from World of Warcraft apparently. Some of the stuff upon release has since been sort of... I would say sanitized. Their explanation is that they’re creating their own original individual world and their own mythology. What do you think about that? I believe you said last time that you wouldn’t have done that if you were still on the project.
MAX SCHAEFER: We definitely would have not done that, because it doesn’t... the idea that it’s just because you want to have a new world that you’re creating something in just doesn’t wash. They picked out those two things because they’re controversial. We wouldn’t have done it. I don’t begrudge them their decisions. Again, they gotta pursue what they think is right with the game. But, we would not have done that.

So you are still saying it's the same ?

 

[Fularu]

ok if my words don't ring a bell to you then here is quote from D3 dev about D3 style:



and quote from one of interviews with original D2 dev about D3 style change:



So you are still saying it's the same ?

Yes, they have all those elements on top of satanism imagery. Those still exist but as with any religion, they don't exist in a vacuum. Expanding the world was a good move. Your problem is that it isn't "dark enough" for your taste, not that they aren't present.

Satanism for the sake of satanism grows old, and fast.

 

[Sir Abacus]

I will disagree with you in a friendly way, there.
...
It would be work, more work, to change everything than the route they do now and as such I can see why they'd refuse to do it in a non-subscription game.

@Midtskill we make abilities work differently as a later sort, but I for one don't want to have to earn two different rule sets.

Straight from GC's Twitter. It's not a technical thing. It's just dev preference.

 

[palpabl_purpura]

fighting games or sports games are deep enough for pvp. Anything else is a mess. Look at how fps have declined in quality thanks to shallow fragfests like cod and bf.

 

[Fularu]

Straight from GC's Twitter. It's not a technical thing. It's just dev preference.

Some things (like CC) work differently in PVP and PVE already.

 

[Sir Abacus]

Some things (like CC) work differently in PVP and PVE already.

I pointed that out in my initial post too.

 

[V_Arnold]

I am sad that they even bother with this.

Should have spent all this resource and time into new items, new events and an infinite dungeon/Horde mode-like system.

 

[Fularu]

I am sad that they even bother with this.

Should have spent all this resource and time into new items, new events and an infinite dungeon/Horde mode-like system.

This is probably coming in 1.08.

I wouldn't be surprised if they stole PoE's map idea, since it's one of the few things that I liked from this game.

 

[Bizazedo]

Straight from GC's Twitter. It's not a technical thing. It's just dev preference.

And you believe him.

It's not like this hasn't been around prior to GC. I don't have it as handy as you, but I distinctly remember them saying they did not want two different rulesets to have to manage.

 

[Perkel]

Yes, they have all those elements on top of satanism imagery. Those still exist but as with any religion, they don't exist in a vacuum. Expanding the world was a good move. Your problem is that it isn't "dark enough" for your taste, not that they aren't present.

Satanism for the sake of satanism grows old, and fast.

This was never case with either D1 or D2.

It is as you said: "still exist" It's like comparing Soldier of Fortune gore part to Call of Duty gore. In Call of Duty it "still exist" (about whole subject not only gore)

 

[EternalGamer]

One sentence in particular points to all types of reasons why I hate Blizz sometimes.

"Simply fighting each other with no other objectives or choices to makes gets old relatively quickly"

Um, not really Blizz. People just dueled because they enjoyed it a shit ton in D2. People did World PVP in WoW for no other reason because they thought it was loads of fun. I don't see why Blizzard has to force or give a reward or objective to PVP. I always enjoyed PVP when it's of the natural or organic nature and it's just fun to do, not forced. Way overthinking it. I loved world PVP in WoW, stuff like fighting at X Roads or Tauren Mill was amazing, and then they went and took a crap with stuff like Battlegrounds.

What that sentence really means is this:

"We have not found a way to make Team Deathmatch something that we can benefit from financially long term."